DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

Darren 83

Ososlo wrote: »

Sounds perfect for recovery this week.

You should be ok by weekend but play it by ear and don't force sessions if the legs still hurt a lot.

maybe speak to the coach about whether you should do the sessions as you're not doing the race. He might suggest something different for you.

He is away at the moment, think he is doing a Ironman. Id be interested to see how long it will take before I recover as Id like to do the Dublin Half then DCM.

If it takes to long might hamper me for DCM reading elsewhere every mile you race is equal to one rest day, going by that id miss two weeks quality sessions before DCM.

frash

Ososlo - if you get a chance would you mind re-entering the dates in the column on the Hal plan? They're gone now & I can't edit that sheet.
Thanks

adrian522

Darren 83 wrote: »

He is away at the moment, think he is doing a Ironman. Id be interested to see how long it will take before I recover as Id like to do the Dublin Half then DCM.

If it takes to long might hamper me for DCM reading elsewhere every mile you race is equal to one rest day, going by that id miss two weeks quality sessions before DCM.

Jack Daniels recommends taking one easy day for every 3K raced. So for a half that would equate to a week with no sessions.

Ososlo

frash wrote: »

Ososlo - if you get a chance would you mind re-entering the dates in the column on the Hal plan? They're gone now & I can't edit that sheet.
Thanks

Sorry frash I'll do that later.

ctmck

Hi All,

I've been following this thread for a while now, but hadnt gotten a chance to do an introduction. I feel by doing this intro now I am completely committing to DCM 14. A bit about myself....I am working mum of 3 smallies who started a couch to 5k in 2012. I did a few of the Dublin race series that year and really enjoyed the buzz. I kept running through the winter of 12/13 and had entered the Limerick marathon in 2013 but 8 weeks out I picked up an injury which put off the road for almost 5 months. I found it really hard to get the motivation back after that so my running was not consistent since then until the end of April this year when I found my love of running again and have been back on the road. I'm not a fast runner and never will be but love the head space I get especially from the longer runs

•Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
Race Series 5mile 2014 : 43.08, Fingal 10 K 2012 55.24, Dublin HM 2012 2.05.08
•Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? (No problem if you do) Nope
•How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.
Currently I am doing 3 mid week short runs with 1 weekend lsr - basically following HHN1
•What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
Dream is to complete it without walking in a time of 4.30 but probably more realistically looking at 5 hr
•How many days a week can you train? I can defo give 4 days. Some weeks 5. But I work and have a very busy house and my hubby trains the local senior hurling team which takes up sooooooooo much time so time is very valuable! I might have to do alot of my runs with the birds in the morning.
•Why are you running this marathon?
Why, because its on my bucket list. And its something I want to achieve for myself :-)

I've been loving the advise given so far and look forward to my journey to DCM with you all over the next few months

adrian522

AMK or anyone else who has an opinion:

I've been thinking about how to accommodate the various races into the BAA plan. I've essentially copied the BAA intermediate plan into a spreadsheet putting in the relevant dates etc.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13AuPkY07wXfnrSsZ-SkBwUMbzlnXDNlTY30-gN8fS2s/edit#gid=1078500440

I would like to do the following races as part of the build up to DCM:

04/08/2014 - DLR Bay 10K
23/08/2014 - Frank Duffy 10 Mile
20/09/2014 - Dublin Half Marathon

What adjustments would you make to the plan to account for these races? What sessions would you drop. Ideally I'd like to race them if possible but I'd also be open to adding on warm up or cool down miles to make up mileage if necessary.

Thoughts?

RunRoryRun

Had a good week!

Mileage all went well - feeling great. LSR up to 14 miles and felt very comfortable. A cold bath after the run is keeping most of the muscle soreness at bay!

Registered for DCM on Friday too and I know the time will fly by between now and October!

adrian522

RunRoryRun wrote: »

A cold bath after the run is keeping most of the muscle soreness at bay!

The cure sounds worse than the disease.

RunRoryRun

adrian522 wrote: »

The cure sounds worse than the disease.

Ha ha, only truly awful for the first 10 seconds

Dub13

adrian522 wrote: »

AMK or anyone else who has an opinion:

I've been thinking about how to accommodate the various races into the BAA plan. I've essentially copied the BAA intermediate plan into a spreadsheet putting in the relevant dates etc.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13AuPkY07wXfnrSsZ-SkBwUMbzlnXDNlTY30-gN8fS2s/edit#gid=1078500440

I would like to do the following races as part of the build up to DCM:

04/08/2014 - DLR Bay 10K
23/08/2014 - Frank Duffy 10 Mile
20/09/2014 - Dublin Half Marathon

What adjustments would you make to the plan to account for these races? What sessions would you drop. Ideally I'd like to race them if possible but I'd also be open to adding on warm up or cool down miles to make up mileage if necessary.

Thoughts?

I will keep on eye on the replies to this as I am doing this plan and the 10 mile & Half plus the Swords 10k.

thehookster

Hi All,

Been a regular reader of this thread and really enjoy the all the advice given and everyones training updates so ive decided to join in the fun. Ive been running a few years on and off, did alot in 2012 but not as much last year, this year ive done 1 half marathon but have been running a bit myself without entering any races. Iv already ran/walked the Longford marathon in 2012 but it didnt go to plan so im doing Dublin to banish longford from my mind.....hopefully i succeed.

•Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
Too many races to mention but heres my PBs - Longford Full(August 2012) 5.45, Liverpool Half(March 2012) 2.02 , Kilbeggan 10 Miler(August 2013) 1.38 and Lough Rynn 10k (September 2011) 55mins

•Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? (No problem if you do)
Nope

•How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.
Currently I am doing 3 mid week short runs with 1 weekend long run, i also try and swim or cycle on cross days

•What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
The aim is to finish under 5hrs but i would absolutely love if i could manage near the 4.30 mark

•How many days a week can you train?
I can give 4 to 5 days training most weeks, have a young son so like everyone there will be weeks that i may struggle to get all days in but im hoping that wont be the case.

•Why are you running this marathon?
When i started running its always been the race i wanted to do, my father completed it 3 times so i want to follow in his footsteps and complete it atleast once.......Oh and also to banish my bad memories of my first marathon.

I took a few weeks off running for a few reasons so i am only starting the plan today, i was doing alot of training before the break so have a decent base built up........but looking forward to the challenge.

gingersnap

My recovery after Clontarf was four hours walking around Blanchardstown SC yesterday with the kids! I also managed a 20 minute walk last night and I'm feeling fine today.
Off on holiday tonight for a week. Really pushed for packing space and at this stage I think the runners and gear are being left behind. I probably wouldn't use them anyway with the heat and not knowing the area.
My official training for DCM will kick off when I get back next week!
Happy running everyone

frash

thehookster wrote: »

Iv already ran/walked the Longford marathon in 2012 but it didnt go to plan so im doing Dublin to banish longford from my mind.....

Mind if I ask what happened to your marathon in 2012?

You'd be doing similar paces to me for the races you've mentioned but wondering how you went from a 2.02 half in March 2012 to a 5.45 full in August of the same year.

Welcome aboard btw

neilthefunkeone

gingersnap wrote: »

Off on holiday tonight for a week. Really pushed for packing space and at this stage I think the runners and gear are being left behind. I probably wouldn't use them anyway with the heat and not knowing the area.

I'm off to Spain in August and i think ill have to bring the gear with me.. only going for a week but don't want to lose momentum.. Hopefully be able to get up early before it gets to unbearable temps for a few easy miles..

In a bit of a stupid decision i have registered for Hell and back in September with a few friends.. kinda regretting it now as it the ideal place to roll my ankle or do some other injury..

thehookster

frash wrote: »

Mind if I ask what happened to your marathon in 2012?

You'd be doing similar paces to me for the races you've mentioned but wondering how you went from a 2.02 half in March 2012 to a 5.45 full in August of the same year.

Welcome aboard btw

Thanks for the welcome.

I probably should have said that i picked up an injury during longford marathon, i got to mile 16 feeling strong and had actually done the first half of it in 1.51 but when i hit the back country roads i started to develop an awful pain in my left knee which got unbearable at mile 18 so i walked alot of the remaining miles which after all the training was so disappointing but i was determined to finish.

Dub13

I did 8k today very slow, so that's 14k done since the half on Sat and feeling very good. May start to push it a bit more tomorrow and Wednesday.

RedRunner

Dub13 wrote: »

I did 8k today very slow, so that's 14k done since the half on Sat and feeling very good. May start to push it a bit more tomorrow and Wednesday.

I'd leave it til Wednesday before doing anything too strenuous. There's no rush to increase the intensity yet after a hard race at the weekend.

Casey78

I'm following the Half Higdon Intermediate 1 plan. Did 9 miles yesterday and my left knee is killing me today. Any tips to relieve the pain?

Ososlo

Casey78 wrote: »

I'm following the Half Higdon Intermediate 1 plan. Did 9 miles yesterday and my left knee is killing me today. Any tips to relieve the pain?

Have you had knee pain before?
Are you doing the long runs nice and slowly?
If you're experiencing pain you might need to see a physio if it's not better in a few days. Don't run with any kind of pain as even easy running could aggravate it more. You might just need some rest. Do you foam roll?

Casey78

Ososlo wrote: »

Have you had knee pain before?
Are you doing the long runs nice and slowly?
If you're experiencing pain you might need to see a physio if it's not better in a few days. Don't run with any kind of pain as even easy running could aggravate it more. You might just need some rest. Do you foam roll?

I meant Hal Higdon not Half Higdon!!
I'm doing my long slow runs @ 10'15 per mile pace. I'm hoping for sub 4hr Marathon.
Haven't really had much knee pain before.
No I don't foam roll.

Ososlo

neilthefunkeone wrote: »

I'm off to Spain in August and i think ill have to bring the gear with me.. only going for a week but don't want to lose momentum.. Hopefully be able to get up early before it gets to unbearable temps for a few easy miles..

In a bit of a stupid decision i have registered for Hell and back in September with a few friends.. kinda regretting it now as it the ideal place to roll my ankle or do some other injury..

Defo bring the gear neil!

Can you get someone else to take your place for H&B? I really wouldn't do it if I were you! A friend of mine did it a few times and was in bits after it and did some ankle damage the last time.
I'm only thinking of you:D

AuldManKing

adrian522 wrote: »

AMK or anyone else who has an opinion:

I've been thinking about how to accommodate the various races into the BAA plan. I've essentially copied the BAA intermediate plan into a spreadsheet putting in the relevant dates etc.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13AuPkY07wXfnrSsZ-SkBwUMbzlnXDNlTY30-gN8fS2s/edit#gid=1078500440

I would like to do the following races as part of the build up to DCM:

04/08/2014 - DLR Bay 10K
23/08/2014 - Frank Duffy 10 Mile
20/09/2014 - Dublin Half Marathon

What adjustments would you make to the plan to account for these races? What sessions would you drop. Ideally I'd like to race them if possible but I'd also be open to adding on warm up or cool down miles to make up mileage if necessary.

Thoughts?

Its never an easy one - balancing training with racing. Its how I got my log title!

At a very simple level you can just replace the full weeks training with a 'training week' that includes a race. In my opinion, thats fine, but I dont think you'll race well or recover well.

If I were you I'd do the following;

Bay 10k:
* Previous Thursday - increase run to 12-13 miles
* Sunday: Rest of 3-4 easy
* Drop the session on following Tuesday for a recovery run.

10m Race:
* Exchange the full week with the previous weeks training (it looks nicely balanced) but drop the session on the Tuesday after the race - run easy instead - no matter how good you feel - run easy.

Half Marathon: This is a key race preparation session - treat it like it.
* Swap that weeks long run into the following weekend (its important to get the longer runs in)
* Drop session on Saturday (obviously as its race day ) & drop session the Tuesday afterwards.
* Do the planned MLR on the Thursday before at easy pace and at lower end of mileage.

Something to consider is moving your training week by 1 day, so the long run falls on a Saturday. it makes it easyier on race week as you've longer to recover from the previous long run and your 1st session is on Monday, not Tuesday, so again, you've longer to recover. (it also means you an have guilt free pints on Saturday night :P)

With the races - dont feel that your missing out on training as the races give you a huge training boost, especially the longer races.

The long runs are the important runs in any training programme, infinitely more important than a 'session', try to plan your training so you get as many as possible in the weekends when you don't have a race.

Ososlo

Casey78 wrote: »

I meant Hal Higdon not Half Higdon!!
I'm doing my long slow runs @ 10'15 per mile pace. I'm hoping for sub 4hr Marathon.
Haven't really had much knee pain before.
No I don't foam roll.

I'd invest in a foam roller if I were you. I had some IT band trouble which bothered my knee about 2 years ago and got one and found it great to work out niggles. There's some good links at the end of post one on foam rollers. Great investment. I foam roll most days.
Your pace seems fine. As long as you've gradually worked up to that distance that shouldn't be the problem either.

I'd rest it for the moment and see how you are in a day or two. Try a few recovery paced miles maybe on grass when you feel it's better but don't force anything if it's causing you pain. You might need to consider a trip to a physio if you still have pain in a few days.
I'd be wary of telling you to do anything more than that to be honest. You might need a professional opinion. But you might be ok with a little rest.

Casey78

Ososlo wrote: »

I'd invest in a foam roller if I were you. I had some IT band trouble which bothered my knee about 2 years ago and got one and found it great to work out niggles. There's some good links at the end of post one on foam rollers. Great investment. I foam roll most days.
Your pace seems fine. As long as you've gradually worked up to that distance that shouldn't be the problem either.

I'd rest it for the moment and see how you are in a day or two. Try a few recovery paced miles maybe on grass when you feel it's better but don't force anything if it's causing you pain. You might need to consider a trip to a physio if you still have pain in a few days.
I'd be wary of telling you to do anything more than that to be honest. You might need a professional opinion. But you might be ok with a little rest.

Thanks for your help. Great thread btw I've just found it.

Ososlo

Casey78 wrote: »

Thanks for your help. Great thread btw I've just found it.

ah cool!
report back about the knee please!

Your name seems familiar. Do I know you from another thread? C25k???

AuldManKing

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

My max heart rate is about 190bpm give or take. I never went over 160bpm today even going up a sharp hill and it would have dropped to around 135 at times.
I dont know my pmp yet. I hope to do it in 3.5 hrs but I have done a half in around 92 mins. Since it is my first I am trying to just enjoy it and have a good day but then you get greedy 😂

I'm no expert on heart rate training so will leave that one.

Regarding your planned finish time - your a wise man, wanting to enjoy the experience is something I'd love to do again - I blew up and hobbled home in 3:65
If your HM was recent, the 92mins puts you in a good place for a 3:15 finish with McMillan - but he's normally on the aggressive side.
3:20 should be very doable (& still enjoy it) with more training under your belt.

NyOmnishambles

Morning All

A bit bleak out this morning but nice and cool for a run

Felt very sluggish starting out this morning but once I got motoring I was ok, only ok mind you, I never felt great and it wasn't from tiredness

I have a bit of an upset stomach so that probably accounted for it

Anyway there will always be bad days, just have to get on with it

3.5 miles today

What is the best way to go about the hill sprints in the plan for tomorrow?
5 ascents and descents one after the other is easiest logistically but would it be better to try and space them out even if it means an awkward route?

Tigerandahalf

AuldManKing wrote: »

I'm no expert on heart rate training so will leave that one.

Regarding your planned finish time - your a wise man, wanting to enjoy the experience is something I'd love to do again - I blew up and hobbled home in 3:65
If your HM was recent, the 92mins puts you in a good place for a 3:15 finish with McMillan - but he's normally on the aggressive side.
3:20 should be very doable (& still enjoy it) with more training under your belt.

Cheers for reply. I think 3.30 is a more reasonable target. For me without a lot of very long runs in the legs it would be too aggressive a target. With experimenting with gels and taking on water a lot can go wrong.
I think upto half marathon distance is easy enough to run in that you don't have to worry about gels, just take on regular sups of water. Anyway it is a long way off and just try to get the runs in at this stage and progress from there.

wowzer

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Cheers for reply. I think 3.30 is a more reasonable target. For me without a lot of very long runs in the legs it would be too aggressive a target. With experimenting with gels and taking on water a lot can go wrong.
I think upto half marathon distance is easy enough to run in that you don't have to worry about gels, just take on regular sups of water. Anyway it is a long way off and just try to get the runs in at this stage and progress from there.

AMK is right, I was part of the novice group last year doing my first marathon, I had a 1:31 half marathon and ran a very comfortable 3:19 in DCM. Its definitely doable so don't sell yourself short.

Ososlo

NyOmnishambles wrote: »

Morning All

A bit bleak out this morning but nice and cool for a run

Felt very sluggish starting out this morning but once I got motoring I was ok, only ok mind you, I never felt great and it wasn't from tiredness

I have a bit of an upset stomach so that probably accounted for it

Anyway there will always be bad days, just have to get on with it

3.5 miles today

What is the best way to go about the hill sprints in the plan for tomorrow?
5 ascents and descents one after the other is easiest logistically but would it be better to try and space them out even if it means an awkward route?

Yes 5 ascents and descents one after the other. I think it's explained fairly well in post two of this thread. Best of luck and let us know how you get on and enjoy!