DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

AuldManKing

MLC_biker wrote: »

Good luck to those doing the Athlone 3/4 this weekend. Just as a heads up, I met Jim Aughney at Lord Mayors 5-alive reception in April. I mentioned I was planning to do the DCM, and asked about Athlone. His view was that (as a novice) if I ran it as a race I'd probably not recover in time, but if I treated it as a training run it was fine.

Given my overzealous approach to races (Endomondo : '' 1km in 5 and a half minutes" Me : oh bu**er , plan was 6.5-7min) I am playing it safe and circling Dublins northside (running down Watermill Road :-) )

Any novice doing Athlone 3/4 this week - DON'T RACE IT.

Very few people actually race it - the vast majority do it with the pacers who will run at MP+5% or run easy for 5-6 miles and MP for the rest.

Whatever your strategy, dont do MP for the full distance.

I'm pacing the 3:30 marathon equivalent with Meno - its about 8:25 pace there or there abouts.

sca21

Ososlo wrote: »

Hope you nail that sub 4 sca21!
How far did you get in training last year? Have the injury woes left you completely?

Got as far as week 8 on my plan. I upped my milage too quickly. That and a combination of poor stretching and overall core strength. Ya injury has stayed away so far (as I touch the kitchen table!) Have ran wisely this year, with plenty of recovery runs and a gradual increase in milage. Have been running consistently all year 15-20 miles a week prior to my plan which is 14 weeks. Weekly milage has been mostly over 30 miles peaking at 40 two weeks ago and a planned 44 mile week this week. Have made my plan myself from a mixture of Hal Higdon notice 2 and my own input.

Ososlo

sca21 wrote: »

Got as far as week 8 on my plan. I upped my milage too quickly. That and a combination of poor stretching and overall core strength. Ya injury has stayed away so far (as I touch the kitchen table!) Have ran wisely this year, with plenty of recovery runs and a gradual increase in milage. Have been running consistently all year 15-20 miles a week prior to my plan which is 14 weeks. Weekly milage has been mostly over 30 miles peaking at 40 two weeks ago and a planned 44 mile week this week. Have made my plan myself from a mixture of Hal Higdon notice 2 and my own input.

Super stuff! Looks like you're well set! How're you finding the longer runs?

Dub13

adrian522 wrote: »

I wouldn't be too sure on doing another 22 miles this weekend. We're following the same plan and that has a 16 mile run for this week I believe. I'm going to push it to 18 but leave it at that.

In terms of long runs I think you are well set but I'd be heeding the advice of AMK above at this stage.

Yes I have had a change of hart on this, I did want this LSR to be my longest and then start the taper but I also think I have the LSR well cover at this stage.

sca21

Ososlo wrote: »

Super stuff! Looks like you're well set! How're you finding the longer runs?

Not bad now. Three 12s , a half, 14,15,16, 19 and a 20 so far with a 20 this week and a 16 yet went. All done at 9.45 pace. All comfortable bar the twenty which was done on a very hot day.

Ososlo

sca21 wrote: »

Not bad now. Three 12s , a half, 14,15,16, 19 and a 20 so far with a 20 this week and a 16 yet went. All done at 9.45 pace. All comfortable bar the twenty which was done on a very hot day.

Great preparation! Hope training continues to go well!

Laois_Man

Ososlo wrote: »

You have any time target at all in mind for it or where you'll line up that morning?

That's the thing you see and it's why I asked the question. Where most people are worried about how they'll feel at 20 miles, I'm only worried about how I'll feel crossing the start line. It's hard to know where to line up when it takes you so long to get going and you're possibly gonna lose your group in the first half mile.

I wouldn't even completely rule out going with the walkers. Yeah, I'm serious.

I'm getting slower and slower. Would it be outlandishly foolish to consider taking 7-10 days off at this stage? Yeah, I'm still serious!

Mimojo

Got into the car last night after work & whatever made me look at the mileage tracker...this is what I saw! I'm really not superstitious but this has gotta be a sign lol!!!

LaHaine

Mimojo wrote: »

Got into the car last night after work & whatever made me look at the mileage tracker...this is what I saw! I'm really not superstitious but this has gotta be a sign lol!!!

Thats awesome! !

Nicsx

Having run the 1st half of DCM route 3 times as part of my LSR I have not been feeling the love for the stretch up by Crumlin Hospital so this morning I decided to do battle with my Drimnagh Road demons at my (hopeful) PMP. Result (for this morning anyway) - demons vanquished!! Of course, today it was part of 9m as opposed to 21m but I'm happy anyway. We'll see how I get on on Friday as I'll be hitting that stretch at 17m.

Nicsx

Mimojo wrote: »

Got into the car last night after work & whatever made me look at the mileage tracker...this is what I saw! I'm really not superstitious but this has gotta be a sign lol!!!

Maybe it's a prediction that you'll be running the exact racing line & won't be adding any unnecessary mileage!

KillianByrne

Mimojo wrote: »

Got into the car last night after work & whatever made me look at the mileage tracker...this is what I saw! I'm really not superstitious but this has gotta be a sign lol!!!

Thats all very good, but I think you could go faster than 14hrs 63minutes and 45seconds. stick with PM and me, the 13hr pacing team.

AdpRo

Looking for some advice from the veterans on here and thought this was the best thread to use! Running Amsterdam marathon the week before Dublin, it will be my 2nd marathon, was a DCM novice in 2012 under the guidance of Younganne and managed to finish in 4.39 after staying with the 4.30 pacers till mile 19. I got injured very early into DCM 2013 training but have been running pretty consistantly this year and set a few pb's.

Training for Amsterdam had been going ok (averaging around 45 mpw) until the last couple of weeks. Some real life stuff got in the way of training and when I did get out I was struggling both physically and mentally even at easy pace. I missed a couple of LSR's and mid-week MP runs as well. I had been targeting sub 4 but ran a shocking Frank Duffy 10 miler and after struggling to 1.53 in Athlone 1/2 a couple of weeks ago decided to drop back to 4.10/4.15.

Went out for my last LSR last friday and got 20 done, it actually went fairly well and I finished averaging 10.23 m/m and felt I could have done another couple of miles. Then this morning the plan called for 14 @ MP, I was absolutely dreading this and decided to run by feel and not keep looking at the watch. I would have been happy with anything around 9.30 m/m but everytime I looked at the watch during the run I was seeing average pace of around 9.08-9.10 m/m. Miles ticked by and all was good. Struggled a little the last 3 miles but they were mainly uphill, especially the last mile. Could have managed a couple more downhill / flat miles if I had too. Miles and HR below.

Mile| Pace | Avg HR

1 |8.57|145
2 |9.22|156
3 |9.05|156
4 |9.17|165
5 |9.05|168
6 |9.02|167
7 |9.08|168
8 |9.09|171
9 |9.04|172
10 |9.05|172
11 |8.59|170
12 |9.04|177
13 |8.56|179
14 |9.07|183



My average HR was 185 for Athlone and maxed out at 205 so I think the above looks reasonable. I done this run before work with only a banana and glass of water 10 mins before starting and took nothing during run. I am absolutely delighted with how it went and think I should go for sub 4 now, better fueling and taper should ensure I get to at least 20 miles feeling reasonable but would love to know other peoples thoughts.

aquinn

***TOP TIP***
Don't have a curry if feeling unwell and expect to run successfully the next day! 😆

menoscemo

Weetabix wrote: »

Mile| Pace | Avg HR

1 |8.57|145
2 |9.22|156
3 |9.05|156
4 |9.17|165
5 |9.05|168
6 |9.02|167
7 |9.08|168
8 |9.09|171
9 |9.04|172
10 |9.05|172
11 |8.59|170
12 |9.04|177
13 |8.56|179
14 |9.07|183



My average HR was 185 for Athlone and maxed out at 205 so I think the above looks reasonable. I done this run before work with only a banana and glass of water 10 mins before starting and took nothing during run. I am absolutely delighted with how it went and think I should go for sub 4 now, better fueling and taper should ensure I get to at least 20 miles feeling reasonable but would love to know other peoples thoughts.

Hi Weetabix. The only worry I would have is that your HR seems to rising rapidly and steadily at that pace, within another 6-7 miles you would be hitting your max Hr which would be unsustainable.
Ideally your HR should remain at a steady level once you are warmed up.

smashiner

Hi guys,
Just did a real 'junk run' on the way home from work! In fairness it was 8 miles/13k all uphill from Heuston to Kingswood via the canal and Naas road finishing with a Roebuck Road type run from New lands cross up past the Fire Station.

Felt knackered after the run, maybe long day at work etc had me tired?? Anyone else struggling with their midweek runs.......please say yes!!!!
Only a week and a half of training torture left :-))

smashiner

Hi guys,
Just did a real 'junk run' on the way home from work! In fairness it was 8 miles/13k all uphill from Heuston to Kingswood via the canal and Naas road finishing with a Roebuck Road type run from New lands cross up past the Fire Station.

Felt knackered after the run, maybe long day at work etc had me tired?? Anyone else struggling with their midweek runs.......please say yes!!!!
Only a week and a half of training torture left :-))

Pacing Mule

KillianByrne wrote: »

Thats all very good, but I think you could go faster than 14hrs 63minutes and 45seconds. stick with PM and me, the 13hr pacing team.

When was I commandeered for this

AdpRo

menoscemo wrote: »

Hi Weetabix. The only worry I would have is that your HR seems to rising rapidly and steadily at that pace, within another 6-7 miles you would be hitting your max Hr which would be unsustainable.
Ideally your HR should remain at a steady level once you are warmed up.

I agree, although i thought it was ok till mile 11 when it took a big jump but that mile was all uphill as was the last mile so was putting it down to that but i see what you are saying and agree it wouldn't be sustainable for another 12 mile. Food for thought anyway and will think about it over the next few days before deciding MP!

MKDTH

Laois_Man wrote: »

That's the thing you see and it's why I asked the question. Where most people are worried about how they'll feel at 20 miles, I'm only worried about how I'll feel crossing the start line. It's hard to know where to line up when it takes you so long to get going and you're possibly gonna lose your group in the first half mile.

I wouldn't even completely rule out going with the walkers. Yeah, I'm serious.

I'm getting slower and slower. Would it be outlandishly foolish to consider taking 7-10 days off at this stage? Yeah, I'm still serious!

Lol you sound like me, although I pretty much took the whole of August and September off besides for 10 mile and half marathon races due to injury.

Still may run the Marathon depending on when my appointment for a operation on a small tear in my cartilage is.

And the Doctor is fine with me running it if the date of the op is after DCM.

I've started the last two races at the back with really slow people and enjoyed slowly building up my pace (finished 10m in 1:41 and half in 2:23) and over taking people so I would not put you off starting with the walkers as its great for the confidence!

Ososlo

MKDTH wrote: »

Lol you sound like me, although I pretty much took the whole of August and September off besides for 10 mile and half marathon races due to injury.

Still may run the Marathon depending on when my appointment for a operation on a small tear in my cartilage is.

And the Doctor is fine with me running it if the date of the op is after DCM.

I've started the last two races at the back with really slow people and enjoyed slowly building up my pace (finished 10m in 1:41 and half in 2:23) and over taking people so I would not put you off starting with the walkers as its great for the confidence!

If you have your heart set on doing it (and I get the impression that you do) then that's actually a really sensible way to approach it. I'm delighted you have the ok from the doc to do it. Do it with no pressures on yourself whatsoever and just plan to enjoy it and take it as it comes and don't force anything if injuries rear their ugly heads.

Ososlo

Laois_Man wrote: »

That's the thing you see and it's why I asked the question. Where most people are worried about how they'll feel at 20 miles, I'm only worried about how I'll feel crossing the start line. It's hard to know where to line up when it takes you so long to get going and you're possibly gonna lose your group in the first half mile.

I wouldn't even completely rule out going with the walkers. Yeah, I'm serious.

I'm getting slower and slower. Would it be outlandishly foolish to consider taking 7-10 days off at this stage? Yeah, I'm still serious!

If you need 7-10 days off then you should take them and review things after that. MKDTH gave some really good advice there.
Why don't you take a few days off for starters and let everything settle and see how you feel?

MKDTH

Ososlo wrote: »

If you have your heart set on doing it (and I get the impression that you do) then that's actually a really sensible way to approach it. I'm delighted you have the ok from the doc to do it. Do it with no pressures on yourself whatsoever and just plan to enjoy it and take it as it comes and don't force anything if injuries rear their ugly heads.

Cheers, well I will see how training goes as I need to get in some long runs to help me get through it. The last four miles of the half were rancid due to my lack of fitness.
I did three miles today just to test the water as my first run training without having to stop and walk for two lamposts and had no reaction and see the doctor in the morning to discuss the minor op.
If the op is after DCM, training will need to not have any back to back days. This will help protect myself against further.

Ososlo

MKDTH wrote: »

Cheers, well I will see how training goes as I need to get in some long runs to help me get through it. The last four miles of the half were rancid due to my lack of fitness.
I did three miles today just to test the water as my first run training without having to stop and walk for two lamposts and had no reaction and see the doctor in the morning to discuss the minor op.
If the op is after DCM, training will need to not have any back to back days. This will help protect myself against further.

Yep error on side of caution for sure. It's really not worth doing extra damage to yourself so you're out for months and months. A walk/run strategy on the day will probably suit you best and you'll still be able to do a decent time.

I've said it before, here and elsewhere, but to say it again to everyone, DCM is only one race. We're all caught up in the frenzy of it now, but it'll be there next year and every year after that for our running lifetimes so no one should put too much pressure on themselves to run it if not fully prepared or if they have constant niggles or injuries. A year is such a short amount of time that if anyone does have to put it off, the time will fly by and you can approach it as a much more experienced and wiser runner (after following this super thread:pac:) next year!

MKDTH

Ososlo wrote: »

Yep error on side of caution for sure. It's really not worth doing extra damage to yourself so you're out for months and months. A walk/run strategy on the day will probably suit you best and you'll still be able to do a decent time.

I've said it before, here and elsewhere, but to say it again to everyone, DCM is only one race. We're all caught up in the frenzy of it now, but it'll be there next year and every year after that for our running lifetimes so no one should put too much pressure on themselves to run it if not fully prepared or if they have constant niggles or injuries. A year is such a short amount of time that if anyone does have to put it off, the time will fly by and you can approach it as a much more experienced and wiser runner (after following this super thread:pac:) next year!

:cool:


Jade Goody has admitted that she didn't finish the London Marathon because she didn't know how long a mile is.

The Big Brother celebrity attempted to run the 26-mile long course, but collapsed after only 21 miles of it and had to be treated for exhaustion.

She told This Morning the reason why she couldn't finish the course: "I don't really understand miles. I didn't actually know how far it was going to be."

"I'll be honest, I didn't take it seriously which is really bad of me because there's people out there who actually want to do the marathon," she said.

"I didn't realise how much commitment the marathon was. I had four training sessions, that's all I did. At most I could run half an hour on a treadmill," Goody said.

"I was expecting to do five miles, not even more than that, so I think I did extremely well to get to 21 miles."


Read more: http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/showbiz/news/a32438/jade-goody-admits-marathon-confusion.html#~oRnu4QPYsN8xZ3#ixzz3EpcfVudk
Follow us: @digitalspy on Twitter | digitalspyuk on Facebook

Laois_Man

MKDTH wrote: »

I've started the last two races at the back with really slow people and enjoyed slowly building up my pace (finished 10m in 1:41 and half in 2:23) and over taking people so I would not put you off starting with the walkers as its great for the confidence!

I swerved the HM completely coz I knew I was literally running into trouble. I'm so glad I did now.

I did a reasonably decent Frank Duffy in 1:24:56 even though I arrived on the day with a lack of confidence similar to that I have now - only it's worse now - my training paces have dropped by a minute and a half since then, all runs are the same paces and it's all become a bit of a very un-enjoyable sufferfest altogether - A very special little boy who's no longer with us and who I am doing the marathon in memory of is the only thing that's keeping me going and determined now. I think a little break from it might help tho - coz at the moment, running is making me less fit and less prepared, not more fit and better prepared. I'll see how I feel tomorrow when I've got a 6 miler due firstly anyhow.

I just need the marathon to be over so that I can give my body a rest and at the same time, take some new (and expensive) measures to get this overpronation sorted out coz that's causing me massive problems ALL the time. Gonna try get proper custom made orthotics made from a proper casting of my feet which ain't cheap (whoever said running was inexpensive needs a hard kickin). I worry it's too late for me now though at age 40. Like, it's so bad, when I met my masseuse for the first time a couple of weeks ago, I took off my shoes and socks to show her how badly I overpronate and she actually laughed out loud. I think I'm about the worst she ever saw. A badge of honor I could do without.

Best of luck. Hope you manage to have a good month of October training wise.

hillsiderunner

smashiner wrote: »

Hi guys,
Just did a real 'junk run' on the way home from work! In fairness it was 8 miles/13k all uphill from Heuston to Kingswood via the canal and Naas road finishing with a Roebuck Road type run from New lands cross up past the Fire Station.

Felt knackered after the run, maybe long day at work etc had me tired?? Anyone else struggling with their midweek runs.......please say yes!!!!
Only a week and a half of training torture left :-))

Jealous :-(. Physio tomorrow morning to get a verdict ...

MLC_biker

Laois man, I only started running 3 years ago, late 40s, doing first marathon @ 51. So you have loads of time on your side, go with your head not the heart for now

beertons

For all you runners looking for a bit of R&R after your big day, Seafield Spa have an offer on GrabOne for €99.

As not to go off topic, did 16km tonight in 1:30.

Joleigh

I went to physio today after the stiffness I felt on the lsr. I have tight it band and hip flexors. I'm actually bruised after it! So I didn't run tonight. I have new stretches to do then hopefully I'll be nice and limber for the big day.