Spring lamb prices

Green farmer

kk.man wrote: »

Don't think Brexit has had effect yet. Sheep is just as scarce at Carlisle mart as any mart in this country. But the dynamics of the customer base has changed. Australia/New Zealand is shipping product to Asia en mass. Muslim population in Europe is also a factor.

Think it's something like nz isn't even filling half its Quota to the e.u. that's some hole

Jjameson

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Very basic question: has the price of lamb gone up in the supermarkets?

That is, are the processors just charging the supermarkets more for lamb? And then the supermarkets pass on the extra costs to the consumer?

I sold my first lambs in spring 09 for 3.70€ a kg.
It hasn’t doubled at retail since then I’ll put it like that.

I priced up lamb in Dunne’s across all cuts recently and averaged a a complete 23kg carcass @ €13 a kg give or take a 50cent. (Taking discount price on legs and loin chops, a few cuts not found so calling diced price) grossing close to €300 at retail.

Excluding tongue, liver, kidneys,heart,sweetbread and the bits the more discerning ethnic consumers pay dear for like tails and testicles.

http://www.abpoffal.com/products/lamb/

Danzy

Green farmer wrote: »

Think it's something like nz isn't even filling half its Quota to the e.u. that's some hole

Nearly every Sheep producing country in the world has their national flocks at lows not seen in decades or a century in Oz.

Not only that but the no. getting out of Sheep in those countries continues apace.

I don't know where the price is going, but my 8 weeks in the game aside, at least numbers are not steadily going up here and in other major exporters like in beef.

At least there is clear pressures to think prices should be positive ahead. Not that that means it'll be paid.

the thing with sheep is,the numbers can grow kinda like covid cases


If a lad is set up properly,fencing,handling facilities etc (and land available),its no big effort to go from 100 to 500 or so.

There isnt 5 times the work in 500 vs 100 sheep,an extra few days a year outside lambing time

Danzy

Deleted User wrote: »

the thing with sheep is,the numbers can grow kinda like covid cases


If a lad is set up properly,fencing,handling facilities etc (and land available),its no big effort to go from 100 to 500 or so.

There isnt 5 times the work in 500 vs 100 sheep,an extra few days a year outside lambing time

Lot of the sheep farms in New Zealand are going to dairy and even beef.

I don't want to over egg my post but I'll put it that it's at least something that the price isn't shi7 and lads still driving numbers on.

Jjameson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

the thing with sheep is,the numbers can grow kinda like covid cases


If a lad is set up properly,fencing,handling facilities etc (and land available),its no big effort to go from 100 to 500 or so.

There isnt 5 times the work in 500 vs 100 sheep,an extra few days a year outside lambing time

When you move past the optimum stocking rate in terms of your land/facilitates or help a profitable enterprise descends into misery and less money than you had before..
Been there done that!

charolais0153

[Deleted User] wrote: »

the thing with sheep is,the numbers can grow kinda like covid cases


If a lad is set up properly,fencing,handling facilities etc (and land available),its no big effort to go from 100 to 500 or so.

There isnt 5 times the work in 500 vs 100 sheep,an extra few days a year outside lambing time

Anyone only stocking the place to 1/5 has no business stocking it fully, any place that wanted to go fulltime farming with a nice block of land is going into dairying not sheep

eire23

charolais0153 wrote: »

Anyone only stocking the place to 1/5 has no business stocking it fully, any place that wanted to go fulltime farming with a nice block of land is going into dairying not sheep

Around here no one is really driving on in sheep numbers. Most don't want the hassle of sheep. Hopefully it stays that way.

Green farmer

[Deleted User] wrote: »

the thing with sheep is,the numbers can grow kinda like covid cases


There isnt 5 times the work in 500 vs 100 sheep,an extra few days a year outside lambing time

Maybe something to think about

J.O. Farmer

kk.man wrote: »

Don't think Brexit has had effect yet. Sheep is just as scarce at Carlisle mart as any mart in this country. But the dynamics of the customer base has changed. Australia/New Zealand is shipping product to Asia en mass. Muslim population in Europe is also a factor.

Could sheep being scarce in Carlisle be an effect of brexit. Would a lot of flocks been scaled back in late 2019 (less ewes to the ram) and in 2020 with lambs sold earlier in anticipation of brexit.

orm0nd

monday's marts could be hot, factories underbooked

Bass Reeves

[Deleted User] wrote: »

the thing with sheep is,the numbers can grow kinda like covid cases


If a lad is set up properly,fencing,handling facilities etc (and land available),its no big effort to go from 100 to 500 or so.

There isnt 5 times the work in 500 vs 100 sheep,an extra few days a year outside lambing time

While 5 time the amount of ewes might not be 5ti.rs the work neither might it entail 5yimes the profit. A 100 ewes can be integrated into a system.fairly easy. On heavy ground they can be used in spring to clean out silage ground prior to April on mixed enterprise farm. As well they can be used to clean off grazing ground if you have a very wet autumn.

A lot with 100 ewes can give attention to detail and they can be lambed earlier if grass on wet ground is go be used up. With attention to detail you might have a dale's ration if 1.7/ewe or above. Sheds from other enterprise's can be used for lambing whether it's an old hay barn or an empty couple of pen in a slatted shed that held a few finishing cattle.

With 500 you need a large amount of grass in the spring. It may delay lambing. Lambs sold/ year may drop to 1.6 or below. You will tend to have a higher percentage of lambs left at the taIl end of the year. The whole farm may need to be sheep fenced compared to a smaller percentage cow where compact grazing takes place from April to early autumn.

Yes you will have the economies of scale. But time spend may not be much less as more land pressure may exist. You may have to draft for 2-3 flocks spread over fragmented land. Which will add risk of dogs or Foxes.

Another reason why lamb numbers may not climb easily was a lot of dairy farmers had a small flock integrated into there system to graze down grass over the winter early spring. With earlier turn out none of these will return to sheep

kk.man

8.50 freely available for hoggets this week. Will there be a breeding hogget available in the county next August!

downtown3858

8.50?? We’re ?? How much springs

Dinzee Conlee

kk.man wrote: »

8.50 freely available for hoggets this week. Will there be a breeding hogget available in the county next August!

8.50 for hoggets?

There wasn’t a typo there was there kk?

Robson99

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

8.50 for hoggets?

There wasn’t a typo there was there kk?

Going by mart prices yesterday for Ram hoggets I'd say there at least €8.00 a kg.
Que next back end. Stores that were €70 - 80 last autumn will be €100 + and come spring prices will be back to €6 a kg in factories and the finisher will give it all back

kk.man

kk.man wrote: »

8.50 freely available for hoggets this week. Will there be a breeding hogget available in the county next August!

SORRY EVERYONE; hoggets making 8 and springs 8.50 freely, which translates into there is more available.

Bass Reeves

Robson99 wrote: »

Going by mart prices yesterday for Ram hoggets I'd say there at least €8.00 a kg.
Que next back end. Stores that were €70 - 80 last autumn will be €100 + and come spring prices will be back to €6 a kg in factories and the finisher will give it all back

It might take longer than that. You really need more lambs to start coming off the mountains. Last year's prices will e courage those lads to start breeding more but ewe lambs are not being retained yet. At 100/store and 7/kg there is still s margin in it

Green farmer

kk.man wrote: »

SORRY EVERYONE; hoggets making 8 and springs 8.50 freely, which translates into there is more available.

At €8 a kilo, that has me seriously thinking my replacement hoggets.

Bass Reeves

DJ98 wrote: »

Have a bunch of ewe lambs here that I kept, but kept more than required, there weighing between 35 and 45 kg at the moment and are Suffolk X cheviots, I had planned on selling them as breeders during the summer but with current prices would I be aswell to sell now?

Well what did you do with them did you feed them on with grass or ration or are you holding them for the autumn for hogget sales

memorystick

Green farmer wrote: »

At €8 a kilo, that has me seriously thinking my replacement hoggets.

Don’t sell all of your seeds.

Albert Johnson

kk.man wrote: »

SORRY EVERYONE; hoggets making 8 and springs 8.50 freely, which translates into there is more available.

At a max weight of 23.5kg dead weight there's hoggets making the equivalent of €8.30 in the marts in recent days and pay haulage and commission on them afterwards. I'm fully expecting to see the €200 barrier broken for heavy hoggets this coming week which would be the equivalent of €8.50. Fleshed sheep number's are rapidly drying up with no sign of demand reducing from the factories and I'd reckon there's another month left for record prices.

Albert Johnson

Green farmer wrote: »

At €8 a kilo, that has me seriously thinking my replacement hoggets.

It depends on the sheep but I'd find it hard to justify carrying them until the backend at those sort of prices. What would you average per head on an average year? Remember that you could put 50 of them through the mart ring currently and get the same price across the bundle. Compare this to splitting them into 5s and 10s at breeding sale's and being told there's "too much black in such a bundles wool" or "they haven't the right heads" ect and taking €30 less than the "proper" one's. For all the high priced one's at €200+ there's plenty of nice sheep sold annually at €130-180.

When you factor in mortality and grazing costs from now until then it seems a no brained really but what would you buy in the place of them atm.

Edited to say that I now realise you were talking about your own home bred replacements as opposed to lambs bought with the intention of selling as breeding hoggets. That changes the argument slightly as you'd have to either purchase more replacements or reduce ewe number's temporarily if culling sheep in the autumn.

eire23

Green farmer wrote: »

At €8 a kilo, that has me seriously thinking my replacement hoggets.

Personally I wouldn't sell my replacements no matter what the money. You know what you have amd what breeding has gone into them. Then having to go buying in hoggets and the possibility of disease etc. Imagine buying in codd or that, ya would kick yourself all for the sake of a few euro.

Green farmer

Albert Johnson wrote: »

I
.

Edited to say that I now realise you were talking about your own home bred replacements as opposed to lambs bought with the intention of selling as breeding hoggets. That changes the argument slightly as you'd have to either purchase more replacements or reduce ewe number's temporarily if culling sheep in the autumn.

I was planning on reducing numbers anyway. My sheep would be plain meddling type of lleyns / easycare . Wouldnt be making big money in hogget sales.

kk.man

I'd sell every hogget in the place only for BEAM. I must reduce my cattle by 20 this year, I was banking on hoggets eating the extra grass.

I'm going to gamble on the hogget sales big time! 🙄

Dinzee Conlee

kk.man wrote: »

I'd sell every hogget in the place only for BEAM. I must reduce my cattle by 20 this year, I was banking on hoggets eating the extra grass.

I'm going to gamble on the hogget sales big time! 🙄

I sold a few more of mine than I had originally planned last week...

If the price holds, a few more might get the chop...

Albert Johnson

Green farmer wrote: »

I was planning on reducing numbers anyway. My sheep would be plain meddling type of lleyns / easycare . Wouldnt be making big money in hogget sales.

If you already had it in mind to reduce stock levels then I don't see a better time to sell them than now tbh. It's either that or hold them and cull extra ewes in the backend but that may or may not be beneficial depending on how happy you are with your current flock.

I'd be very slow to advocate anyone selling homebred hoggets now and buying in breeding stock to replace them in the future. A closed flock isn't something I've ever had personally but it's something worth preserving where in place imo. I'd still be tempted to hang up this year's replacements and temporarily reduce ewe numbers or look to keeping a greater number of this year's lamb crop. If current high prices are a flash in the pan then you'd make some fast cash and if they remain high in the future then it would average itself out due to smaller lamb crops from fewer ewes for a year or 2 until you had more replacements coming into the flock.

Albert Johnson

kk.man wrote: »

I'd sell every hogget in the place only for BEAM. I must reduce my cattle by 20 this year, I was banking on hoggets eating the extra grass.

I'm going to gamble on the hogget sales big time! 🙄

I don't see much other options there apart from perhaps setting some grassland. There's not much point selling one dear sheep to replace with another equally dear one. There's not much value to be had in cattle atm and the BEAM requirements have that ruled out regardless. Selling fodder is a waste of time and resources in most cases unless perhaps as a standing crop. You'd be as well to keep at what your at in that case and hope for the best. If the hogget price was currently €5 would we be advocating buying the best of the ewe hoggets to store over until the autumn breeding sale's?

Bass Reeves

kk.man wrote: »

I'd sell every hogget in the place only for BEAM. I must reduce my cattle by 20 this year, I was banking on hoggets eating the extra grass.

I'm going to gamble on the hogget sales big time! 🙄

The hoggets you have are more than likely for lowland production. If lambs hold a good price all summer then hogget prices should be strong.

However I be tempted to hang so e if they were mine. Spread less fertlizer. Lower fertlizer on silage ground and cut a larger area. Set stock some of the farm. Mover cattle out if paddocks a day sooner and top them. Some of it entails extra work but savings can be made that will further increase profits

Drystock is a low input game if you can lower inputs it will increase profits to add to profit on those hoggets