Scottish Independence discussion area

Not2Good

who the fug wrote: »

Newfoundland 1948

Good on you, we have two now, faith restored

LoTR

Looks like the Irish are the only real "bravehearts" when it comes to the question of English rule in this part of the world.

Not2Good

Balmed Out wrote: »

quite a few have turned it down

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence_referendum

Cheers, very interesting Article

force eleven

Not2Good wrote: »

A question that someone may have already answered; has any state/region in the world ever turned down independence voluntarily in history?

Us.To Brussels. Reference Lisbon & Nice.

munchkin_utd

eeepaulo wrote: »

Somebody mentioned quebec, twice.

indeed, and should there say be a vote in places like the "free state of Bavaria" (to give it its proper title), it'd be also a no for complete independence.

Why, because when you have so much power locally at city or regional level you can live with the big stuff like defence, or setting standards for mundane stuff like fire regulations or how roadsigns look etc, being dealt with on a larger basis.

LorMal

LoTR wrote: »

Looks like the Irish are the only real "bravehearts" when it comes to the question of English rule in this part of the world.

Yee Har, more Braveheart

Chrissybhoy

Why is it anyone on here that supports a UI gets run down called armchair republicans nationalists and the rest. Some people are still passionate about UI. Is a sin now to be patriotic. Would the same people get upset if they were called weak said that they were full of fear and hypocrites

First Up

force eleven wrote: »

Us.To Brussels. Reference Lisbon & Nice.

Don't forget all fifty of the United States.

Not2Good

force eleven wrote: »

Us.To Brussels. Reference Lisbon & Nice.

Yes, begs the question 'What is Independence?"

eeepaulo

Not2Good wrote: »

Yes, begs the question 'What is Independence?"

Nooooooo, start a new thread, preferably on a different website

Wossack

either way it falls (was optimistic for a Yes), gotta be impressed by that 85% voter turnout - incredible really

iDave

Not2Good wrote: »

Yes, begs the question 'What is Independence?"

Something Cork people will never have.

2ndcoming

Chrissybhoy wrote: »

Why is it anyone on here that supports a UI gets run down called armchair republicans nationalists and the rest. Some people are still passionate about UI. Is a sin now to be patriotic. Would the same people get upset if they were called weak said that they were full of fear and hypocrites

There's an incredibly strong anti-Irish sentiment on boards. A general consensus of Sinn Fein should be tried for war crimes / UVF, RUC, consecutive British governments were a nice bunch of lads consensus seems to rule. It isn't helped by the occasional stereotypical armchair Dublin Celtic fan Brits out type poster but it has always surprised me.

LorMal

iDave wrote: »

Something Cork people will never have.

Which, let's face it, is a pity (for the rest of us)

LorMal

2ndcoming wrote: »

There's an incredibly strong anti-Irish sentiment on boards. A general consensus of Sinn Fein should be tried for war crimes / UVF, RUC, consecutive British governments were a nice bunch of lads consensus seems to rule. It isn't helped by the occasional stereotypical armchair Dublin Celtic fan Brits out type poster but it has always surprised me.

Why do you equate anti-Sinn Fein with anti-Irish? I am as Irish as anyone and I despise Sinn Fein.

pablomakaveli

2ndcoming wrote: »

There's an incredibly strong anti-Irish sentiment on boards. A general consensus of Sinn Fein should be tried for war crimes / UVF, RUC, consecutive British governments were a nice bunch of lads consensus seems to rule. It isn't helped by the occasional stereotypical armchair Dublin Celtic fan Brits out type poster but it has always surprised me.

Disliking Sinn Fein doesn't make you anti-Irish. And being a republican doesn't make you more Irish either. That sort of sentiment is why a lot of people dislke republicans.

Rightwing

Democracy was the real winner here. More regions should be given this vote.

Lapin

Wossack wrote: »

either way it falls (was optimistic for a Yes), gotta be impressed by that 85% voter turnout - incredible really

Very good point.

The fact that such a large proportion voted Yes on such a large turnout means that a very sizable number of people cannot be dismissed.

Westminster needs to deliver on the pre referendum commitments and promises that Cameron, Clegg, Miliband etc made, and prove that digging people like Gordon Brown up to speak for them wasn't a stunt. And the changes need to be determined immediately. Not put on the back burner behind a bunch of red tape and excuses.

Everyone who voted yesterday deserves that much.

Scotland may have said No. But its clear from the result that change is desired.

And needed.

VinLieger

LorMal wrote: »

Why do you equate anti-Sinn Fein with anti-Irish? I am as Irish as anyone and I despise Sinn Fein.

Exactly why am I considered to be less Irish by hardcore republicans just because I don't support a UI for some pretty reasonable and logical reasons.

The superiority complex most republicans have is a large part of what makes me dislike them. That and they think with their hearts and not their heads anytime UI is mentioned.

pickarooney

Is the Catalonia one going ahead or not?

Barely There

2ndcoming wrote: »

There's an incredibly strong anti-Irish sentiment on boards. A general consensus of Sinn Fein should be tried for war crimes / UVF, RUC, consecutive British governments were a nice bunch of lads consensus seems to rule. It isn't helped by the occasional stereotypical armchair Dublin Celtic fan Brits out type poster but it has always surprised me.

If you despise SF you're anti-Irish?

Maybe it's sentiments like this that lead to so much derision of the Shinnerbots on boards.

It's perfectly possible to despise the murderers and gangsters that ran their own private army of thugs for years, and still feel 'Irish'.

Bad enough they tried to appropriate our flag during the troubles, they tried to appropriate the word 'Republican'

Now they're trying to appropriate patriotism.

Balmed Out

iDave wrote: »

Something Cork people will never have.

I think you mean something which Cork people gave the rest of ye ungrateful so and so's as we continue to have to subsidize yere lazy arses.

EazyD

Lapin wrote: »

Very good point.

The fact that such a large proportion voted Yes on such a large turnout means that a very sizable number of people cannot be dismissed.

Westminster needs to deliver on the pre referendum commitments and promises that Cameron, Clegg, Miliband made immediately and prove that digging people like Gordon Brown up to speak for them wasn't a stunt.

Scotland may have said No. But its clear from the result that change is desired.

And needed.

It'd be naive to think a spinster such as Cameron would have any intention of delivering on stated commitments.

Grandpa Hassan

Barely There wrote: »

If you despise SF you're anti-Irish?

Maybe it's sentiments like this that lead to so much derision of the Shinnerbots on boards.

It's perfectly possible to despise the murderers and gangsters that ran their own private army of thugs for years, and still feel 'Irish'.

Bad enough they tried to appropriate our flag during the troubles, they tried to appropriate the word 'Republican'

Now they're trying to appropriate patriotism.

Like what some parts of the Yes campaign tried to do in Scotland. If you were a No voter you weren't a real Scot

Grandpa Hassan

EazyD wrote: »

It'd be naive to think a spinster such as Cameron would have any intention of delivering on stated commitments.

Actually I think he has played a blinder by tying in the committments to Scotland into English devolution.

The Tories would not mind further Scottish devolution at all if they also got to exclude Scottish MPs from voting on English matters. Labour would hate English devolution however, but if they stand in the way of that, it will lead to delays in devolving more power to Scotland. And thus they will be blamed.

Either way the conservatives are happy

Chrissybhoy

VinLieger wrote: »

Exactly why am I considered to be less Irish by hardcore republicans just because I don't support a UI for some pretty reasonable and logical reasons.

The superiority complex most republicans have is a large part of what makes me dislike them. That and they think with their hearts and not their heads anytime UI is mentioned.

U won't be celebrating the 100 anniversary of 1916 then safe to say

LorMal

Barely There wrote: »

If you despise SF you're anti-Irish?

Maybe it's sentiments like this that lead to so much derision of the Shinnerbots on boards.

It's perfectly possible to despise the murderers and gangsters that ran their own private army of thugs for years, and still feel 'Irish'.

Bad enough they tried to appropriate our flag during the troubles, they tried to appropriate the word 'Republican'

Now they're trying to appropriate patriotism.

What worries me is the Anniversary of 1916 in 2016. Our gob****e politicians will be tripping over themselves to prove that they have Republican heritage. ("my great grandfather fought the Tans in a shed in Ballygobackwards"). And the Shinners will dominate because the other eejits have no pride or intelligence.

LorMal

Chrissybhoy wrote: »

U won't be celebrating the 100 anniversary of 1916 then safe to say

Oh FFS!!!! Its starting already!!!!!

WesternZulu

LorMal wrote: »

What worries me is the Anniversary of 1916 in 2016. Our gob****e politicians will be tripping over themselves to prove that they have Republican heritage. ("my great grandfather fought the Tans in a shed in Ballygobackwards"). And the Shinners will dominate because the other eejits have no pride or intelligence.

In fairness Ballygobackwards was up there with the GPO in terms of significance in the rising.

NewCorkLad

Chrissybhoy wrote: »

U won't be celebrating the 100 anniversary of 1916 then safe to say

So unless you vote Sinn Fein you cant celebrate 1916 :eek:. Your some joke.

eeepaulo

LorMal wrote: »

("my great grandfather fought the Tans in a shed in Ballygobackwards")

The place i live is twinned with Ballygobcackwards, does that count?

VinLieger

Chrissybhoy wrote: »

U won't be celebrating the 100 anniversary of 1916 then safe to say

Of course I will it was a defining moment in our countries history and has absolutely nothing to do with modern day sinn fein and their push for a UI.

Arbiter of Good Taste

hadepsx wrote: »

Mel Gibson will be turning in his grave

You do realise that he only PLAYED William Wallace in a movie?

catallus

4 councils voted no against 28 voting yes?

Nearly a 90% rejection.

Arbiter of Good Taste

Chrissybhoy wrote: »

U won't be celebrating the 100 anniversary of 1916 then safe to say

Oh grow up!

Barely There

LorMal wrote: »

What worries me is the Anniversary of 1916 in 2016. Our gob****e politicians will be tripping over themselves to prove that they have Republican heritage. ("my great grandfather fought the Tans in a shed in Ballygobackwards"). And the Shinners will dominate because the other eejits have no pride or intelligence.

I quite confident, with recent data indicating the economy in full recovery, that by the time 2016 rolls around, the Shinners will be back to the political irrelevance they've always been in the Republic,

I mean if they could only huff and puff their way to less than 12% in a Local Election where most people were pissed off about the raft of new taxes and charges being introduced, I can't see them making any political inroads for a considerable period.

Chrissybhoy

NewCorkLad wrote: »

So unless you vote Sinn Fein you cant celebrate 1916 :eek:. Your some joke.

I never once mentioned Sinn Fein read my OP before u get yourself in a tangle

Satriale

Grandpa Hassan wrote: »

Like what some parts of the Yes campaign tried to do in Scotland. If you were a No voter you weren't a real Scot

Ahem

Gordon Brown wrote:

"Our patriotic vision is up against a nationalist vision that only has one aim in mind"

http://news.sky.com/story/1337371/brown-urges-scottish-patriots-to-vote-no


Good luck with your decision Scotland!!!

Happyman42

NewCorkLad wrote: »

So unless you vote Sinn Fein you cant celebrate 1916 :eek:. Your some joke.

I think somebody who 'despises' SF and then steps out to celebrate 1916 is pretty f**ked up to be honest.

pablomakaveli

Happyman42 wrote: »

I think somebody who 'despises' SF and then steps out to celebrate 1916 is pretty f**ked up to be honest.

Why? Does everyone who celebrates 1916 have to fit into your narrow minded stereotypes to celebrate?

dark crystal

There's a Sky News clip doing the rounds of social media showing a table of 'No' votes, however when the camera zooms in a bit, you can clearly see two ballots with a 'Yes' mark sitting atop two of the piles.

Apanachi

LorMal wrote: »

I am trying to understand why so many Irish people feel so angry and bitter about Scotland not voting for Independence.
Seems to threaten them for some reason?

I wouldn't say we are angry and bitter, but I think, (and while I am speaking for myself here, I think a lot of us feel the same), a lot of wanted to see a break up of the Union, for a various amount of reasons, one of them being with a view to Irish unity and feel disappointed that they wasted the chance given to them

Barely There

Happyman42 wrote: »

I think somebody who 'despises' SF and then steps out to celebrate 1916 is pretty f**ked up to be honest.

It's always instructive (and dare I say, amusing) to get a little glimpse into the mind-set of a typical SF supporter.

WesternZulu

Happyman42 wrote: »

I think somebody who 'despises' SF and then steps out to celebrate 1916 is pretty f**ked up to be honest.

How!!?
The Sin Fein of then and now are completely different.

You could argue at the time that using the gun in politics was a necessity but keeping that sentiment in the following decades was reckless.

VinLieger

Chrissybhoy wrote: »

I never once mentioned Sinn Fein read my OP before u get yourself in a tangle

No but you were responding to my post about not supporting sinn fein so maybe YOU should read what your replying to

desertcircus

2ndcoming wrote: »

There's an incredibly strong anti-Irish sentiment on boards. A general consensus of Sinn Fein should be tried for war crimes / UVF, RUC, consecutive British governments were a nice bunch of lads consensus seems to rule. It isn't helped by the occasional stereotypical armchair Dublin Celtic fan Brits out type poster but it has always surprised me.

Anti-Irish. Boards.ie. Right.

Harry Palmr

I'm listening to Gerry Adams on the radio who is a model of restraint and sense when compared to some people here.

LorMal

Happyman42 wrote: »

I think somebody who 'despises' SF and then steps out to celebrate 1916 is pretty f**ked up to be honest.

I wont be 'celebrating' 1916. However, your link between SF 2014 and IRB 1916 is tenuous to say the least.
I suspect that someone like Micheal Collins or Eamon De Valera would despise modern day SF

Henlars67

catallus wrote: »

4 councils voted no against 28 voting yes?

Nearly a 90% rejection.

that's the most stupid post I've ever seen

Not2Good

I think we are all getting a wee bit off the topic of the thread!