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Washing machine - who is responsible, landlord or tenant?

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24

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    #32
    Bart Mars
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 24 ✭Bart Mars


    Tennants use it so their responsibility 100%


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    #33
    maringo
    Registered Users Posts: 959 ✭✭✭maringo


    Bart Mars wrote: »
    Tennants use it so their responsibility 100%

    Landlord's responsibility to maintain the item he is renting.


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    #34
    Bart Mars
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 24 ✭Bart Mars


    maringo wrote: »
    Landlord's responsibility to maintain the item he is renting.

    He rents the apartment. Not the washing machine.


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    #35
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Bart Mars wrote: »
    Tennants use it so their responsibility 100%
    odds_on wrote: »
    The Housing (Standards for Rented Houses) Regulations 2008 and amended 2009
    (2) Subject to sub-article (1), there shall be provided, within the habitable area of the house, for the exclusive use of the house:
    (g) Washing machine, or access to a communal washing machine facility within the curtilage of the building,
    (h) Where the house does not contain a garden or yard for the exclusive use of that house, a dryer (vented or recirculation type) or access to a communal dryer facility.
    (3) All facilities under sub-article (2) shall be maintained in good working order and good repair.
    (4) Responsibility for maintenance of facilities under sub-article (2) shall rest with the landlord.

    What part of Odds On's post did you miss?


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    #36
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    The first thing is... How old is the washing machine, was it brand new when they moved in or a few years old?
    Secondly, if your tenants are looking after the property and keeping it in very good order, they are the ones you need to keep sweet.
    It might be a L.L. market at the moment and rates are on the increase, but believe me when I tell you, increased rent does not get you improved tenants.
    I am in and out of rented properties almost every day of the week and have seen 2k / mth properties treated like dirt.
    If you do jack up the rent and they stay, they will most likely have you out for the most minor of things because they will feel they are justified in calling you because of the rental increase.


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    #37
    Bart Mars
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 24 ✭Bart Mars


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    What part of Odds On's post did you miss?

    A washing machine doesn't not constitute "facilities". That should be immediately obvious to you ?


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    #38
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Bart Mars wrote: »
    A washing machine doesn't not constitute "facilities". That should be immediately obvious to you ?

    It does, now watch your tone.
    /Mod


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    #39
    hardCopy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    Bart Mars wrote: »
    A washing machine doesn't not constitute "facilities". That should be immediately obvious to you ?

    Even when the law specifically states that the facilities must include a washing machine?

    Have you read any of this thread?


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    #40
    Bart Mars
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 24 ✭Bart Mars


    hardCopy wrote: »
    Even when the law specifically states that the facilities must include a washing machine?

    Have you read any of this thread?

    If it is an integrated washing machine then possibly you have a point. A standing alone washing machine shouldn't be considered as " facilities"


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    #41
    hardCopy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    Bart Mars wrote: »
    If it is an integrated washing machine then possibly you have a point. A standing alone washing machine shouldn't be considered as " facilities"

    It's the first item in the list of facilities under section 2 paragraph G.


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    #42
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Bart Mars wrote: »
    If it is an integrated washing machine then possibly you have a point. A standing alone washing machine shouldn't be considered as " facilities"

    But it is considered a facility and it is a requirement of a landlord to provide a working one for use by his / her tenant.


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    #43
    maringo
    Registered Users Posts: 959 ✭✭✭maringo


    The OP asked what should he do. If it was me I'd fix the washing machine and hold onto the decent tenants. Plenty of bad tenants out there as have friends who have had their property left in a very poor state due to careless and filthy tenants. Plenty of good tenants out there too but once you have a bad one you are stuck with them and the hassle of getting them out.


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    #44
    cerastes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,601 ✭✭✭cerastes


    Id a discussion similar to this but which I think is related to the thread.
    It was about unfurnished properties and what items might still be supplied.

    If and previously when I rented, I would prefer not to use certain items left in the rented property.
    While there isnt much choice, Id have preferred to have used some items I owned (at least a mattress). Microwaves, kettles and toasters are all small items and it doesnt necessarily suit either landlords or tenants to have to use items provided, or teapots for that matter.

    It comes up a bit how other countries do things, so we should follow suit,

    How do the regulations fare in relation to unfurnished properties?
    Can a landlord agree with a tenant if they have their own stuff to use it? or do they have to tell them no, store it??

    Unfurnished and regulations?


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    #45
    kravmaga
    Registered Users Posts: 1,952 ✭✭✭kravmaga


    cathleencp wrote: »
    We rent a house to very good tenants for past 2.5 years (we have not increased rent). They say we are responsible for repairs to washing machine - my understanding is that the tenant is responsible for the day-to-day maintenance. We have repaired electrical items a few times before but I think it should be their problem now - can anyone advise?

    If you supplied the washing machine in the first instance, I would say you are liable for repairs/maintenance to it.

    So its a landlord responsibility.


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    #46
    Electric Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 2,107 ✭✭✭Electric Sheep


    hardCopy wrote: »
    It's the first item in the list of facilities under section 2 paragraph G.

    I sincerely hope Bart is not a landlord. There should be a requirement for landlords to be able to understand the basic housing standard regulations.


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    #47
    iguana
    Registered Users Posts: 12,916 ✭✭✭✭iguana


    murphaph wrote: »
    Yep, time for the rent to be adjusted for these tenants to the current market rate. Some people don't know a sweet deal when it hits them in the face. Replace the machine and send a notice of rent increase to actual market rates.

    Is the OP's property based in the the small percentage of the country where rents are rising? I didn't see her mention that anywhere in her post? In the majority of the country rents are stagnant and even falling in places. Market rate could easily be quite a bit less than the current rent.


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    #48
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,022 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    iguana wrote: »
    Is the OP's property based in the the small percentage of the country where rents are rising? I didn't see her mention that anywhere in her post? In the majority of the country rents are stagnant and even falling in places. Market rate could easily be quite a bit less than the current rent.
    Just taking OP at face value. It's the OP that claims the rent is a good deal below market rate.


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    #49
    sligoface
    Closed Accounts Posts: 556 ✭✭✭sligoface


    Why are people talking about a broken washing machine and the amount of rent paid in the same sentence? They're not related. Saying that a tenant who isn't paying top dollar in rent needs to 'keep a low profile' by not requesting a necessary item be fixed is ridiculous. If they pay on time and maintain the place than they are keeping a low profile IMO. Fix the stupid machine. They are basically made to break every few years now as soon as the warranty runs out, that keeps the appliance companies in business, so this is a pretty normal repair.

    Only on the internet would people say you should or could raise the rent every time an item needs to be repaired or fixed. You can't. Isn't the main advantage of renting is that repairs and maintenance are included in rent paid? Conversely the advantage to owning is that it belongs to you, even if you rent it out and have someone else pay the mortgage on the place, it is your property.

    Now we have landlords who want tenants to pay their mortgage AND pay for repairs and maintenance?! Boy, that's a sweet deal. If that was the way it worked, no one would rent at all.


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    #50
    mikemac1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,395 ✭✭✭✭mikemac1


    The best landlord I ever had and he's still my current one owns over 20 properties. Rare I would have to contact him but when I do everything is sorted easily

    It's the amateur landlords like the OP who cause tenants grief

    No issue with asking questions :) but after two years being a landlord you should already know the answer.


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    #51
    dharma200
    Registered Users Posts: 998 ✭✭✭dharma200


    This thread is perhaps indicative that landlords should have to do a short test or something before being allowed to have tenants... What kind of mentality states that if a washing machine breaks the rent should be put up.... It is a horrible precarious place to be renting in Ireland, even with part four etc because of attitudes like this... And landlords refusing to learn even the most basic procedures and legislation.
    OP fix the washing machine. The fact thisisnt immediately apparent to you a snot only common sense but the decent thing to do, and as per legislation, really shows you that you must get a print out of all your obligations as a landlord.... And don't, as others here have suggested, charge your tenant for your trouble of finding out the minimum standards in the business you are in.


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    #52
    .jacksparrow.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,428 ✭✭✭.jacksparrow.


    Who's gonna be responsible for water charges, tenant or landlord ?


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    #53
    sligoface
    Closed Accounts Posts: 556 ✭✭✭sligoface


    .jacksparrow. wrote: »
    Who's gonna be responsible for water charges, tenant or landlord ?

    There's a thread on that already. Tenants.


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    #54
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,022 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    It's naïve in the extreme to think a tenant on a sweet deal won't be raising their head above the parapet when requesting repairs like this to be carried out. The tenant has been foolish here. Should have realised a washing machine repair would have cost maybe 1 month's difference between his current tent and what he could be asked to pay according to market rates. Now he stands to lose a large multiple of that as his landlord simply adjusts the rent to the market rate.

    Tenants have no problem requesting reductions when the market falls. It cuts both ways.


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    #55
    the world wonders
    Registered Users Posts: 489 ✭✭the world wonders


    murphaph wrote: »
    The tenant has been foolish here. Should have realised a washing machine repair would have cost maybe 1 month's difference between his current tent and what he could be asked to pay according to market rates. Now he stands to lose a large multiple of that as his landlord simply adjusts the rent to the market rate.
    I disagree, I think that would be a poor bet on the part of the tenant. Why wouldn't the landlord increase the rent to market rate even if the tenant pays for the repairs themself?


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    #56
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    the world wonders wrote: »
    I disagree, I think that would be a poor bet on the part of the tenant. Why wouldn't the landlord increase the rent to market rate even if the tenant pays for the repairs themself?

    The LL can always do that. However you have to balance that against the tenant leaving. If its a good tenant it pays to retain them. While its easy to get a new tenant at the moment, getting a good tenant isn't always easy. LL could increase the rent slightly, if not quite to market rate.


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    #57
    weisses
    Registered Users Posts: 9,457 ✭✭✭weisses


    murphaph wrote: »
    Just taking OP at face value. It's the OP that claims the rent is a good deal below market rate.

    Where does the OP claims the rent is a good deal below market rate ? All I see that the rent is at the same level for the past 2.5 years.

    Considering the OP previous experience she should be very happy with these tenants.


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    #58
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    murphaph wrote: »
    It's naïve in the extreme to think a tenant on a sweet deal won't be raising their head above the parapet when requesting repairs like this to be carried out. The tenant has been foolish here. Should have realised a washing machine repair would have cost maybe 1 month's difference between his current tent and what he could be asked to pay according to market rates. Now he stands to lose a large multiple of that as his landlord simply adjusts the rent to the market rate.

    Tenants have no problem requesting reductions when the market falls. It cuts both ways.

    Your suggestion could cause more problems than it solves. Its most likely a breach of their contract to change fittings without the LL approval. Also the tenant might by something that doesn't last long without a warranty that breaks itself very quickly. Maybe the LL has a preferred supplier etc.


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    #59
    drumswan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,592 ✭✭✭drumswan


    There was another thread here recently with landlords berating a bloke for carrying out repairs without permission, now some of the same posters are saying the opposite.

    Raise the tent because a tenant asked to have something fixed? Irish landlords are absolute cowboys.


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    #60
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    drumswan wrote: »
    There was another thread here recently with landlords berating a bloke for carrying out repairs without permission, now some of the same posters are saying the opposite.

    Raise the tent because a tenant asked to have something fixed? Irish landlords are absolute cowboys.

    Less of the gross generalisations please.

    /Mod


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    #61
    iguana
    Registered Users Posts: 12,916 ✭✭✭✭iguana


    murphaph wrote: »
    Just taking OP at face value. It's the OP that claims the rent is a good deal below market rate.

    Where? All the OP says about the rent is that it hasn't been increased in 2.5 years. Afaik, the OP does not live in Dublin, so that has no bearing on whether or not the tenants are paying market rate or not.


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