The Virgin Media Television thread

Elmo

channelsurfer2 wrote: »

2 articles today in Indo and Times on TV3. Times says TV3 HD TV3 +1 and 3E(possibly part pay tv for 3E - what is worth paying for on it?) are in negotiations to launch on UPC and Sky next year. No mention of saorview at all so no RWC 2015 in HD on saorview by the sound of it.

Indo article is a beauty piece with David McRedmond putting a brave face on things and saying things are really great next year with all our homegrown programmes. Link to indo article below.

http://www.independent.ie/business/media/keep-calm-and-corrie-on-its-man-vs-machine-at-tv3-30531378.html

While they have built up 3e audience that is on the basis that it is on Saorview, The channel would see audience drop significantly if it left the platform and unless they plan get a significant amount of money from Sky and UPC for 3e I can see it getting 50% of its income from pay and 50% from advertising, I assume that 3e would remain part of the basic TV package.

I never really expected TV3 HD to launch on Saorview, but again if people want HD they will now seek it out on ITV via satellite. TV3 +1 could just replace 3e Pay on Saorview, this could help to retain an audience on TV3 but RTÉ 1 +1 only has 0.5% share.

3e pay will really need to improve its imports to become a pay service even a basic pay service.

As for loosing audiences when Coro St and Emmerdale went to TV3, he is correct but then those that didn't leave were loyal to RTÉ is there loyalty to TV3? I wouldn't think so.

30million should provide TV3 with a standout schedule but if the majority is on Studio based productions then well.... It surprising that TV3's CEO is on the kind of money he is on, is he really worth it?...... Though I say that about the DG of RTÉ....

Infoanon

TV3 may have to pay Sky for HD carriage which they probably wont be able to pay, while I would not be surprised to see 3E becoming TV3+1.

As for their new soap.......considering the struggles Fair City had in its early years Red Rock mat be another El Dorado.

Elmo

The Times article has said that TV3 have Six Pilars for growth.

Now either they are expecting to loose an audience and are planning the growth for next year or the are thinking they are going to grow from 10%, though I expect that TV3 expect to have to regrow their audience.

The Six Pillars are: -

1. Communicorp Partnership (As UTV is a major Radio Player) with a hope to share the talent (must be F-ing that Pat has gone to UTV!)
2. New Advertising Technology
3. Home-Grown Productions (50% of all TV3 will be Irish made)
4. HD and +1 channels on UPC and Sky (TV3HD, TV3 +1 and 3eHD)
5. A pay option for the "entirely new" 3eHD (2016)
6. New presenters such as Jason Byrne


Bizarrely nothing about On-Demand.

Infoanon

Elmo wrote: »

The Times article has said that TV3 have Six Pilars for growth.

Now either they are expecting to loose an audience and are planning the growth for next year or the are thinking they are going to grow from 10%, though I expect that TV3 expect to have to regrow their audience.

The Six Pillars are: -

1. Communicorp Partnership (As UTV is a major Radio Player) with a hope to share the talent (must be F-ing that Pat has gone to UTV!)
2. New Advertising Technology
3. Home-Grown Productions (50% of all TV3 will be Irish made)
4. HD and +1 channels on UPC and Sky (TV3HD, TV3 +1 and 3eHD)
5. A pay option for the "entirely new" 3eHD (2016)
6. New presenters such as Jason Byrne


Bizarrely nothing about On-Demand.

Equally bizzare the noton of a pay channel 3E HD - if the thinking is an ITV2-4HD Sky type deal then the BAI may see that quickly come to nothing.

Cork_chick_94

I wonder will Communicorp buy them out in the next year or two ? The bai would allow it rather than let it close down.

Elmo

Cork_chick_94 wrote: »

I wonder will Communicorp buy them out in the next year or two ? The bai would allow it rather than let it close down.

If it did happen I'd say BAI would see them as a White Knight and agree, they might put conditions on such as to sell 98FM or the 2 Spin stations.... but would it be worth it Communicorps considering the loan book with TV3.

irishmusicfeed

Despite both the Sunday Times and Indo reports being overly positive about the TV3 Group. It's future plans if true are promising... 3e could easily become a pay only channel if they are willing to fork out broadcasting rights (in the past they may not have done this but when the pressure is on they'll have to) for key programming it could easily secure a broadcasting deal with a major US broadcaster such as Showtime or Cinemax etc for first rights and with a mix of key sporting events could make 3e (pay) more viable. TV3+1 could easily replace 3e (though less diverse programming for viewers on Saorview platform if this happens) and 3e could move to UPC, Sky and eVision.

I would rather see Communicorp purchase TV3 Group rather than see it collapse.

icdg

Elmo wrote: »

3e pay will really need to improve its imports to become a pay service even a basic pay service.

....

3e always was a pay-TV service right up until the day it went on Saorview. It is not free on any platform other than Saorview.

So TV3 should call a spade a spade and say that by saying "we are thinking of making 3e a pay TV service" what they really mean is that they are considering withdrawing it from Saorview.

Sam Russell

icdg wrote: »

3e always was a pay-TV service right up until the day it went on Saorview. It is not free on any platform other than Saorview.

So TV3 should call a spade a spade and say that by saying "we are thinking of making 3e a pay TV service" what they really mean is that they are considering withdrawing it from Saorview.

They have always considered they should not pay for Saorview. So what is new?

gordongekko

You know your in trouble when your main strategy to save the station is to hire Jason Byrne.

Onthe3rdDay

McRedmond shows very little understanding of Television at times. He says that an entire audience doesn't move the dial when a programme moves channels. That's actually true on Radio. On Television that's not the case, Unless you're RTE 1 or BBC One in the UK there's very little loyalty to stations, but to programmes.

He said he learnt that lesson when they originally got the soaps. Again with no understanding of the situation. In the first year or two Many went to UTV and then there were about 20percent of the Viewership that couldn't get TV3 at all!!!

The ratings were falling for the Soaps on TV3, but remained much the same on UTV. A lot of the problem is that missing 10-15 percent of the viewership were the causal viewer, not the soap addict. The poor programme choices at 6.30 and at 8.00 got rid of the extra viewers over the years.

I love the way that he says we're the leader of under 45 viewers in this country and in the next line goes on about Downton Abbey, a real under 45 winner.

Now to be fair it was an Independent article and I take almost everything they print these days with a pinch of salt. However, it does seem to be someone making claims that have little basis on reality. I can't say it was good or bad PR because no one is really going to take notice other those that are interested in such stuff and they won't be fooled by upbeat remarks in Ireland worst Broadsheet.

Onthe3rdDay

icdg wrote: »

3e always was a pay-TV service right up until the day it went on Saorview. It is not free on any platform other than Saorview.

So TV3 should call a spade a spade and say that by saying "we are thinking of making 3e a pay TV service" what they really mean is that they are considering withdrawing it from Saorview.

But if they redraw it from Saorview they will lose maybe 80 percent of it's audience overnight. Anyone with Multichannel would never watch the station. The only person I know that watches it (for Family guy) only has Saorview.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Onthe3rdDay

First of all I can’t understand what TV3 thinks the audience is going to do. They basically have no audience once you strip out the soaps and Xfactor/Britains got talent.

Will those that watch Coronation Street all stay on TV3 on the 1st of January out of loyalty or will they switch over to UTV? That’s really hard to answer. :eek:

Their Audience will basically halve in the first 3 months. So in real terms their audience is 5% and they’ll have to build from that, and that 5% will drift away if efforts are not made to keep them.

As for the six Pillars

1.The Communicorp Partnership is Sensible but what exactly are the terms, or is it pie in the sky? Pat would never have joined TV3 anyway, they wouldn’t have paid enough for himself and he also likes a biggish team to work around him.

2. Can’t Comment on the New Advertising Tech, but you need advertisers for this to work.

3. Home produced programmes will work If they’re well made, people will not watch if they’re up to current TV3 quality.

4. Again no HD for the rugby if you’re not in a Cable or Sky House. However there is a large part of the population outside of Dublin that have dishes and they all know how to get ITV via other channels, or they have a cheap HD box. A huge loss of audience if they go down this road.

5. The all new 3e will fail if they don’t buy lots of new material, even if that happens they’re competing against all the UK sat Stations that are all much better. There’s almost no logic in that at all.

6. Jason Byrne could disappear very quickly after one series of his show.

If anything after what I've heard and seen today I think it's now more likely that TV3 are on the way out. It all really depends on what Communicorp want to do. Would they be willing to buy TV3 as a going concern? Trading in good radio stations for a very poorly preforming TV station would be different. However Communicorp do think very long term at times.

However, if Communicorp decide to stay away, it's basically all over. Again TV3 are back to finding someone to buy them rather than really resolving problems.

All these things could have been done 2, 5 and 8 years ago and they might be in a decent place today, even with the soaps going. However they didn't and now it's too late. The plans are pie in the sky as you need a lot of money and an audience to do what they want to do.

The 3e plans are nuts and possibly a smokescreen. They'll close 3e, promising to bring out a new 3e next year....which will never appear. Meanwhile TV3 +1 will take it's place on the various platforms.

As for everything else, I get the feeling of Hitler's bunker at this stage. Everyone agreeing with Management, but the smart one's have already left for Argentina.

Onthe3rdDay

Also according to UTV

http://www.independent.ie/business/media/tv-wars-hot-up-as-kenny-joins-utv-ireland-but-earnings-will-be-hit-30531411.html

UTV expect to be the second largest station by 2016, which is what any normal person would assume, but it's quite normal in Media companies that start ups will take 2, 3 or even 4 years to turn a profit depending on Plans and Markets.

UTV are claiming the station will be making a profit by the end of 2015??? They must really not consider TV3 a challenge at all. Basically if he's forecasting that now, their already happy that advertisers will flock to them and their real competition is the Sat Stations that take money out of the Market.

icdg

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

But if they redraw it from Saorview they will lose maybe 80 percent of it's audience overnight. Anyone with Multichannel would never watch the station. The only person I know that watches it (for Family guy) only has Saorview.

I'm not sure that the type of person who watches 3e - generally young people - are the kind of people who would only have Saorview anyway, unless they're a student living in rental accommodation who can't get or can't afford pay TV. So the impact may be overstated there. Maybe they have run the numbers and figure the 3e carriage on Saorview doesn't pay. If however this is the road they want to travel down the BAI should insist on TV3 and 3e reverting to having separate contracts and TV3 not being allowed to use 3e to meet licence requirements for TV3.

Onthe3rdDay

icdg wrote: »

I'm not sure that the type of person who watches 3e - generally young people - are the kind of people who would only have Saorview anyway, unless they're a student living in rental accommodation who can't get or can't afford pay TV. So the impact may be overstated there. Maybe they have run the numbers and figure the 3e carriage on Saorview doesn't pay. If however this is the road they want to travel down the BAI should insist on TV3 and 3e reverting to having separate contracts and TV3 not being allowed to use 3e to meet licence requirements for TV3.

I agree with all of this, However, I do believe that the vast majority of viewers of 3e are on Saorview. With the exception of Uploaded everything else is available elsewhere. If you're a young person and have multichannel television I would assume (and from some knowledge of under 25's) that 3e is the very last place you'd go for anything (except a rerun of family guy that happens to be on) The one show that might have drawn a young audience that was no where else was dropped (conan)

Sam Russell

icdg wrote: »

I'm not sure that the type of person who watches 3e - generally young people - are the kind of people who would only have Saorview anyway, unless they're a student living in rental accommodation who can't get or can't afford pay TV. So the impact may be overstated there. Maybe they have run the numbers and figure the 3e carriage on Saorview doesn't pay. If however this is the road they want to travel down the BAI should insist on TV3 and 3e reverting to having separate contracts and TV3 not being allowed to use 3e to meet licence requirements for TV3.

Yes.

I had never watched 3E before it went onto Saorview as I do not have payTV. I have never watched anything on 3E since, except for an ocasional flick through because it has no programme I would watch. My wife watches Exposed and VB, but that is all the TV3 she/we watch here. I normally watch the RTE news on another TV.

I cannot beleive TV3 gets away with such rubbish programmes as it produces concentrating on the lower side of life. [Travellers, Gypsies, criminals, Fat weddings,etc.] It was bad enough when they only had talking heads going on about some nonsense, or promoting some bizare product in an infomercial product placement kind of way, but can you imagine what they will make of a soap? It will probably actually feature a product placement of a bar of soap.

channelsurfer2

logically, I cant see 3E being around in 2 years time on any platform. Its all pie in the sky.. possible pay station 2016 etc. they will be lucky to have any money in 2016 never mind try and launch a pay station with no rights. Showtime (nurse jackie etc) and AMC have deals with Sky and the sky deals cover UK and Ireland rights so thats a non-runner for first run rights the premium income earner for pay stations.

Onthe3rdDay

That's the thing. TV3 don't want to pay any money to anyone if possible. They obviously want to close 3e now but would get huge hassle from the BAI if they did it, so they're saying instead that they'll retool it. If they did decide to bring it back, Surprise, Surprise it's not on Saorview.

We're going into 2015 with the likelihood (if things go well for TV3)

No TV3 HD on Saorview
No 3e on Saorview
A very real possibility at this stage of no new proper news service.

Just to make clear, that's almost certainly part of any partnership with the Communicorp group. News bulletins Scraped as we know them at the moment. Rip and read headline service instead. No real effect on Ireland AM (TV3's jewel in the Crown) and the rest of the day.... "It's an exciting new addition to News in Ireland, TV3 news in 90 seconds throughout the day. News bulletins are so 2014.

Infoanon

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

That's the thing. TV3 don't want to pay any money to anyone if possible. They obviously want to close 3e now but would get huge hassle from the BAI if they did it, so they're saying instead that they'll retool it. If they did decide to bring it back, Surprise, Surprise it's not on Saorview.

Huge hassle from the BAI - more likely that they don't want to give up the EPG position - the BAI will allow TV3 do what they want in order to survive.

Elmo

Wednesday if TV3 plan something major

1. TV3 are to commission Newstalk to provide News and Current Affairs
2. Savage will be given an Hour long News programming @5 Monday To Friday
3. Late Lunch Live will finish up at the end of the year
4. Big name shows for 3e



Sorry that's major in TV3 speak.

Major in Elmo Speak would be@-

1. Intro of HD on TV3 across all platforms by a certain date(I wonder if Sky will take TV3HD after all they took so long to take RTÉ HD)
2. Axing of Late Lunch Live, Midday, News @12:30
3. Move of all ITV Daytime programming to 3e until the end of the year
4. Intro of TV3 +1 come Jan 2015
5. Complete overhaul of Daytime
6. Major Focus on Prime Time.

In fairness to them on their soap they have got good producers behind Red Rock, the problem is Red Rock has nothing supporting it.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Onthe3rdDay

Infoanon wrote: »

Huge hassle from the BAI - more likely that they don't want to give up the EPG position - the BAI will allow TV3 do what they want in order to survive.

Yes I agree with you and the BAI allowing them to do whatever they want. But there's an easy way to get the BAI to give in and a hard way. It is true however that they will give in.

Onthe3rdDay

Elmo wrote: »

Wednesday if TV3 plan something major

1. TV3 are to commission Newstalk to provide News and Current Affairs
2. Savage will be given an Hour long News programming @5 Monday To Friday
3. Late Lunch Live will finish up at the end of the year
4. Big name shows for 3e



Sorry that's major in TV3 speak.

Major in Elmo Speak would be@-

1. Intro of HD on TV3 across all platforms by a certain date(I wonder if Sky will take TV3HD after all they took so long to take RTÉ HD)
2. Axing of Late Lunch Live, Midday, News @12:30
3. Move of all ITV Daytime programming to 3e until the end of the year
4. Intro of TV3 +1 come Jan 2015
5. Complete overhaul of Daytime
6. Major Focus on Prime Time.

In fairness to them on their soap they have got good producers behind Red Rock, the problem is Red Rock has nothing supporting it.

I would presume knowing TV3 their form of Major change won't happen. Elmo form of Major change is decent, the main thing with it is that you're actually trying something.

Their soap does have good producers, and I'm sure a decent product can be produced. However, you're right there's nothing to support it. Looking at things logically It would be easier for a brand new station to start a soap than TV3.

Plus this is the big point. Will TV3 support a soap that costs a lot of money to make for the first 18 months while it finds it feet. Or after the first 80 eps we'll hear that RED ROCK will be back next year and it never returns?

Onthe3rdDay

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I fully expect that's what's going to happen, plenty on this board down through the years have been able to work out some of what TV3 will do next. (UTV always seem to be 5 steps ahead)

One of the obvious ones was to cut back on PSB programmes as much as possible. First they got rid of any major Weekend News, then All weekend News, then they dropped the FYI news on 3e. The natural progression sometime next year.

TV3: "We're going broke we have to drop all News"
BAI: "You can't do that, we'll have to look at your licence"
TV3: "Okay how about a fast paced new News service never seen in Ireland TV3 Headline News"
BAI: "You mean Like 60 Second News on BBC 3"
TV3: "No, No, nothing like that, it'll be far more in depth, it'll be 90 seconds long"
BAI: "That sounds great, work away. Glad we could negotiate a solution we're both happy with"

icdg

The big reason for TV3 to keep 3e alive at all is the very valuable EPG slots it holds on Sky and UPC that they'd have to give up if they closed it.

Onthe3rdDay

icdg wrote: »

The big reason for TV3 to keep 3e alive at all is the very valuable EPG slots it holds on Sky and UPC that they'd have to give up if they closed it.

But what would they do with it, I don't think either SKY nor UPC would be happy with TV3 +1 so high up. Obviously it's a blocking tactic because UTV would immediately get it if became free.

irishmusicfeed

Actual Real News:

FOX and TV3 have signed deal which allows TV3 to secure some TV shows and the latest 20th Century Fox film releases. It means Family Guy and American Idol will continue on 3e. It also means TV3 has first rights (in terms of terrertsial TV) to broadcast FOX films prior to other broadcasters.

Infoanon

irishmusicfeed wrote: »

Actual Real News:

FOX and TV3 have signed deal which allows TV3 to secure some TV shows and the latest 20th Century Fox film releases. It means Family Guy and American Idol will continue on 3e. It also means TV3 has first rights (in terms of terrertsial TV) to broadcast FOX films prior to other broadcasters.

Don't think thats going to save them - so much for using the money saved on corrie and emmerdale to invest in home grown programming.

You have to ask what other Irish Terrestial channel would want the rights to Family Guy and Americsn Idol ? Next week the big news will be exclusive rights to Bondi Rescue !