DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

Ososlo

gingersnap wrote: »

I'm following a mix of a few plans! It is mainly a LSR and recovery run at the weekend and two club sessions mid-week (Tuesday and Thursday). I have also one other run going up to 10 miles on a Monday. As the club sessions are generally hard, I will keep this one easy. Thanks Ososlo.

Cool. Sounds like a great 'plan'! Great to have the medium run up to 10 miles too!
What kind of club sessions are you doing?

gingersnap

Ososlo wrote: »

Cool. Sounds like a great 'plan'! Great to have the medium run up to 10 miles too!
What kind of club sessions are you doing?

They vary every month. One session is usually speedwork or hills and the other is usually a tempo. This evening it was 12x400m with 1 minute recovery. The tempo last week was 40 mins. I usually run over and back to the club to add on a few extra miles.

Ososlo

gingersnap wrote: »

They vary every month. One session is usually speedwork or hills and the other is usually a tempo. This evening it was 12x400m with 1 minute recovery. The tempo last week was 40 mins. I usually run over and back to the club to add on a few extra miles.

Brill. Sounds fun. I think tempo runs are great for building stamina for marathon training. Looks like you'll be well set up for the big one!

SoundoftheSea

Ososlo wrote: »

Bear in mind that you will be running a bit faster on the big day than you are in training so you might need a little extra sustenance to keep energy levels up for the duration of the marathon. If you don't like gels (who does!) try bringing food with you instead like jellys. You might not think the gels are doing anything for you, but they are calories and you do need to take on calories during the marathon for energy. I'd be a bit concerned that lucozade on its own might not be enough to keep you well fuelled.
I think your runners should be fine. However, if finances allow, I'd suggest having another pair on standby. It's always good to have a second pair to rotate if they get excessively wet in training and are not well dried out for your next run.

I love your positivity Ososlo. I am not so sure about the running faster!
I didn't completely dislike the gel but because I didn't feel the effects and have a sensitive stomach that can tolerate something one day and not on another I was going to try and go without. My stomach can act up on long runs with just water. I will add in gels and see how I get on.

I will invest in a second pair of runners just in case. Work shoes can wait even if I do get strange looks wearing sandals in October.

Kop On

ecoli wrote: »

Welcome on board Kop On

Just highlighted one point, looking at your recent 20k I would say one of two things is happening

1) Underestimating your HM ability
2) Running your long run too fast

The second of these is a common pitfall many suffer from at all level of abilities. Given how you felt 2 days later I would say maybe slow the pace down a small bit on these runs and just focus on time on your feet and you will find you will actually benefit more

One of the most important principles of running is Stress and Adapt. If you are unrecovered your body is unable to build back up and get stronger and fitter.

If you take weights as a example, weight training tears the muscle and breaks it down, it is only through recovery that they repair and get bigger.

You don't have to flog yourself in training. Training smarter rather than hard and I can assure you it will stand to you

Thanks for the feedback, I have to say, I hadn't even considered the fact that my run on Saturday might have been at too fast a pace. If anything I would have thought it was too slow. Going to change my GPS watch to miles this week so I can track my pace properly.

Some really good chat in here about MP and PMP and I need to get my head around it.

Ososlo

SoundoftheSea wrote: »

I love your positivity Ososlo. I am not so sure about the running faster!
I didn't completely dislike the gel but because I didn't feel the effects and have a sensitive stomach that can tolerate something one day and not on another I was going to try and go without. My stomach can act up on long runs with just water. I will add in gels and see how I get on.

I will invest in a second pair of runners just in case. Work shoes can wait even if I do get strange looks wearing sandals in October.

Nothing wrong with running your marathon at your long slow run effort either and ensuring you have a really fun easy day out and enjoy every minute! You can be much more aggressive then with your target for your next one;)
But you will be running further than you've ever run before so do try the gels again. You'll be surprised with what your system can tolerate just through practice.

lol - who needs work shoes!

martyboy48

How are we all doing? Enjoying the journey? Good

Just thought I'd drop by to say for those country-folk like myself who like to be organised, we are now within the 2 month window to book Irish rail tickets for the exciting train ride to the big city

Nice and comfy journey home, plenty of leg room ect.... You will thank me after

Keep up the good work everybody, we're nearly there. One of the biggest moments in yer lives... See ye all in McGrattans

Ososlo

Kop On wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback, I have to say, I hadn't even considered the fact that my run on Saturday might have been at too fast a pace. If anything I would have thought it was too slow. Going to change my GPS watch to miles this week so I can track my pace properly.

Some really good chat in here about MP and PMP and I need to get my head around it.

Most people don't come to that realisation until they find this forum:D And an awful lot of people blow up on their first marathon attempts and have a really bad day out. So feel lucky now that you've discovered this wonderful forum!
Have a read of post 2 in detail about pacing your runs for a little more information. Concentrate on keeping the effort easy and don't worry too much about the pace.

Ososlo

martyboy48 wrote: »

How are we all doing? Enjoying the journey? Good

Just thought I'd drop by to say for those country-folk like myself who like to be organised, we are now within the 2 month window to book Irish rail tickets for the exciting train ride to the big city

Nice and comfy journey home, plenty of leg room ect.... You will thank me after

Keep up the good work everybody, we're nearly there. One of the biggest moments in yer lives... See ye all in McGrattans

Do you work for Iarnrod Eireann?

Laois_Man

hillsiderunner wrote: »

I have been a bit disturbed by the injury reports of Laois_Man on this forum - that's a *lot* of niggles. Remember that DCM will still be here next year.

Ahh don't be disturbed now. I'll be grand. I think most of us have niggles - I'm just the excessive moaner one!!

Joleigh

Speaking of niggles, my little toe is sore. I never even gave my little toe a
Seconds thought before and now I can't stop thinking about it. It better not try and disrupt my training. Hope I don't need new runners. That's today's moan out of the way nice and early!

digger2d2

AuldManKing wrote: »

Just wondering Ososlo, will you be tapering 'off' this log as a sudden stop in late October may be too sudden a change for you!

Just what will you do with your time from Nov onwards!

Get back to cleaning her gaff!

NyOmnishambles

Morning folks

8 miles this morning and it was a tough one

I was doing weights in the gym last night, trying to combine this with the running as I need to drop some weight before the marathon to make it easier to get round, plus when the marathon is over I want to hit the weights big time so need some prep work

Anyway due to being busy this evening I needed to do my run this morning before work and my back was really stiff from the weights yesterday evening

The first 4 miles were rough, I couldn't get comfortable and into a rhythm and walked in places to ease off on the back
Thankfully it loosened up so the inward 4 miles were much more pleasant

Any suggestions for stretching the lower back either the night before or on the morning of a run after a weights session that might be useful?

Lovely misty morning for it though

Firedance

NyOmnishambles wrote: »

Any suggestions for stretching the lower back either the night before or on the morning of a run after a weights session that might be useful?

I do yoga and pilates for core work & stretching, yoga is super for an all over body stretch - try the cat/cow pose for back stretches and sun salutations will help too as they have forward/back bends but also work on hamstrings etc.

NyOmnishambles

Firedance wrote: »

I do yoga and pilates for core work & stretching, yoga is super for an all over body stretch - try the cat/cow pose for back stretches and sun salutations will help too as they have forward/back bends but also work on hamstrings etc.

Cool

Will look them up this evening

Thanks

martyoo

Anyone going to do the 3/4 marathon in Athlone? About three weeks before DCM.

Link

Firedance

martyoo wrote: »

Anyone going to do the 3/4 marathon in Athlone? About three weeks before DCM.

Link

yep I am, its the same week as my scheduled 20 mile run anyway so might as well do it with some company, I'm not sure though if participants will the 'racing' this and I'll be paddy last home doing it at my LSR pace!

Mimojo

NyOmnishambles wrote: »

Morning folks

8 miles this morning and it was a tough one

I was doing weights in the gym last night, trying to combine this with the running as I need to drop some weight before the marathon to make it easier to get round, plus when the marathon is over I want to hit the weights big time so need some prep work

Anyway due to being busy this evening I needed to do my run this morning before work and my back was really stiff from the weights yesterday evening

The first 4 miles were rough, I couldn't get comfortable and into a rhythm and walked in places to ease off on the back
Thankfully it loosened up so the inward 4 miles were much more pleasant

Any suggestions for stretching the lower back either the night before or on the morning of a run after a weights session that might be useful?

Lovely misty morning for it though

Hi NyOmnishambles,

Just spotted your post there, I am a gym regular, prob do weights 3 or 4 sessions a week at the moment, nothing hectic or very heavy, have been building up for about a year now, started off very light. Like that plan is to up the intensity after DCM, if I make it! Focusing on arms and core mostly at the moment, doing one session of leg work per week but finding my legs are very tired for running the next day so generally try to go an easy run the next day.

When are you planning to scale back on the weight training? I am wondering when I should be cutting back, as like that would be sore the next day. Not sure how much to cut it back either, I guess the 2 weeks leading up to the marathon would be a good plan to stop completely?

martyoo

Firedance wrote: »

yep I am, its the same week as my scheduled 20 mile run anyway so might as well do it with some company, I'm not sure though if participants will the 'racing' this and I'll be paddy last home doing it at my LSR pace!

That was my thinking behind it too plus they have full marathon pacers and split timing.

I'd say there will be a few serious heads at it but plenty of us mere mortals too

NyOmnishambles

Mimojo wrote: »

Hi NyOmnishambles,

Just spotted your post there, I am a gym regular, prob do weights 3 or 4 sessions a week at the moment, nothing hectic or very heavy, have been building up for about a year now, started off very light. Like that plan is to up the intensity after DCM, if I make it! Focusing on arms and core mostly at the moment, doing one session of leg work per week but finding my legs are very tired for running the next day so generally try to go an easy run the next day.

When are you planning to scale back on the weight training? I am wondering when I should be cutting back, as like that would be sore the next day. Not sure how much to cut it back either, I guess the 2 weeks leading up to the marathon would be a good plan to stop completely?

I am sure there are people more qualified than me to answer this but that all sounds very sensible
I am going fairly easy on the legs in the gym these days as it is

I will probably cut the weights altogether for the taper before the marathon to try and be as reasted as possible for the big day
I would imagine 2-3 weeks would be a good cut off period

ciaranmac

Firedance wrote: »

yep I am, its the same week as my scheduled 20 mile run anyway so might as well do it with some company, I'm not sure though if participants will the 'racing' this and I'll be paddy last home doing it at my LSR pace!

I'm planning to do it so ye needn't worry about paddy last, I've that covered. :rolleyes:

Tigerandahalf

Following the boards plan (sort of) and tonight called for 8 miles at easy pace. I did the 4 miles last night at a pace that was too fast but it just felt good to go. So tonight I decided to do the last 4 miles at MP. I haven't done enough of these sessions as I haven't been following the plan to the letter. Warm and humid out and as I did the first 4 miles at an easy pace I was still sweating and wondering what lay ahead. Anyway I managed the 4 miles at MP without my breathing getting too heavy. However lots of sweat and plenty of effort as well. Ah only another 22 miles at that effort I thought to myself!
Dont know if I can sustain that pace on the day. I think I would want to run 16 or 17 miles at that pace at some stage ahead to have confidence that the pace is realistic. I may pull back the MP as I get closer.

Tigerandahalf

Thinking of running a 10k race this weekend. Maybe warm up with a very easy 10k or less, do the race and then try and do another 10km or so to cool down to make up a lsr of 19 miles. Is this reasonable?

MKDTH

I finally went to the Physio on Tuesday, to at the very least get confirmation of what my knee injury was!

A little history behind this injury.....I have had this on and off when I used to play Football ten years ago, and it emerged two years ago when I was in a 90 mile Cycling road race and again recently during my DCM training. I had previously just stopped exercise till the pain went away but was determined to carry on the dcm training so patched myself up with little training in the few weeks leading up to the Frank Duffy, but got around thanks to the DCM training that had previously gone to plan between May and July.
Then after the Frank Duffy I rested until six dull days had passed, which was a effort to help my knee heal. I only managed a mile and half before the same pains came back to haunt me . I did this run on grass so the impact on my knee each stride had a little more give, and even tried attempting to run after the pain went after 10 meters walking, but found 20 meters of running meant I was in agony again.

So the Physio had me in all sorts of positions, pushing down my knee in various areas to finally tell what was wrong....Patellar Tendonitis!!!!
She has given me some exercise routines to strengthen the knee up and advised me that I can not go back to training for a month, but in order to keep my fitness I can go and run a short distance before then walking a similar distance before repeating it and building up the mileage that way. She also suggested I should get a knee support with a hole in it to support the knee cap for races.
She gave the knee a nice massage and Ultrasound so hopefully this is the beginning of my running career rather than the end as I feared before seeing the Physio
I see her again in two weeks, fingers crossed the exercises work to show improvement!

Calvin Johnson

Sorry to hear that you're out of DCM MKDTH - there's always next year.

MKDTH

Calvin Johnson wrote: »

Sorry to hear that you're out of DCM MKDTH - there's always next year.

No, still running both DCM and the half.

Pacing Mule

MKDTH wrote: »

No, still running both DCM and the half.

Now I am quite partial to a tilt at the DCM whilst injured myself ! But would you not think it better to skip the half and save everything up recovery wise for the main event ?

scheister

just in the door from a 4 mile time trial complete in 29:53 to say i was dying at the end is an understatement. i think tomorrow 6 mile at 10mim pace will seem like a gift from heaven after tonight

digger2d2

martyoo wrote: »

Anyone going to do the 3/4 marathon in Athlone? About three weeks before DCM.

Link

Firedance wrote: »

yep I am, its the same week as my scheduled 20 mile run anyway so might as well do it with some company, I'm not sure though if participants will the 'racing' this and I'll be paddy last home doing it at my LSR pace!

martyoo wrote: »

That was my thinking behind it too plus they have full marathon pacers and split timing.

I'd say there will be a few serious heads at it but plenty of us mere mortals too

ciaranmac wrote: »

I'm planning to do it so ye needn't worry about paddy last, I've that covered. :rolleyes:

All standards at the Athlone 3/4 by the way - Also, fyi... The pacers run based on LSR min/mile time with relevance to the various Marathon slots

Laois_Man

Went out to do the '5 miles' on the plan last night....got back, and an hour I bothered to actually look at the plan (which I have stuck on a wall at home) and realized I was supposed to do 6 miles.

Must pay more attention to the plan :rolleyes:

Leg in a bit of discomfort but not too bad now. Wondering if I should drastically reduce the 18 miler planned for tomorrow night. Maybe. I'll see how it is at the time and during it.