NBA Offseason 2014

Paully D

Adrian Wojnarowski @WojYahooNBA
LeBron James has reached to tell Kevin Love of his desire for them to play together with the Cavaliers, front office sources tell Yahoo.

@WindhorstESPN: LeBron intrigued w/Andrew Wiggins' potential but has made clear to Cavs he wants to compete for title now.

Well, that "I know it's going to be a long process with a young team, I'm intrigued by the potential, blah, blah" spiel lasted a long time :pac:

In all seriousness though, Wiggins looks like he'll be superb, Love already is. Giving Wiggins three seasons to really come into his own which seems fair and by that stage LeBron would be heading for 33.

To me it's a no-brainer trade for Minny. Getting a talent like Wiggins on a rookie salary for someone who will leave for nothing in less than a years time is great for the Timberwolves. Getting Love in alongside LeBron and Irving doesn't need justifying for the Cavaliers, but as he's going to walk for free next summer anyway, could the Cavaliers be more forceful? Simmons and co had a good read on it here. A lot of them seem to think anything Cleveland can offer will trump others, there's no need to rush into it and they could wait a few months to see how Wiggins is doing. I can see their point, but you give LeBron what he wants I guess. I'd pull the trigger on the trade if I was them and I'd imagine they gave LeBron some assurances that they'd go all out for Love if he joined. If someone said to any basketball fan that they could have LeBron and Love on their team but it meant giving up Wiggins as the main piece in a trade, everyone would say yes!

One big worry on that Cavaliers team would be injuries. Kyrie has had problems, Love has had problems, as has Varajeo. Miller can hardly walk. Defense also. Mark Titus makes a good point in the above article re: defense, saying:

I’m just not for giving up Wiggins. A lot of people seem to misunderstand the talk surrounding Wiggins and assume that because he’s described as a guy with a ton of potential, he must therefore be a gamble. But just because his ceiling is so high doesn’t mean his cellar is just as low. In truth, even if Wiggins never asserts himself offensively as consistently as he should, he’s still likely going to be a 15-plus PPG guy and one of the best perimeter defenders in the league.

That last bit is huge. The Cavs are in a great spot as it stands by having a young guy who can help LeBron carry the offensive load (Irving) and another who can help carry the defensive load (Wiggins). Wiggins on the Cavs means LeBron won’t always have to guard the other team’s best player. It also means Cleveland could conceivably have the two best perimeter defenders in the game three years from now. That might not sound as sexy as a 26-and-12 guy joining LeBron, until you realize that a Cavs defense with Wiggins and LeBron will get infinity steals, those steals will trigger fast breaks, and those fast breaks will end with one of those guys putting his nuts above the rim.

I feel sorry for Wiggins though. Going from potentially playing alongside LeBron and being the #3 option on the team with no real pressure to do too much to soon, to now probably having to become "the man" in Minnesota straight away. That's rough.

Dublin Red Devil

Aye you could see this coming. It was made pretty clear that as soon as LeBron was secured, Cavs were looking for K.Love They are now real championship contenders, having added arguably two of the top 3 players in the league

ButtersSuki

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Aye you could see this coming. It was made pretty clear that as soon as LeBron was secured, Cavs were looking for K.Love They are now real championship contenders, having added arguably two of the top 3* players in the league

* the other being Paul George :rolleyes::D:D

Dublin Red Devil

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Jordan is the GOAT. Undisputed

Kobe is a top 10 or top 15 player all time depending on who you ask

Lebron still has some years to go. Probably top 10. Could put himself in top 5 consideration if gets few more rings

no way id put kobe outside top 10

blake griffins reaction to a donald sterling joke at the espys

http://www.thescore.com/nba/news/538643

Dublin Red Devil

Cali Angry Roller-skate wrote: »

no way id put Kobe outside top 10

I'm not so sure, For me he's just on the border. Hovers between 9th and 11th on my list.

Lets go.

Jordan
Johnson
Russell
Kareem
Bird
Chamberlain
Robertson
West
Duncan
O'Neal

James (pending)

Nuri Sahin

I agree with... DRD on Kobe O_o

Nuri Sahin

I'd feel for sorry for Wiggins if he ends up in that hell hole.

Dublin Red Devil

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

I'm not so sure, For me he's just on the border. Hovers between 9th and 11th on my list.

Lets go.

Jordan
Johnson
Russell
Kareem
Bird
Chamberlain
Robertson
West
Duncan
O'Neal

James (pending)

hards to argue when you put it that way:D

buyer95

I love basketball.






(When it's played like this.)

Nuri Sahin

Nuri Sahin wrote: »

I'd feel for sorry for Wiggins if he ends up in that hell hole.

it would be a shame. a few years of learning off lebron before taking the mantle and he could potentially end up an all time great and he could get that fabled 6 rings

Paully D

Saunders should be sectioned if this is true. The picture is taken from Pro Basketball Talk:

D2D

Rumours are we offered Wiggins, Bennett and a 1st rounder to Minny for K Love and it's been rejected as they don't think that's enough value.........

NufcNavan

lol

Dublin Red Devil

Dare_2_defy wrote: »

Rumours are we offered Wiggins, Bennett and a 1st rounder to Minny for K Love and it's been rejected as they don't think that's enough value.........

T wolves might as well take it. There's nothing to be gained by holding on to Love anymore

ButtersSuki

Dare_2_defy wrote: »

Rumours are we offered Wiggins, Bennett and a 1st rounder to Minny for K Love and it's been rejected as they don't think that's enough value.........

They don't really have a choice at this stage….they're damned if they do and damned if they don't so might as well hang in and see what else comes along. Seems they want Klay Thompson more than Wiggins.

They're probably looking at the Melo-Knicks trade (pretty much the exact same situation) from a few years ago and thinking (rightly) that Love is a more valuable asset so deck it, let's see what we can get?

I know this will sound like hindsight, but the smart money would either have given Love a max last time around (they didn't, they didn't even give him 5 years!) OR traded him last summer when they had 2 years of a contract to bargain with. Everyone knew Love wasn't going to resign as far back as 2012 so if they don't get something out of the trade it's on them. I did read one piece however which said that they wouldn't mind losing him for nothing next summer from a cap perspective as it will allow them to rebuild more cost effectively - so you can see upside to that too. Let's face it, I don't think anyone seems Minnesota winning a championship in the next 20 years regardless of what Love does.

If I'm Love, I can force a trade now or in February when I'll have much more leverage as the clock is ticking……or I can sit and wait until next summer and move wherever I want then. Logically, Cleveland is where I'd want top go - to play with LeBron and crucially play in the East.

Paully D

ButtersSuki wrote: »

They don't really have a choice at this stage….they're damned if they do and damned if they don't so might as well hang in and see what else comes along. Seems they want Klay Thompson more than Wiggins.

They're probably looking at the Melo-Knicks trade (pretty much the exact same situation) from a few years ago and thinking (rightly) that Love is a more valuable asset so deck it, let's see what we can get?

I know this will sound like hindsight, but the smart money would either have given Love a max last time around (they didn't, they didn't even give him 5 years!) OR traded him last summer when they had 2 years of a contract to bargain with. Everyone knew Love wasn't going to resign as far back as 2012 so if they don't get something out of the trade it's on them. I did read one piece however which said that they wouldn't mind losing him for nothing next summer from a cap perspective as it will allow them to rebuild more cost effectively - so you can see upside to that too. Let's face it, I don't think anyone seems Minnesota winning a championship in the next 20 years regardless of what Love does.

If I'm Love, I can force a trade now or in February when I'll have much more leverage as the clock is ticking……or I can sit and wait until next summer and move wherever I want then. Logically, Cleveland is where I'd want top go - to play with LeBron and crucially play in the East.

The danger they face is that the closer it comes to trade deadline day without moving him on, they could end up with offers of scraps compared to what they're being offered now. Either that, or lose him for nothing.

The ideal scenario from my own point of view if I'm a Cleveland fan would be for Love to coast through the season in Minny and join as a free agent this time next year. That would allow them to keep Wiggins and essentially have a core four of Irving/Wiggins/LeBron/Love which would be a ridiculously good line-up. Cleveland would challenge for the Eastern title this year in any case, hell, they might even end up winning it. I'm just not sure if LeBron wants to wait the year for him to become a free agent. The danger in that would be someone would offer Love a deal that trumps Cleveland, but if he really wants to play with LeBron, in a soft conference where he'd have a great shot of making the Finals every year for the duration of his contract, then money won't matter all that much.

If I'm Saunders, I take any deal including Wiggins, Bennett and first round picks. There really is no point keeping Love now. He's not going to go 100% next season and Minny are doing nothing anyway. If Saunders loses him for nothing especially if Wiggins is on the table, then he's a complete and utter idiot.

ButtersSuki

Paully D wrote: »

The danger they face is that the closer it comes to trade deadline day without moving him on, they could end up with offers of scraps compared to what they're being offered now. Either that, or lose him for nothing.

The ideal scenario from my own point of view if I'm a Cleveland fan would be for Love to coast through the season in Minny and join as a free agent this time next year. That would allow them to keep Wiggins and essentially have a core four of Irving/Wiggins/LeBron/Love which would be a ridiculously good line-up. Cleveland would challenge for the Eastern title this year in any case, hell, they might even end up winning it. I'm just not sure if LeBron wants to wait the year for him to become a free agent. The danger in that would be someone would offer Love a deal that trumps Cleveland, but if he really wants to play with LeBron, in a soft conference where he'd have a great shot of making the Finals every year for the duration of his contract, then money won't matter all that much.

If I'm Saunders, I take any deal including Wiggins, Bennett and first round picks. There really is no point keeping Love now. He's not going to go 100% next season and Minny are doing nothing anyway. If Saunders loses him for nothing especially if Wiggins is on the table, then he's a complete and utter idiot.

Yeah but what if that article I read (think it was si.com) that says they don't mind losing him for nothing - then they're the ones playing with the loaded hand. I keep referring to the Melo trade as the same type of situation - if he waited he could have walked for free but because New York gave up so much to get him early he effectively crippled New York for a few years after the trade and some would argue for the next few too, and that's before we talk of his contract. So if you're Minnesota, you probably figure you can get more (not less) for Love if a bidding war breaks out between two or more teams - be that now or be that in Feb. There's not a team in the league that wouldn't want Love.

This is a delicate one and one that will have a few twists and turns to go yet, with the power switching sides a few times during that period.

Paully D

Bulls close to signing PG Aaron Brooks per ESPN (Marc Stein). I'd be very happy with that. He provides an offensive spark off the bench that Hinrich just simply cannot. I'm hoping he'll have a similar impact to Augustin and Robinson have had in recent seasons in Thibs' system.

padraig_f

Paully D wrote: »

Bulls close to signing PG Aaron Brooks per ESPN (Marc Stein). I'd be very happy with that. He provides an offensive spark off the bench that Hinrich just simply cannot. I'm hoping he'll have a similar impact to Augustin and Robinson have had in recent seasons in Thibs' system.

Don't know him that well, but seems to have solid numbers for a min salary guy. Definitely a need to replace DJ.

buyer95

OT.
Bill Russell collapsed at the podium, while doing a speaking engagement.

Witness Michael Rooney tells The Associated Press that Russell was telling a story about Wilt Chamberlain to a roomful of Konica Minolta employees when he started to sway at the podium and then fell backward.
Rooney says Russell seemed to be conscious as hotel personnel and first responders came to his aid. The meeting was cut short and attendees left.
Russell, a five-time NBA MVP, is considered one of the best players in basketball history.
He won 11 championships in 13 years as a center with the Celtics. As a player-coach for the last two, he was the first black head coach in a major U.S. pro sport.
He was inducted into the Hall of Fame in 1975, was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom in 2010 and was honored last year with a statue outside Boston's City Hall.

-NBA.com

Get well big fella.

ButtersSuki

Reading more on the Love potential trades:

Wiggins hasn't signed his rookie contract yet and can't be traded for 30days after he does, so this will run for a while yet.

Love reportedly said he will resign with the Warriors if they trade for him.

Boston might yet be a dark horse in this race as they have the most picks to give to Minnesota having amassed a ton of picks over the last few years (esp. From the Nets trades). Rookie contracts are the cheapest way to build a team in the NBA which in turn will give them cap space to land a superstar.....in theory, though you can't see many guys wanting to be a star in a T Wolves jersey.

Te issue with Boston is would love resign its a poor team compared to some of the others and he'd be resigning for potential more than current level

ButtersSuki

Cali Angry Roller-skate wrote: »

Te issue with Boston is would love resign its a poor team compared to some of the others and he'd be resigning for potential more than current level

He has flirted with them so you'd have to think there is some interest on his side. Agree it would be more long term ambition than the win now situation Cleveland offers but Love is only 25 and maybe he wants to be "the man" as opposed to LeJon's sidekick. But Ainge is a canny operator and has previous in pulling more than one big signing out of his backside (Garnett and Ray Ray) - who knows what the plan is long term. Still think it's a long shot but as a Celtics' fan I'd love to see Love in a Boston jersey.

ButtersSuki

ButtersSuki wrote: »

He has flirted with them so you'd have to think there is some interest on his side. Agree it would be more long term ambition than the win now situation Cleveland offers but Love is only 25 and maybe he wants to be "the man" as opposed to LeJon's sidekick. But Ainge is a canny operator and has previous in pulling more than one big signing out of his backside (Garnett and Ray Ray) - who knows what the plan is long term. Still think it's a long shot but as a Celtics' fan I'd love to see Love in a Boston jersey.

I love it to but I'd hate to give up both Ko and sullinger and Marcus smart for that matter and flip said he has no interest in draft picks

ButtersSuki

Cali Angry Roller-skate wrote: »

I love it to but I'd hate to give up both Ko and sullinger and Marcus smart for that matter and flip said he has no interest in draft picks

Yeah but the longer this runs with no deal everything is in play. If you're Love and you have the chance of being Larry Bird Mark 2 in Boston that had to be attractive.

ButtersSuki

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Yeah but the longer this runs with no deal everything is in play. If you're Love and you have the chance of being Larry Bird Mark 2 in Boston that had to be attractive.

Hard to argue that plus they have a bit of cap flexibility next year even if rondo stays

Dublin Red Devil

Brian Windhorst just said on ESPN2 that the Pacers are in Detroit for talks on deal with the Pistons. No names mentioned though.
Hopefully something involving Gregg Monroe.

NufcNavan

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Brian Windhorst just said on ESPN2 that the Pacers are in Detroit for talks on deal with the Pistons. No names mentioned though.
Hopefully something involving Gregg Monroe.

Detroit ain't giving up Monroe. No way.

Could be J Smoove. I hope not though.

Dublin Red Devil

I miss Lance already. Pacers fcked up here, Well done Hornets