County Council Long Term Leasing Scheme

fussyonion

delthedriver wrote: »

Cannot see landlords in Dublin or any of the main cities signing up to RAs or any other long term scheme.


Rents are sky rocketing in Dublin, there are queues of people viewing rental units. Landlords would be off their heads to sign up to such paltry amounts being offered by RAS


There is a lot more wear and tear on the fabric of the house and contents where RAS tenants are in situ as they spend more time in the premises as opposed to a working couple who spend only 10 hours per day in the unit.


To a certain extent there is a greater degree of helplessness amongst RAS tenants who tend to bother landlords about every little thing, whereas the working couple just want to go about their business with as little contact with landlord as possible.

You make some valid points but the part highlighted in bold isn't something I agree with.
Just because someone is working doesn't necessarily mean they aren't going to bother their LL with anything.

Also, a lot of RAS tenants ARE working. The scheme allows them to work full or part time as opposed to Rent Allowance which meant you couldn't work.

I don't think it goes by whether someone is a RAS tenant or a non-RAS tenant to say they'd bother/not bother the LL.

I was a Rent Allowance tenant and never bothered my LL about anything; I did everything myself.

delthedriver

Gatling wrote: »

Pretty broad generalisations

Please feel free to elaborate

delthedriver

fussyonion wrote: »

You make some valid points but the part highlighted in bold isn't something I agree with.
Just because someone is working doesn't necessarily mean they aren't going to bother their LL with anything.

Also, a lot of RAS tenants ARE working. The scheme allows them to work full or part time as opposed to Rent Allowance which meant you couldn't work.

I don't think it goes by whether someone is a RAS tenant or a non-RAS tenant to say they'd bother/not bother the LL.

I was a Rent Allowance tenant and never bothered my LL about anything; I did everything myself.

Well I respect your views. You are exceptional in my experience. IMHO where people are working they just want to get on with their lives like you, if there was an issue you sorted it.

Gatling

delthedriver wrote: »

Please feel free to elaborate

Read above fussyonion ,said it all ,

Except that part about wear and tear doesn't matter if your there 5 hours or out 10 hours things still need doing regardless and as for tenants been on to landlords its there job isn't it to fix and deal with there customers for a better word,
People who work are just as likely if not more likely to get on to landlords as those who dont

delthedriver

Gatling wrote: »

Read above fussyonion ,said it all ,

Except that part about wear and tear doesn't matter if your there 5 hours or out 10 hours things still need doing regardless and as for tenants been on to landlords its there job isn't it to fix and deal with there customers for a better word,
People who work are just as likely if not more likely to get on to landlords as those who dont

Absolutely , the tenant is the landlord's customer, no issue there.


It amazes me however the number of dishwashers, washing machines, microwave ovens , sofas , tables , beds ,chairs I have replaced , the original items being new at the commencement of the tenancy!


The wear and tear rate is definitely higher , where tenants are in the property 24 hours!

I can understand why landlords are not accepting Rent Allowance or RAS in Dublin

Gatling

I've been renting 15 years most long term let's ,I've never once had to have a bed ,cooker ,dishwasher replaced ,
But if your replacing goods every 12 months for tenants ,you either have bogey tenants or bogey appliances ,

My only complaints are usual based on beds that I don't talk to landlords over ,
Just have my own bed that I bought for specific needs

chopper6

No Pants wrote: »

Might as well not have a guaranteed tenant when you're losing approximately 2.5 months of rent per year.

Always with the short-term gain,eh?

No Pants

chopper6 wrote: »

Always with the short-term gain,eh?

I'm not a landlord, so no.

delthedriver

Gatling wrote: »

I've been renting 15 years most long term let's ,I've never once had to have a bed ,cooker ,dishwasher replaced ,
But if your replacing goods every 12 months for tenants ,you either have bogey tenants or bogey appliances ,

My only complaints are usual based on beds that I don't talk to landlords over ,
Just have my own bed that I bought for specific needs

Perhaps I have been unlucky?


TBF I have perhaps been spoiled by some wonderful tenants, on the other hand a tenant waiting for the landlord to change the light bulbs ...............!

Ray Palmer

Gatling wrote: »

I've been renting 15 years most long term let's ,I've never once had to have a bed ,cooker ,dishwasher replaced ,
But if your replacing goods every 12 months for tenants ,you either have bogey tenants or bogey appliances ,

My only complaints are usual based on beds that I don't talk to landlords over ,
Just have my own bed that I bought for specific needs

That is magical good luck. I wouldn't say any tenant is worse or better on appliances but every tenant is quite destructive on everything. I actually keep spare appliances about as they get broken so often by tenants.

There is a slight difference in a family let compared other tenants but then the kids destroy many other things.

Gatling

Ray Palmer wrote: »

That is magical good luck. I wouldn't say any tenant is worse or better on appliances but every tenant is quite destructive on everything. I actually keep spare appliances about as they get broken so often by tenants.

There is a slight difference in a family let compared other tenants but then the kids destroy many other things.

I think its down to respecting other peoples property ,we have 2 kids but were not running the washing machine or other appliances 24 /7 ,use the cooker hob daily and oven maybe once a month ,

I've seen tenants do the landlord having to replace everything down to the light bulbs ,
We ve no light bulbs when we moved there was 12 bulbs blown in 3 rooms ,which were replaced within a few months they all blew most of which were Long life efficient bulbs ,
Landlord had 2 electricians to check over the whole place and found no issues ,so only use lamps in the sitting room in the evening's and night lights for the kids rooms

delthedriver

Ray Palmer wrote: »

That is magical good luck. I wouldn't say any tenant is worse or better on appliances but every tenant is quite destructive on everything. I actually keep spare appliances about as they get broken so often by tenants.

There is a slight difference in a family let compared other tenants but then the kids destroy many other things.

It amazes me how I can get 10 years + out of a washing machine , dishwasher etc. Meanwhile a tenant could be unlucky to only get 2 years out of the same quality appliances.

Ray Palmer

delthedriver wrote: »

It amazes me how I can get 10 years + out of a washing machine , dishwasher etc. Meanwhile a tenant could be unlucky to only get 2 years out of the same quality appliances.

Your telling me. I have said this before, I bought 4 washing machines all the same model. 1 for my mother, 1 for me and 2 for tenants. Still using ours as is my mother after 10 years and the machines lasted roughly 2 years in the rentals. New machines bought for the tenants and again only lasted about 2 years, same again and again and again. Never again will I buy high end appliances for rentals it makes no difference.

As for bulbs blowing we had a similar problem in our own property. It was ESB power supply surging. Spent a long time investigating it before we got it sorted.

Also had a tenant complain about bulbs blowing and it was their fault. Halogen bulbs can blow if you don't clean them when handled and some of the energy bulbs have a similar problem. Rub them down before putting them up and use a cloth when putting them in. I told the tenants about the placing of bulbs they just ignored it but yelled pretty load about it happening.

murphaph

In Germany most leases contain a "small repairs clause" which can (by law) allow a LL to decline any small repairs of items that are handles by the tenant up to €410 per year. So, the pump in the heating system remains the LL's problem as the tenant doesn't touch it but light bulbs or even a kitchen tap would fall under the small repair clause and if they break, the tenant must fix them (up to €410 in any year).

No LLs in Germany are getting phonecalls about blown lightbulbs! I wouldn't even entertain such a call from a tenant.

MadDog76

Searching for house wrote: »

Has anyone ever been successful in finding a landlord to lease their property under the county council long term leasing scheme? It's a scheme whereby you rent a property long term between 10 and 20 years. The council look after the property during the tenancy and the landlord receives 80% of the current market rent value. The rent is governed by the differential rent scheme.

I have recently been told that my husband and I can look for a four bedroom house under this scheme. However, I have no idea where to start looking. Are there any particular websites where I can search for a landlord? I have been trawling the internet the last week but I am not having much luck. The county council staff, although very nice and helpful, do not have a list of landlords wanting to rent their properties. They acknowledge that it is difficult to find a landlord willing to partake in the scheme.

I would really love to get some advice. I feel that we have been given a fantastic opportunity but I have no idea where to start!

Thanks so much.

As an ASH Scheme tenant my advice would be to find the house you're happy with in an area you're happy with and rent it privately for a period of time (if possible!!) ........ build up a good relationship with your Landlord then approach him/her about the Ash Scheme pointing out all the positive benefits (of which there are many!!) to him/her and you might get lucky!
That's what myself and my wife did and we are now SDCC Tenants on the Ash Scheme .......

MadDog76

fussyonion wrote: »

This is the RAS scheme, yes?

No the RAS Scheme is completely different than the Ash Scheme in lots of ways ........ for example you MAY be employed and still qualify for the RAS Scheme whereas with the ASH Scheme you MUST be in employment to qualify!

MadDog76

The_Conductor wrote: »

Clarify this.
Its come up here several times in this forum- with the council and the landlord both claiming the other is responsible for day-to-day management of the property........
You need it clarified in writing- and proper details given to the tenant for points of contact when things go wrong (as they will do).
Its rarely the case that the landlord simply hands over the property and walks off laughing into the sunset- to come back 20 years later, and renegotiate the deal then).

From the landlord's perspective- you need to copperfasten the rental element in writing- the government have been very active in applying unilateral reduction in rents for landlord's- on the expectations that market rents would fall by a commensurate amount- and they'd be home and dry- which has not happened in Dublin or Cork- which is why there are so few properties available on the schemes there............

Both prospective tenants and prospective landlords, need to do their homework on this- there is more involved for both tenants and landlords, than immediately meets the eye.

Each ASH lease is slightly different and is tailored to meet the needs/requirements of individual Landlords/Tenants .......... both parties must be completely happy with the final lease agreement BEFORE anything is signed.

Also the rent can be reviewed on a yearly basis (if the Landlord wishes) in order to be in-line with the rental market prices for that year ......... the Tenants pay 10% of their take-home pay in rent regardless.

Nothing is set in stone with the ASH Scheme regarding leases, the Council are very open to negotiation with Landlords .......... for example our Landlord wanted 90% of the average rent prices in our area and the Council agreed. In fact he ended up 50 euros better off per month than what we were paying him privately!!

MadDog76

yankinlk wrote: »

doesnt matter, as i said. they will determine the market rate, and in my city its basically set at the lowest possible rent for the worst condition house in the worst area of the city, and they dont increase it no matter what. and in a market where rents are going up.... i dont even need to finish that sentence, this idea is going nowhere. the only people that will seek this idea out will be tenants.

The Council don't determine the market rate, the Landlord and the Council determine the market rate together and negotiate what the Council will pay and what the Landlord is happy to accept ........... it's a Scheme that does/is working for many Landlords and Tenants alike.

fussyonion

MadDog76 wrote: »

No the RAS Scheme is completely different than the Ash Scheme in lots of ways ........ for example you MAY be employed and still qualify for the RAS Scheme whereas with the ASH Scheme you MUST be in employment to qualify!

No that's not true. My partner and I were going to do the ASH scheme and it didn't mention anywhere that we needed to be in employment.
The difference between RAS and ASH is that the ASH scheme allows the LL to choose his tenant. The RAS scheme means the Council chooses.

MadDog76

fussyonion wrote: »

No that's not true. My partner and I were going to do the ASH scheme and it didn't mention anywhere that we needed to be in employment.
The difference between RAS and ASH is that the ASH scheme allows the LL to choose his tenant. The RAS scheme means the Council chooses.

Maybe you and your partner WERE going to do the ASH Scheme but me and my wife actually DID the Ash Scheme ........ we went through the whole 5 month process (including proof of employment) and are now 2 weeks into our ASH Scheme Tenancy ........... you MUST be in employment to finally sign the ASH Scheme lease with SDCC ....... fact.

fussyonion

MadDog76 wrote: »

Maybe you and your partner WERE going to do the ASH Scheme but me and my wife actually DID the Ash Scheme ........ we went through the whole 5 month process (including proof of employment) and are now 2 weeks into our ASH Scheme Tenancy ........... you MUST be in employment to finally sign the ASH Scheme lease with SDCC ....... fact.

Not true in our case.
I was given all the paperwork..the Social Welfare and Council were well aware of my employment situation and it didn't come into it.

We were told to source a property suitable for our needs and discuss the scheme with the LL and that the rent would be negotiated between the Council and LL.

We were days away from signing up and then we were offered a Council home.
I've never heard of employment being a factor.

Unless you're working at the time and they need to take all your details anyway.

But we were never told we MUST be employed.

MadDog76

fussyonion wrote: »

Not true in our case.
I was given all the paperwork..the Social Welfare and Council were well aware of my employment situation and it didn't come into it.

We were told to source a property suitable for our needs and discuss the scheme with the LL and that the rent would be negotiated between the Council and LL.

We were days away from signing up and then we were offered a Council home.
I've never heard of employment being a factor.

Unless you're working at the time and they need to take all your details anyway.

But we were never told we MUST be employed.

We were told that we qualify for the ASH Scheme as opposed to the RAS Scheme because we are employed .......... Landlords seem to be less keen (according to the Council) on the RAS Scheme as they have pre-conceived (and unfair) opinions of Tenants associated with any kind of Rent Allowance/Benefits etc. whereas with the ASH Scheme the Landlords are made aware that their Tenants are in employment which apparently makes the Landlords feel more "comfortable" accepting those Tenants.

fussyonion

MadDog76 wrote: »

We were told that we qualify for the ASH Scheme as opposed to the RAS Scheme because we are employed .......... Landlords seem to be less keen (according to the Council) on the RAS Scheme as they have pre-conceived (and unfair) opinions of Tenants associated with any kind of Rent Allowance/Benefits etc. whereas with the ASH Scheme the Landlords are made aware that their Tenants are in employment which apparently makes the Landlords feel more "comfortable" accepting those Tenants.

Which Council was this?

MadDog76

fussyonion wrote: »

Which Council was this?

South Dublin County Council ........... it was our preferred area as my wife is originally from the general area ......... in fact she has 3 relatives working in SDCC which helped with guiding us through the process although they couldn't/wouldn't influence the process in any way nor would we expect/want them to ......... however they were very good in answering our many many questions in a more honest and open way than they could in any official capacity.

jetfiremuck

Housing shortages would be eliminated fairly quickly if the gov offered tax incentives. I know some will crib about it but lets be honest the hotel bills etc for temp housing is going to get worse.I know social welfare tenants, lovely couple that their rent is below going rates. If they move they wont find as good as they have now.

yankinlk

never heard of the ash scheme, sounds interesting, but i know the ras scheme and u are not correct. tenant finds house, asks if LL will accept RAS and then if LL accepts, they begin the process.

the CC never finds the LL in my experience, and even if the tenant moves out, they are not replaced by another, at least not in my area.

the tenant normally pays deposit and first months rent and begins to rent the house, some time later RAS will kick in. in many ways it makes no difference, except for the odd troubled tenant. one that has not saved a deposit, or lost it in the last place they stayed. as soon as a tenant tells me they want to do ras, but they have no deposit or first months rent in advance, i run away. once the excuses start... they never end.

chopper6

Just my two cents worth but it's about time they started chucking out "buy to let" defaulters

These idiots have gotten in over their heads and now are pitching hugely high rents to try and pay their bills.

They talk about "market prices" but it's really a purely artificial market caused by their own greed/stupidity.

Any professional landlord would instantly see the difference between a short term 1200 pm versus a settled tenant paying a little less but with a long term lease.

landlords are making a rod for their own backs in typical irish style .

delthedriver

chopper6 wrote: »

Just my two cents worth but it's about time they started chucking out "buy to let" defaulters

These idiots have gotten in over their heads and now are pitching hugely high rents to try and pay their bills.

They talk about "market prices" but it's really a purely artificial market caused by their own greed/stupidity.

Any professional landlord would instantly see the difference between a short term 1200 pm versus a settled tenant paying a little less but with a long term lease.

landlords are making a rod for their own backs in typical irish style .

Mmmmm....... Interesting points.


Though I know landlords who have properties in Dublin which are mortgage free in South Dublin. Rents are rising from €1200 to €2000. Market forces .Supply and demand !

MadDog76

yankinlk wrote: »

never heard of the ash scheme, sounds interesting, but i know the ras scheme and u are not correct. tenant finds house, asks if LL will accept RAS and then if LL accepts, they begin the process.

the CC never finds the LL in my experience, and even if the tenant moves out, they are not replaced by another, at least not in my area.

the tenant normally pays deposit and first months rent and begins to rent the house, some time later RAS will kick in. in many ways it makes no difference, except for the odd troubled tenant. one that has not saved a deposit, or lost it in the last place they stayed. as soon as a tenant tells me they want to do ras, but they have no deposit or first months rent in advance, i run away. once the excuses start... they never end.

Don't know much about the RAS Scheme as we don't qualify for it (myself & wife are both employed) but it's the same with ASH Scheme ie. the Tenant finds the House/Landlord and gives the Council his/her details if said Landlord is interested and it goes from there .............. however there is no deposit to be paid with the ASH Scheme (no need as Council guarantee rent and pay it directly to the Landlord) and the Council also offer replacement Tenant if original Tenant breaks the lease agreement.

yankinlk

MadDog76 wrote: »

Council also offer replacement Tenant if original Tenant breaks the lease agreement.

IMHO that comes down to supply and demand. If the CC is struggling to house people then they might replace someone... BUT if they dont need to house anyone and the lease is broken by the RAS/ASH tenant, they wont go out of their way to make it up to the LL.

Unfortunately I know this firsthand in the RAS scheme - there is very little advantage for the LL in reality... open market with rising rents - LL is much better off DIY'ing it or using a service that finds high paying quality tenants.

The problem with ASH - is the part where the market rent is determined by the NEGOTIATION between CC and LL. They will never meet the actual market value.