Bloodborne (From Software / Sony)

bigphil2

Doctor Nick wrote: »

Flame sprayer comes from

Gilbert

.

Thanks.. ive delved into the lore a bit,and its helped with the immersion alot.. but still fairly lost.. i suppose thats the enjoyment,piecing it together.

Potential-Monke

OK, I've already had a slight disagreement on this thread for having an opinion, so i'm taking a risk here again. This is a general question for everyone that likes this game. I understand it can be rewarding, etc, but why is it ok for these games to have grinding as part of the requirement to progress, but grinding in nearly any other game is frowned upon?

I played about 6 hours of this in total, if not more, and the grinding was the most annoying part. I can't understand how someone can get enjoyment from doing the same thing over and over with the hope they have grinded enough to take on the next boss. I'm not saying you shouldn't, but the same amount of grinding in any other non-Souls like RPG and it would be lambasted, but it's totally accepted by everyone who enjoys these types of 'games' (they're not games, they're patience testers).

I have games that people hate and I like, so i'm not saying this is a bad game, it's just not for me, but it's the acceptance of grinding I can't get my head around!

nix

Potential-Monke wrote: »

OK, I've already had a slight disagreement on this thread for having an opinion, so i'm taking a risk here again. This is a general question for everyone that likes this game. I understand it can be rewarding, etc, but why is it ok for these games to have grinding as part of the requirement to progress, but grinding in nearly any other game is frowned upon?

I played about 6 hours of this in total, if not more, and the grinding was the most annoying part. I can't understand how someone can get enjoyment from doing the same thing over and over with the hope they have grinded enough to take on the next boss. I'm not saying you shouldn't, but the same amount of grinding in any other non-Souls like RPG and it would be lambasted, but it's totally accepted by everyone who enjoys these types of 'games' (they're not games, they're patience testers).

I have games that people hate and I like, so i'm not saying this is a bad game, it's just not for me, but it's the acceptance of grinding I can't get my head around!

There is no grind, you can get by without repeating any of the same content. However a lil grinding can be beneficial, if even just to farm some bloodvials.

Hell alot of people can kill all bosses by just running passed everything and bee lining to each boss, level up on the souls they just get off bosses. And then you have people who can complete the game in full without leveling up at all. Heck theres even some people who try and do it without being hit once, and succeed.

Now if you're bad at the game, you may feel that you need to grind and kill mobs over and over.. Which is true, but not for the souls/echoes, to just get better at killing, the echoes would just be a bonus. Heeding caution and mastering timing is how to kickass in this game, not your stats

Retr0gamer

Potential-Monke wrote: »

OK, I've already had a slight disagreement on this thread for having an opinion, so i'm taking a risk here again. This is a general question for everyone that likes this game. I understand it can be rewarding, etc, but why is it ok for these games to have grinding as part of the requirement to progress, but grinding in nearly any other game is frowned upon?

I played about 6 hours of this in total, if not more, and the grinding was the most annoying part. I can't understand how someone can get enjoyment from doing the same thing over and over with the hope they have grinded enough to take on the next boss. I'm not saying you shouldn't, but the same amount of grinding in any other non-Souls like RPG and it would be lambasted, but it's totally accepted by everyone who enjoys these types of 'games' (they're not games, they're patience testers).

I have games that people hate and I like, so i'm not saying this is a bad game, it's just not for me, but it's the acceptance of grinding I can't get my head around!

Well totally disagree with you on this for the sole reason that I never had to do grinding in any of the soulsborne games.

These games dole out enough experience where if you play the game progressing from one point to the next you will gain enough experience to keep up with the difficulty curve. There's also the fact that the way the damage scaling works means that even at level 1 you can beat bosses. Beating a boss is more about skill than anything and if you need extra help being clever with your equipment will do far more for you than an extra level or two which helps very little due to damage scaling.

The fact that you are grinding in the game suggests to me that you just don't get that game. It's an action game, progress is almost entirely skill based and you can't brute force your way through by grinding levels, which in itself is folly as levels mean very little in the game due to damage scaling.

Generic Dreadhead

nix wrote: »

Hell alot of people can kill all bosses by just running passed everything and bee lining to each boss, level up on the souls they just get off bosses.

Funny you mention that. I was watching this video last night before I headed to bed. It's interesting how much time you can save.

Potential-Monke

Fair enough, just not my type of game so! I think it was more the fact that all the same enemies were in exactly the same place every time that really annoyed me! Need a lot of patience for this game! I apparently don't have enough! Which is a shame, as it seems like it has good lore/story, but the combat puts me right off!

Retr0gamer

It can get frustrating but it's rarely the games fault (although there's the odd badly designed section full of dick moves in areas that had to be rushed). It's always you and you can always learn and do better. The sense of accomplishment is incredible when you do beat a tough area.

And if you are really cack handed you can always try the game's easy mode, co-op. Co-op with even one other person makes these games a cake walk. Bloodbourne is a ghost town because of how broken and awful the online stuff is but the souls games are still pretty active.

Digital Solitude

Potential-Monke wrote: »

OK, I've already had a slight disagreement on this thread for having an opinion, so i'm taking a risk here again. This is a general question for everyone that likes this game. I understand it can be rewarding, etc, but why is it ok for these games to have grinding as part of the requirement to progress, but grinding in nearly any other game is frowned upon?

I played about 6 hours of this in total, if not more, and the grinding was the most annoying part. I can't understand how someone can get enjoyment from doing the same thing over and over with the hope they have grinded enough to take on the next boss. I'm not saying you shouldn't, but the same amount of grinding in any other non-Souls like RPG and it would be lambasted, but it's totally accepted by everyone who enjoys these types of 'games' (they're not games, they're patience testers).

I have games that people hate and I like, so i'm not saying this is a bad game, it's just not for me, but it's the acceptance of grinding I can't get my head around!

As has been said, there's no grind unless you want to grind. I presume you're taking having to rerun an area a couple of times as the grind.

It's there at the start alright but once you get 4 or 5 bosses in you'll start clearing most areas in 3 or fewer runs. It's more about learning how to play the game than grinding, the difficulty is massively overstated because they're reasonably straightforward for the main game once you figure out your character is weak and needs more than mashing attack to win.

There's 100% no grind to take on the next boss, I've beaten this with the bare minimum of bosses, beaten most of this and 2 Dark Souls at the lowest possible level and I'm not particularly good at the games. This would be impossible if there was an arbitrary grind for each boss.

Generic Dreadhead

I've never played a Soulsborne game and I'd agree with what DS said above.
It's about learning how the game expects you to play it and not pushing that extra bit too far in combat/exploration cause it will hand you your a$$ to put you back in your place.
The "grind" is less noticable if you do the optional areas in the order they make "levelling up" sense (see the image I posted a page back)
So for example

Old Yharnam prior to Cathedral Ward, Hemwich Chapel Lane prior to Forbidden Woods, Hunters Nightmare prior to Y'har Gul Village

etc etc.
Also weapons make the game a lot easier

I got the Tonitris early and it makes a lot of the fights easy mode

I've beaten Vicar Amelia:D
Took an hour alone tonight but i managed it. With the blood echoes i got from the fight ive been able to level up my strength enough to use Ludwigs Blade, so i'm delighted with that.
I triggered the cutscene and now the game has progressed to night time but i had to turn it off, i'll be up all night if i started exploring:pac:

DeadlyByDesign

Cake of Tremendous Power wrote: »

I've beaten Vicar Amelia:D
Took an hour alone tonight but i managed it. With the blood echoes i got from the fight ive been able to level up my strength enough to use Ludwigs Blade, so i'm delighted with that.
I triggered the cutscene and now the game has progressed to night time but i had to turn it off, i'll be up all night if i started exploring:pac:

Your next area should be Hemwick. Turn your volume up for a complete mindf**k in this area!

WarpAsylum

The Orphan of Kos.

Lamb of divine...

If I had any hair, it would be gone.

On my umpteenth try this morning, I got him.
Got a lucky run of viscerals in the first phase and on the last phase, during one of his jumps, he landed on a charged attack (Ludwig +10 in Greatsword with Fire Paper) from behind, got stunned, and I got a visceral attack in with Clawmark ruin equipped, so it was meaty.
One more swing and he was done.

This is my first play through. In fairness, I left the DLC until after I beat the Wet Nurse, so I'm fairly well levelled up.

Not looking forward to him in NG

I've wrapped up a few loose ends like Hypogean Gaol, the witch and the first chalice dungeon thing.
Although I'm making my way through forbidden woods now and it's testing my bloody patience

Generic Dreadhead

Make sure you unlock the shortcuts where you can as that area is large and tedious.
I didn't hate Forbidden Woods, but didn't really do anything to make me love it.
Funnily enough the next area then is super short.
Are you going totally blind or are you keeping an eye out for "missable trophies"?

I've relented and started following a guide. Forbidden woods was too much, couldn't find my way around. Although i think i've picked up nearly everything worthwhile in the area through trial and error:D
When I finally found the Shadows of Yharnham I was able to take em down first try, first time thats happened so far, and probably the last:rolleyes:
I'm debating will I use the tonsil stone i got in the woods now or will i press on with the story

Generic Dreadhead

Just if you're concerned about "missable" trophies/events/items I will say this:

The next logical storyline area area is tiny but killing the boss there (Rom) triggers a point of no return for many of the NPC activities

Personally I was glad I knew that beforehand as I wouldn't have necessarily wanted to do be pushed to do a 2nd playthrough

I have Oedon chapel full I think and Henryk killed Eileen the Crow on me so i missed her questline. I've completed Hypogean Gaol and Nightmare frontier

Not sure is there much else to do before progressing the story?

nix

Cake of Tremendous Power wrote: »

I have Oedon chapel full I think and Henryk killed Eileen the Crow on me so i missed her questline. I've completed Hypogean Gaol and Nightmare frontier

Not sure is there much else to do before progressing the story?

Have you got

all the NPC's sent to the chapel or Iosefka's clinic? there are 5 in total.

I'd just restart though, I never had

Henryk

kill

Eileen

on me

Is it 5 including

the weirdo from the woods?

No way was I sending him back:pac:
I was furious with

Eileen dying. I went to the graveyard, he battered me and as i'm dying I see Eileen running in. So i run back from the lantern and he has a sliver of health left, kills her and then kills me again:mad:

Generic Dreadhead

Cake of Tremendous Power wrote: »

I have Oedon chapel full I think and Henryk killed Eileen the Crow on me so i missed her questline. I've completed Hypogean Gaol and Nightmare frontier

Not sure is there much else to do before progressing the story?

Have you done

Upper Cathedral Ward including finding the Abandoned Workshop and, importantly, 1/3rd Umbilical Chord?

Also, secret missable boss related... As long as

Arianna is safe in Odeon Chapel and you haven't told the "Suspicious Begger" in Forbidden Woods to go to Odean Chapel (send him to Iosefkas Clinic) and you haven't taken Ariannas Blood more than 3x times (Adela gets jealous and murdery if you do) you are in line to get the 2nd 1/3rd umbilical chord which is missable overall and can result in you missing a Secret Boss and the end of the game

Yeah, I got the

umbilical cord and didnt send the oddball to the chapel

Do i need to use the

cord

or keep it in my inventory?
I'm gonna try to finish Cainhurst Castle later and hopefully on to main story then assuming all goes well

Digital Solitude

Generic Dreadhead wrote: »

Have you done

Upper Cathedral Ward including finding the Abandoned Workshop and, importantly, 1/3rd Umbilical Chord?

Also, secret missable boss related... As long as

Arianna is safe in Odeon Chapel and you haven't told the "Suspicious Begger" in Forbidden Woods to go to Odean Chapel (send him to Iosefkas Clinic) and you haven't taken Ariannas Blood more than 3x times (Adela gets jealous and murdery if you do) you are in line to get the 2nd 1/3rd umbilical chord which is missable overall and can result in you missing a Secret Boss and the end of the game

There's 4 umbilical cords, 3 needed for the true ending, pretty sure you can't lock yourself out of it

Generic Dreadhead

Cake of Tremendous Power wrote: »

Yeah, I got the

umbilical cord and didnt send the oddball to the chapel

Do i need to use the

cord

or keep it in my inventory?[/SPOILER]

I used them at the end.

But you can use them as soon as you get them too afaik, makes no odds. You need 3 total (obviously) and theres only 4 in the game and 2 are "missable". As long as you don't go and interact with the final boss / game ending (and annoyingly forcing New Game+ instantly grrrr) sequence before taking them,

you'll be fine

Did you

go to Ioesfkas Clinic via Forbidden Woods btw?

I'm gonna try to finish Cainhurst Castle later and hopefully on to main story then assuming all goes well

I'd leave Chainhurst until later on tbh It's a higher level area and the Boss can be tough...

... well maybe that was just my experience with him :pac:

Exhibit A) Cainhurst Boss dying spoiler (feat: Imagine LTE $hitty upload speeds)
https://clips.twitch.tv/GlamorousInterestingNuggetsArsonNoSexy

Digital Solitude wrote: »

There's 4 umbilical cords, 3 needed for the true ending, pretty sure you can't lock yourself out of it

You can depending on if you Kill Imposter Ioesfka or visit the Clinic before you Kill Rom (which I actually intentionally did for a Rune, safe in the knowledge I had Ariannas cord secured) and if you let Arianna die to either Adella/Suspicious Begger or just straight up never interact with her prior to the Rom Kill which triggers the Blood Moon

But maybe I'm wrong

GoldenLynel

Generic Dreadhead wrote: »

I'd leave Chainhurst until later on tbh It's a higher level area and the Boss can be tough...

... well maybe that was just my experience with him :pac:

One of the best boss battles I've ever played. Not objectively, probably, but just because of the sheer number of times I tried to beat him and lost.

When I finally did it you'd think Ireland had just won the world cup, the way I reacted.

Magnificent game!

TitianGerm

GoldenLynel wrote: »

One of the best boss battles I've ever played. Not objectively, probably, but just because of the sheer number of times I tried to beat him and lost.

When I finally did it you'd think Ireland had just won the world cup, the way I reacted.

Magnificent game!

I found him the toughest boss in the game. I really struggled to beat him and when I finally did I ran a celebration around the house :pac:

Digital Solitude

Generic Dreadhead wrote: »

You can depending on if you Kill Imposter Ioesfka or visit the Clinic before you Kill Rom (which I actually intentionally did for a Rune, safe in the knowledge I had Ariannas cord secured) and if you let Arianna die to either Adella/Suspicious Begger or just straight up never interact with her prior to the Rom Kill which triggers the Blood Moon

But maybe I'm wrong

Nah you're right, I didn't realise you could miss the Clinic's

Generic Dreadhead

Cake of Tremendous Power you should have 10% Vitality and 10% Stamina Runes now (Anti Clockwise Metamorphosis and Clockwise Metamorphosis) by the way.
If not, go back into the relevant areas and get them.
2x best runes for 99% of the game and they are total "gimmes"

http://bloodborne.wiki.fextralife.com/Clockwise+Metamorphosis
http://bloodborne.wiki.fextralife.com/Anti-Clockwise+Metamorphosis

I got them, 5% and 10% ones i think
On the topic of Bloodborne, anyone pick this up? First issue is interesting and the writer says hes put 200 hours into the game/

WarpAsylum

Cake of Tremendous Power wrote: »

On the topic of Bloodborne, anyone pick this up? First issue is interesting and the writer says hes put 200 hours into the game/

Ooooh!! Now that, I'd be interested in.

Don't know how I did it but i bate Martyr Logarious first try:eek:
I thought I might be overlevelled so I started the DLC. Old Hunters wasn't long putting me in my place.
Found the shortcut back to the first lamp and turned it off. Wrecked from the Bloodborne