DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

Darren 83

Sitting down legs elevated and wearing compression socks all to aid recovery, what does everyone else do to help the process along?

Dub13

Darren 83 wrote: »

Sitting down legs elevated and wearing compression socks all to aid recovery, what does everyone else do to help the process along?

I am running around after 4 kids, not ideal but its just life...:)

Ososlo

Dub13 wrote: »

I am running around after 4 kids, not ideal but its just life...:)

ha ha actually I think that's a really good way to recover! Stay moving!!!! Keep the blood flowing and don't let the legs seize up!

RedRunner

Darren 83 wrote: »

Sitting down legs elevated and wearing compression socks all to aid recovery, what does everyone else do to help the process along?

A scatter of pints normally especially if I PB ;-)

But seriously.....lots of water, protein packed food today and tomorrow, light recovery run tomorrow. Epsom salts in the bath helps too.

Darren 83

Dub13 wrote: »

I am running around after 4 kids, not ideal but its just life...:)

Hope that's at recovery pace

AuldManKing

RedRunner wrote: »

A scatter of pints normally especially if I PB ;-)

But seriously.....lots of water, protein packed food today and tomorrow, light recovery run tomorrow. Epsom salts in the bath helps too.

Wouldn't have a bath straight away as the legs are still inflamed, but the water, protein and pints sound great!

Dub13

Darren 83 wrote: »

Hope that's at recovery pace

Recovery pace...your having a laugh. So far tonight one of the kids has a bug and did not make the toilet, crap all over the stairs. Another one opened the attic window and told nobody, a downpour a few min ago has a decent size pond in the attic. All this while trying to watch the world cup.

Tigerandahalf

Did 25k tonight for my lsr. Felt a bit sluggish going out as hadn't slept great last night. Sure enough my heart rate was very elevated and jumping up and down a lot. Thought it might have been poor contact with my skin as I think the contacts need a bit of sweat to properly read. However after a while it settled down and it was an enjoyable run. Felt quite strong as I went on. Put a good bit of vaseline on my inner thighs before I went out as the liner on my running shorts causes chaffing on distances over 10k. About 42k done so far this week. I also did a couple of 20k cycles but I guess you can't really include those in your mileage. Legs feeling fairly ok tonight. Had 2 bananas afterwards and a glass of water with a spoon of salt. The marathon seems so far off but I guess it is now you have to lay the foundations. I am hoping to eventually do a couple of lsrs of about marathon distance to give me that extra bit of stamina for the race.

adrian522

I'm not sure what others opinion is but from what I've read I don't think its a good idea to have such a high percentage of your mileage in one run. The general consensus seems to be about 30-40% of your total in your long run should be about right.

Ososlo

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Did 25k tonight for my lsr. Felt a bit sluggish going out as hadn't slept great last night. Sure enough my heart rate was very elevated and jumping up and down a lot. Thought it might have been poor contact with my skin as I think the contacts need a bit of sweat to properly read. However after a while it settled down and it was an enjoyable run. Felt quite strong as I went on. Put a good bit of vaseline on my inner thighs before I went out as the liner on my running shorts causes chaffing on distances over 10k. About 42k done so far this week. I also did a couple of 20k cycles but I guess you can't really include those in your mileage. Legs feeling fairly ok tonight. Had 2 bananas afterwards and a glass of water with a spoon of salt. The marathon seems so far off but I guess it is now you have to lay the foundations. I am hoping to eventually do a couple of lsrs of about marathon distance to give me that extra bit of stamina for the race.

Explain? Am I reading that wrong? You plan to do 26.2 miles in training? A few times???? That really wouldn't be recommended! Most novices would do 22 max in training and most experienced people wouldn't do much more than that!

Tigerandahalf

adrian522 wrote: »

I'm not sure what others opinion is but from what I've read I don't think its a good idea to have such a high percentage of your mileage in one run. The general consensus seems to be about 30-40% of your total in your long run should be about right.

Ya I have seen something about that alright. I was only going to do 23k again but felt strong so felt I would add on another 2k. I will probably do another recovery run tomorrow so that should push me towards the 50k mark. With the cycling I would also have other kms in my legs so I probably wouldn't be far off that rate.

Tigerandahalf

Ososlo wrote: »

Explain? Am I reading that wrong? You plan to do 26.2 miles in training? A few times???? That really wouldn't be recommended! Most novices would do 22 max in training and most experienced people wouldn't do much more than that!

I guess it is a bit risky. However I always hear people talking of hitting the wall at 20 miles, the same and longest distance that most people will have done in training.

adrian522

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Ya I have seen something about that alright. I was only going to do 23k again but felt strong so felt I would add on another 2k. I will probably do another recovery run tomorrow so that should push me towards the 50k mark. With the cycling I would also have other kms in my legs so I probably wouldn't be far off that rate.

Would you not be better off sticking to a marathon training plan? After all they are tried and trusted and will give you a much better chance of getting to the starting line without injury.
If you look at any marathon plan you will see a variety of different runs rather than just the same type of run all the time.

Have you just done the 2 runs this week?

Ososlo

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

I guess it is a bit risky. However I always hear people talking of hitting the wall at 20 miles, the same and longest distance that most people will have done in training.

There'll be no talk of walls around here;) Nobody has to hit any walls if they train properly. If you train smartly (run your long slow runs SLOWLY see post 2 on thread) and get your weekly mileage in, you won't ever see or experience any walls. You need time on your feet at a nice slow pace. The only people who experience walls are people who haven't trained properly. What plan are you following?
I ran 21 miles max in training and not a sign of a wall anywhere.

Tigerandahalf

adrian522 wrote: »

Would you not be better off sticking to a marathon training plan? After all they are tried and trusted and will give you a much better chance of getting to the starting line without injury.
If you look at any marathon plan you will see a variety of different runs rather than just the same type of run all the time.

Have you just done the 2 runs this week?

Today was my third run plus I will do a recovery run tomorrow.
I am roughly following a marathon plan in doing 4/5 runs a week with a lsr at the weekend. Once I do that I should be on track.

Tigerandahalf

I am also trying to break my 5k/10k times over the next month so following a plan to exact detail doesn't suit. One of my runs during the week was a 5k race and I hit 19.15. I'm trying to get under 19mins and sub 40 for 10k.

Dub13

I have heard a few people talk about how low your immune system gets near the end and or just after the big day. A mate did limerick a couple of months back and got the shingles after it. Is there anything we can do to help the immune system and why does it get so low..?

Ososlo

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

I am also trying to break my 5k/10k times over the next month so following a plan to exact detail doesn't suit. One of my runs during the week was a 5k race and I hit 19.15. I'm trying to get under 19mins and sub 40 for 10k.

No harm in chasing the shorter stuff for the next while imo as long as your long run and weekly mileage is not suffering too much/too often.

What pace are you doing the lsr at and what would be your pmp at this point?

Tigerandahalf

Dub13 wrote: »

I have heard a few people talk about how low your immune system gets near the end and or just after the big day. A mate did limerick a couple of months back and got the shingles after it. Is there anything we can do to help the immune system and why does it get so low..?

I found when I first did lsrs my immune system used to take a battering. However I slowed them down as much as I could and now it is easier on my system. Your body will definitely take a hit. Getting the balance right is hard. Lots of sleep, water and good food should help. Also the step back week is important to allow your body to recover and strengthen.
I am chasing PBs in 5/10k as I want to achieve something first just in case I get injured or sick before the marathon and all the training would go out the window.

Ososlo

Dub13 wrote: »

I have heard a few people talk about how low your immune system gets near the end and or just after the big day. A mate did limerick a couple of months back and got the shingles after it. Is there anything we can do to help the immune system and why does it get so low..?

Really good question. I think most people treat themselves a lot after a marathon so aren't eating as well as they should and go drinking that day and the days afterwards. Just try to be as sensible as possible I guess. We're all so sick of drinking water and sports drinks that we let that slide too so keep well hydrated. I went on hols after it and overdid things so got a sore throat and a cold afterwards. But you have to let go a bit too I guess so it's a case of achieving a happy medium.

Tigerandahalf

Ososlo wrote: »

No harm in chasing the shorter stuff for the next while imo as long as your long run and weekly mileage is not suffering too much/too often.

What pace are you doing the lsr at and what would be your pmp at this point?

My lsrs are normally at an average pace of 5.20min/km. There would be some hills in it too. I run with my watch set at heart rate and it would average around 150bpm.

AuldManKing

Ososlo wrote: »

Really good question. I think most people treat themselves a lot after a marathon so aren't eating as well as they should and go drinking that day and the days afterwards. Just try to be as sensible as possible I guess. We're all so sick of drinking water and sports drinks that we let that slide too so keep well hydrated. I went on hols after it and overdid things so got a sore throat and a cold afterwards. But you have to let go a bit too I guess so it's a case of achieving a happy medium.

Agreed - cant say I've suffered after a marathon with flu or anything, but once you are aware of it, maybe a course of multi vit or plenty of vit C as you taper and just after the big day will help ward off those pesky lurgys.

Ososlo

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

My lsrs are normally at an average pace of 5.20min/km. There would be some hills in it too. I run with my watch set at heart rate and it would average around 150bpm.

Do you know what % of your max hr that would be? And is your max hr an accurate figure?

Basically, are you running the lsr a lot slower than what you think your current marathon pace would be?

Tigerandahalf

Ososlo wrote: »

Do you know what % of your max hr that would be? And is your max hr an accurate figure?

Basically, are you running the lsr a lot slower than what you think your current marathon pace would be?

My max heart rate is about 190bpm give or take. I never went over 160bpm today even going up a sharp hill and it would have dropped to around 135 at times.
I dont know my pmp yet. I hope to do it in 3.5 hrs but I have done a half in around 92 mins. Since it is my first I am trying to just enjoy it and have a good day but then you get greedy 😂

Ososlo

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

My max heart rate is about 190bpm give or take. I never went over 160bpm today even going up a sharp hill and it would have dropped to around 135 at times.
I dont know my pmp yet. I hope to do it in 3.5 hrs but I have done a half in around 92 mins. Since it is my first I am trying to just enjoy it and have a good day but then you get greedy 😂

You're way too fast for me to be giving you advice:D I'll let AMK look after you;)
Sounds like you know what you're about. I think the general consensus is to run at about 75% of max hr for the lsr.
I ran all my lsrs at 50bpm slower than max and never found any run up to 21 miles too taxing and didn't get any injuries so that approach certainly worked for me.
You should really look at a plan as you might get the most out of your training if you are following some structure and some marathon pace work in your long run might be beneficial to you.

Tigerandahalf

Thanks for the advice Ossolo. I am just hoping I can get those PBs over this month and then I will stick to a plan. The marathon is a long way away yet and I haver never run over 26km so who knows how the body will respond. I still have to experiment with energy gels and I have a light stomach so no doubt a lot has to be learnt yet, hopefully not all through the hard way!

Ososlo

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Thanks for the advice Ossolo. I am just hoping I can get those PBs over this month and then I will stick to a plan. The marathon is a long way away yet and I haver never run over 26km so who knows how the body will respond. I still have to experiment with energy gels and I have a light stomach so no doubt a lot has to be learnt yet, hopefully not all through the hard way!

Stay sensible after you have the pbs out of the way and you're in for an epic DCM adventure! Lots of time to experiment with the fuel side of things. Keep us posted on how you do over the next while.

frash

Well I did Clontarf Half yesterday and the ankle held up!

Started off at a pace of around 9:30 for the first 8 miles.
Began to feel a bit of tiredness coming on then so took a gel but didn't feel much of an effect apart from gettinga stitch .
As I turned onto the beach it started to lash & I think that helped me cool down a bit but by the end of the beach my pace had dropped to just over 11 mins/mile .
Picked it up a bit for the last 2 miles to around 10:40 but that was all I could muster.

Finished in 2:10.

I guess it's the stamina I need to work on which will hopefully come with more LSRs?

Muscle in the ankle very sore since (RHS) and the pain in the ball of my foot is back on the LHS so will be making an appointment to see someone again about that tomorrow.

Laois_Man

Laois_Man wrote: »

I was supposed to be doing a 14 mile LSR tomorrow. But seeing as I haven't done one in 3 weeks, I think it'll be wise to keep it at 10 or so for this week and see how it feels....will cut it even shorter if I'm feeling pain....but fingers crossed!

So I did the full 14 mile LSR at 10:34 pace. Got to 10 miles and felt great to said I'd go to 14 which is what's on my plan.

Feckin delighted!!!

Didn't get out til after 9pm. I hate doing LSRs that late coz I never sleep well afterwards - and I didn't. But it was the only time I could fit it in.

I usually do a mile at PMP on the second last or third last mile but I thought I better not push my luck. Kept the pace nice and slow throughout - even when it started bucketing down on me on mile 4 when it was hard to curb the natural instinct to leg it. Pace for the first 10 miles averaged 10:19 and then it slowed to 11:11 for the last 4.

No ill effects this morning!!

Darren 83

frash wrote: »

Well I did Clontarf Half yesterday and the ankle held up!

Started off at a pace of around 9:30 for the first 8 miles.
Began to feel a bit of tiredness coming on then so took a gel but didn't feel much of an effect apart from gettinga stitch .
As I turned onto the beach it started to lash & I think that helped me cool down a bit but by the end of the beach my pace had dropped to just over 11 mins/mile .
Picked it up a bit for the last 2 miles to around 10:40 but that was all I could muster.

Finished in 2:10.

I guess it's the stamina I need to work on which will hopefully come with more LSRs?

Muscle in the ankle very sore since (RHS) and the pain in the ball of my foot is back on the LHS so will be making an appointment to see someone again about that tomorrow.

Well done Frash and thanks again