Deonte Wilder "The Bronze Bomber"

walshb

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

On of the worst stoppages I have ever seen in my life. Up there with Taylor/Chavez.

It was not. The referee was watching closely. Stiverne was taking too many unanswered and clean shots. What is the ref meant to do?

megadodge

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

On of the worst stoppages I have ever seen in my life. Up there with Taylor/Chavez.

I agree that that was a very bad stoppage. Stiverne was NOT in trouble. Ok he had taken a few punches, but didn't wobble and was actually punching back when the ref stepped in.

However, I strongly disagree with you about Taylor/Chavez. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind if it was the Mexican who was stopped late by the American everybody would have forgotten about it now, but of course the Yanks love to whinge. Taylor had been floored very heavily, struggled to his feet, didn't respond to the ref's instructions and was stopped. The time gone in the fight really has no bearing in it. As it turned out Taylor had swallowed a huge amount of his own blood, had numerous stiches, had a badly swollen face and damaged ribs, plus he was never the same after that fight, which in my eyes suggests Richard Steele knew what he was doing when he stopped it. But even besides that, to suggest it was at the same level as that Stiverne stoppage is exaggerating it quite a bit, do you not think?

megadodge

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Yeah he's the mandatory challenger. Plus you could also say that it is in the interest the heavyweight division and the whole of boxing that an American heavyweight with a brash and charismatic personality is fighting in Vegas for the World championship.

I think it's in the interest of the Americans and nobody else. Who gives a sh!t where the heavyweight champ is from. More American whinging, but the truth is the rest of the world has not only caught up, but passed them out, it's time for them to step up a level or two.

Personally I think Wilder is the 2014 version of Michael Grant, a carefully created American heavyweight, moved to a title shot with what looked like impeccable timing, except Grant had actually beaten a few good fighters to get there, unlike Wilder. Only problem is, Stiverne ain't no Lennox.

It's a fight unlikely to go the distance, either Wilder early or Stiverne in 7-9. Neither possess a threat to Vlad, unless he gets very, very careless against Wilder.

Dublin Red Devil

Well Vegas is the mecca of professional boxing. The heavyweight division has been ruined by Vlad an Vitali. They have taken heavyweight boxing out of Vegas/NY buy fight bums out in Germany. Heavyweight needs guys like Wilder like Bryant Jennings maybe, to at least try to bring HW back from over 10 years of obscurity

gene_tunney

The Taylor/Chavez stoppage was a good stoppage. Taylor looking over at his corner and not responding to the referee. If the fighter doesn't respond you stop the fight regardless of how much time is left.

megadodge

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Well Vegas is the mecca of professional boxing. The heavyweight division has been ruined by Vlad an Vitali. They have taken heavyweight boxing out of Vegas/NY buy fight bums out in Germany. Heavyweight needs guys like Wilder like Bryant Jennings maybe, to at least try to bring HW back from over 10 years of obscurity

So they should have fought those "bums" in Vegas? How would that have changed boxing in the last 10 years? They fought and beat every top contender out there. Where they did it is irrelevant.

For the vast majority of boxing history, heavyweight boxing has been so-so. Occasional exceptions like the 1970s are rare. On a fight by fight basis, heavyweights are the least exciting boxers out there.

Dublin Red Devil

megadodge wrote: »

So they should have fought those "bums" in Vegas? How would that have changed boxing in the last 10 years? They fought and beat every top contender out there. Where they did it is irrelevant.

For the vast majority of boxing history, heavyweight boxing has been so-so. Occasional exceptions like the 1970s are rare. On a fight by fight basis, heavyweights are the least exciting boxers out there.

I agree HW has had it's down periods in boxing history, particularly in the last 10 years. But in my mind HW has always been the prime division that people want to embrace. When there are stars out there other than 2 Ukrainians with no personality.

walshb

Part of the Klits problem over the years has been their utter dominance. Another part is the robotic and stiff look to them. They could have great personalities, but they seem to be perceived as robots.

megadodge

When you look at it objectively, the Klitchkos are white, highly intelligent, genuinely decent people who always come to the ring in fantastic shape and have been utterly dominant fighters who draw massive crowds in Europe.

It's very obvious what the so-called "problem" is - they're not American!

It really is that simple. Could you imagine the hype if they were?

DK224

As much as I would like to buy into the Wilder hype I have severe doubts about him when he is eventually forced on the backfoot. There is no doubting his power but he is so wild and open when he attacks that I could see easily him folding against someone who fires back.

I don't know if Stiverne is that guy but he is tough, durable, has a decent punch and is by far Deontays biggest test. I will be having a nibble on the 2/1 price on the Stiverne stoppage win.

magma69

megadodge wrote: »

When you look at it objectively, the Klitchkos are white, highly intelligent, genuinely decent people who always come to the ring in fantastic shape and have been utterly dominant fighters who draw massive crowds in Europe.

It's very obvious what the so-called "problem" is - they're not American!

It really is that simple. Could you imagine the hype if they were?

Wladimir is boring and a notorious clincher also though. Successful fighters who have been fond of hugging haven't exactly crossed over to stardom despite their success. I'm talking the likes of Hopkins, Andre Ward, Carlos Molina. Hardly any people over there care for them fighters.

Whilst not being American is a factor, it's not the main reason for their lack of popularity stateside. Gennady Golovkin is all them things you credit the Klitschkos and HBO can't get enough of him and the American and Mexican fans have really taken to him also.

megadodge

magma69 wrote: »

Wladimir is boring and a notorious clincher also though. Successful fighters who have been fond of hugging haven't exactly crossed over to stardom despite their success. I'm talking the likes of Hopkins, Andre Ward, Carlos Molina. Hardly any people over there care for them fighters.

Whilst not being American is a factor, it's not the main reason for their lack of popularity stateside. Gennady Golovkin is all them things you credit the Klitschkos and HBO can't get enough of him and the American and Mexican fans have really taken to him also.

Can you explain Mayweather's popularity then?

Deiseboy01

His winning personality!

walshb

Floyd is divisive. His OTT brash and arrogant and crass manner, as well as his flash lifestyle gets him really noticed. Mr. Nice guy Wlad and Vitali are safe and predictable. I guess Floyd is predictable, too, but his volatility is just more appealing to the media.

magma69

megadodge wrote: »

Can you explain Mayweather's popularity then?

Mayweather fights nothing like either of the Klitschko brothers or anyone I mentioned in my point so that question doesn't really have any relevance.

Most people enjoy watching Mayweather fight. He doesn't clinch all the time though he moves around a bit much for some. There's also his brash, controversial personality and the fact he's undefeated, people tune in to see him lose.

megadodge

magma69 wrote: »

Mayweather fights nothing like either of the Klitschko brothers or anyone I mentioned in my point so that question doesn't really have any relevance.

Most people enjoy watching Mayweather fight. He doesn't clinch all the time though he moves around a bit much for some. There's also his brash, controversial personality and the fact he's undefeated, people tune in to see him lose.

I would disagree with that point. Strongly.

You said

Wladimir is boring and a notorious clincher also though. Successful fighters who have been fond of hugging haven't exactly crossed over to stardom despite their success.

Well, there are an awful lot of people out there who think Floyd is boring. As for clinching, I'm going to say it again, one of the worst exhibitions of holding I've ever seen was Mayweather's first five rounds against Ricky Hatton. Any fair ref would have disqualified him, or at the very least warned him and deducted points, but Joe Cortez.....

magma69

megadodge wrote: »

I would disagree with that point. Strongly.

I'll make a poll on here to see what people here think.

You said



Well, there are an awful lot of people out there who think Floyd is boring. As for clinching, I'm going to say it again, one of the worst exhibitions of holding I've ever seen was Mayweather's first five rounds against Ricky Hatton. Any fair ref would have disqualified him, or at the very least warned him and deducted points, but Joe Cortez.....

You're picking an example from 8 years ago which is worthy of noting in itself.

Secondly, Ricky Hatton's whole game was to get in the inside and use rough house tactics. Most of Hatton's fights involved a lot of clinching, it's a way to counteract his strengths. Mayweather's clinching in that fight was a reactive measure. It occured on a less frequent scale in his fights with Maidana also, who employed similar tactics as Hatton's against him.

Compared that to Wlad's fights, in which every one of his fights since his last loss involves excessive clinching instigated by him regardless of the opponents style.

All you see from Wlad is his jab, maybe a double jab and then a clinch. He does this until his opponent is out on his feet then he lets his right hand go.

Floyd uses a variety in his offensive arsenal, check hooks, uppercuts, jabs. His defense involves a shoulder roll, upper body movement and allows him to get off counters which are all pleasing to watch for many people.

Wlad's defense is his employ his reach using his jab and clinch if there's a chance of his opponent getting past his left and getting a punch off. There's no countering or variety in how he handles his opponent. I've no problem with that, it works for him, but it's not aesthetically pleasing for me and for many others.

Hinomaru

w ww.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-yVrzt0v_Y

(Remove space after first "w" to complete URL. In the style of Islamic extremists in Paris. Boards like to sensor free speech)

It's the full version of the post fight preview.



I'd love Wilder to win but Stiverne is by far the best he has ever faced. Head and Heart split here. Head says Stiverne, Heart says Wilder.

barney4001

Hinomaru wrote: »

w ww.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-yVrzt0v_Y

(Remove space after first "w" to complete URL. In the style of Islamic extremists in Paris. Boards like to sensor free speech)

It's the full version of the post fight preview.



I'd love Wilder to win but Stiverne is by far the best he has ever faced. Head and Heart split here. Head says Stiverne, Heart says Wilder.

the one thing about wilder is he connects its over

Hinomaru

barney4001 wrote: »

the one thing about wilder is he connects its over

True. But I think Stiverne might just be able to get through those first few rounds. I don't know if Wilder has never really been hit before. Stiverne packs allot of power too. How will Wilder be able to take it.

menoscemo

I think it's a 60/40 fight in favour Stiverne. Stiverne stopped Arreola so he must have a lot of power. Also there must be some serious questions over Wilders Stamina and chin. I am not sure we can really laud Wilder's power either based on some of the bums he has knocked out. His only credible opponent (Malik Scott) appeared to take a dive.

If Stiverne gets through the first 4 rounds he must be a strong favourite.

Rhys Essien

Hinomaru

Great fight last night, Very impressed with Wilder, I couldn't have predicted he'd go 12 rounds and win almost every one. He proved that he can box 12 rounds with a quality Heavyweight He showed that there is allot more to him than just athleticism and punching power. He's the real deal.

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

This "real deal" that is been bandied about is annoying me. What exactly did you see last night that made you come to the conclusion that "he's the real deal" or what exactly does that mean?

Probably because he utterly cake walked a win against the WBC champion. I wasn't overly impressed with Stiverne before the fight, and was maybe less impressed after, (like a slightly better version of Chisora) but credit must be given to Wilder for the manner of the win. He shut Stiverne out, and used his height and reach superbly. He performed in a real deal manner. Now we need to see him take it a step farther!

BTW, real mean means a worthy and credible specimen or thing. Wilder so far has shown that he is the real deal. In any sport or activity there can be several real deals, and of them 1/2 stand out as the best of the best!

walshb

pac_man wrote: »

It was a good performance not exactly quality personified however the comments are borderline sensationalistic.

They are not borderline sensationalistic. The guy put on a very good display. End of.