Arts NUIG points?

Lollipop95

Hoping to go to NUIG in September last year the cut off was 300. Do you think the points will rise or stay the same for this year? Thanks

Noccy_Mondy

Hard to tell, you won't know for sure until August. This is a rough estimate as to how many applied to each area. Now, bear in mind that this is from March, and things will have changed since then, but it's the most up to date info I have with me at the moment.

http://www2.cao.ie/app_stats/pdf/appstats01feb2014.pdf

Lollipop95

Thanks for that I don't understand the graph though terrible at maths

Mr Pseudonym

Lollipop95 wrote: »

Thanks for that I don't understand the graph though terrible at maths

What graph?

robman60

Lollipop95 wrote: »

Thanks for that I don't understand the graph though terrible at maths

According to the data, points for arts are likely to stay roughly the same, or potentially drop by a few points. There's been very little change in the number of first preferences for arts courses.

Mr Pseudonym

robman60 wrote: »

According to the data, points for arts are likely to stay roughly the same, or potentially drop by a few points. There's been very little change in the number of first preferences for arts courses.

Last year, the points for Arts in NUIG remained static yet there was a 4.5% reduction in first-preferences for Arts/Social Science courses nationally. So, static application numbers won't necessarily correspond with static points.

robman60

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

Last year, the points for Arts in NUIG remained static yet there was a 4.5% reduction in first-preferences for Arts/Social Science courses nationally. So, static application numbers won't necessarily correspond with static points.

Of course it doesn't necessarily correspond. All these data can do is give us an indication of what will happen come August.

Mr Pseudonym

robman60 wrote: »

Of course it doesn't necessarily correspond. All these data can do is give us an indication of what will happen come August.

I was merely responding to your suggestion that "according to the data, points for arts are likely to stay roughly the same, or potentially drop by a few points" - which I disagree with.

ejayy

Anyone know if the points for psychology will go up or down for ucd/nuig/dcu?? I don't get what it says on cao so please don't link me to it :P

Mr Pseudonym

ejayy wrote: »

Anyone know if the points for psychology will go up or down for ucd/nuig/dcu?? I don't get what it says on cao so please don't link me to it :P

Applicant Stats | CAO

randylonghorn

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

I was merely responding to your suggestion that "according to the data, points for arts are likely to stay roughly the same, or potentially drop by a few points" - which I disagree with.

Actually, it does suggest that if you were to average the points nationally, there wouldn't be much difference between last year and this.

There can always be variations at individual college level, though, which is kinda your point.

We're all guessing at this point, and will be until late August, but for what it's worth I wouldn't expect a major change for Arts in Galway, OP, or indeed Arts in any of the major colleges, though you can never rule out one college rising slightly, another dropping slightly depending on the year.

Something like psychology with much smaller numbers is always more liable to fluctuation.

Mr Pseudonym

randylonghorn wrote: »

Actually, it does suggest that if you were to average the points nationally, there wouldn't be much difference between last year and this.

It does not stand that because there is no change in choices nationally there will not potentially be significant fluctuations for specific courses.

randylonghorn

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

It does not stand that because there is no change in choices nationally there will not potentially be significant fluctuations for specific courses.

Did you even read the rest of the post, or even the second line?

randylonghorn wrote: »

There can always be variations at individual college level, though, which is kinda your point.

But no, I don't think you will see "significant" fluctuations in omnibus Arts course points in the major colleges this year. I would be surprised if any of UCD, UCC, NUIG or NUIM vary by more than 10 points from last year (if even that) and that wouldn't be considered a significant change, especially after the last few years, when the economic recession saw an unusually noticeable downward trend in the points for Arts courses over a period of 5-6 years. This seems to be leveling off to some extent at this stage.

You tend to see much more significant fluctuations in courses with smaller intakes of course.

Mr Pseudonym

randylonghorn wrote: »

Did you even read the rest of the post, or even the second line?

Yes, I did! But, I disagreed when you said, "Actually, it does suggest..."

randylonghorn

Well, funnily enough, that's the bit which is pretty incontrovertible. With both no significant difference in the level of mentions or first preferences (change in both under 0.5% ... at this stage at least, Change of Mind is still to come) and in the total number of places available in Arts in the four main NUI colleges, it's pretty much a mathematical certainty that if we were to average the points out nationally between the four for the two years, the difference would be negligible. (We don't tend to include Trinity as its 2-subject moderatorship system is much less amenable to prediction, and essentially acts as a plethora of small courses for CAO points, rather than one "Arts" offering, thus there can be much more significant fluctuation from year to year.)

I *then* went to point out that the fact that averaging nationally gave us a very similar result to last year didn't necessarily mean that there couldn't be variations in individual colleges ... which was pretty much your point! ... but that for a variety of reasons I didn't expect there to be any *major* swings this year (5 / 10 points is not a major swing).

In any case, I have no doubt that we will see who is right in August.

Mr Pseudonym

randylonghorn wrote: »

Well, funnily enough, that's the bit which is pretty incontrovertible. With both no significant difference in the level of mentions or first preferences (change in both under 0.5% ... at this stage at least, Change of Mind is still to come) and in the total number of places available in Arts in the four main NUI colleges, it's pretty much a mathematical certainty that if we were to average the points out nationally between the four for the two years, the difference would be negligible. (We don't tend to include Trinity as its 2-subject moderatorship system is much less amenable to prediction, and essentially acts as a plethora of small courses for CAO points, rather than one "Arts" offering, thus there can be much more significant fluctuation from year to year.)

I *then* went to point out that the fact that averaging nationally gave us a very similar result to last year didn't necessarily mean that there couldn't be variations in individual colleges ... which was pretty much your point! ... but that for a variety of reasons I didn't expect there to be any *major* swings this year (5 / 10 points is not a major swing).

In any case, I have no doubt that we will see who is right in August.

Will you please clarify what you mean by averaging out the points nationally?

Edit: there's actually quite a lot of your post I don't understand: I'm with you all the way to the first set of parentheses, after that I lose you. You seem to suggest that there is "no significant difference" in the number of places between the Arts courses of the NUI universities; I don't think that's correct. You then talk about averaging the points out nationally which I don't understand. Finally, what "similar figure" are you referring to?

randylonghorn

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

Edit: there's actually quite a lot of your post I don't understand.

That would explain a lot tbh. It's always a good idea to understand the point you are disagreeing with before attacking it.

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

You seem to suggest that there is "no significant difference" in the number of places between the Arts courses of the NUI universities; I don't think that's correct.

No, I said that there was no significant difference in the total number of places available in Arts in the four main NUI colleges. Note the word "total". Add up the number of places in UCD and NUIM and UCC and NUIG and you get the total number of places available in Arts in the four main NUI colleges. That total hasn't changed significantly between last year and this year.

That is not the same as saying that each of the colleges has an identical number of places available in Arts.

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

Will you please clarify what you mean by averaging out the points nationally?

[(Number of places in Arts in UCD x points for UCD) + (Number of places in Arts in UCC x points for UCC) + (Number of places in Arts in NUIM x points for NUIM) + (Number of places in Arts in NUIG x points for NUIG)] divided by (total number of places overall in Arts in the 4 colleges)
will give you average points for the 4 main NUI colleges nationally.

Lollipop95

So the points for Arts could go below 300? :eek: I remember in 2012 it was 340 so are people no longer as keen do Arts as they once were?

rainbowtrout

Lollipop95 wrote: »

So the points for Arts could go below 300? :eek: I remember in 2012 it was 340 so are people no longer as keen do Arts as they once were?

Yes, in theory it could. As randy said, the courses that have a large intake of students each year like Arts tend not to have major fluctuations in points from year to year, they rarely go up or down by more than 10 points. So the ripple effect of the rising/falling popularity of the course is absorbed more readily by a course that has a couple of hundred places rather than a course that feels the same effect but only has 20 places.

I would imagine that the drop in points for Arts in the last couple of years may be as a result of students aiming for courses with a defined job at the end of it given the state of our economy - science, technology, engineering.

I teach Agriculture and I always have a couple of students aiming for Ag Science in UCD. The points for that have boomed from a low of 310 in 2004/05 to 455 in 2013. I would expect a rise again this year. People are returning to the land, agriculture is a growth area and people have farms. Many deserted farming for construction jobs in the boom years, now they are flocking back. The smaller number of places on the course in comparison to Arts shows the rise in popularity much more evidently.

Mr Pseudonym

[(Number of places in Arts in UCD x points for UCD) + (Number of places in Arts in UCC x points for UCC) + (Number of places in Arts in NUIM x points for NUIM) + (Number of places in Arts in NUIG x points for NUIG)] divided by (total number of places overall in Arts in the 4 colleges) will give you average points for the 4 main NUI colleges nationally.

That statistical analysis is worthless.

randylonghorn

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

That statistical analysis is worthless.

Thank you, God, for your judgement!!

It didn't start off as some mathematical exercise in statistical analysis, it started off as a simple comment which you chose to dissect and argue with (while later admitting that you hadn't even understood what was meant), just as you always seem to argue with everyone for the sake of it, whether you have any great experience or understanding to bring to the topic or not.

Please try to understand that the style of debating which may suit the L&H or Hist or whichever college you're in, and which is all about "proving" you're right regardless, and ignoring everything which doesn't suit your case, and "winning" the argument doesn't translate very well to real life ... or even to Boards.