Rent allowance limits need to rise.

quadrifoglio verde

Gatling wrote: »

So if say you lost your job tomorrow and applied for social welfare as you would be entitled to ,and they tell you sorry you can't apply in Dublin for any benefits including rent allowence ,until you move to the arse of cork or Kerry ,
Would you just upsticks and go or would you be screaming discrimination and telling everyone how your been forced to live in a totally different part of the country on social welfares demand

If I was in the position where it was a decision between go homeless on the streets of dublin, or move to Kerry, I'd move to Kerry.

What happens if you're working and your rent has gone up above what you can afford to pay? You can't turn to the government and say hey enda I need a dig out.
What you do is you find somewhere that you can afford to live. That mightn't be the area of your choice, but it's still a roof over your head

Pocoyo

Gatling wrote: »

Here's another example of problems shifting people around the country ,
I suffer 3 degenerative conditions I'm practically hospitalised for 2/3 weeks every years and have regular gp and physio visits ,
All this with 2 kids one school going ,now we've looked into moving away from dublin ,Kildare ,Carlow as far as Kilkenny ,
Proper research we found schools had massive waiting lists some up to 4+ year waits for admissions ,doctors surgerys over subscribed and very few willing to take new patients ,
No car and can't afford one so then have to figure in costs to and from gp's and hospitals and commuting to schools ,
So just when some people think ah sure you just leave your county you will be grand ,not everything is as simple as it sounds

100% correct if your on RA with a family you may forget kildare,But i will say carlow is a good spot especially if you cant afford a car but the schools are an issue.

Gatling

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

If I was in the position where it was a decision between go homeless on the streets of dublin, or move to Kerry, I'd move to Kerry.

What happens if you're working and your rent has gone up above what you can afford to pay? You can't turn to the government and say hey enda I need a dig out.
What you do is you find somewhere that you can afford to live. That mightn't be the area of your choice, but it's still a roof over your head

I fully understand that I'd take a house any where but as I stated in my last post just upping sticks and moving counties isn't as simple for some ,

There are areas that have been decimated due to emmigration and lack of opportunities around the county that would benefit greatly from an imflux of new people and families

Potatoeman

jane82 wrote: »

I personally know of two respectable enough renting families who have had the rent raised so much they had to move. One of them has presented homeless the others lease is up in a week and will be doing the same.
Houses in the places where rent allowance was expected are now saying no to rent allowance.
I luckily got a years lease from a friend at a decent price but was a week away from taking the kids to declare homeless
when I got lucky.
Its a bad state out there at the moment.

Where were they living during the boom? Could they not get a place anywhere at all?

quadrifoglio verde

Gatling wrote: »

I fully understand that I'd take a house any where but as I stated in my last post just upping sticks and moving counties isn't as simple for some ,

There are areas that have been decimated due to emmigration and lack of opportunities around the county that would benefit greatly from an imflux of new people and families

It's not nice, but neither is paying paye, prsi and USC at their current level, Let alone at the much higher level required to house people in areas they want to live in. The money is simply not there.

Pocoyo

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

It's not nice, but neither is paying paye, prsi and USC at their current level, Let alone at the much higher level required to house people in areas they want to live in. The money is simply not there.

This isnt about taxation its about finding a remedy to a corrupt rental system. Rents are being kept artificially high.

Up until last year i paid 180e in tax on a weekly basis thats some ones full dole and i paid similar rates of tax for 10 years i now want to be able to live a decent quality of life until i can find employment. I have to subsidize my rent which is keeping me from using my money to find work, pay the bills and look after my kid.

jane82

Potatoeman wrote: »

Where were they living during the boom? Could they not get a place anywhere at all?

One family in areas where people wouldnt live during the boom. Very rough areas of dublin where during the boom rent allowance was all that was asked for.
The other family would have had way more money during the boom.
I didnt get a ref from the last landlord because my dog peeing in the garden made his grass yellow(i think he just wouldnt put down on paper I rented the place for tax reasons or ptrb reasons it seemed a silly excuse anyway he knew I had a dog) I couldnt get anywhere with no recent reference.

quadrifoglio verde

Pocoyo wrote: »

This isnt about taxation its about finding a remedy to a corrupt rental system. Rents are being kept artificially high.

Up until last year i paid 180e in tax on a weekly basis thats some ones full dole and i paid similar rates of tax for 10 years i now want to be able to live a decent quality of life until i can find employment. I have to subsidize my rent which is keeping me from using my money to find work, pay the bills and look after my kid.

But you see it involves taxation. If we increase the rent allowance rates, we either have to cut spending somewhere else (and most likely in the social protection budget) or increase taxation.
When it comes to taxation, no one wants to see extra taxation, except for the person benefiting from the increased taxes.

How is our rental system corrupt? Should prices in a free market not be allowed go up and down? Also see my earlier post here as to why rent control won't work.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=90158710&postcount=54

Social welfare isn't meant to give you a decent quality of life, its meant to give you an emergency fall back until you can get employment somewhere else. Its meant to keep you alive, give you shelter and put enough food in your stomach so that you won't starve to death.

Its not meant to be easy, its not meant to be a nice way to live, its not meant to be comfortable because if it was, why would any of us go out and work 40 hours a week when the alternative was a decent quality of life on social welfare?

Pocoyo

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

But you see it involves taxation. If we increase the rent allowance rates, we either have to cut spending somewhere else (and most likely in the social protection budget) or increase taxation.
When it comes to taxation, no one wants to see extra taxation, except for the person benefiting from the increased taxes.

How is our rental system corrupt? Should prices in a free market not be allowed go up and down? Also see my earlier post here as to why rent control won't work.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=90158710&postcount=54

Social welfare isn't meant to give you a decent quality of life, its meant to give you an emergency fall back until you can get employment somewhere else. Its meant to keep you alive, give you shelter and put enough food in your stomach so that you won't starve to death.

Its not meant to be easy, its not meant to be a nice way to live, its not meant to be comfortable because if it was, why would any of us go out and work 40 hours a week when the alternative was a decent quality of life on social welfare?

Absolutely incorrect rent are artificially high. taxation shouldnt come into it,you are wrong.

http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/this-map-shows-you-why-rent-is-rising-in-dublin-more-than-anywhere-else-892458-May2013/

Oh and as for quality of life,by that i mean enough money to eat and look for work at the same time,god im living it up i am.

B.A._Baracus

Probably the best place to ask this, as whats the point in creating a new thread.

But how much rent allowance can a person get? I was looking earlier at citizens information and couldnt really find an answer. Like say a single man, on the social welfare who is in a 1 bedroom apartment that rent costs 800 per month.

What would get get? 400 towards the rent? 300? I have no clue

quadrifoglio verde

Pocoyo wrote: »

Absolutely incorrect rent are artificially high. taxation shouldnt come into it,you are wrong.

http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/this-map-shows-you-why-rent-is-rising-in-dublin-more-than-anywhere-else-892458-May2013/

Oh and as for quality of life,by that i mean enough money to eat and look for work at the same time,god im living it up i am.

How is the rent artificially high?
Its a case of supply and demand. IF i have 10 cars and 100 people want to buy my cars i can push up the prices. Likewise If i have 10 cars and only one person wants to the buy a car, then I have to drop the price.
the landlord can't pluck the figures for rent out of his arse, he can only rent at a price below or at market rate.
Or should he be obliged to accept 500 a month, even though the market rate is 1000 a month?

And taxation does come into it. If rent allowance levels are increased then that money has to come from somewhere. We can't just magic it out of our arse. Either taxes will rise to fund it, or spending will be cut elsewhere.

Pocoyo

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Probably the best place to ask this, as whats the point in creating a new thread.

But how much rent allowance can a person get? I was looking earlier at citizens information and couldnt really find an answer. Like say a single man, on the social welfare who is in a 1 bedroom apartment that rent costs 800 per month.

What would get get? 400 towards the rent? 300? I have no clue

In kildare the bracket is 440 and the rent actually paid is 320. But due to rent exceeding the bracket the majority are now lying about the actual rent and just topping the rest up out of their dole.

harpsman

Eric Cartman wrote: »

anyone on rent allowance will almost certainly be unemployed, unlike employed people they have no reason to 'need' to live in dublin and close parts of north kildare , wicklow and meath. I dont understand anyone complaining when they could go live in areas like athy, gorey , kilcock , bettystown and other areas with a lower demand for housing and cheaper rents, even if you need to come up to dublin once a month for a job interview then you can as some public transport is available.

anyone who thinks they are 'entitled' to live in dublin on rent allowance is mad.

+1. City centres are for working people. Not multi generation welfare recipients. But in our bleeding heart country people are too mentally frail to see that. See someone slashed in the face on henry st today. RA recipints i bet

Pocoyo

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

How is the rent artificially high?
Its a case of supply and demand. IF i have 10 cars and 100 people want to buy my cars i can push up the prices. Likewise If i have 10 cars and only one person wants to the buy a car, then I have to drop the price.
the landlord can't pluck the figures for rent out of his arse, he can only rent at a price below or at market rate.
Or should he be obliged to accept 500 a month, even though the market rate is 1000 a month?

Wrong link it was supposed to be about nama keeping property prices artificially high and in return raising rents i will post the link in one minute.

quadrifoglio verde

Pocoyo wrote: »

Wrong link it was supposed to be about nama keeping property prices artificially high and in return raising rents i will post the link in one minute.

Where are all these NAMA properties. It gets thrown out again and again that NAMA are holding these properties off the market?
But where are they? I can't actually find any of them in Dublin City Centre, save for development sites which are in the process of being sold. We've had a massive pick up in the last few months of property portfolios being sold by NAMA as well as the liquidation of IBRC.

Gatling

Pocoyo wrote: »

In kildare the bracket is 440 and the rent actually paid is 320. But due to rent exceeding the bracket the majority are now lying about the actual rent and just topping the rest up out of their dole.

Yes and the recepiant need to add between 35/40 pw depending on circumstances single or couple

No Pants

xOxSinéadxOx wrote: »

Don't see why people should have to move away from their area where their family and friends are just because they become unemployed

Or their friends and family can put them up if they're so popular.

jane82

Potatoeman wrote: »

Where were they living during the boom? Could they not get a place anywhere at all?

One family in areas where people wouldnt live during the boom. Very rough areas of dublin where during the boom rent allowance was all that was asked for.
The other family would have had way more money during the boom.
I didnt get a ref from the last landlord because my dog peeing in the garden made his grass yellow(i think he just wouldnt put down on paper I rented the place for tax reasons or ptrb reasons it seemed a silly excuse anyway he knew I had a dog) I couldnt get anywhere with no recent reference.

Victor

harpsman wrote: »

+1. City centres are for working people. Not multi generation welfare recipients. But in our bleeding heart country people are too mentally frail to see that. See someone slashed in the face on henry st today. RA recipints i bet

Trolling / off-topicness not welcome.

Moderator

ted1

Rent allowance keeps the market artificially high.
I have properties in areas where by target market is people on rent allowance. To set my rent I look at what there entitlment is, usually single mum
With 2 kids and I add about 40 euro.
I have not had a bad tenant. A bit moany in that they have never worked a day in there life and expect everything done for them, but that's all.

As a ll I say raise the limit . As a tax payer I say no, it should be lowered

quadrifoglio verde

ted1 wrote: »

Rent allowance keeps the market artificially high.
I have properties in areas where by target market is people on rent allowance. To set my rent I look at what there entitlment is, usually single mum
With 2 kids and I add about 40 euro.
I have not had a bad tenant. A bit moany in that they have never worked a day in there life and expect everything done for them, but that's all.

As a ll I say raise the limit . As a tax payer I say no, it should be lowered

Are these in Dublin, or outside Dublin.
If in Dublin, Id be shocked if you couldn't get more for your property from a non RA tenant.

ted1

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

Are these in Dublin, or outside Dublin.
If in Dublin, Id be shocked if you couldn't get more for your property from a non RA tenant.

In ballyfermont. A private tenant wouldn't stay as long as a rent allowance stays and I'd lose a month it two rent each year trying to replace them.
I can't imagine private tenants wanting to stay in council areas.

Ray Palmer

Gatling wrote: »

So if say you lost your job tomorrow and applied for social welfare as you would be entitled to ,and they tell you sorry you can't apply in Dublin for any benefits including rent allowence ,until you move to the arse of cork or Kerry ,
Would you just upsticks and go or would you be screaming discrimination and telling everyone how your been forced to live in a totally different part of the country on social welfares demand

Except that isn't happening. You can claim all your payments in Dublin. The issue is quite simple LL are not accepting RA due to the way the government managed it. They were warned this would happen and ignored it and we still have people claiming RA was the cause of high rents.
If you loose your job you need to learn pretty quickly your lifestyle has to change to match your income. Not being able to afford something is not discrimination.

Ray Palmer

ted1 wrote: »

In ballyfermont. A private tenant wouldn't stay as long as a rent allowance stays and I'd lose a month it two rent each year trying to replace them.
I can't imagine private tenants wanting to stay in council areas.

You'd be wrong. I have a former council house in Dublin and rent it out no problem. It is above RA limits.

During the boom many professionals bought in the area including doctors, vets, architects etc...

Council housing was sold years ago and many of them have gone through gentrification. Some areas it may never happen to but then again it may just take time. Good links to transport and proximity to work are still valuable assets of a property

Barely Hedged

Pocoyo wrote: »

This isnt about taxation its about finding a remedy to a corrupt rental system. Rents are being kept artificially high.

Up until last year i paid 180e in tax on a weekly basis thats some ones full dole and i paid similar rates of tax for 10 years i now want to be able to live a decent quality of life until i can find employment. I have to subsidize my rent which is keeping me from using my money to find work, pay the bills and look after my kid.

You want rent allowances increased, which is money provided by the government and the government raises income through taxation. You say it isnt about taxation?

The rental system isnt corrupt. Its a product of the many inputs required to increase the supply of housing being handicapped by the current economic circumstances. There is nothing a debt laden government can do about it in the short term.

What about somebody thats paid around €1k a week in tax and similarly for 10 years. Should they be entitled to over 5 times the current living circumstances you find yourself in?

If you want a decent quality of life this will be provided through savings you would have built up while working for the past 10 years. Expecting other people to make extra financial sacrifices, which you should be aware of are quite significant at the moment, just so you can maintain the life you were accustomed to while working? Thats a corrupt opinion/mindset if ever i heard one

zef

ted1 wrote: »

Rent allowance keeps the market artificially high.
I have properties in areas where by target market is people on rent allowance. To set my rent I look at what there entitlment is, usually single mum
With 2 kids and I add about 40 euro.
I have not had a bad tenant. A bit moany in that they have never worked a day in there life and expect everything done for them, but that's all.

As a ll I say raise the limit . As a tax payer I say no, it should be lowered

Why do you ad about 40e? Your own personal 'single mother' tax?

Gatling

zef wrote: »

Why do you ad about 40e? Your own personal 'single mother' tax?

Everyone on rent allowence has make a minimum weekly contribution to the over all rent

Its € 40 for a couple less if your single

ted1

Ray Palmer wrote: »

You'd be wrong. I have a former council house in Dublin and rent it out no problem. It is above RA limits.

During the boom many professionals bought in the area including doctors, vets, architects etc...

Council housing was sold years ago and many of them have gone through gentrification. Some areas it may never happen to but then again it may just take time. Good links to transport and proximity to work are still valuable assets of a property

There's a difference between ex council houses and council areas which never experienced the boom and has a low employment rate.

ted1

zef wrote: »

Why do you ad about 40e? Your own personal 'single mother' tax?

It keeps within the limit, as posters have pointed out I could charge more . But some people like to see the negative in things and expect charity.

Pocoyo

Barely Hedged wrote: »

If you want a decent quality of life this will be provided through savings you would have built up while working for the past 10 years. Expecting other people to make extra financial sacrifices, which you should be aware of are quite significant at the moment, just so you can maintain the life you were accustomed to while working? Thats a corrupt opinion/mindset if ever i heard one

Savings,savings? i was what the economy needed i used to buy my dog steaks twice a week ffs,I cant even buy myself one now,I shared my very limited wealth for the good of this country i didnt help the bank with their schemes and as i said i paid 180e tax most weeks and didnt complain about it,I want to be able to work are you blind or what did you read my post i can either look for work or eat,after i pay my bills im left with 25e to buy household items and food so please dont talk rubbish to me my current rent is 480e im not living in dublin or in a lap of luxury.