Stronger

COH

I 've had lots of coffee today so this might become very long... but 40% carryover from a double ply slingshot? ... jesus. As fun as that sounds I doubt you'll get a single kg of actual carryover to your raw bench from something that offers that much support. For the lols ober the years I've used (among other things):
2 ply sleeves
single ply sleeves
4 boards
3 boards
band assisted benches
reverse band benches
Speed benching
Fancy bars..

and the net result of all of them was that I got sore shoulders and became sh*t off the chest.

Best way for raw lifters to get better at benching is a f*ck tonne of volume, kcals to support recovery, simple programming and better technique, paused/tempo work with assistance movement that are specific to weak points. At 40% extra loading the chances are your just butchering your actual bench pattern.

In a nut shell 9 times out of 10 better benches are built by benching more often and dipping over 90% as seldom as possible along with never missing reps. All my best benches in training have been built on simple linear tapers, benching twice a week and keeping my shoulders healthy. I do like floor pressing and 1 and 2 board pressing for lockout work.

While I'm waffling on I also hate speed/dynamic work with bands for raw benching and I've very rarely seen anyone using chains correctly.

So... in summary, as much as I like Mark Bell, he might be raping your bench.

What were we talking about again?

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

COH wrote: »

(lots of good info)

Cheers dude. Makes an awful lot of sense. I'm not planning to program any overload work using the slingshot. I used it last week to vent some frustration and this week to see how much I'd actually get out of it (silly amounts).

Bench has always been abysmal. Best (yet still very shiit) progress it's made was in mid-2012 when I was doing some programming with Hanley and then again in mid-2013 when I was working with Clint (which did involve heaps of bands, chains, and boards) .

Biggest technique thing for me to work on now is trying not to bring the bar back over my neck/face/eyes as soon as I start actually pressing. As for weak points? All of them.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Friday, May 30th, 2014

2 Mile Run
2mi / 3.22km in 18:18 (9:09/mi pace)
HR Avg. 152, Max. 174

Gah. This is about as fast as I can run for anything longer than a sprint. Adding a quarter-mile a week and not liking it.

Avg. HR for 1.75 miles last week was 158 (at a very slightly faster 9:00 pace) so something seems to be improving.

Hanley

Ivory Old-fashioned Helicopter wrote: »

Cheers dude. Makes an awful lot of sense. I'm not planning to program any overload work using the slingshot. I used it last week to vent some frustration and this week to see how much I'd actually get out of it (silly amounts).

Bench has always been abysmal. Best (yet still very shiit) progress it's made was in mid-2012 when I was doing some programming with Hanley and then again in mid-2013 when I was working with Clint (which did involve heaps of bands, chains, and boards) .

Biggest technique thing for me to work on now is trying not to bring the bar back over my neck/face/eyes as soon as I start actually pressing. As for weak points? All of them.

So following programming worked?

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Hanley wrote: »

So following programming worked?

I'm usually pretty good about following programming! Not all programming is created equally though... (ahem... 5/3/1)

Da Za

5/3/1 is a template and when programmed smartly can work very well.

Linear periodisation is most widely used programme

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Da Za wrote: »

5/3/1 is a template and when programmed smartly can work very well.

Linear periodisation is most widely used programme

I'm quite stupid.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Saturday, May 31st, 2014

Bench
20 x 10 x 2
40 x 6
50 x 6
60 x 2
70 x 2
80 x 1
90 x 1
100 x 1
90 x 3 x 5 (0:30 rest)

Press
60 x 3 x 2
65 x 2 x 2

Push Press
70 x 2
75 x 1
85 x 1

Rear Delt Flyes
10s x 12, 10, 10, 8

Snatch-Grip Pendlay Row
85 x 6 x 4

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Sunday, June 1st, 2014

Deadlift
70 x 6 x 2
120 x 4
150 x 2
170 x 1
190 x 1
205 x 1
220 x 1
240 x 1 x 2

Snatch-Grip Pendlay Row
80 x 5
90 x 2 x 4

High-Bar Pause Squat
100 x 5 x 2
120 x 3 x 2

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Monday, June 2nd, 2014

HR Limited Run + Quick 1km
7.97km in 60:00 with Avg. HR <= 140
then immediately
1.00km in 5:45

Idea was to get an hour in keeping the HR at or below 140 then do a fast 1km to finish (fast being a very relative term).

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Tuesday, June 3rd, 2014

Bench
20 x 10
60 x 6
85 x 4
100 x 2
110 x 1 
120 x 1
122.5 x 1
110 x 3
122.5 x 1
+ Double Mini Band
130 x 1 x 2
- Double Mini Band
115 x 2
110 x 1

Wide Grip Pause Bench
80 x 3 (3s Pause)

Bench
80 x 11 (Comp. Pause)

Underhand BB Rows
60 x 10 x 3

Blegh. Talking to the guy doing my programming about working smarter on the bench stuff.

COH's note a couple of posts ago is making me realise the current program has me spending too much time working close to my current max. Reps are slow and grind-y too much.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Wednesday, June 4th, 2014 (AM)

Snatch Warm-Up (all 20kg)
- Overhead Squat: 5 x 3
- Snatch Drop: 2 x 3
- Press to Drop Snatch: 2 x 3
- 3 Position Snatch: 2 x 3

Snatch Special Exercise
25kg x 3
30kg x 3
35kg x 3

Snatch Complex
(Sn. Grip DL + Snatch from Above-Knee then Sn. Grip DL + Snatch from Below-Knee)
40kg x 1
43kg x 1
45kg x 1
47kg x 1
49kg x 1

Snatch
50kg x 1
52kg x 1
54kg x 1
56kg x 1
60kg x F, F

Jerk Lockouts
20kg x 5 x 2

Jerk Lockout Jumps
20kg x 3 x 2

Hanley

Ivory Old-fashioned Helicopter wrote: »

Wednesday, June 4th, 2014 (AM)

Snatch Warm-Up (all 20kg)
- Overhead Squat: 5 x 3
- Snatch Drop: 2 x 3
- Press to Drop Snatch: 2 x 3
- 3 Position Snatch: 2 x 3

Snatch Special Exercise
25kg x 3
30kg x 3
35kg x 3

Snatch Complex
(Sn. Grip DL + Snatch from Above-Knee then Sn. Grip DL + Snatch from Below-Knee)
40kg x 1
43kg x 1
45kg x 1
47kg x 1
49kg x 1

Snatch
50kg x 1
52kg x 1
54kg x 1
56kg x 1
60kg x F, F

Jerk Lockouts
20kg x 5 x 2

Jerk Lockout Jumps
20kg x 3 x 2

What the...?!???

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

I don't even know any more.

Did a few sessions with Harry in Capital Strength last year and decided to go back and give it a go for a little bit because I won't be competing in PL for a while.

Hanley

Ivory Old-fashioned Helicopter wrote: »

I don't even know any more.

Did a few sessions with Harry in Capital Strength last year and decided to go back and give it a go for a little bit because I won't be competing in PL for a while.

I say this because I like you...

For the love of god stop with all the maxing, low reps and testing.

Spend a few months following a linear periodised plan. You've still so much to gain from it.

I know you train cos you enjoy it, but you could enjoy it and progress at the same time

COH

I don't really know what it is you are training for at the moment but I usually tell people I train the following:

1 - Pick a goal
2 - Decide on a plan that is in alignment with that goal
3 - Stick to the f*cking plan


Basically if you want to get stronger, train for it. If you want to get leaner, train for that. If you want to try weightlifting, but anti-depressants!

You have to pick your battles to win the war.

EDIT - Hanley got there first

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Hanley wrote: »

I say this because I like you...

For the love of god stop with all the maxing, low reps and testing.

Spend a few months following a linear periodised plan. You've still so much to gain from it.

I know you train cos you enjoy it, but you could enjoy it and progress at the same time

I hear you.

Right now, I'm just doing what I'm told to do by Kev's hero (Alex Viada). Running is improving nicely (linear progress, newbie gains).

The lifting side is four days:

1. Bench
2. Squat
3. Pull
4. DE Bench + Overheads

The three main days all seem to involve lots of singles and doubles in the 85% - 95% range. I've asked him what the story is here and the idea seems to be to try and just keep things as stable/maintained as possible while I cut weight (been dropping about 1.5kg/week for the past month) and deal with leverages shifting all over the place.

There has been some silly stuff going on in the bench sessions out of sheer mischief really but we've talked about that and that's getting cut back.

The Olympic stuff is two sessions a week and nothing too taxing strength wise. Focusing on technique/mobility and working with weights I could throw overhead on my worst day.

Genuine question because I respect your opinion an awful lot: at a very high level, what way would you program things if I came to you and said I'm working on losing ~15kg and want to maintain as much strength as possible?

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

COH wrote: »

I don't really know what it is you are training for at the moment but I usually tell people I train the following:

1 - Pick a goal
2 - Decide on a plan that is in alignment with that goal
3 - Stick to the f*cking plan


Basically if you want to get stronger, train for it. If you want to get leaner, train for that. If you want to try weightlifting, but anti-depressants!

You have to pick your battles to win the war.

EDIT - Hanley got there first

Goal is cut down to 110kg... PL, running, weightlifting, all secondary to that at the moment. Things going reasonably well on that front (dropping 1.5kg/week at the moment, that'll probably slow a little after June).

The thing about that goal is it's largely not training related. Eating right will take care of it for the most part.

So training has been a mish-mash of new things (running, weightlifting) and trying to retain whatever meagre strength I have in PL.

Hanley

Ivory Old-fashioned Helicopter wrote: »

Genuine question because I respect your opinion an awful lot: at a very high level, what way would you program things if I came to you and said I'm working on losing ~15kg and want to maintain as much strength as possible?

General template...

6 Weeks of GBC style set up, focusing on tempo and getting your muscles working. As an example;

4 rounds w/ 2 min between rounds
A1) Squat 60% x6 @ 4010
A2) Split Squat x12 @ 3010
A3) Leg Press/Reverse Lunge x25 @ 2010

Split;
Quad/Back
Hams/Chest
Sholders/Tris/Gunzz

Retest maxes, they'll probably be down, or at best the same.

6-12 weeks of linear periodisation;
A) main movement
B1) main lift assistance movemet
B2) if above was upper body, this would be lower body
C1) main lift assistance movemet
C2) if above was upper body, this would be lower body
D1/2/3) some sort of full body triset

...and I'll stay a million miles away from running etc. 2-3 hour long walks a week with good nutrition.

Hanley

Ivory Old-fashioned Helicopter wrote: »

Goal is cut down to 110kg... PL, running, weightlifting, all secondary to that at the moment. Things going reasonably well on that front (dropping 1.5kg/week at the moment, that'll probably slow a little after June)

If that's what's going on, I probably wouldn't change a whole lot!

Considering your goals

RidleyRider

There's nothing better than a COH and Hanley dropping knowledge in sequence!

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Wednesday, June 4th, 2014 (PM)

Squat
20 x 10
60 x 6
100 x 4
125 x 3
140 x 2
155 x 2
170 x 1
185 x 1 (+wraps)
200 x 3 (+wraps)
170 x 2 x 2
150 x 6 x 2

Wide Arched GM
125 x 4 x 2
100 x 6 x 2

Front Squat
100 x 5
110 x 3 x 3

2km Run
2km in 11:27 (5:43/km)
HR Avg. 160, Max. 172

Good day. The 200kg triple matches a PR from last year. I was about 10kg heavier then but also not wearing wraps so it doesn't really count.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Thursday, June 5th, 2014

Run
3.64km (2.25mi) in 20:13 (8:59/mi)
HR Avg. 154, Max. 171

Happy with that.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Saturday, June 7th, 2014

Bench
20 x 10 x 2
30 x 6
40 x 6
50 x 2
60 x 2
70 x 1
80 x 3 x 5 (fast!, 0:30 rest)

Press
60 x 3 x 2
65 x 2 x 2

Push Press
70 x 2
75 x 1
85 x 1

CG Press
45 x 12
45 x 10

Underhand BB Row
75 x 10 x 3

Nothing very exciting.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Sunday, June 8th, 2014

Deadlift
70 x 6 x 2
100 x 4
140 x 2
165 x 1
180 x 1

Deficit Deadlift (3")
195 x 1
205 x 1
185 x 2 x 4

Snatch-Grip Pendlay Rows
80 x 5
90 x 2
100 x 1 x 5

Squat (High-Bar, 3s Pause)
100 x 6 x 2
120 x 3 x 3

Deficit deads are... interesting.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Monday, June 9th, 2014

Run
12km in 1:34:39 (7:53/km)
HR Avg. 142, Max. 164

Needed a calendar to measure this one, not a stopwatch. Not great.

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Tuesday, June 10th, 2014

Squat
20 x 10
60 x 6
100 x 4
120 x 3
140 x 2
160 x 2
170 x 1
+ Wraps
190 x 1
210 x 1
220 x 1 (PR)
- Wraps
140 x 10 x 3

Wide Arched GMs
125 x 4 x 2

Kneeling Squats
60 x 4
90 x 4
110 x 2
130 x 2
150 x 2

Run
2km in 10:46
HR Avg. 176, Max. 183

Good day.

COH

Nice squatting. Any particular reason you tested it?

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

That's the nice thing. It wasn't a test, program said work up to a ~95% single, and that was it. There was more there.

I did briefly entertain giving 230 a go but shut it down because I'd done what was in the program. (And I couldn't face writing "230 x F" in the log and seeing you and Hanley's disapproving faces.)

oq4v3ht0u76kf2

Wednesday, June 11th, 2014 (Early AM)

Snatch Warm-Up (all 20kg)
- Overhead Squat: 5 x 3
- Snatch Drop: 2 x 3
- Press to Drop Snatch: 2 x 3
- 3 Position Snatch: 2 x 3
- Snatch Special Ex.: 3 x 3

Snatch
35 x 2
40 x 2
45 x 2
49 x 2
53 x 2
57 x 2
59 x 1
61 x 1

Jerk Dips
20 x 5 x 2

BTN Jerk Press
35 x 3
40 x 3
50 x 3
60 x 3
70 x 3
80 x 2 x 3