A friend is getting new dogs - do I interfere?

TG1

I'm hoping for some ideas/ advice on a delicate issue that has cropped up!

I have a friend who up until recently had a 14 year old "miniature" yorkie. I want to stress, the dog never wanted for a thing in her 14 year long life, but, she was never trained. She was tiny when she was a pup and this was used as an excuse to carry her when she didn't want to walk and not let her socialise with other dogs.

As a result she was snappy with dogs (She bit mine on a few occasions but her tiny mouth didn't get through the fur), was only allowed socialise with my guy since he's a pushover, was picked up if any other dog so much as looked at her, had no recall, didn't respond to any commands and didn't walk more than a couple of meters before sitting down and refusing to budge. She still peed in the house if new rugs or carpets were put down.

She was also regularly fed chocolate and for at least the last 6 years vets were describing her as obese.

She was never neutered because she was "too small" but was never bred from, and at age 12 had to go under anesthetic because she had pyometra.

None of the behavioral issues caused huge problems as she was tiny and could be picked up if anything went wrong, but they would definitely have been problematic if she was bigger. the health issues are another side to the problem, but not one I think can really be influenced... Vets tried for years and failed.

Years ago we were very close, went to school together, walked the dogs together etc. Over the last few years we have drifted as people do, but she rang me after the dog died as I would have been closest to her over most of the dogs life. I was genuinely upset for her and we've met up a few times since, and kept in regular contact.

She's now just after deciding to get two new yorkie puppies, two girls from the same litter.... Now I don't think any dogs would be intentionally mistreated with the family, in fact the opposite will occur, they will be dearly loved, and have everything a dog could want, but I worry that the reason the old dog didn't cause issues was because there was one of her and she could easily be removed from any situation.

I worry that the two new dogs will not be trained, be stuffed with food and chocolate and never be neutered just like the old dog,and that with two the situation will get out of control, and one or both dogs could end up in a pound or worse...

I understand she wants a new dog, I can imagine the house is horribly empty as the old one was definitely a character, I'd say they are really missing her. She says she couldn't have one as it would feel like replacing the old one but two will be a different dynamic so it wouldn't be as bad.

I know its none of my business really, but I just don't know should I try to discuss my fears about two pups with her, or try to be a bit more delicate and offer to lend her training and dog books in the hopes she takes the hint, or just watch and see what happens... Or am I just sticking my nose in where it shouldn't be?

I really don't want to come off as judgmental or preachy as our friendship is only starting up again, but I had 3 dogs in the house I lived in at one point and it was chaos... they were all adult dogs and 2 of the three were fairly decently trained, and myself and the other dog owner spent the 6 months that the three were there thinking of nothing but dogs, as everything to do with them required military-style planning! I just don't think she appreciates how much work two puppies will be...

Any opinions or advice are appreciated!

borderlinemeath

There was a thread on something similar recently - 2 bitches is a bad combinations, worse still if hormones are at play. Also it is infinitely harder to train littermates as they have each other and tend to rely on each other rather than the human, they also need to be trained apart. As you expect there isn't going to be any training done anyway, it's going to be a nightmare. And then they'll start fighting and something will have to give.

This is the thread that describes how close family bitches can spark off each other, don't mind the thread title.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=89937194

Inexile

I think you could give constructive advice eg. getting two litter mates is a bad idea its better to get one now and another next year. Show her a few articles how to chose a pup etc so its not just your opinion.

If you steer her towards a good breeder or rescue, if she wants to go that route, they will probably tell her the same thing.

that's said this is a woman who took on two female litter mates and they were absolutely great but then they were not terriers

Tranceypoo

From my experience, and speaking as a person who is not known for treading gently or being remotely diplomatic, you need to tread gently and be diplomatic!!

I would engage with her about it in such a way as you almost aren't sure what you're talking about and so you did a bit of research on the subject and 'I was reading this article about littermates and apparently 2 females from the same litter can very often be really hard to handle, sounds like a bit of a nightmare, here look at this...' sort of thing, then 'I was on FB and looking at this rescue site oh look at this gorgeous puppy/small dog/young dog looking for a home, wouldn't that be great to get a lovely dog and you'd be saving a rescue dog at the same time you know I was reading up on puppy farms and back yard breeders oh my god it sounds awful...', don't flood her with too much info at once, don't get judgemental or come across as if you're pushing your ideas onto her, just softly softly, a bit more every day - does that make sense?

DaisyD2

You may not have any influence as it sounds like the decision is made but something that sticks out for me is - does she already have 2 sisters/littermates picked out?

My DaisyDawg is a very small Yorkie, bred from a runt who only had 1. She was so small getting her that I had her spayed at 6mths as my Mums male Yorkie was not yet neutered (they since came round & have had him done) but her dog is 4 times the size of mine!

Its very unusual to get tiny Yorkies, a litter of 2 or more suggests to me at least a regular size. Is your friend prepared for extra work? They are highly intelligent breed, mine has pure ratter instincts which were a joy to train. I suffer with a bad back so got her for company & trained her to do the running & bring the toys to me but she still loves a good walk from time to time. Shes not just a pretty face!

Unfortunately a lot of people love the "idea" of having animals but have no idea how to actually go about doing whats best for one, your friend, I fear, falls into this category

TG1

Thanks for the replies!

The info in that thread you linked Borderlinemeath is exactly the sort of thing I'm afraid of... I know from her reactions to other dogs that she doesn't really understand where aggression comes from, and I'm afraid if any signs of aggression might end up with one or both given away or PTS despite it being a very predictable outcome of two littermates... (she never viewed her last dog biting mine as aggressive because "he sniffed her first" etc. and there were never consequences because he was to hairy for her to damage)

I thought when I posted that it was still just a thought but I chatted to her this morning and she has been talking to the breeder of her old dog, who has puppies currently, so I don't know has she specific pups picked but... as for steering her towards other breeders or rescues, she would love a rescue dog, but her mom (who would spend most time with them I think) is extremely prejudiced... the old "oh no, you'd never know when that would snap" rubbish, and my friend is pretty allergic to my hairy dog (who is a pound dog and her Mom loves, but I don't think she does the maths on that one... :rolleyes:) which is why she wants yorkies, I might try to suggest looking at other breeders though as I don't think this one batted an eye at taking two females together.

I tried chatting to her about how much hard work puppies are but she is convinced they did a grand job with the last dog and that was easy... as I said in my OP, I don't agree with that, but everyone has rose tinted glasses when it comes to their own I think...

Diplomacy is not a trait I'm known for but I'll take the suggestions on board and try to tread lightly and have a chat with her, but after talking to her this morning I think you might be right DaisyD2, it might be a lost cause...