DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

Corrib man

Hey all, no harm to race the hm, why not finish flat out, legs feeling it afterwards? The dcm is weeks away and being out on your feet this weekend won't do any harm when the pressure kicks in late in dcm.

laura_ac3

Short week this week.

Sunday - rest
Monday - 4 miles. Legs felt very very heavy at first but loosened out in the last mile.
Tuesday - squash.
Wednesday - 5 miles. Garmin was dead so just had to run by feel. Legs a bit better than Monday but still heavy at first, took the pace easy. Felt great in the last 2 miles, no watch obviously but pace definitely quicker than usual, decided to enjoy it.

Will rest tomorrow and Friday before the half. Might have an Epsom salt bath tomorrow - Thursday madness :cool: booked in for a sports massage next week so looking forward to that, will keep up the foam rolling in the meantime.

Looking forward to Saturday now.

Firedance

There's lots of chat over on the DCM thread about the course itself and where you should/shouldn't increase/decrease your effort, do we need to think about this at all as novices? Should we be planning for how we might feel at certain points and plan adjust pace accordingly?

Joleigh

I think my strategy on the day will be to find a comfortable pace and stick to it. Hills will take extra effort and and flats/downhills will be a welcome break. Sometimes having a marathon plan is like having a birth plan. It sounds great until you get into the labour ward then it all goes out the window!

adrian522

If you are following a pacer just follow their pace, if not I guess make sure not to over extend your self too early, i.e don't try to run to some predetermined pace up Chesterfield avenue and don't try to make up time coming down from Castleknock.

In other words just run to effort rather than pace if you are not going with a pacer. As we are all(mostly) doing this for the first time I imagine the targets and the pace will be pretty conservative so there should be no thoughts of trying to make up time on down hill sections or anything like that.

Leave that to the guys and girls trying to shave a few mins off a PB.

That is my take on it, though obviously I've never run the distance so that that with a pinch of salt too.,

dukeraoul

Firedance wrote: »

There's lots of chat over on the DCM thread about the course itself and where you should/shouldn't increase/decrease your effort, do we need to think about this at all as novices? Should we be planning for how we might feel at certain points and plan adjust pace accordingly?

I'd honestly ignore a lot if it(and I say that as a vocal participant in that thread) most of the chat is between posters who are on a knife edge time wise and are trying to calculate down to the minute.

Is the course a bit tougher this year? IMO yup but tbh if you're well trained, have followed the plan and aren't particularly bothered about a minute or two lost here or there then it won't make one bit of difference.

For most of you it's your first marathon and the most important thing is to enjoy it. It's actually a prettier course this year with great views up in Chapelizod etc.. So what I'm saying is, don't worry at all. Be aware of effort on particular drags or hills and adjust accordingly. Most of all- have fun!

Ososlo

Firedance wrote: »

There's lots of chat over on the DCM thread about the course itself and where you should/shouldn't increase/decrease your effort, do we need to think about this at all as novices? Should we be planning for how we might feel at certain points and plan adjust pace accordingly?

They're a load of scardey cats you guys can handle a few bumps in the road

There are two things you can't control on the day. They are the weather and the course. It is completely pointless worrying about either thing. You are stressing yourselves unnecessarily. Just go out there with a good positive attitude and trust in your training and it will all fall into place!

hillsiderunner

Have just finished my running for the week until Saturday morning. Skipped Wednesday's 3miles, but everything else ran according to plan and both legs are feeling ok.

Tues: 1.6miles w/u, 5x650m intervals, 1.6miles c/d
[the w/u and c/d miles were slow and untimed! The repeats were 2:49, 4x2:46. A little bit slower than the last set of these I did some weeks ago ... but I had big difficulty pushing myself out the door for this session - so the accomplishment was going along at all]

Thurs: 4.61miles w 4x100m strides.
[Average pace for the non-stride running was 9:05, fairly consistent. Strides done at .93 mark of miles 1-4 and reduced the mile pace by about 10secs each time]

Just a bit of stretching for the next day and a half.

I measured the DCHM online and the landscape is:

first 1.5miles (flattish), miles 1.5-3.5 (uphill climb of about 48metres), miles 3.5-9 flattish, mile 9-10 downhill :-), mile 10-11.7 (mostly flattish, some small up/downs), mile 11.7-12.9 (climb of about 48 metres), run-in flat...
The early climb and later climb have about the same increase in height, but the early one is over a longer distance so will feel easier. Neither is too terrible.

I am still aiming for the sub 1:50, but I've decided I'm going to head out a bit slower than the pacer for the first 3-4 miles, around 8:30-8:35, or slower if it's hot. Then I will pick it up a bit if I'm feeling good. Negative splits I hope :-)

The weather forecast is looking a bit better than it had been, slightly more cloud and slightly cooler. Fingers crossed.

Good luck to everyone with the Goal pace

frash

hillsiderunner wrote: »

The weather forecast is looking a bit better than it had been, slightly more cloud and slightly cooler. Fingers crossed.

Rain forecast too!

Chrismc31

I've been following this thread for a while and it's been very useful. I'm hoping to do my first DCM in Oct but been a bit plagued by injury so had been a bit behind on training my longest run was 15M on 7th Sept. All was going well until I did something to my IT band last week. Off to Physio for some deep tissue massage and dry needling and taping.......to make matters worse i developed a bad kidney infection this week so off the roads since last Thursday. IT band no better so will need to revisit Physio - was hoping to be back running this weekend but this is unlikely. My running buddies reckon I'll be fine to start on the 27th but I'm not so sure..........time is really coming in fast. At this rate the longest run I could hope for pre DCM would be an 18 miler. I have no ambition re time at this stage...would take 5/5:30 as it is my first (and possibly only) marathon. Am I deluding myself that I will be able to start or should I just see how recovery goes and make a decision nearer the time?

Ososlo

Chrismc31 wrote: »

I've been following this thread for a file and it's been very useful. I'm hoping to do my fits DCM in Oct but been a bit plagued by injury so had been a bit behind on training my longest run was 15M on 7th Sept. All was going well until I did something to my IT band last week. Off to Physio for some deep tissue massage and dry needling and taping.......to make matters worse i developed a bad kidney infection this week so off the roads since last Thursday. IT band no better so will need to revisit Physio - was hoping to be back running this weekend but this is unlikely. My running buddies reckon I'll be fine to start on the 27th but I'm not so sure..........time is really coming in fast. At this rate the longest run I could hope for pre DCM would be an 18 miler. I have no ambition re time at this stage...would take 5/5:30 as it is my first (and only) marathon. Am I deluding myself that I will be able to start or should I just see how recovery goes and make a decision nearer the time?

If you have no time target yes you can do it imo provided your injury has healed up soon. It'd be a really bad idea to run it on an injury so I wouldn't make a final decision yet.
What do you mean by it being your 'only' marathon? Do you not plan on ever doing another one?

Chrismc31

Thanks a million for your quick reply and all your advice on this thread. I'll give Physio another shot and see how the recovery goes. I certainly wouldn't dream of running if not 100% fit though. I always said I have only one marathon in me but with all the injuries during training for this one I think DCM and I may have unfisinished business come the afternoon of the 27th October :-)

Ososlo

Chrismc31 wrote: »

Thanks a million for your quick reply and all your advice on this thread. I'll give Physio another shot and see how the recovery goes. I certainly wouldn't dream of running if not 100% fit though. I always said I have only one marathon in me but with all the injuries during training for this one I think DCM and I may have unfisinished business come the afternoon of the 27th October :-)

Cheers for that

how long are you running? If you're fairly new to it it'd be normal to get the odd overuse injury due to ramping up the mileage quickly.
What's your weekly mileage like and are you following a plan?

Chrismc31

Thanks Ososlo

I'm running about 2 years and have a few halfs under my belt with no problems (PB 2:09)

Was running between 26 - 30 miles a week depending on long run before injury. Fingers crossed second physio session will work some magic :-)

Pacing Mule

Firedance wrote: »

There's lots of chat over on the DCM thread about the course itself and where you should/shouldn't increase/decrease your effort, do we need to think about this at all as novices? Should we be planning for how we might feel at certain points and plan adjust pace accordingly?

My approach to this has been relatively simple. The course has hills - practice running on hills. Get used to running up them, how it feels, what effort is required to maintain pace, what happens the pace with the same effort going up and what happens in reverse going down. I used to be afraid of hills - I'm not anymore. That may change 22 miles in after Roebuck Road appears of course.

My plan is to go out with the pace group but not be a slave to it. If I need to slow a bit I will, If I feel it is wise to speed up to gain some time I will but all along it will be my race I will run - not the pacers.

Ecoli however did offer some great advice about not trying to immediately make up time on the steep downhill from Castleknock to Chapleizod as he reckons it is likely to end up thrashing your quads which you won't realise at the time but will miles later. That's something I probably would have done so am glad to have read the advice here in advance.

Calvin Johnson

Would you speed up at random parts of the course PM - or in the last few miles?

Pacing Mule

Calvin Johnson wrote: »

Would you speed up at random parts of the course PM - or in the last few miles?

TBH most speed fluctuations I would imagine would be from the terrain. I'm hoping for relatively constant effort which will see minor pace fluctuations either side of goal. I had reckoned I would lose a bit of time on Chesterfield Ave but could easily make it back up in the next couple of miles. That may have been a fatal mistake by what Ecoli has said so I would be a bit more inclined now to be looking at pulling any lost time back more gradually and later in the race. For example it may be wiser to claw more back down Fosters Ave and Nutley lane than trying to get it all back in the first half. Towards the end yeah if there is something in the tank I would love to finish strong but time will tell there.

Murph_D

Calvin Johnson wrote: »

Would you speed up at random parts of the course PM - or in the last few miles?

The last few miles are all about hanging on. I wouldn't be banking on a speed boost at that stage. If you can maintain pace you'll be doing well.

Dub13

Looking forward to the half now but I hate tapering don't know what to be doing with myself...:) I feel good and hope to go sub 1:45 (pb is 1:46:26) but not to hung up on that.

menoscemo

Pacing Mule wrote: »

TBH most speed fluctuations I would imagine would be from the terrain. I'm hoping for relatively constant effort which will see minor pace fluctuations either side of goal. I had reckoned I would lose a bit of time on Chesterfield Ave but could easily make it back up in the next couple of miles. That may have been a fatal mistake by what Ecoli has said so I would be a bit more inclined now to be looking at pulling any lost time back more gradually and later in the race. For example it may be wiser to claw more back down Fosters Ave and Nutley lane than trying to get it all back in the first half. Towards the end yeah if there is something in the tank I would love to finish strong but time will tell there.

By far the fastest part of the course is from Terenure College (mile 15??) to Milltown (mile 20??). It's a gradual slight downhill on very nice, straight, newly tarmacked roads. Personally as a pacer we will be aiming to be on time at halfway but I won't worry if we are a few seconds behind at that point because if you've paced it right you will make up some time on those 5 mile without busting a gut.

Pacing Mule

menoscemo wrote: »

By far the fastest part of the course is from Terenure College (mile 15??) to Milltown (mile 20??). It's a gradual slight downhill on very nice, straight, newly tarmacked roads. Personally as a pacer we will be aiming to be on time at halfway but I won't worry if we are a few seconds behind at that point because if you've paced it right you will make up some time on those 5 mile without busting a gut.

I think Terenure comes around mile 18 this year. Milltown is at 20 alright.

adrian522

Terenure College is at mile 17, more or less.

menoscemo

adrian522 wrote: »

Terenure College is at mile 17, more or less.

Yes you are right, just checked the new route. Miles 17-21 are very fast and it's a lovely stretch.

Joleigh

Think I will get the hubby to drive me along the marathon route so I can concentrate and take note!! Maybe I'll get out of the car at Roebuck and run up the hill!

adrian522

6 Miles this evening, threw in 8 strides at the end, feeling a lot better now, knee was giving a bit of trouble but now seems much better.

I always get super paranoid about injuries the week of a race, and my half was partially ruined by an injury this time last year.

Plan for tomorrow is for 3 easy miles at lunch time, then a bit of foam rolling and stretching tomorrow evening.

Heading to Cork for a stag night after the half on Saturday, I'd say I'll be in some state Saturday night. Planning on jumping on the train at 2pm so will try and clean myself as much as possible before getting on the train !!

tunguska

Firedance wrote: »

There's lots of chat over on the DCM thread about the course itself and where you should/shouldn't increase/decrease your effort, do we need to think about this at all as novices? Should we be planning for how we might feel at certain points and plan adjust pace accordingly?

I think its a good idea to study the course and know what you're getting into. I mean just because its your first marathon doesn't mean you can't be well prepared. Fore warned is fore armed and the more wide you are to the various hills and general terrain the more enjoyable the whole thing will be. There's absolutely nothing wrong with knowing where to push and where to hold back. Having that kind of information at hand will reduce the chances of blowing up and having a nightmare.

annapr

frash wrote: »

Rain forecast too!

looking like it will be cooler and less humid on Saturday... perfect conditions!

locombia

Hi there! Looking forward to tomorrows half but this morning I woke up feeling a little run down..that feeling of an oncoming cold/flu...any good suggestions on what to do/take to strengthen my system and get me through the race tomorrow? I'm looking to come in sub 1 50 but to do this I really need to push myself and race it flat out... Thanks :-)

Ososlo

locombia wrote: »

Hi there! Looking forward to tomorrows half but this morning I woke up feeling a little run down..that feeling of an oncoming cold/flu...any good suggestions on what to do/take to strengthen my system and get me through the race tomorrow? I'm looking to come in sub 1 50 but to do this I really need to push myself and race it flat out... Thanks :-)

Sorry to hear that
Plenty of fluids and vitamin c - oranges, vegetables etc and just rest yourself as much as possible!
Hope you wake up feeling a million dollars!

SeanPuddin

locombia wrote: »

Hi there! Looking forward to tomorrows half but this morning I woke up feeling a little run down..that feeling of an oncoming cold/flu...any good suggestions on what to do/take to strengthen my system and get me through the race tomorrow? I'm looking to come in sub 1 50 but to do this I really need to push myself and race it flat out... Thanks :-)

If your not feeling well tomorrow forget about the tactic of running and hanging on, it will end in sheer misery. My advise would be to start behind even the 2hr pacer and take it handy to half way, assess and push on if you think everything's okay. Very easy to turn a race into a death slog by not listening to your body, I know all about it! Take care.