Keeping dogs outside

Zapperzy

tk123 wrote: »

OP just buy a load of these :P

I have an image in my head of my fella half stuck in the wee cat door having tried to chase the cat through it

I would put a dog kennel inside the shed and put a plastic flap on the shed door so they can come and go during the day. I'v seen nice insulated dog kennels on donedeal, I'd love to get one myself as our 6 year old wooden one is starting to look a bit worn. I second vetbed as bedding, it's warm, it'l keep them dry and it's easy washed and dried.

If they're going to be outside all year round I'd look into getting plugs installed in the shed and buying an infared lamp. I'm not sure if it's possible but can you wire a lamp up to a thermometer to come on when it dips below a certain temperature?

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

cocker5 wrote: »

...its cruelty...

Wow... just wow...

I guess my dogs never got love, attention, shown effection or cared for as they are "outside" dogs... I don't understand this mentality at all.

OP is doing his/her best in their situation and shouldn't be judged by anybody here who holds a different opinion on how to treat their pets.

Un Croissant

This forum is amazing sometimes. I'm sure that if the OP posted about having to squash his dogs into a small utility room due to the open plan nature of his house this place would go equally mental.

OP I honestly cant see too much of an issue with a properly constructed, secure, insulated shed for them.

cocker5

Amaya Sweet Mint wrote: »

Wow... just wow...

I guess my dogs never got love, attention, shown effection or cared for as they are "outside" dogs... I don't understand this mentality at all.

OP is doing his/her best in their situation and shouldn't be judged by anybody here who holds a different opinion on how to treat their pets.

Dont quote two words of my post and leave out all the other revelant words its very misleading and incorrect..... my actual post was the following:

Dogs make great garden decorations in some peoples eyes but in reality its no place for a dog 24/7 outdoors with little interaction. its cruelty.

what i actually said is "full time outdoor" 24/7 dogs, penned in is cruelty and I stand by it.

I never said dogs who sleep outside = cruelty.

Dogs who have a pen and spend 24/7 outdoors and are never allowed in is cruelty... this whole crap of sure ill send sometime outside with them is nonsense you'd wnat to be spending 4/5 hours outside each day with them for them to get everything they need...

Outside dogs 24/7 (ie never allowed inside) = glorified garden decoration = cruelty.... get a stuffed dog instead

tk123

Zapperzy wrote: »

If they're going to be outside all year round I'd look into getting plugs installed in the shed and buying an infared lamp. I'm not sure if it's possible but can you wire a lamp up to a thermometer to come on when it dips below a certain temperature?

I'd say so? We have a fan heater in our shed that kicks in when the temp drops below a certain level (you set the level).

cocker5

Amaya Sweet Mint wrote: »

Wow... just wow...

I guess my dogs never got love, attention, shown effection or cared for as they are "outside" dogs... I don't understand this mentality at all.

OP is doing his/her best in their situation and shouldn't be judged by anybody here who holds a different opinion on how to treat their pets.

Yes your probably right if you left them outside 24/7 in a pen and never allowed them inside your home then yes they didnt get proper love affection attention, Im glad you realise that now next time maybe you can right your wrongs


Never said dogs wouldnt be cared for... again rambling nonsense I said they wouldnt have the interaction and family bond dogs crave.. they are social creatures, all they want is to be with their families.. not locked in a pen 24/7 in the garden looking in

Flippyfloppy

OP regarding your original question about the insulation of the shed, it might be an idea to go the whole hog and get a concrete shed constructed and insulate that. It would be secure and not too cold during our sometimes cold winters, and not too hot during the summer!

The thing with wooden sheds is that they can get weathered, develop leaks and need replacing/maintenance down the line. I think you can possibly buy steel insulated sheds also. I would think insulating the building would be better than relying solely on blankets , heat lamps etc. while of course these could be added

thehouses

Some crazy responses here! I have seen Kingspan insulated kennels on donedeal, some build them to be a full size garden shed. That or a shed built with blocks would be good, I don't like timber sheds or kennels as they need extra maintenance and can be chewed.

Lemlin

cocker5 wrote: »

Never said dogs wouldnt be cared for... again rambling nonsense I said they wouldnt have the interaction and family bond dogs crave.. they are social creatures, all they want is to be with their families.. not locked in a pen 24/7 in the garden looking in

That's a very "urban" response. We had terriers when I was growing up. They rarely entered the house. I grew up on a farm though where work was constantly outside so the dogs got plenty of interaction.

My own dogs spend time inside and outside. I feel that's best for them. I wouldn't agree with a dog being inside 22/23 hours a day either, particularly in this good weather.

I still know plenty of local people with dogs who would never enter their homes but get plenty of interaction on their farms.

gramar

I'm amazed at some of the responses on here. There must be some dogs with a room to themselves and 4 poster beds. Dogs weren't born to live in houses.

There is nothing wrong with keeping a dog outside. In this case there are two so they have company. Once they have a reasonable amount of space and a decent kennel that's dry and orientated away from prevailing winds they'll be fine. If you build one, a pallet is a good way of raising it from ground level to keep them warmer.

If they have social contact and get the love and affection and walks they need then there is no reason why they won't be the same happy dogs when they're outside. Now is the time to do it before they get used to being inside the new house. If they are put straight outside from the start they won't mind.

cocker5

Lemlin wrote: »

That's a very "urban" response. We had terriers when I was growing up. They rarely entered the house. I grew up on a farm though where work was constantly outside so the dogs got plenty of interaction.

My own dogs spend time inside and outside. I feel that's best for them. I wouldn't agree with a dog being inside 22/23 hours a day either, particularly in this good weather.

I still know plenty of local people with dogs who would never enter their homes but get plenty of interaction on their farms.

Maybe an urban response but many many dogs live in urban areas.. in small pens down the back of an average sized 3 bed semi garden.....where people do not spend lots of time outdoors but in fact inside watching TV etc.... doing house chores...kids stuck infront of ipads / ebox etc its a fact of urban modern days life regretably.

Dogs who are living on farms etc are a different story alltogether, someone works on the farm daily, usually more than 2 dogs etc, so you cant really compare farms and urban living with regard to dogs lifestyle.

gramar....

Just to point out my dog doesnt have a four poster bed... just some vet bed and a plastic dog bed..... although he would like one... maybe i should invest! He currently sleeps in our kitchen but we do have a spare room... so maybe ill move him in there with a four poster bed.... and maybe his own xbox too...

Your still missing the point... nobody said a dog sleeping outside was wrong.. BUT having a dog sleeping outside, in a pen, 24/7 never being allowed inside the house (in other words left in a pen until (if) they get walked) isnt right by any standards

Graces7

gramar wrote: »

I'm amazed at some of the responses on here. There must be some dogs with a room to themselves and 4 poster beds. Dogs weren't born to live in houses.

There is nothing wrong with keeping a dog outside. In this case there are two so they have company. Once they have a reasonable amount of space and a decent kennel that's dry and orientated away from prevailing winds they'll be fine. If you build one, a pallet is a good way of raising it from ground level to keep them warmer.

If they have social contact and get the love and affection and walks they need then there is no reason why they won't be the same happy dogs when they're outside. Now is the time to do it before they get used to being inside the new house. If they are put straight outside from the start they won't mind.

no four poster beds here but safety. sure they have their own room. dogs were born to be companions for most of us here

Graces7

andreac wrote: »

Yes, that's you Graces, im talking about in general.

A lot of people can and do leave their dogs out in the garden during the day. I know i can leave mine out for a few hours if i go out and there's no problems.

no such thing as in general

ThirdMan

You can keep your dogs outside if there's no other option. But you have to appreciate that it's not the best option for them. Make sure you have appropriate shelter and warm bedding. Insulation and a special lamp/bulb are also things to consider.

You say that the cats and dogs don't get along. Well if that's the case then I don't see how you're ever going to have the dogs inside. And if you can get them to get along then why not go the whole way and have them live together? I'm not trying to catch you out. I'm just trying to help you arrive at the best solution.

I know from experience that best intentions are not enough in these situations. You say you'll spend enough time with them in the garden, along with their daily walk, but it won't work out that way. Sometimes it's just too cold, wet and boring to be standing outside punching in time with your dog. It's fun hanging out with your pet when you're doing it at your leisure, but it's a chore when you're only doing it because it needs to be done. You'll know from living with dogs that the best and easiest way to spend time with them is having them inside. They love just lying around, relaxing.

You need to be honest with yourself about how this is going to work. If the dogs are going to be outside 24/7 then you will not be caring for them properly. Plenty of people do it, and years ago it seemed like everyone used to do it. But our understanding of dogs has come on leaps and bounds in recent years and decades. Being on their own for so long is not good for them.

You're going to have to face up to the cat/dog issue. That is the root of your problem. Can the cats go outside for a few hours each night while the dogs are inside? That's not a great solution to be honest, but you need to work something out.

Also, it will effect your dogs behaviour. No doubt about that. I was on holidays for two weeks last summer. My brother, who loves dogs, fed and walked him. But in reality he was on his own for 22 hours a day. When I came home he was different. He seemed timid and didn't want to come inside. I had to drag him in to bed where normally I can't get him out. It took him a few days to get back into the swing of things, but then he was back to his normal, happy self. But that was only because his old routine returned and he was back indoors. In your case the old routine will be gone, permanently. I'm not sure what I'm gonna do the next time I go away but I won't be leaving him on his own, that's for sure.

Plenty of people have their dogs outdoors and it works for them, but I'd argue that's because they've grown up that way and they spend plenty of time with their owner. Your dogs sound like they're going to be outside all of the time.

Best of luck with whatever you do. You sound like you want the best for them.

Theanswers

Dog's sleeping outside will cause them no bother. I know plenty of dogs whom sleep outside and are quite happy. Many wouldn't even want to enter the house.

As long as someone gives them attention, works about outside daily they will be happy.

andreac

Graces7 wrote: »

no such thing as in general

Huh? Yes there is. I was saying a lot of people would leave their dogs out during the day in a garden, thats in general.:rolleyes:

cocker5

andreac wrote: »

Huh? Yes there is. I was saying a lot of people would leave their dogs out during the day in a garden, thats in general.:rolleyes:

I really wish they wouldnt... its faaar too dangerous with dog theifs etc.
My guy is in the kitchen quiet happily sleeping all day (well 3 days a week the other two he's up in his grandparents running around on an acre)...

I would NEVER leave him alone in my garden even though its very secure and on a cul de sac so not much traffic.....

Main reason is I would be terrifed he would be taken.. and secondly I would hate him barking all day annoying my neighbours - not thats he is a barker but if left alone i reckon he would become one.

borderlinemeath

gramar wrote: »

I'm amazed at some of the responses on here. There must be some dogs with a room to themselves and 4 poster beds. Dogs weren't born to live in houses.

Your joke about dogs having a room to themselves is COMPLETELY at odds to what a dog actually wants. Human company. They would be pretty unhappy in a room to themselves.

Dogs became domesticated as companion animals. There's a world of difference. The whole point of dogs being inside with their humans is the companionship and social interaction they get with their family, and they can get that outside too, once their human family is with them. I have no objections to outdoor dogs, once they get their socialisation needs fulfilled during the day. My own dogs spend a huge amount of time outside - with me.

There is nothing wrong with keeping a dog outside. In this case there are two so they have company. Once they have a reasonable amount of space and a decent kennel that's dry and orientated away from prevailing winds they'll be fine. If you build one, a pallet is a good way of raising it from ground level to keep them warmer.

Dogs don't necessarily get by on having another dog as a companion. While two dogs can entertain themselves and tire each other out to a degree, they would far prefer their human family to be there. Sometimes two dogs can be double trouble, encouraging each other to dig, or damage or will rile each other up with barking.

If they have social contact and get the love and affection and walks they need then there is no reason why they won't be the same happy dogs when they're outside. Now is the time to do it before they get used to being inside the new house. If they are put straight outside from the start they won't mind.

If they have the adequate social contact. Plenty of dogs don't. Many a dog I've fostered for my local rescue that didn't even have the most basic housetraining because they were never let indoors at all. I'm sure the OP is going to do his level best to ensure that they get plenty of attention to compensate for the upheavel. He wouldn't be on here asking for advice otherwise.

andreac

cocker5 wrote: »

I really wish they wouldnt... its faaar too dangerous with dog theifs etc.
My guy is in the kitchen quiet happily sleeping all day (well 3 days a week the other two he's up in his grandparents running around on an acre)...

I would NEVER leave him alone in my garden even though its very secure and on a cul de sac so not much traffic.....

Main reason is I would be terrifed he would be taken.. and secondly I would hate him barking all day annoying my neighbours - not thats he is a barker but if left alone i reckon he would become one.

There are some dogs that wouldnt be prime targets for thiefs, good luck trying to get in to my garden with 3 Rottweilers in it

I do understand that its a risk leaving them out. I was terrified my fella when he was a pup would be stolen so he was never outside in the garden as a pup.
Mine arent left on their own anyway for too long and thankfully my 2 older ones can be given the run of the house all day if ever needs be and they wouldnt do a thing.
The pup on the other hand is a diff story lol. But im rarely gone for that long so they wouldnt be outside for too long on their own and mine come to work with me too so again arent left on their own for too long.

gramar

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Your joke about dogs having a room to themselves is COMPLETELY at odds to what a dog actually wants. Human company. They would be pretty unhappy in a room to themselves.

Dogs became domesticated as companion animals. There's a world of difference. The whole point of dogs being inside with their humans is the companionship and social interaction they get with their family, and they can get that outside too, once their human family is with them. I have no objections to outdoor dogs, once they get their socialisation needs fulfilled during the day. My own dogs spend a huge amount of time outside - with me.



Dogs don't necessarily get by on having another dog as a companion. While two dogs can entertain themselves and tire each other out to a degree, they would far prefer their human family to be there. Sometimes two dogs can be double trouble, encouraging each other to dig, or damage or will rile each other up with barking.



If they have the adequate social contact. Plenty of dogs don't. Many a dog I've fostered for my local rescue that didn't even have the most basic housetraining because they were never let indoors at all. I'm sure the OP is going to do his level best to ensure that they get plenty of attention to compensate for the upheavel. He wouldn't be on here asking for advice otherwise.

So you've more or less agreed with me in everything that I said!

borderlinemeath

gramar wrote: »

So you've more or less agreed with me in everything that I said!

Eh, no. You have the attidude that "ah sure they'll be fine, dogs were meant to be outdoors, they can keep each other company". It's not that simple, they need interaction with their family and as a previous poster stated, sometimes in the depths of winter when it's lashing rain, the last thing you want to do is go outside and spend time with the dogs because you "have to".

OP, would it be possible to get a large crate and crate the cats in the evening for bedtime? At least then they are separate and the dogs will still have their indoor bed and not feel completely left out. Or how about the bathroom for the cats for night time?

cocker5

andreac wrote: »

There are some dogs that wouldnt be prime targets for thiefs, good luck trying to get in to my garden with 3 Rottweilers in it

I do understand that its a risk leaving them out. I was terrified my fella when he was a pup would be stolen so he was never outside in the garden as a pup.
Mine arent left on their own anyway for too long and thankfully my 2 older ones can be given the run of the house all day if ever needs be and they wouldnt do a thing.
The pup on the other hand is a diff story lol. But im rarely gone for that long so they wouldnt be outside for too long on their own and mine come to work with me too so again arent left on their own for too long.

Thats true maybe I could borrow one of your rotties... my guy a total softie and has a permanent sign *please rob me or this house* above his head

When my guy was a pup he too would "rearrange the house" but now he older he's happy chillaxing in the kitchen!

Gotta love our furry friends... life wouldnt be the same without them

cocker5

gramar wrote: »

So you've more or less agreed with me in everything that I said!

Quiet the opposite Im afraid... read the post again!

gramar

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Eh, no. You have the attidude that "ah sure they'll be fine, dogs were meant to be outdoors, they can keep each other company". It's not that simple, they need interaction with their family and as a previous poster stated, sometimes in the depths of winter when it's lashing rain, the last thing you want to do is go outside and spend time with the dogs because you "have to".

OP, would it be possible to get a large crate and crate the cats in the evening for bedtime? At least then they are separate and the dogs will still have their indoor bed and not feel completely left out. Or how about the bathroom for the cats for night time?

I don't have that attitude. You didn't read my post.

let me quote myself for you

'If they have social contact and get the love and affection and walks they need then there is no reason why they won't be the same happy dogs when they're outside'

runawaybishop

larrlin24 wrote: »

I'm in the process of moving and our new house doesn't have anywhere for both of my dogs to be inside. I'm planning on building them an area in the garden that's fenced off and buying a large shed that they can take shelter in. They're going to be full time outdoor dogs as this is what works best for us, but I want them to be safe and happy. They're used to being indoor at night and when it's cold, but that won't be possible when I move so I'm trying to plan things in advance. Is there a certain shed I can buy that is insulated? Or will a normal garden shed be okay for them as I'll obviously be putting their beds in with tons of blankets etc. I want them to be cool enough in the summer, and warm enough in the winter. Any advice is greatly appreciated!

If you build a normal garden shed stick an insulated kennel into it, they prefer smaller spaces to rest. Alternatively you cold build an insulated block shed which could also be used by yourself for other purposes. You should buy a temp activated heat lamp, any co-op or farm supplier will stock them, for the winter.

Admldj

Some of the responses on here are ridiculous! the op didnt say the dogs were to abandoned to the yard to die, they are there to live and sleep,they will still be walked ,played with, fed watered and loved and believe me they will be happy, especially with the summer coming in, fresh air and sunshine all day, my dogs (2 labs) have never been in the house for more than a couple of mins and they are the happiest and healthiest dogs you could come across; the op knows their dogs and wouldn't have decided to put them out if there were doubts about their health/happiness as long as they have a decent size run and a good kennel all will be grand.

gramar

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Your joke about dogs having a room to themselves is COMPLETELY at odds to what a dog actually wants. Human company. They would be pretty unhappy in a room to themselves.

Dogs became domesticated as companion animals. There's a world of difference. The whole point of dogs being inside with their humans is the companionship and social interaction they get with their family, and they can get that outside too, once their human family is with them. I have no objections to outdoor dogs, once they get their socialisation needs fulfilled during the day. My own dogs spend a huge amount of time outside - with me.
I AGREE! If they are outside in the right conditions then there is no reason why they wouldn't be happy!


Dogs don't necessarily get by on having another dog as a companion. While two dogs can entertain themselves and tire each other out to a degree, they would far prefer their human family to be there. Sometimes two dogs can be double trouble, encouraging each other to dig, or damage or will rile each other up with barking. I agree but I'd prefer to have 2 together and not one on their own. They can be trouble but it's not a given



If they have the adequate social contact. Plenty of dogs don't. Many a dog I've fostered for my local rescue that didn't even have the most basic housetraining because they were never let indoors at all. I'm sure the OP is going to do his level best to ensure that they get plenty of attention to compensate for the upheavel. He wouldn't be on here asking for advice otherwise. Again I agree but in the right conditions as I've said...social interaction, affection, proper walks then they'll be fine

So again as I've said we more less agree. You're looking at the worse case scenario which of course can happen. I'm looking at the a scenario where things are done properly ..decent sizes pen, good kennel and proper attentio nand care. It's not the same as being inside but being inside isn't automatically a perfect solution. They could be there for hours alone in a confined space. I'd never use a crate for example but that's only me!

gramar

Admldj wrote: »

Some of the responses on here are ridiculous! the op didnt say the dogs were to abandoned to the yard to die, they are there to live and sleep,they will still be walked ,played with, fed watered and loved and believe me they will be happy, especially with the summer coming in, fresh air and sunshine all day, my dogs (2 labs) have never been in the house for more than a couple of mins and they are the happiest and healthiest dogs you could come across; the op knows their dogs and wouldn't have decided to put them out if there were doubts about their health/happiness as long as they have a decent size run and a good kennel all will be grand.

Couldn't have put it better myself!

cocker5

gramar wrote: »

I don't have that attitude. You didn't read my post.

let me quote myself for you

'If they have social contact and get the love and affection and walks they need then there is no reason why they won't be the same happy dogs when they're outside'

I dunno different people have different views on what is adequate social interaction ... one hour a day... two or less??

The fact is being outside 24/7, they will not be getting proper social interaction daily... unless the dog owner will spend each evening outside with them.... from 6pm to 10pm (if you know what i mean) and lets all be honest life just doesnt work like that.. people are tired in the evenings, its could be cold... raining... dark etc it just wont happen.

Best way for a dog to get social interaction is to be part of the family, in the home (regardless of its sleeping arrangements) , interacting with the family all the time the family are home... thats what a dog wants... in reality all they want is to be with their humans and thats it.

All the walks, posh dog food, lamp heaters etc wont make up for all the want is our company its really as simple as that.

And let be frank here being a 24/7 outdoor dog in 95% of the situations isnt fair on the dog - simple

cocker5

Admldj wrote: »

Some of the responses on here are ridiculous! the op didnt say the dogs were to abandoned to the yard to die, they are there to live and sleep,they will still be walked ,played with, fed watered and loved and believe me they will be happy, especially with the summer coming in, fresh air and sunshine all day, my dogs (2 labs) have never been in the house for more than a couple of mins and they are the happiest and healthiest dogs you could come across; the op knows their dogs and wouldn't have decided to put them out if there were doubts about their health/happiness as long as they have a decent size run and a good kennel all will be grand.

ah sure it will be grand.... the dogs who have been house dogs all thier lives, banished to the garden.. ahh sure they'll be grand.. they are only dogs afterall

your dogs are happy (or so you think) as they dont know any different...

why not try a test...

take them out of their pen for 2 weeks and allow them in the house to relax, sleep etc....

then dump them back outside and let them choose where they want to be...

hhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm no prizes for guessing where they will choose. :rolleyes: