New Dog Was Fed On Raw Meat=Aggressive

beauty101

So last Friday we got a new dog. As it turns out she's the mother of our other dog, her owner was ill and couldn't look after her. She's a 4 yr old poodle. A few months ago for some bizarre reason beyond me, her old owner began feeding her raw meat. We had met this dog before on several occasions and she was always great with our dog (her puppy). Now she's continuously growling and snapping at her.

At first we thought this may be due to the stress of a new home but I'm wondering if it could be related to the raw meat. We've since changed her diet to the same as our own dog, which is hard dog food from the vet's clinic. She's eating happily but still always on the look out for meat.

Any ideas how to stop this aggression towards our dog? Will it be short term or a slow process?

meoklmrk91

beauty101 wrote: »

So last Friday we got a new dog. As it turns out she's the mother of our other dog, her owner was ill and couldn't look after her. She's a 4 yr old poodle. A few months ago for some bizarre reason beyond me, her old owner began feeding her raw meat. We had met this dog before on several occasions and she was always great with our dog (her puppy). Now she's continuously growling and snapping at her.

At first we thought this may be due to the stress of a new home but I'm wondering if it could be related to the raw meat. We've since changed her diet to the same as our own dog, which is hard dog food from the vet's clinic. She's eating happily but still always on the look out for meat.

Any ideas how to stop this aggression towards our dog? Will it be short term or a slow process?

This is absolutely 100% nothing to do with the fact that she was fed raw food, for some reason this myth grew legs over the years and people seem to believe it. Many owners feed RAW because it suits them and their dog, people do it for a wide variety of reasons, they like to know exactly what their dog is getting, they can source RAW foods cheaply and easily, it can help with many medical conditions. I don't feed RAW because it isn't easy for me to source and dry food suits both me and my dog.

When I moved last year it took my dog about a month to settle in, he wasn't himself. This dog has moved home, has new owners and now has a puppy to deal with, it is a lot of change and you need to give her time to settle and get used to all these massive changes. I would recommend that you set an area that's just for her so she can get away from everything and the pup, a nice comfy bed in a quiet place with a kong or something similar so she can relax. It sounds like its all just a bit too much for her which to me is understandable.

Hooked

It ain't the food... That's for certain.

We feed part raw - and yes, Hugo 'much prefers' it to kibble. There are tonnes of benefits to feeding raw. Also be aware that most vets have ulterior motives to pushing a certain brand of dry food.

We introduced a puppy over 2 months ago. Did they 'just get on' straight away? Hell no! And they're both males. Like you, same sex pairings are 'not advised' but... With proper introductions and time-apart, can work!

As with everything we do with our dogs, it's a slow introduction, phased in, over time. 2 months on... They can be left alone together. 2 months ago? Hugo would have killed Jack if left alone together.

Food MUST be fed separately. Toys not shared or left 'in between' them from the off... Again... Built up over time, they are taught to get along and share a toy or feeding area. Supervised!!!

In short. It ain't the raw meat. You can't just 'expect' them to just get along.

beauty101

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

This is absolutely 100% nothing to do with the fact that she was fed raw food, for some reason this myth grew legs over the years and people seem to believe it. Many owners feed RAW because it suits them and their dog, people do it for a wide variety of reasons, they like to know exactly what their dog is getting, they can source RAW foods cheaply and easily, it can help with many medical conditions. I don't feed RAW because it isn't easy for me to source and dry food suits both me and my dog.

When I moved last year it took my dog about a month to settle in, he wasn't himself. This dog has moved home, has new owners and now has a puppy to deal with, it is a lot of change and you need to give her time to settle and get used to all these massive changes. I would recommend that you set an area that's just for her so she can get away from everything and the pup, a nice comfy bed in a quiet place with a kong or something similar so she can relax. It sounds like its all just a bit too much for her which to me is understandable.

Thanks for your advice, a kong sounds like a good idea!

borderlinemeath

Jeepers, if raw meat = aggressive my dogs would have savaged each other or me a long time ago!:D. Not being funny OP but feeding raw meat is nothing bizarre at all, sure what did dogs eat before there was such a thing as processed dry food? In fact to me, feeding dried processed food every day of a dogs life is bizarre, but that's for another thread .

As others have said it's a myth, there's absolutely no substance in the 'type' of food being a reason for aggression/tension between two dogs. However, the dog you took in could have a touch of resource guarding towards certain things such as food, or people, or is just out of sorts with being thrust into a new home, with new owners, a companion, albeit a familial companion and is now sharing everything that they once had to themselves in their original home. Are both bitches intact? Sometimes bitches can clash, hormones can play a part as well.

I think once a dog gets a taste of a fresh/raw food as opposed to the same kibble day after day, they're always going to want the good stuff. TBH OP I wouldn't be wasting your money on the stuff the vet plugs as the brands that they tend to push are full of wheat fillers, there's far better foods out there on the market for better value and a far higher meat content, you never know, a different better food might appeal to the dogs palette.

beauty101

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Jeepers, if raw meat = aggressive my dogs would have savaged each other or me a long time ago!:D. Not being funny OP but feeding raw meat is nothing bizarre at all, sure what did dogs eat before there was such a thing as processed dry food? In fact to me, feeding dried processed food every day of a dogs life is bizarre, but that's for another thread .

As others have said it's a myth, there's absolutely no substance in the 'type' of food being a reason for aggression/tension between two dogs. However, the dog you took in could have a touch of resource guarding towards certain things such as food, or people, or is just out of sorts with being thrust into a new home, with new owners, a companion, albeit a familial companion and is now sharing everything that they once had to themselves in their original home. Are both bitches intact? Sometimes bitches can clash, hormones can play a part as well.

I think once a dog gets a taste of a fresh/raw food as opposed to the same kibble day after day, they're always going to want the good stuff. TBH OP I wouldn't be wasting your money on the stuff the vet plugs as the brands that they tend to push are full of wheat fillers, there's far better foods out there on the market for better value and a far higher meat content, you never know, a different better food might appeal to the dogs palette.

Call it naivety but I'd always presumed that raw meat (dogs getting the taste of blood etc) can spark aggression in them...obviously I fell for the myth. She's not bad when it comes to feeding time with the other dog, we feed them at opposite ends of the room and they're both on Royal Canin (that's what my other dog has been on since she was a pup and she loves it and the mum was on it too before the swap to raw meat).

Both the bitches aren't neutured and the pup hasn't been in heat yet however she's not even slightly aggressive, when the mum snaps at her she cowers down and runs away, she's become genuinely afraid of her.

borderlinemeath

beauty101 wrote: »

Call it naivety but I'd always presumed that raw meat (dogs getting the taste of blood etc) can spark aggression in them...obviously I fell for the myth. She's not bad when it comes to feeding time with the other dog, we feed them at opposite ends of the room and they're both on Royal Canin (that's what my other dog has been on since she was a pup and she loves it and the mum was on it too before the swap to raw meat).

Both the bitches aren't neutured and the pup hasn't been in heat yet however she's not even slightly aggressive, when the mum snaps at her she cowers down and runs away, she's become genuinely afraid of her.

How old are both OP? My female doesn't really like jumpy puppies, and even adolescent dogs that are still puppylike, she gives out to them if they come up and look to play or are too boisterous near her, yet she's fairly happy to entertain older dogs once she's met them and had a pleasant greeting with them.

It's still really early days, so give them space and time, and loads of separate affection, you don't want your poor pup to feel hard done by, but you want to make the new dog feel at home too. How are walks together? Walks are a great way for dogs to relax and enjoy each others company on a neutral territory.

tk123

Older females have no problem putting puppies in their place and as long as it's not going too far she's doing you a favour teaching the pup some manners. Before I got my pup I was told to get her around an adult female if possible to keep her in line so arranged play dates with my friend's dog. My 4 year old male still gets fed up with her some times and will tell her off - much much less than when she was very young because she's learnt what's acceptable when playing with him. She's very polite when greeting other dogs which is down to him putting manners on her and saves her getting herself into trouble compared to other puppies who rush in at other dogs annoying them. Puppies get to the stage where older dogs won't entertain them anymore - sounds like you pup's 'puppy license' has expired as far as the mum is concerned
I'd put her back on her original diet too - she could be on it for health reasons that the dry food will aggravate. Both mine are on raw btw - pup has been since she was 9 weeks old as is 100% NOT aggressive.

beauty101

The mother is about 4 yrs old, pup is just over a year. The thing is the pup doesn't really do anything to annoy her, on day one of course she was excited and jumping all over her so it was understandable the older one would be a bit miffed. But even if the pup passes by her she'll start snarling + snapping..in her defence she never actually bites it's more of a threat

DBB

Hopefully they just need some time to adjust to one another, but you may also be discovering why having two females together is more likely to cause trouble of the type you're describing.
Two intact females together can be a difficult combination. A great way to make it more difficult is to add genetic relatedness into the mix... bitches are more likely to have problems with one another when they're closely related.
I've also seen it a number of times, indeed I've seen it with one of my own dogs, where they met their mothers again after a bit of a gap, and mother did not take kindly to being reunited with their offspring at all.
Just tread with care here OP: tensions build up between bitches like nothing else, to the point where they are more likely to boil over in to a potentially disastrous fight. They are often far worse than two males in this regard. I would not be leaving these two alone and unsupervised for some time yet: I would not be completely separating them either, but I would most certainly be keeping one of them in a playpen if I wasn't there to keep a very close eye on things.

Tranceypoo

DBB - do you think one or both of them being spayed makes/would make a difference? If so is it all purely 'hormonal' then?

ShaShaBear

I imagine a lot of it has to do with primal hormonal instinct. Obviously in order to carry on their own genetic line they are going to want to be the female to get pregnant. If there are other females in heat at the same time, it lessens their chance of getting mated with. I know obviously the time for that is long since gone, but I imagine if they were both spayed (since there is no good reason not to spay them) it might calm down a tad. Also, there is the obvious connection in them being mother and daughter. Mammy animals rarely like to keep their kids around once they've learned to fend for themselves. Being trapped in a house with one of them is probably grinding her gears, especially if she was alone in her last home.

Switching the food would make no difference - blood doesn't make a dog aggressive, else they'd all be eating people after licking their own/friend's wounds.

To be honest, the whole thing just sounds like an utterly nasty shock for mama dog, and it will take some getting used to

DBB

Tranceypoo wrote: »

DBB - do you think one or both of them being spayed makes/would make a difference? If so is it all purely 'hormonal' then?

No doubt aggression between females can worsen around the bitch(es) being in heat, and spaying *may* help reduce the aggression between them.
But I wouldn't be banking on it as a cure, because females can be pretty bitchy with one another even when they're spayed, and when they're in the asexual phase of their cycle.
And to complicate things more, with some females, spaying them can actually increase the aggression they're already showing.

Graces7

DBB wrote: »

No doubt aggression between females can worsen around the bitch(es) being in heat, and spaying *may* help reduce the aggression between them.
But I wouldn't be banking on it as a cure, because females can be pretty bitchy with one another even when they're spayed, and when they're in the asexual phase of their cycle.
And to complicate things more, with some females, spaying them can actually increase the aggression they're already showing.

my two, spayed bitches, are,,,,, bitchy to each other, but it is almost always just talk. wee dog was an only dog for five years and bitterly resented the collie

after many years they still will not sleep together but that works too.