DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

KillianByrne

I am a confirmed morning runner. 3miles done, just about. It's too damn hot. 27c and I started at 8pm.

Combine that with a days worth of (careful) eating, lots of water and a small beer my stomach was churning. Need to pull myself back and start the early morning runs.
But looking on the brightside, it's 3miles I mightn't have done!

Ososlo

Good evening fellow runners!
So here we are about to start THE PLAN(S)!
It's been a rocky road to even get to this point with ITB, ankle, foot and calf pains and strains along with bloody nipples and that's before we even start!!!!Neil I'll never forget that picture...you've scarred me for life...:(
Unfortunately we've lost one or two novices along the way due to injury. My sympathies go out to you but remember this: your day will come before you know it so don't lose heart and keep following the thread as you'll pick up so much knowledge for next year.

There are still a few of you running the lsr and easy and recovery runs too fast but it's not too late to amend your ways. Start afresh tomorrow Well done to those who've heeded our advice to slow down. Remember this: SPEED KILLS . If you run too hard all the time you very likely won't make it to the start line. Simple. So Slow Down unless you're racing or doing a pace session or club work and always ensure you do a proper warm up and cool down for these sessions. For recovery runs you should run them as slowly as possible, almost like a fast walk. Run them too hard and you're not giving your body a chance to recover and adapt to the training you've done. If you're not able to run them slowly enough you'd be better off not doing them at all as running them to fast might lead to injury. Have a complete rest day or do another sport that doesn't take too much out of you.

We've had some great racing to date also so congrats everyone on those efforts. It's fantastic to see improvements along the road to DCM and they're good confidence boosters and it'll be exciting to see more improvements in the build up to the big one.
Well done to those who've used the last few weeks to really knuckle down and get up to the required milage/day per week of training, to be able to handle the first week of the plan safely. It'll stand to you.

So, everyone should be sorted with a plan at this point and many thanks to Auldmanking, Redrunner and Menoscemo for helping some of you out with choosing plans.
Our plans start tomorrow so I hope everyone has gradually built up to be able to handle the first week without any problem. If you want to follow the plan but your'e a little behind, then don't jump in to do the first full week. Tweak it so that you gradually catch up over the following weeks.

Anyone racing the Race Series 5 mile this week then have an extra easy week. For those following the Boards Plan, do the strides session on Wednesday as per the plan. Run 2-3 miles at recovery effort the day before the race or rest completely, whatever you feel suits you best or whatever you normally do in the week of a race.

So tomorrow is the first day of both plans and as luck would have it it's a rest/recovery day:pac: If you're following the Boards plan you have the option to do a few easy miles.
Good luck with the week ahead all and try not to get too distracted by the football:D
I've added a column to the mileage tracker so you can add in the name of the plan you're following - link.

ps: if we have any Google Doc experts, please step forward if you'd like to be in charge of the spreadsheet when I'm not available. I might be too busy to deal with it not know how to fix it if it goes wrong:o

rockwell

Evening all,
I've finally decided to take the plunge and sign up. it has been great reading this thread so far and I'm looking forward the next 18 weeks.

Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs?
My running commenced late last year with training for the Killarney Adventure Race in Oct 2013. Did this 59km route in 5h21m. So I decided to stick with the training and focus the running since then.
March 2014 Kinvara 10k 48m 53s
May 2014 Limerick Half Marathon 1h 45m 50s
May 2014 Sixmilebridge 10k 48m 25s

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? No

How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level. As a min I would do 20 to 25k running each week plus a couple of cross training classes (barbell and high intensity aerobic classes) 5 days per week. In the lead up to races the kms get greater.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time? 1)to complete the course 2)maybe 4h15

How many days a week can you train? 5 days. I’ll do as the plan says!

Why are you running this marathon? Running is something I’ve come to enjoy. Life’s too short to have regrets. Just something I want to do and I think it is important to have a goal in mind when you’re doing training so this is my big 2014 one 

AuldManKing

Ososlo wrote: »

Good evening fellow runners!
So here we are about to start THE PLAN(S)!
It's been a rocky road to even get to this point with ITB, ankle, foot and calf pains and strains along with bloody nipples and that's before we even start!!!!Neil I'll never forget that picture...you've scarred me for life...:(
Unfortunately we've lost one or two novices along the way due to injury. My sympathies go out to you but remember this: your day will come before you know it so don't lose heart and keep following the thread as you'll pick up so much knowledge for next year.

There are still a few of you running the lsr and easy and recovery runs too fast but it's not too late to amend your ways. Start afresh tomorrow Well done to those who've heeded our advice to slow down. Remember this: SPEED KILLS . If you run too hard all the time you very likely won't make it to the start line. Simple. So Slow Down unless you're racing or doing a pace session or club work and always ensure you do a proper warm up and cool down for these sessions. For recovery runs you should run them as slowly as possible, almost like a fast walk. Run them too hard and you're not giving your body a chance to recover and adapt to the training you've done. If you're not able to run them slowly enough you'd be better off not doing them at all as running them to fast might lead to injury. Have a complete rest day or do another sport that doesn't take too much out of you.

We've had some great racing to date also so congrats everyone on those efforts. It's fantastic to see improvements along the road to DCM and they're good confidence boosters and it'll be exciting to see more improvements in the build up to the big one.
Well done to those who've used the last few weeks to really knuckle down and get up to the required milage/day per week of training, to be able to handle the first week of the plan safely. It'll stand to you.

So, everyone should be sorted with a plan at this point and many thanks to Auldmanking, Redrunner and Menoscemo for helping some of you out with choosing plans.
Our plans start tomorrow so I hope everyone has gradually built up to be able to handle the first week without any problem. If you want to follow the plan but your'e a little behind, then don't jump in to do the first full week. Tweak it so that you gradually catch up over the following weeks.

Anyone racing the Race Series 5 mile this week then have an extra easy week. For those following the Boards Plan, do the strides session on Wednesday as per the plan. Run 2-3 miles at recovery effort the day before the race or rest completely, whatever you feel suits you best or whatever you normally do in the week of a race.

So tomorrow is the first day of both plans and as luck would have it it's a rest/recovery day:pac: If you're following the Boards plan you have the option to do a few easy miles.
Good luck with the week ahead all and try not to get too distracted by the football:D
I've added a column to the mileage tracker so you can add in the name of the plan you're following - link.

ps: if we have any Google Doc experts, please step forward if you'd like to be in charge of the spreadsheet when I'm not available. I might be too busy to deal with it not know how to fix it if it goes wrong:o

Whatever you do - LISTEN to the lady. ^^^^^

Alan30

Not much running done this week, i only done 3 midweek runs totaling 11.5miles, was due to do the LSR on Friday but i somehow hurt the arch of my foot kicking a football about with the young fella on Thursday evening so i knocked the LSR on the head to rest it. The foot feels a lot better now but slightly swollen so will leave it until Tuesday before I run on it.

vitani

First week of the plan completed with an 8 mile LSR this evening at about 10 min/mile - I could probably do with slowing that down even more as the mileage grows. Will do a few recovery miles tomorrow. It feels great to be following a plan again. I tend to flounder if I'm left to my own devices.

Ososlo

vitani wrote: »

First week of the plan completed with an 8 mile LSR this evening at about 10 min/mile - I could probably do with slowing that down even more as the mileage grows. Will do a few recovery miles tomorrow. It feels great to be following a plan again. I tend to flounder if I'm left to my own devices.

Great stuff! Best of luck for week 2! Slow it down as much as you need to; especially in the current warm spell.

Laois_Man

Here's another one who has mitched off the LSR this weekend. Decided to give the gammy leg a rest for a few days and see if I can sort it out. Not too confident in the long term but we'll see. Plus I'm feeling the hamstring in the same leg a bit. So I've had to rest and concentrate on loads of stretching and some foam rolling.

denis160

Looking for a bit of advice oh wise one's
I'm on the last 3 weeks of a plan for a half in july. Ran 11mile LSR today. 12 to do this week, but I'm doing the 5 mile run on Saturday. Was planning on boot camp/core tomorrow, speed/ tempo club session Tuesday & a run on Wednesday. Should I try & do the LSR Wednesday or Sunday after the 5? I like to leave 2 days before a race, so would prefer to leave Thursday & Friday free.I'm over tthinking it at this stage, so any advice would be great!
Thanks

Ososlo

denis160 wrote: »

Looking for a bit of advice oh wise one's
I'm on the last 3 weeks of a plan for a half in july. Ran 11mile LSR today. 12 to do this week, but I'm doing the 5 mile run on Saturday. Was planning on boot camp/core tomorrow, speed/ tempo club session Tuesday & a run on Wednesday. Should I try & do the LSR Wednesday or Sunday after the 5? I like to leave 2 days before a race, so would prefer to leave Thursday & Friday free.I'm over tthinking it at this stage, so any advice would be great!
Thanks

Wed is too close to the race imo. Sunday is too soon after the race. Too much chance of injury.
If I were you this is what I would do on Saturday:
2 mile (very slow) warm up before the race
5 mile race
2/3 mile very slow cool down
and I'd have that as my lsr for the week.
You're getting in 9-10 miles that way with a great quality session in the middle (race) so a good day's work.
Anyone with differing opinions please jump in.

JMSE

best of luck to one and all as the programs start officially

did the dunshaughlin 10k last night and pulled it off in just over 47mins, only my 2nd one but an improvement of nearly 5mins, not near as stiff as I've been after my other few races that I've done but a new niggle (adductor) in one leg and maybe extensor down on the opposite side - yes I googled 'anatomy of leg muscles' to do my own diagnosing. Should be both cleared up in a day or two so hopefully by Tues I can get out there and train.

menoscemo

JMSE wrote: »

did the dunshaughlin 10k last night and pulled it off in just over 47mins, only my 2nd one but an improvement of nearly 5mins, not near as stiff as I've been after my other few races that I've done but a new niggle (adductor) in one leg and maybe extensor down on the opposite side - yes I googled 'anatomy of leg muscles' to do my own diagnosing. Should be both cleared up in a day or two so hopefully by Tues I can get out there and train.

These are the kind of niggles that I find clear up much quicker by dong a recovery run rather than doing nothing. I did the race last night in 40 minutes (6:30/mile) and did a recovery run today (4 miles @ 9;30/mile). If i hadn't done a recovery run today i would still be stiff and 'niggly' tomorrow and would be forced to do a recovery run instead of a 'normal' run tomorrow.

In short a recovery run can save you a days recovery.

I'd advise you to get out and do a short run at 10-11 minutes/mile tomorrow and you'll feel a lot better on tuesday for it.

Firedance

JMSE wrote: »

best of luck to one and all as the programs start officially

did the dunshaughlin 10k last night and pulled it off in just over 47mins, only my 2nd one but an improvement of nearly 5mins, not near as stiff as I've been after my other few races that I've done but a new niggle (adductor) in one leg and maybe extensor down on the opposite side - yes I googled 'anatomy of leg muscles' to do my own diagnosing. Should be both cleared up in a day or two so hopefully by Tues I can get out there and train.

well done on your PB JMSE, it was a hot and hillyish(!) race, I went out waaay to fast at the start and paid for it later on but still got a PB 55.30, The foot was not bad yesterday, still niggling at me but no where near as sore so am going to keep icing it and hopefully its just a niggle in the end. Lunchtime run planned for today at a nice slow pace.

denis160

Ososlo wrote: »

Wed is too close to the race imo. Sunday is too soon after the race. Too much chance of injury.
If I were you this is what I would do on Saturday:
2 mile (very slow) warm up before the race
5 mile race
2/3 mile very slow cool down
and I'd have that as my lsr for the week.
You're getting in 9-10 miles that way with a great quality session in the middle (race) so a good day's work.
Anyone with differing opinions please jump in.

Plan for the week sorted so! thanks Ososlo!

earwego

well this is it Day 1 !!!

Dow99

earwego wrote: »

well this is it Day 1 !!!

Me too... (checks training plan) ... and its a rest day

ciaranmac

Ososlo wrote: »

Best of luck tomorrow ciaranmac. Looking forward to the race report!

Bit of a logistics failure there... I showed up at the race without my runners. 10 miles in the Converse I was wearing would mess up my legs for weeks so I gave it a miss. I was raging with myself but it's a lesson in organisation, to check I have everything before I leave the house.

I went out later and did 7k in an hour, averaging at what I think is LSR pace, which raises another question. I don't run comfortably much slower than 6.40 min/km (11min/mi) and this is a tad faster than PMP. To go at 8 min/km I'm walking and running which is probably not ideal. What should I work on to get over this?

http://www.endomondo.com/workouts/361553615/6891640

NyOmnishambles

Dow99 wrote: »

Me too... (checks training plan) ... and its a rest day

I am planning on doing some weights this evening, mainly upper body/core stuff and only a small bit of leg work to keep the legs fresh for tomorrows festivities

BuilderBob

Dow99 wrote: »

Me too... (checks training plan) ... and its a rest day

Day 1 baby - here we go!:eek:
Very nest of luck to one and all

Dow99 wrote: »

Me too... (checks training plan) ... and its a rest day

I know it's not good to get too cocky but half way through day 1 and I'm feeling good. No ill effects from the rest day but will keep it steady :cool:


Joking aside - with kids summer holidays coming up I had intended cycling to work (14km each way) and was thinking of Bootcamp type excercise for Monday's as I'm not one that knows too much about stretching/core so will use it instead? Any advice given the DCM training?

neilthefunkeone

Ha i got all excited this morning thinking marathon plan starts proper now... with a day off!! But its a good sign that im looking forward to getting the miles in!

Last week was fairly quiet due to being between work sites and in late for most of the week. Managed to squeeze in 2 x 5 miles on road. I was away for the weekend and the hotel had a gym so a 10k in on the treadmill just to keep going!

Now wheres my nipple tape... :pac:

ChadHogan

Good luck to everyone starting the plan this week.

I've had a bit of a set back in the last week. Suspected hamstring tear playing tag rugby. I'll find out tonight what the prognosis is when I meet the physio. I'm very disappointed but better it happen now than August or September.

I was up to 13 miles on the LSR so if I can jump back on the plan in a few weeks I still have a chance of making the start line.

jtceltic

Day 1! first time out in 6 weeks after the wife had baby! good luck to everyone

earwego

ahhh..... well i had today as day 1 for some reason and then saw plan and it was rest day ha ha.. I still did 3.2 miles as i have been on a rest 6 months ! and also next week will be a bit messy run wise... it was tough, hot, legs like lead.. but good to be back i think !!! congratulations on your new arrival and best of luck to everyone starting the journey this week !!

and now back to carb loading !

Laois_Man

Is anyone else of the view that the official Dublin HM is too close to marathon day - It may be good for someone who has run a few marathons but is it a bit close for a novice? It's September 20th...end of week 13....which is only 2 weeks before taper starts.

Would people consider slotting in the Rock & Roll HM on August 4th instead - which is at the start of week 7 and which also fits into the HHN1 plan better for anyone who's following that. HHN1 puts it at the end of week 8.

vitani

Laois_Man wrote: »

Is anyone else of the view that the official Dublin HM is too close to marathon day - It may be good for someone who has run a few marathons but is it a bit close for a novice? It's September 20th...end of week 13....which is only 2 weeks before taper starts.

Would people consider slotting in the Rock & Roll HM on August 4th instead - which is at the start of week 7 and which also fits into the HHN1 plan better for anyone who's following that. HHN1 puts it at the end of week 8.

I suppose it depends on your own fitness levels. I've ran two half marathons so far - after the first last August, I felt drained for a couple of weeks, but after the second this March, I was back training two days later.

Laois_Man

vitani wrote: »

I suppose it depends on your own fitness levels. I've ran two half marathons so far - after the first last August, I felt drained for a couple of weeks, but after the second this March, I was back training two days later.

Well, there's bigger concerns I have about it apart from the time it would take to recover (and that's a concern too - doing an 18,19,20 mile LSR a week after a HM could be asking for trouble).
But also; If you get an injury running it, you leave yourself very little time to get back on track. And week 13 is when all the plans are really hitting their peak - it's the longest or second longest LSR on pretty much all of the recognised plans. Having a HM on that week is a bad interference IMO


By the way, if you're near Tipperary or willing to travel there, the Boston Scientific Half Marathon in Clonmel actually fits in perfectly with HHN1 and is closer to the timelines of other plans also. Just food for thought!

Nicsx

BuilderBob wrote: »

I know it's not good to get too cocky but half way through day 1 and I'm feeling good. No ill effects from the rest day but will keep it steady :cool:

I like that attitude!

Hey ho & away we go!!!

I'm doing things a bit back to front & doing my LSR tomorrow as it suits better with work & kids in school etc so I'll be heading out later for an easy one.

Ososlo

Very busy around these parts today! Anyone opt for the short recovery pace run instead of rest?

ciaranmac wrote: »

Bit of a logistics failure there... I showed up at the race without my runners. 10 miles in the Converse I was wearing would mess up my legs for weeks so I gave it a miss. I was raging with myself but it's a lesson in organisation, to check I have everything before I leave the house.

I went out later and did 7k in an hour, averaging at what I think is LSR pace, which raises another question. I don't run comfortably much slower than 6.40 min/km (11min/mi) and this is a tad faster than PMP. To go at 8 min/km I'm walking and running which is probably not ideal. What should I work on to get over this?

http://www.endomondo.com/workouts/361553615/6891640

Sorry to hear about the race but good call giving it a miss. Could have been disastrous.

Pacing: Have a read of this thread on some tips to slow down.
I guess running very slowly must be a special skill as some of us have no problems with it at all:) I think I'm a bit faster than you (in races) but can easily run over 11 min/miles for recovery runs. Are your legs very long?
Whatever you do, ensure you're maintaining good running form (see post on good running form on post one of thread).
I wouldn't opt for a run/walk strategy.
Do you run with music? If so maybe try without it.
Did you feel very comfortable during yesterday's lsr? Could you chat and run easily enough?

Ososlo

BuilderBob wrote: »

Day 1 baby - here we go!:eek:
Very nest of luck to one and all

I know it's not good to get too cocky but half way through day 1 and I'm feeling good. No ill effects from the rest day but will keep it steady :cool:


Joking aside - with kids summer holidays coming up I had intended cycling to work (14km each way) and was thinking of Bootcamp type excercise for Monday's as I'm not one that knows too much about stretching/core so will use it instead? Any advice given the DCM training?

Ha ha so far so good BB! You're off to a great start:D
The cycling is a nice compliment to your running fitness. As for Bootcamp exercises, what kind of exercises would they be? I'm not familiar with them at all.
Whatever is involved I'd be very careful of doing them correctly as you could easily do yourself an injury with poor form etc.
I have a link to some good AIS stretching exercises on post one which I find great.

Ososlo

jtceltic wrote: »

Day 1! first time out in 6 weeks after the wife had baby! good luck to everyone

what plan will you be following? Be very careful jumping back in and take it very gradually. What were you doing training-wise before the 6 weeks off?
Oh and congratulations btw:D