Dublin City marathon

Kurt Godel · 14-10-2014 10:45pm

KillianByrne wrote: »

A pacer question, out of interest in the process, nothing more...

I assume you find it as difficult as most people to run the exact 'racing line' (but obviously better than most) how do you aim to come in a smidgen under target if you're running 26.3/26.4/26.5miles?

Is this where working off mile markers and pace bands come into play over watches?

All of the pacers will be running at a speed thats a comparative jog for them. Speeding up/slowing down will come easy if needed, so running a racing line, while optimal, won't be that vital to them. So long as they are hitting the right times by the mile/5k markers they will be fine (never mind the first few mile markers, they are always wrong, and the cause of a hundred frantic and eager runners looking doubtfully at the pacers). Garmins will always measure short, so they are secondary to markers/time.

The bottom line is all the pacers know their small part in this marathon very well, and have performed largely perfectly over the last few years. Many of them have done it for years, and they are very good at it. Anyone looking to run with a pace group should just trust 'em to get you to 20, 21, 22...26.2 miles on time. If you feel good after 20 miles, push on, its a better finish IMO this year than last.

KillianByrne · 14-10-2014 10:50pm

Kurt Godel wrote: »

All of the pacers will be running at a speed thats a comparative jog for them. Speeding up/slowing down will come easy if needed, so running a racing line, while optimal, won't be that vital to them. So long as they are hitting the right times by the mile/5k markers they will be fine (never mind the first few mile markers, they are always wrong, and the cause of a hundred frantic and eager runners looking doubtfully at the pacers). Garmins will always measure short, so they are secondary to markers/time.

The bottom line is all the pacers know their small part in this marathon very well, and have performed largely perfectly over the last few years. Many of them have done it for years, and they are very good at it. Anyone looking to run with a pace group should just trust 'em to get you to 20, 21, 22...26.2 miles on time. If you feel good after 20 miles, push on, its a better finish IMO this year than last.

Cheers, please don't pick me up wrong, I wasn't questioning the pacers strategy. I have nothing but admiration for their efforts to help others out. I find it difficult enough to just run, so working out the maths of a pacing band in my head at the same time is pretty much ruled out!

Kurt Godel · 14-10-2014 11:02pm

KillianByrne wrote: »

Cheers, please don't pick me up wrong, I wasn't questioning the pacers strategy. I have nothing but admiration for their efforts to help others out. I find it difficult enough to just run, so working out the maths of a pacing band in my head at the same time is pretty much ruled out!

Wasn't picking you up that way Killian- anything I can do to keep you in marathons (and away from Tri) I'm more than happy to help (Joke!;))

Seriously though, there's a million ways to run a marathon, but the best way for most is to run evenly for the first 3/4, and then either push on or hang on depending on how you feel; so let the pacers worry about the math and you worry about running ahead of them after 20 miles or so:)

laura_ac3 · 14-10-2014 11:04pm

Kurt Godel wrote: »

All of the pacers will be running at a speed thats a comparative jog for them. Speeding up/slowing down will come easy if needed, so running a racing line, while optimal, won't be that vital to them. So long as they are hitting the right times by the mile/5k markers they will be fine (never mind the first few mile markers, they are always wrong, and the cause of a hundred frantic and eager runners looking doubtfully at the pacers). Garmins will always measure short, so they are secondary to markers/time.

The bottom line is all the pacers know their small part in this marathon very well, and have performed largely perfectly over the last few years. Many of them have done it for years, and they are very good at it. Anyone looking to run with a pace group should just trust 'em to get you to 20, 21, 22...26.2 miles on time. If you feel good after 20 miles, push on, its a better finish IMO this year than last.

Hi Kurt...sorry if this is a really silly question but I'm just curious - why do you say that the first few markers are usually wrong? What makes you say that about the those ones?

Thanks.

Kurt Godel · 14-10-2014 11:11pm

laura_ac3 wrote: »

Hi Kurt...sorry if this is a really silly question but I'm just curious - why do you say that the first few markers are usually wrong? What makes you say that about the those ones?

Thanks.

The markers have to be attached to fixed points, like lampposts, and street furniture doesn't tend to occur at the optimal point... its not really a big deal, its just that for the past few years everyone runs by the first mile marker, and 30 seconds later a thousand garmins start beeping in unison, and two thousand eyes start glaring at whoever joker is meant to be pacing them

For whatever reason, its been the case over the past few years that the first two or three have been out, but other later ones have been more accurate.

laura_ac3 · 14-10-2014 11:16pm

Kurt Godel wrote: »

The markers have to be attached to fixed points, like lampposts, and street furniture doesn't tend to occur at the optimal point... its not really a big deal, its just that for the past few years everyone runs by the first mile marker, and 30 seconds later a thousand garmins start beeping in unison, and two thousand eyes start glaring at whoever joker is meant to be pacing them

For whatever reason, its been the case over the past few years that the first two or three have been out, but other later ones have been more accurate.

Thanks for the reply. My guess was something to do with fixed posts for the signs but wasn't sure why it would apply only to the first few. I'll be (hopefully) ticking along with the 4.50 crew so that'll be two less eyes glaring at those jokers

davedanon · 14-10-2014 11:19pm

Kurt Godel wrote: »

The markers have to be attached to fixed points, like lampposts, and street furniture doesn't tend to occur at the optimal point... its not really a big deal, its just that for the past few years everyone runs by the first mile marker, and 30 seconds later a thousand garmins start beeping in unison, and two thousand eyes start glaring at whoever joker is meant to be pacing them

For whatever reason, its been the case over the past few years that the first two or three have been out, but other later ones have been more accurate.

Absolutely, the first mile marker at DCM is always miles out. As it were.

menoscemo · 14-10-2014 11:22pm

davedanon wrote: »

Absolutely, the first mile marker at DCM is always miles out. As it were.

Enough so for Jerry Kiernan to declare they had gone out at WR pace a few years ago when they were clearly jogging.

davedanon · 14-10-2014 11:24pm

menoscemo wrote: »

Enough so for Jerry Kiernan to declare they had gone out at WR pace a few years ago when they were clearly jogging.

Did he? The klutz.

Ghost in Cratloe · 15-10-2014 1:13am

If anyone is concerned by the stretch of hills between miles 3-7 I would cordially invite all aspiring marathoners down to Cratloe Woods this weekend for a supervised crest load session!

Jay D · 15-10-2014 7:44am

I just realised I registered for the 3rd wave.

My target time is under 4 hours. Was planning on using 4hr pacers.

Are they in the second wave?

RayCun · 15-10-2014 8:19am

I got a reminder from admin@eventmaster.ie today with my confirmation slip attached to print and bring t the expo. if you haven't seen it yet, check your spam folder

M.J.M.C · 15-10-2014 8:24am

Jay D wrote: »

I just realised I registered for the 3rd wave.

My target time is under 4 hours. Was planning on using 4hr pacers.

Are they in the second wave?

From http://dublinmarathon.ie/faq/
"The wave system successfully blends participants in mutually competitive groupings.

Under 3 hours 50 minutes (Orange Race number) starting at 9am." This is wave one.

Afaik you can ask to change waves at the expo
Wave 1's last pacers are 3hr 40min, wave 2's first pacers are 3:50min (least that was the format last year)

davedanon · 15-10-2014 9:59am

RayCun wrote: »

I got a reminder from admin@eventmaster.ie today with my confirmation slip attached to print and bring t the expo. if you haven't seen it yet, check your spam folder

Me too.

Jay D · 15-10-2014 10:03am

RayCun wrote: »

I got a reminder from admin@eventmaster.ie today with my confirmation slip attached to print and bring t the expo. if you haven't seen it yet, check your spam folder

thanks, got the same one. I still have the original I printed out at time of purchase. I also remember getting the reminder email the other day (during busy time at work) regarding deadline for changing waves and saying I'd check it out later, I forgot though.

M.J.M.C wrote: »

From http://dublinmarathon.ie/faq/
"The wave system successfully blends participants in mutually competitive groupings.

Under 3 hours 50 minutes (Orange Race number) starting at 9am." This is wave one.

Afaik you can ask to change waves at the expo
Wave 1's last pacers are 3hr 40min, wave 2's first pacers are 3:50min (least that was the format last year)

Thank you. I'd read through the FAQs alright but wasn't clear on pacers. I'm going to email them and hopefully get moved up. Failing that ask nicely at the expo, it was a genuine downer realising the possible logistics and my actual start wave when I got that email this morning. I'm just not sure I'd maintain the speed adequately to do it in sub 4 without pacers!

snailsong · 15-10-2014 10:21am

sideswipe wrote: »

I'm still debating weather to join ye. I'm hoping for sub 3:10 but am also hoping to run a negative split as I'm not sure about trying for an even pace on that course, even more so reading Tunguska review!!

I'll hopefully be running a negative split too. Will give the pacers plenty of rope early on and try to reel them in later.

Woden · 15-10-2014 11:00am

Can I ask who's pacing 3:30?

sideswipe · 15-10-2014 11:04am

Bib No.| Username | PB | Predicted Time | Actual Time
|yaboya1|2:59:11|TBC|
|Tunguska|2:38:40|2:38:39|
|Netwerk Errer|3:15:29|2:59:59|
|Paddybarry|N/A|2:55|
|Adrian522|N/A|3:48:00|
|Canine Marathoner|3.09.xx|2.59.59|
|Fraggle00|4.05.xx|3.45.00|
|xElDeeX|4:09:xx|3:47:00|
|Bahanaman|2:57:52 *|2:59:59|
|dublin runner|2:50:35|>2:43:00|
|chavezychavez|3:20:57|3:20:00|
|RayCun|2:59:06|2:55|
|AuldManKing||3:40:10|
|fletch|3:16:26|3:14:59|
|DogSlySmile|2:59:59|2:49:59|
|Endurancer123|3:25:59|3:19:59|
|Mr Freeze|3:50:11|3:35:00|
|Plodman|3:17:22|2:49:59|
|dcorcaigh|4:19:40|3:49:49|
|Pacing Mule| 5:36:53|4:19:00|
|Martyoo| |3:55:00|
|geodesic|3:44:17|3:59:59|
|Killian Byrne|4:30:26|4:29:59|
|Toblerone1978|3:05:23|2:59:59|
|snailsong|3:12:32|3:09:30|
|Tyrone_03|3:52:18|3:44:59|
|skeleton_boy|3:28:02|2:54:59|
|overthebridge|4:23:xx|4:19:59|
|davedanon|3:17:15|3:14:59|
|rockstar_91|N/A|4:19:59|
|Crisco10|n/a|3:25:00|
|Bladeserver|4:26:01|4:10:00|
|run_Forrest_run|3:24:28|2:59:59|
|JohnDozer|4:09:05|3:44:59|
|Cabaal|3:33:33|3:19:59|
|Basster|3:35:09|3:08:00|
|MacSwifty|3:26:16|3:35:00|
|bugsy2000|3:26:26|3:17:59|
|Downtime|4:00:58|3:57:00|
|Figlen|4:22:00|3:39:59|
|Sideswipe|3:15:33|3:09:59|

sideswipe · 15-10-2014 11:06am

snailsong wrote: »

I'll hopefully be running a negative split too. Will give the pacers plenty of rope early on and try to reel them in later.

Good stuff, might see you out there....... I might also need a lone of that rope when your finished with it!

TFBubendorfer · 15-10-2014 11:14am

Woden wrote: »

Can I ask who's pacing 3:30?

Robert W 3:30
Beepbeep67 3:30
Caprica 3:30

Mind, things can and do change, even at last minute

neilc · 15-10-2014 11:17am

Bib No.| Username | PB | Predicted Time | Actual Time
|yaboya1|2:59:11|TBC|
|Tunguska|2:38:40|2:38:39|
|Netwerk Errer|3:15:29|2:59:59|
|Paddybarry|N/A|2:55|
|Adrian522|N/A|3:48:00|
|Canine Marathoner|3.09.xx|2.59.59|
|Fraggle00|4.05.xx|3.45.00|
|xElDeeX|4:09:xx|3:47:00|
|Bahanaman|2:57:52 *|2:59:59|
|dublin runner|2:50:35|>2:43:00|
|chavezychavez|3:20:57|3:20:00|
|RayCun|2:59:06|2:55|
|AuldManKing||3:40:10|
|fletch|3:16:26|3:14:59|
|DogSlySmile|2:59:59|2:49:59|
|Endurancer123|3:25:59|3:19:59|
|Mr Freeze|3:50:11|3:35:00|
|Plodman|3:17:22|2:49:59|
|dcorcaigh|4:19:40|3:49:49|
|Pacing Mule| 5:36:53|4:19:00|
|Martyoo| |3:55:00|
|geodesic|3:44:17|3:59:59|
|Killian Byrne|4:30:26|4:29:59|
|Toblerone1978|3:05:23|2:59:59|
|snailsong|3:12:32|3:09:30|
|Tyrone_03|3:52:18|3:44:59|
|skeleton_boy|3:28:02|2:54:59|
|overthebridge|4:23:xx|4:19:59|
|davedanon|3:17:15|3:14:59|
|rockstar_91|N/A|4:19:59|
|Crisco10|n/a|3:25:00|
|Bladeserver|4:26:01|4:10:00|
|run_Forrest_run|3:24:28|2:59:59|
|JohnDozer|4:09:05|3:44:59|
|Cabaal|3:33:33|3:19:59|
|Basster|3:35:09|3:08:00|
|MacSwifty|3:26:16|3:35:00|
|bugsy2000|3:26:26|3:17:59|
|Downtime|4:00:58|3:57:00|
|Figlen|4:22:00|3:39:59|
|Sideswipe|3:15:33|3:09:59|
|neilc|3:10:28|<3:10:00|

training went well, here's hoping!!

TFBubendorfer · 15-10-2014 11:19am

KillianByrne wrote: »

A pacer question, out of interest in the process, nothing more...

I assume you find it as difficult as most people to run the exact 'racing line' (but obviously better than most) how do you aim to come in a smidgen under target if you're running 26.3/26.4/26.5miles?

Is this where working off mile markers and pace bands come into play over watches?

I find it impossible to run the race line when in a group, simply because you can't just cut into the tangents when you've got people running left and right of you.

My Garmin usually shows 26.4 miles at the end. I need to run about 4 seconds per mile quicker as a result (e.g. 3:10 is 7:14 pace, but I'll make sure my Garmin will display 7:09 or 7:10 average pace).

The official mile markers are the ones that count and I generally check them off my wristband as I pass them, but being short-sighted cane make that a bit more complicated.

Tyrone_03 · 15-10-2014 11:28am

I'll not lie the nerves are hitting big time now.

Running Fool · 15-10-2014 11:31am

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

I find it impossible to run the race line when in a group, simply because you can't just cut into the tangents when you've got people running left and right of you.

My Garmin usually shows 26.4 miles at the end. I need to run about 4 seconds per mile quicker as a result (e.g. 3:10 is 7:14 pace, but I'll make sure my Garmin will display 7:09 or 7:10 average pace).

The official mile markers are the ones that count and I generally check them off my wristband as I pass them, but being short-sighted cane make that a bit more complicated.

Some people say its better to set your GARMIN to 1.1 mile laps and it should even out. Does that work?

menoscemo · 15-10-2014 11:34am

Running Fool wrote: »

Some people say its better to set your GARMIN to 1.1 mile laps and it should even out. Does that work?

Maybe 1.01 mile laps. 1.1 mile laps would be a bit much (means you are expecting the course to measure 28.8 miles on your watch), though if UM1 measured the course you never know....

RayCun · 15-10-2014 11:35am

Running Fool wrote: »

Some people say its better to set your GARMIN to 1.1 mile laps and it should even out. Does that work?

if you run 29 miles in the marathon you are most definitely doing it wrong

(and running almost 10% faster than goal pace per mile would be a killer)

Running Fool · 15-10-2014 11:43am

menoscemo wrote: »

Maybe 1.01 mile laps. 1.1 mile laps would be a bit much (means you are expecting the course to measure 28.8 miles on your watch), though if UM1 measured the course you never know....

Ah sorry, thats what I meant.

Alf Veedersane · 15-10-2014 11:52am

Best of luck to all y'all doing it.

It's been a long time since my last one but I still miss the buzz when it comes around, even though I'd have been slower than most of you on the list

M.J.M.C · 15-10-2014 11:58am

Tyrone_03 wrote: »

I'll not lie the nerves are hitting big time now.

You're not alone buddy

Running Fool · 15-10-2014 12:10pm

Bib No.| Username | PB | Predicted Time | Actual Time
|yaboya1|2:59:11|TBC|
|Tunguska|2:38:40|2:38:39|
|Netwerk Errer|3:15:29|2:59:59|
|Paddybarry|N/A|2:55|
|Adrian522|N/A|3:48:00|
|Canine Marathoner|3.09.xx|2.59.59|
|Fraggle00|4.05.xx|3.45.00|
|xElDeeX|4:09:xx|3:47:00|
|Bahanaman|2:57:52 *|2:59:59|
|dublin runner|2:50:35|>2:43:00|
|chavezychavez|3:20:57|3:20:00|
|RayCun|2:59:06|2:55|
|AuldManKing||3:40:10|
|fletch|3:16:26|3:14:59|
|DogSlySmile|2:59:59|2:49:59|
|Endurancer123|3:25:59|3:19:59|
|Mr Freeze|3:50:11|3:35:00|
|Plodman|3:17:22|2:49:59|
|dcorcaigh|4:19:40|3:49:49|
|Pacing Mule| 5:36:53|4:19:00|
|Martyoo| |3:55:00|
|geodesic|3:44:17|3:59:59|
|Killian Byrne|4:30:26|4:29:59|
|Toblerone1978|3:05:23|2:59:59|
|snailsong|3:12:32|3:09:30|
|Tyrone_03|3:52:18|3:44:59|
|skeleton_boy|3:28:02|2:54:59|
|overthebridge|4:23:xx|4:19:59|
|davedanon|3:17:15|3:14:59|
|rockstar_91|N/A|4:19:59|
|Crisco10|n/a|3:25:00|
|Bladeserver|4:26:01|4:10:00|
|run_Forrest_run|3:24:28|2:59:59|
|JohnDozer|4:09:05|3:44:59|
|Cabaal|3:33:33|3:19:59|
|Basster|3:35:09|3:08:00|
|MacSwifty|3:26:16|3:35:00|
|bugsy2000|3:26:26|3:17:59|
|Downtime|4:00:58|3:57:00|
|Figlen|4:22:00|3:39:59|
|Sideswipe|3:15:33|3:09:59|
|neilc|3:10:28|<3:10:00|
|Running Fool|3:35:07|3:29:59|

Dublin City marathon

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