Season 4 Episode 6 "The Laws of Gods and Men": *HAVENT* read the books MOD NOTE POST1

Letyourselfgo

I don't think Tywin wants Tyrion dead so why would he pick someone capable of beating Tyrions representative (so that rules out the Mountain for me). I think it will be Bron against the guy from Kings guard who testified first at the trial as Jamie will put up some money on Tyrions part to pay Bron.

ziedth

Letyourselfgo wrote: »

I don't think Tywin wants Tyrion dead so why would he pick someone capable of beating Tyrions representative (so that rules out the Mountain for me). I think it will be Bron against the guy from Kings guard who testified first at the trial as Jamie will put up some money on Tyrions part to pay Bron.

This is another reason I think he could pick the mountain. It's been mentioned a number of times how strong a warrior Oberyn is so I think Tywin will "kill two birds with with one stone" by giving Oberyn his shot at the mountain and to ensure Tyrion doesn't die.

BanksysGhost

Should Tyrion's representative lose the trial by combat and he be found guilty, would it even necessarily mean he'd be executed? Could be still be exiled or kept in prison?

After Tyrion's outburst Tywin can't be seen to be go easy on him. The people of King's Landing are already unhappy enough with the Lannisters. So he'll have to put out the best warrior, who is The Mountain. It won't be a problem giving him some time to get to King's Landing because Tyrion, in his first trial by combat, thought he would have time for Jaime to get to The Vale to defend him.

bren2001

BanksysGhost wrote: »

Should Tyrion's representative lose the trial by combat and he be found guilty, would it even necessarily mean he'd be executed? Could be still be exiled or kept in prison?

After Tyrion's outburst Tywin can't be seen to be go easy on him. The people of King's Landing are already unhappy enough with the Lannisters. So he'll have to put out the best warrior, who is The Mountain. It won't be a problem giving him some time to get to King's Landing because Tyrion, in his first trial by combat, thought he would have time for Jaime to get to The Vale to defend him.

I think it is fair to say if Tyrion loses he will be executed. There is no way he will be sent to the wall. If he wins, where does he go?

2ndcoming

The previous deal is off, there's only two outcomes of a trial by combat, defeat meaning guilt and death or victory meaning innocence and freedom.

That's not to say Tyrion would be free, in King's Landing at least, after insulting all the local nobles and wishing he could kill them all.

degrassinoel

ziedth wrote: »

This is another reason I think he could pick the mountain. It's been mentioned a number of times how strong a warrior Oberyn is so I think Tywin will "kill two birds with with one stone" by giving Oberyn his shot at the mountain and to ensure Tyrion doesn't die.

was thinking exactly that too

Naydy

If Oberyn does end up fighting in this trial by combat and dies, I'm gonna be really sad. He's one of the most interesting characters this season.
I would really like him to get his revenge on the Mountain, but I don't think he'd stand a chance against him one-on-one (I don't think anyone would beat the Mountain one-on-one).

I know Tywin was willing to let Tyrion live, but only as an exile. I think that since the choice is now either killing him or letting him off scot-free, he'll go for the former. So from that point of view, it would make sense for Tywin to pick the Mountain. The only reason I can see Oberyn volunteering is if he thinks Tywin is going to try wriggling out of giving him the Mountain. And since he clearly doesn't trust any of the Lannisters, I suppose that's a good possibility.

I bet we won't find out straight away anyhow, they'll drag it out a few more episodes :P

bren2001

Naydy wrote: »

If Oberyn does end up fighting in this trial by combat and dies, I'm gonna be really sad. He's one of the most interesting characters this season.
I would really like him to get his revenge on the Mountain, but I don't think he'd stand a chance against him one-on-one (I don't think anyone would beat the Mountain one-on-one).

I know Tywin was willing to let Tyrion live, but only as an exile. I think that since the choice is now either killing him or letting him off scot-free, he'll go for the former. So from that point of view, it would make sense for Tywin to pick the Mountain. The only reason I can see Oberyn volunteering is if he thinks Tywin is going to try wriggling out of giving him the Mountain. And since he clearly doesn't trust any of the Lannisters, I suppose that's a good possibility.

I bet we won't find out straight away anyhow, they'll drag it out a few more episodes :P

I expect the ending of episode 7 to be whoever Tywin names as champion for the crown. End of episode 8 to be the fight itself with one of them dying. It leads to a huge episode 9 of Tyrion either being executed/somehow escaping or having won the dual having to get as far away from KL as possible.

Son0vagun

As usual the Non Book readers thread is far more interesting then the book readers thread! Too much complaining over there about changes to the book!

Naydy

bren2001 wrote: »

I expect the ending of episode 7 to be whoever Tywin names as champion for the crown. End of episode 8 to be the fight itself with one of them dying. It leads to a huge episode 9 of Tyrion either being executed/somehow escaping or having won the dual having to get as far away from KL as possible.

I don't think Tyrion will actually die. He'll win the duel or escape. But I think you're right, that he'll have to leave KL either way, cause Cersei won't let it rest.

I think Varys might help him behind the scenes. I know he went against him in the trial, but he always keeps up appearances in public. We know he tried to help Ned Stark by convincing him to plead guilty to Joffrey.

snausages

Son0vagun wrote: »

As usual the Non Book readers thread is far more interesting then the book readers thread! Too much complaining over there about changes to the book!

What have they changed? Spoiler tag it.

DDC1990

snausages wrote: »

What have they changed? Spoiler tag it.

Or don't post it at all.

Thank you.

K_user

Son0vagun wrote: »

As usual the Non Book readers thread is far more interesting then the book readers thread! Too much complaining over there about changes to the book!

That sounds about right.

There are many that would rather spoil the whole experience of having a successful fantasy show on TV, then just enjoy it.

I'll never understand the nit-picking.

snausages

DDC1990 wrote: »

Or don't post it at all.

Thank you.

Or you could just not read the spoiler. I'd rather not wade into the book thread and find future spoilers, I'm just curious about what current events have been changed.

K_user

Naydy wrote: »

If Oberyn does end up fighting in this trial by combat and dies, I'm gonna be really sad. He's one of the most interesting characters this season.
I would really like him to get his revenge on the Mountain, but I don't think he'd stand a chance against him one-on-one (I don't think anyone would beat the Mountain one-on-one).

I know Tywin was willing to let Tyrion live, but only as an exile. I think that since the choice is now either killing him or letting him off scot-free, he'll go for the former. So from that point of view, it would make sense for Tywin to pick the Mountain. The only reason I can see Oberyn volunteering is if he thinks Tywin is going to try wriggling out of giving him the Mountain. And since he clearly doesn't trust any of the Lannisters, I suppose that's a good possibility.

I bet we won't find out straight away anyhow, they'll drag it out a few more episodes :P

The mountain is a brute. We saw his "skills" in season 1 against Loras.

Oberyn looks to be more like Jamie, strong, fit, intelligent and light on his feet. His introduction by Tyrion tells us that he's an accomplished fighter. I think that he would have the edge, if he can avoid any bone crushing blows from the mountain.

If the mountain is nominated then I can't see Oberyn resisting the chance. Its all above board and very public. And I can't see the mountain saying no.


Oberyn has been introduced to the story for a reason. His back story is interesting, as he is instantly a problem for the Lannisters. If he wasn't involved in the poisoning of Joff, which Little Finger has taken credit for, then he has to be there for a revenge plot line.

I can't see him taking on Jamie and there is no way that Tywin will partake - although I'd love to see that fight. And most of the Kings Guard are fairly faceless.

Apart from Brienne, the only other "known" noble swordsman is Loras, and he has nothing to personally gain from the fight. Bronn is the obvious other choice, but that has been done.

Liamalone

Son0vagun wrote: »

As usual the Non Book readers thread is far more interesting then the book readers thread! Too much complaining over there about changes to the book!

I enjoy the book readers in here posting as non book readers, pointing no elbows lol







*points elbow*

snausages

Grimebox wrote: »

:eek:

I guess I just don't really like the sadist stuff, kind of ties into the fooking legend guy in one of the previous eps, it's not easy viewing and some of it (not all) is unnecessary.

I get the sense that a lot of the torture scenes in season 3 were put in to give Alfie Allen something to do.

Son0vagun

snausages wrote: »

What have they changed? Spoiler tag it.

Nah not a hope.

K_user

snausages wrote: »

I get the sense that a lot of the torture scenes in season 3 were put in to give Alfie Allen something to do.

Giving us an idea as to what Alfie's character went through and how messed up his torturer was, makes it easier to believe how broken he is now.

Had they just skipped season 3 and reintroduced him in season 4, it just wouldn't feel right.

It would be like leaving Bran's story half way through season 1 and then have him show up in season 4, over the wall, all puppet master with Hordor.

Grimebox

snausages wrote: »

I guess I just don't really like the sadist stuff, kind of ties into the fooking legend guy in one of the previous eps, it's not easy viewing and some of it (not all) is unnecessary.

I get the sense that a lot of the torture scenes in season 3 were put in to give Alfie Allen something to do.

I'm not sure how to respond to this. I don't think this show is for you. Anything could be interpreted as unnecessary.

snausages

Well that's different though, you're talking about a crazy bastard offspring of a familiy who's emblem is a man being flayed breaking down a guy into a pathetic Smeagol-like creature versus a guy who's got mysterious unknown powers.

Anyway, I don't want to argue! Just saying that I have a different opinion.

Grimebox wrote: »

I'm not sure how to respond to this. I don't think this show is for you. Anything could be interpreted as unnecessary.

Well yeah, but it's a whole season's worth of torture. It got tedious after a while.

celica00

snausages wrote: »

What have they changed? Spoiler tag it.

that could actually fill a whole book haha
enough was changed due the seaons(s).
I like to read here too btw haha

snausages

Just as an aside to the Ramsay Snow stuff, I'm not the only Boardsie who found that plot thread a little wearying by the end of season 3: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=85013614

(Not trying to start an 'I'm right and you're wrong' debate, but I hate being made to feel the contrarian sometimes.)

Hi folks, I'm a book reader. If you don't mind, I might post in the "haven't read the books thread" as I feel this is the truest place to talk about the TV show without having to engage in "why is X different from the books/what does this mean for future unreleased books?". For my part I promise not to try to slyly drop future plot points.

I thought that was the best episode of Thrones so far, every scene was perfection for me, maybe except the Theon rescue attempt. In fairness though, from Yara's point of view, her brother is now "dead" and hanging around any longer would have surely resulted in death/flaying for her and her Ironborn. I think rather than fúcked up sex games, the blood on Ramsey was from some Ironborn he might have encountered on his way to the dog kennels where Yara was. But with Ramsey Snow, who knows!

Comment from this thread or the book thread which gave me a good belly laugh - Yara and the Ironborn running away was like something from Monty Python

Poor Tyrion, that outburst was justified. I feel the acting from 'Shae' let down the emotional value of the scene slightly but otherwise it was top notch stuff. To even be an extra in that scene would have been amazing.

I had no idea what to expect when we saw that little boy sitting out in the fields on his own, when Drogon appeared in front of him my heart skipped a beat. Have to say that all of the CGI work in the show is quality, the shot of Bravos as Stannis' ships passed under the Titan was truly epic.

Hopefully this show gets to see a definite conclusion. HBO have fúcked me before (ahem...Deadwood!) but that show had nowhere near the viewers/reputation at the time that GoT has now.

bren2001

snausages wrote: »

Just as an aside to the Ramsay Snow stuff, I'm not the only Boardsie who found that plot thread a little wearying by the end of season 3: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=85013614

(Not trying to start an 'I'm right and you're wrong' debate, but I hate being made to feel the contrarian sometimes.)

Its difficult to say at this stage was it pointless. If Ramsay Snow or Theon turn out to be major characters. Then the amount of time spent on them in season 3 was necessary. There was important character development there. We saw how sadistic Ramsay is and equally how Theon was broken.

On the other hand, if they continue to be minor (ish) characters, then the amount of time spent on it is ludicrous.

snausages

bren2001 wrote: »

Its difficult to say at this stage was it pointless. If Ramsay Snow or Theon turn out to be major characters. Then the amount of time spent on them in season 3 was necessary. There was important character development there. We saw how sadistic Ramsay is and equally how Theon was broken.

On the other hand, if they continue to be minor (ish) characters, then the amount of time spent on it is ludicrous.

Even if they're major characters, I'd say that the scene where Ramsay sets a dog on that woman at the start of this season and the bit with 'Reek' meekly following and calling him master would have told us a lot of both Ramsay's character and just how much Theon's position had changed since the season 2 finale. Sometimes a bit of mystery is great, just tell the audience enough to fill in the blanks themselves.

bren2001

snausages wrote: »

Even if they're major characters, I'd say that the scene where Ramsay sets a dog on that woman at the start of this season and the bit with 'Reek' meekly following and calling him master would have told us a lot of both Ramsay's character and just how much Theon's position had changed since the season 2 finale. Sometimes a bit of mystery is great, just tell the audience enough to fill in the blanks themselves.

One of the reasons I watch the show and started to read the books was due to the fantastic characters it has. Which, imo, is the best thing any TV show can have. To get it, time has to be invested in each of them. Skipping over the story and allowing the viewer to fill in the blanks would not cover it in this case for me. It would have felt very cheap to just have Theon jump back into the show. I think they could have cut it down to 3-4 scenes instead of the ridiculous amount they had. At least now we have seen the extent to which he has been tortured and how much Ramsay owns him. If in a while Theon plays a big part and then gives up everything he has to Ramsay, it will make sense. Without those scenes, I do not think it would feel right and we would question Theons actions.

snausages

But by investing less time into the torture arc they'd have more space to cover more interesting and engaging plots. And it's not really 'skipping' it over either. It would be skipping things if they got rid of Bran and brought him back with supernatural powers, but it's easy enough to deduce that Theon went through some pretty heavy stuff if you see how he is now.

God, I don't know, I'd just love more Tywin scenes. He's amazing. The ruler Westeros deserves

Grimebox

stankratz wrote: »

I think rather than fúcked up sex games, the blood on Ramsey was from some Ironborn he might have encountered on his way to the dog kennels where Yara was. But with Ramsey Snow, who knows!

I definitely think it was sadistic sex games. There were too many shallow wounds on him for it to happen in a fight. It would take far too many glancing swipes to get the same effect in a fight. She was beginning to choke him at the end of the sex scene before we see him again, which suggests he likes it rough. It fits perfectly with his character. Not that this little detail matters too much.

GerB40

snausages wrote: »

I guess I just don't really like the sadist stuff, kind of ties into the fooking legend guy in one of the previous eps, it's not easy viewing and some of it (not all) is unnecessary.

I get the sense that a lot of the torture scenes in season 3 were put in to give Alfie Allen something to do.

The torture scenes were put in to show Theons transformation into Reek. We now know that Theon is essentially dead and, by showing the torture last season, we also know why.

celica00

snausages wrote: »

But by investing less time into the torture arc they'd have more space to cover more interesting and engaging plots. And it's not really 'skipping' it over either. It would be skipping things if they got rid of Bran and brought him back with supernatural powers, but it's easy enough to deduce that Theon went through some pretty heavy stuff if you see how he is now.

God, I don't know, I'd just love more Tywin scenes. He's amazing. The ruler Westeros deserves

I think those torturing scenes were important, because it gives a good feeling of WHY he turns that way and calls himself reek now etc.
many people can (thank god) not imaing how the former prince suddenly becomes the Reek, I think that was a good idea

Grimebox

Grimebox wrote: »

I definitely think it was sadistic sex games. There were too many shallow wounds on him for it to happen in a fight. It would take far too many glancing swipes to get the same effect in a fight. She was beginning to choke him at the end of the sex scene before we see him again, which suggests he likes it rough. It fits perfectly with his character. Not that this little detail matters too much.

It totally does, what a fúcked up man! For me, he is the character I would least like to encounter out of all my favourite shows i.e. Breaking Bad, The Shield, Sopranos, Deadwood.

Well maybe him and the Mountain, but at least with the Mountain death would be (relatively) quick

chasmcb

One thing I find a bit implausible about the whole arrest and trial of Tyrion is how willingly Tywin seems to go along with it. He's always been very savvy and must surely know that Cercei's accusation against Tyrion is driven by blind, vengeful rage. As the Lannister patriarch he looks very unfazed about the prospect of his son being condemned in a show trial (and he did seem to be acquiring a grudging respect for Tyrion's ability and intelligence over the course of the last season or two). Does he actually think Tyrion bumped off Joffrey? Or Sansa, the woosiest, weepiest offshoot of the Stark clan? Surely not?

Penn

chasmcb wrote: »

One thing I find a bit implausible about the whole arrest and trial of Tyrion is how willingly Tywin seems to go along with it. He's always been very savvy and must surely know that Cercei's accusation against Tyrion is driven by blind, vengeful rage. As the Lannister patriarch he looks very unfazed about the prospect of his son being condemned in a show trial (and he did seem to be acquiring a grudging respect for Tyrion's ability and intelligence over the course of the last season or two). Does he actually think Tyrion bumped off Joffrey? Or Sansa, the woosiest, weepiest offshoot of the Stark clan? Surely not?

Tyrion is still an embarrassment to him, and he still holds resentment for his wife dying in childbirth. Plus, not being able to find Joffrey's killer makes them look weak. They need someone to take the fall for Joffrey's death. Add to that how Jamie was willing to quit the Kingsguard and be Lord of Casterly Rock so Tywin's bloodline would live on (which Jamie wouldn't have done otherwise), it made sense for Tywin to let Tyrion be charged with it.

Don't get me wrong, I doubt it was Tywin's idea. Cersei (being Queen Regent) accused him and called for the trial. I just think Tywin saw an opportunity to take advantage. His conversation with Jamie in this episode was very telling.

K_user

stankratz wrote: »

Hi folks, I'm a book reader. If you don't mind, I might post in the "haven't read the books thread" as I feel this is the truest place to talk about the TV show without having to engage in "why is X different from the books/what does this mean for future unreleased books?". For my part I promise not to try to slyly drop future plot points.

Well said. This thread is all about the show, not the books.

You can argue the plot lines of the books until you are blue in the face. But the TV show should be a stand alone story. It should be enjoyed for what it is, not for what it hasn't included.

K_user

snausages wrote: »

Well that's different though, you're talking about a crazy bastard offspring of a familiy who's emblem is a man being flayed breaking down a guy into a pathetic Smeagol-like creature versus a guy who's got mysterious unknown powers.

But both are about character development. The story of what happens to a person is the story.

We got to learn several things from the torture scenes. We saw Theon becoming Reek, which I'm sure is a major plot point. We were introduced to a frightening new character, Ramsay, who is crazier than Joffrey. And we got more of a feeling for Roose, the man responsible for the Red Wedding.

All great stuff.

snausages wrote: »

Anyway, I don't want to argue! Just saying that I have a different opinion.

Debate, it keeps a chat forum alive!

Degag

Lads I just can't see it being Bronn unless it's against Meryn Trant or someone like that.

Bronn is not going to willingly take on The Mountain for love nor money!

Another poster did raise a good point though: Tywin could nominate someone like Trant because as much as he hates Tyrion, he still doesn't want him dead.

TimeToShine

Degag wrote: »

Lads I just can't see it being Bronn unless it's against Meryn Trant or someone like that.

Bronn is not going to willingly take on The Mountain for love nor money!

Another poster did raise a good point though: Tywin could nominate someone like Trant because as much as he hates Tyrion, he still doesn't want him dead.

Is it Cersei or Tywin who gets to nominate who represents the crown? I realize Tywin is in charge but Cersei is the one pressing charges so I'm not too sure.

seligehgit

chasmcb wrote: »

One thing I find a bit implausible about the whole arrest and trial of Tyrion is how willingly Tywin seems to go along with it. He's always been very savvy and must surely know that Cercei's accusation against Tyrion is driven by blind, vengeful rage. As the Lannister patriarch he looks very unfazed about the prospect of his son being condemned in a show trial (and he did seem to be acquiring a grudging respect for Tyrion's ability and intelligence over the course of the last season or two). Does he actually think Tyrion bumped off Joffrey? Or Sansa, the woosiest, weepiest offshoot of the Stark clan? Surely not?

Tywin has never really forgiven Tyrion whom he holds responsible for his wife's death when Tyrion was born.

Degag

TimeToShine wrote: »

Is it Cersei or Tywin who gets to nominate who represents the crown? I realize Tywin is in charge but Cersei is the one pressing charges so I'm not too sure.

I don't know but I imagine its Tywin.

ceadaoin.

Does anyone else think that Tywin agreed to Jamie's proposal to leave the kings guard in return for Tyrions life very quickly? Almost like he anticipated him doing something like that. Even Jamie looked surprised it was so easy. Maybe that was his plan all along, he is very concerned with continuing the Lannister name.

Also, I read yesterday that Alfie Allen's audition for GoT was as Reek. I found that interesting. He had to wait a while to play that part anyway!

kryogen

chasmcb wrote: »

One thing I find a bit implausible about the whole arrest and trial of Tyrion is how willingly Tywin seems to go along with it. He's always been very savvy and must surely know that Cercei's accusation against Tyrion is driven by blind, vengeful rage. As the Lannister patriarch he looks very unfazed about the prospect of his son being condemned in a show trial (and he did seem to be acquiring a grudging respect for Tyrion's ability and intelligence over the course of the last season or two). Does he actually think Tyrion bumped off Joffrey? Or Sansa, the woosiest, weepiest offshoot of the Stark clan? Surely not?

I think its because he is in control of the situation, he won't let him die, of that I am sure. Not to say Tyrion wouldn't kill him though if he got the chance but Tywin is using him as leverage over Jaime it seems.

He can have Tyrion banished/exiled if found guilty, or locked in the dungeon or something, but I have no weight in the idea that he would condemn him to death. He is ok right now as he controls the situation

seligehgit

Grimebox wrote: »

I definitely think it was sadistic sex games. There were too many shallow wounds on him for it to happen in a fight. It would take far too many glancing swipes to get the same effect in a fight. She was beginning to choke him at the end of the sex scene before we see him again, which suggests he likes it rough. It fits perfectly with his character. Not that this little detail matters too much.

The wounds definitely seemed to be as a result of his sexual encounter with that girl,seemed to be implied.

Degag

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Does anyone else think that Tywin agreed to Jamie's proposal to leave the kings guard in return for Tyrions life very quickly? Almost like he anticipated him doing something like that. Even Jamie looked surprised it was so easy. Maybe that was his plan all along, he is very concerned with continuing the Lannister name.

Also, I read yesterday that Alfie Allen's audition for GoT was as Reek. I found that interesting. He had to wait a while to play that part anyway!

I think it was definitely part of his plan but at the same time I doubt he has much intention of having Tyrion killed.

Syferus

Degag wrote: »

I think it was definitely part of his plan but at the same time I doubt he has much intention of having Tyrion killed.

Imagine if Jaime represented Tyrion, lost and meant Tyrion was condemned to death. Tywin would be up the river without a paddle in that case.

EyeSight

I think Tywin know the Tyrells had something to do with the kings poisoning. But he didn't care about Jeoffery and he needs the Tyrell alliance.
I can see either Tyrion or Jamie dying because of this.

Also I think Ramsay snows torture scenes were needed last season. Firstly, it was a good mystery trying to figure out who he was and why he was doing this. Also if we had not seen all that, we wouldn't believe that Theon would be the way he is now - and that's what we would complain about. I don't think I would perceive Ramsay as being that evil otherwise

iamanengine

Don't think it needs to be said anymore in this thread but, Tyrion = Awesome. Took me ages to get around to watching it, so worth it in the end.

Was great to see Mycroft in there doing his bit for the Iron Bank!!


So, seems we're all assuming that Tyrion does live, so, what is he gunna do after the trial? He can hardly hang around Kings Landing, nor does he want to it would seem, although maybe he will, try an exact some revenge perchance? But doubtful.

EyeSight

iamanengine wrote: »

Don't think it needs to be said anymore in this thread but, Tyrion = Awesome. Took me ages to get around to watching it, so worth it in the end.

Was great to see Mycroft in there doing his bit for the Iron Bank!!


So, seems we're all assuming that Tyrion does live, so, what is he gunna do after the trial? He can hardly hang around Kings Landing, nor does he want to it would seem, although maybe he will, try an exact some revenge perchance? But doubtful.

He might go off in search of Sansa - God i hate trying to spell GOT names

jebidiah

seligehgit wrote: »

The wounds definitely seemed to be as a result of his sexual encounter with that girl,seemed to be implied.

I really don't think so. They don't look like cuts to me.

We saw him fight with a knife and a short weapon, an axe or mace? He fights up close, he was bare chested, no doubt he would get splashes of blood on his body from slashing and smashing his opponent.

kryogen

EyeSight wrote: »

He might go off in search of Sansa - God i hate trying to spell GOT names

He might kill everyone! Start with Cersei, then move on to his dad

Though I suspect with the constant musings and sort of foreshadowing about Tywins legacy and what will happen to the Lannisters when he is dead, and the repeated references to his age and that he wont be around much longer, there is a much bigger chance it will be him that gets it rather then the young (ish) Queen Mum