Capture the Dream

jfh

July Update
the engine never felt better, however the chassis is not.
it's been a frustrating few weeks, i was keeping away from this log, hoping that my injury would miraculously go away. it hasn't, infact it's worse.

it's been a constant minding process, do a hard session, cant walk the next day, ease back after another few recovery days and do another session.
then i went off a did a stupid thing, started a marathon paced session one sunday morning, i was interupted after 5 miles in, had to return to the farm for emergency, so headstrong, i decided to start the same session again a few hours later & ran 14 miles at MP, which nearly finished me. i aggreviated the injury fairly badly after that, the patching up the physio was doing made no difference so after much deliberation, i done what i should have done last year & went for an MRI in the sports clinic in santry.

it seems i'm carrying an old injury, a tear on the hamstring attachment, High Hamstring Tendinopathy to be exact, this has caused my hip flexor and psaos to get very sore. the hip flexor in particular is inflamed so taking difane helps but nothing but rest will sort out the hamstring.
So according to the good DR, i can do the marathon, well he knows what runners are like but i have to do it on minimum mileage, very little speed work & limit the hills.
After that i will have to stop completely for a couple of months.
i was releaved that it wasn't serious but i'm sorry that i'm going all the way to Berlin & i wont be able to give it my best shot.

cianc

That's rough jfh. Does the physio think you'll recover faster if you skip the marathon? Not that I'm advocating doing that, it's purely a personal
choice based on your priorities, just a bit curious since most of my experience with physios has been less forgiving.

jfh

cianc wrote: »

That's rough jfh. Does the physio think you'll recover faster if you skip the marathon? Not that I'm advocating doing that, it's purely a personal
choice based on your priorities, just a bit curious since most of my experience with physio's has been less forgiving.

i had got conflicting advise from several phyios, hence santry, to be fair it would have been difficult to diagnose without an MRI.
the guy i saw is the top hip specialist in the country, i'd say a lot of runners here have gone through his doors, he advised if i was determined to do it, to do it on as easy a schedule as i can. long term i would probably be better off stopping now, but honestly i've never felt fitter, bar the crocked hip:mad:
the thing is i have know about this injury since dublin marathon and didn't take any time off, when i should have.

how the hip Cianc, you were sailing fairly close to the wind with some of those sessions,

cianc

jfh wrote: »

i had got conflicting advise from several phyios, hence santry, to be fair it would have been difficult to diagnose without an MRI.
the guy i saw is the top hip specialist in the country, i'd say a lot of runners here have gone through his doors, he advised if i was determined to do it, to do it on as easy a schedule as i can. long term i would probably be better off stopping now, but honestly i've never felt fitter, bar the crocked hip:mad:

Yeah, I can definitely empathize. The fact that it's Berlin and you've already planned the thing tips the scales even further I imagine.

the thing is i have know about this injury since dublin marathon and didn't take any time off, when i should have.

Ah but it's hard. I used to beat myself up every time I got injured. Swearing I'd be more careful next time etc etc. But the truth is it's a much harder balancing act than that. If you don't have a strong drive to get the training done and improve, then the training will suffer every time there's a little niggle that could have been run through, or life is busy, or it's raining And that same stubbornness that makes you train when you shouldn't, is the same that gets you to kick at the end of a race, or do that final rep when you're knackered, or go out when it's lashing.
Some day we'll all be older and wiser.

how the hip Cianc, you were sailing fairly close to the wind with some of those sessions,

OK, getting better, but still niggly. The physio has given me the green light for easy running until things feel better, or the DL 10K on Monday, whichever comes first. "Sailing to close to the wind" is a good way to put it. You pays your money, you takes your chances

jfh

after the diagnosis from dr falvey, he did suggest i could carry on running so i carried on, however i took his "easy" running very liberally, that's not to say i didn't heed him, i went easy for a couple of days, i was the perfect patient, did all the strengthening exercises, iced it, etc.

the pain was reduced to a minor niggle that i would run with so i went back to the JD plan and picked up where i should be. i knew this was stupid but i remarking my extraordinary healing power and with just over 50 days to go, it was time to see if i was up for it or not.

did the following T session
2E + 3T + 3 min rest + 2T + 2min rest +5* 3 min hard + 6 * 200
in total 13.6 quality miles .
i felt alright afterwards, of course it was sore but i could walk, which is my guideline.
after a couple of E days & not much improvement just a constant pull feeling on glutes.
then i decided to throw caution to the wind again, i went out and the next monster on the plan,
4 miles E + 15 MP to add to this i was tired before i started, fairly long physical day on farm on saturday but it had loosened out the hip so it was a good time to go for it.
the first few miles were difficult, fought to keep pace under 6:29, i was going on avg pace over the 15 miles so i knew i had time to pull this back, got a second wind & got used to the effort and brought it back to 6:22 which i was absolutely delighted with.
a few weeks earlier i had done 14 miles @ 6:16, considering the amount of day off, i was very happy,the only negative was the pain was back.

i had to take next 2 days off & only for still having an eye on the streets of galway on saturday, decided i had to get the next monster out of the way on wednesday so i would be recovered fully.

i was away in dublin thursday & friday so window of opportunity to get out for a long run was minimal.
2E+8MP+1E+6MP+2E
i was sore going into this and it was progressively worse, i should have dropped out after the first 8 but no i had to do the intended session or no session at all.
this dogged determination is what drives me to improve but ultimately it was too much. i'm barely able to walk 3 days later so i think i'm finally coming around to the idea that the good DR was right, i either jog around berlin or don't do it at all, racing it is out of the question.
the thought of putting so much time, money, effort into this, so i can jog around, doesn't sit well. actually tried to cancel my hotel this morning but my email address used is my old work address so i may have to ring them up.

of course i went into this all guns blazing, never checked when registering if i could postpone/cancel the marathon entry if injured, it doesn't look like it & i added a marathon jacket as a memento to my ticket when i entered so not sure what happens to this if i don't show.
lesson learned.

cianc

i'm barely able to walk 3 days later

There's no arguing with this. No amount of juggling easy days to get the big sessions in is going to work. It sucks I know, but as a wise man pointed out to me recently, once you make the decision to call a time out and commit to it, a lot of the stress drops away.
I can honestly say the two weeks leading up to my recent halt were way more stressful than the day after I stopped. It's a huge relief not be constantly monitoring the body and trying to convince yourself that things are grand.
I see where you're coming from on not wanting to jog Berlin, but what about just heading over for the weekend anyway? It probably doesn't sound very appealing now either, but maybe give it a few days before deciding? There are more than a few heads around here who have done tourist marathons, maybe ask them if it was worth it?

jfh

so took that advise & decided to call a halt to training, such a relief. 10 days off so far, this is the longest i've taken off since i started running.
it felt great to go on holidays & not feel guilty about missing a run.
i tried to cancel hotel & was hoping to cancel/postpone entry but not looking good.
there i was content with my running sabbatical, until i went back to the physio,
he urged me to try an easy few miles this weekend.

i've been doing nothing, i'd abandoned the stretching/strength work he advised, was just taking time out so this took me by surprise, going to try spinning to regain some fitness. 40 days left so will try to get out for a light session end of the week. i will have to stop running at some stage but he thinks i could get the marathon done first.

jfh

7th to 17th Aug
off no running. did one Spinning class & one Yoga Class

18th August
1 hour Easy on trail

19th August
didn't feel too bad after yesterdays session, decided to go for it again..
25 min WU + 4*2 @ T pace + 1 T + 20 WD
this was a tough session, months earlier, i was doing 5:50 Tempos on grass but today i was struggling at 6 Mile pace. i didn't think i would get through this session after the first one but managed to keep all except the last around the 6 min mile.
20th August
6 miles recovery

21st August
staying in Dublin 1 for the night, it was either a chance to get a long run in or catch up with old acquaintances. was feeling a bit tired to go drinking,
so back to the place of my running birth, ran from connolly out to north bull. Great to get out to clontarf again but i did a lot of running on hard ground which left me fairly sore again.
2 E + 3 * 2T + 8 * 200m + 1 T + .5 E
i managed the first 2 at 6 mile pace, however the last slipped to 6:10, i was getting very sore after the 200m so reduced the last 2 T to one 1T& reduced the warm down from 2 miles to half mile.

22nd August
too much sitting down so sore all day. suffering from cold that's in my chest, explains why i sufered last night at Tempos.

23rd August
40 min recovery 8:30 pace

24th August
havn't done a long run in weeks so decided to go back to the trails that served me so well. dunno what was up with me, could not get going, after 7miles hamstring got at me so had to jog very slowly, still managed 2hr or 14 miles. very dissappointed with pace, just could not push myself.

25th August
off

dukeraoul

jfh wrote: »

7th to 17th Aug
off no running. did one Spinning class & one Yoga Class

18th August
1 hour Easy on trail

19th August
didn't feel too bad after yesterdays session, decided to go for it again..
25 min WU + 4*2 @ T pace + 1 T + 20 WD
this was a tough session, months earlier, i was doing 5:50 Tempos on grass but today i was struggling at 6 Mile pace. i didn't think i would get through this session after the first one but managed to keep all except the last around the 6 min mile.
20th August
6 miles recovery

21st August
staying in Dublin 1 for the night, it was either a chance to get a long run in or catch up with old acquaintances. was feeling a bit tired to go drinking,
so back to the place of my running birth, ran from connolly out to north bull. Great to get out to clontarf again but i did a lot of running on hard ground which left me fairly sore again.
2 E + 3 * 2T + 8 * 200m + 1 T + .5 E
i managed the first 2 at 6 mile pace, however the last slipped to 6:10, i was getting very sore after the 200m so reduced the last 2 T to one 1T& reduced the warm down from 2 miles to half mile.

22nd August
too much sitting down so sore all day. suffering from cold that's in my chest, explains why i sufered last night at Tempos.

23rd August
40 min recovery 8:30 pace

24th August
havn't done a long run in weeks so decided to go back to the trails that served me so well. dunno what was up with me, could not get going, after 7miles hamstring got at me so had to jog very slowly, still managed 2hr or 14 miles. very dissappointed with pace, just could not push myself.

25th August
off

Good to see you back training. You seemed to be in fantastic shape before the injury. Bummer how those kinda things can put a spanner in the works.

I just wanted to throw one thing out there which of course you can totally discount. Do you really think Daniels is a good plan to be doing w/ an injury that needs TLC? Those sessions are completely over the top IMO - in fact if you look at the amount of boardsies who attempted Daniels and who are now injured you'd be pretty shocked.

Daniels is a make or break plan and IMO he breaks more than 50 % of people who try his plans but obviously a decent number (see Krusty etc) get fantastic results off him.

If it were me I'd be concentrating on lots of easy milage and running max 1 session a week and 1 LSR. Of course it isn't me so make your own call but I'd think long and hard about the role some of those over the top sessions Daniels prescribes played in your current injury situation! Good luck whatever you choose to do

-dq

jfh

dukeraoul wrote: »

Good to see you back training. You seemed to be in fantastic shape before the injury. Bummer how those kinda things can put a spanner in the works.

I just wanted to throw one thing out there which of course you can totally discount. Do you really think Daniels is a good plan to be doing w/ an injury that needs TLC? Those sessions are completely over the top IMO - in fact if you look at the amount of boardsies who attempted Daniels and who are now injured you'd be pretty shocked.

Daniels is a make or break plan and IMO he breaks more than 50 % of people who try his plans but obviously a decent number (see Krusty etc) get fantastic results off him.

If it were me I'd be concentrating on lots of easy milage and running max 1 session a week and 1 LSR. Of course it isn't me so make your own call but I'd think long and hard about the role some of those over the top sessions Daniels prescribes played in your current injury situation! Good luck whatever you choose to do

-dq

i think you are spot on DQ, i was looking forlornly at the rest of the plan this morning & thinking, how could i get this through this.
i was thinking of swapping the T sessions for MP sessions.
the main thing is just to turn up, relatively fresh and do this marathon.
i've got another 4 weeks, should i look at P&D or any sessions you woudl suggest?
appreciate the feedback, you have made huge improvement

dublin runner

Completely agree with DQ. If you are coming off an injury the last thing you should be doing is some of those sessions in my opinion. The main thing for you now is to get strong again, not to force it and to build sensibly again. It's better to be on an upward trajectory, even if slightly under-trained, come marathon day than to possibly force it and risk injury.

jfh

on advice, i decided to banish the JD book, to a dark press where it wont be tempting me, the plan this week was to try to run easy & regularly & fit in a long run. i've been running on my own all summer so wanted to get a bit of company this week.

26th Tues Aug
meet up with a friend of mine who is targeting sub 3 for dublin, i was in between that i should do so i tagged along with him, 2 miles WU - 8 * 800m @ 3:45 pace with 2 min recovery, 1 mile WD on grass.

27th Wed Aug
did this solo & really had to force myself out the door, did 1 hr Easy, 7:24 pace, 8.14 miles.

28th Thurs Aug
meet up with 2 lads for a few miles, nothing eventful, but great to have the run done.
6.5 miles 7:15 pace

29th Fri Aug
first early morning run in a while, funny how the body gets out of practice, was wrecked all day after this.
4 miles with 8 strides.

went back to physio who advised i was allowed to do long run EASY.
cut out all hill work & speed work, which isn't a big hinderance. i did feel it after the strides.

looking back over my training log, the last long run i did was 18 miles on the 6th August, so long over due.

30th Sat
i still have a cold with has spread to one lung so like a car working of 3 cylinders, i knew that i wouldn't be able for speed but long & slow should be ok.

i did 50 min Easy, (7:45 pace) then 16 miles as close to MP as i could, it turned out that this was not happening so abandoned that, thank god i had the foresight to remove the pace alarm from the watch so that it wasn't beeping when i went out of range.

i knew i was in trouble when i got into the warm up, far too hot & sweating heavily, i was hell bent on keeping the 16 miles below 7 min miles & i fought hard to do so, finishing exactly on 7 min/mile with a half mile cool down t bring it to 23 miles. that's the long run out of the way.

the positives , the hamstring & hip flexor were tender while running but it was only when i stopped that i really felt the effects.it was my chest that was the problem & that wont be an issue in months time, please God.

jfh

August Update
bit of catching up here, left this go as i wasn't too motivated when not running.
week 1
2 days running, 25 miles
week 2
zero running, one spinning class
week 3
6 days & back up to 61 miles
2 quality Tempo runs all rest easy
week 4
5 days all easy, one long run 50 miles

August was a case of learning to listen to the body. body got fatigued from the hugely draining Quality session. it makes what Krusty has done ever more impressive.

jfh

after almost a in the planning, september has finally come around.
i was hoping to be fighting fit but to use that soundbite that make me want to go out for a long tempo run, "We are where we are".

i've eased off on the JD sessions, but i've caught a cough/slight chest infection that just isn't shifting.
The last thing i want to do is go on antibotics as they drain me too much, so hoping the body will fight it out eventually but it's getting too close for comfort.

Mon 1st Sept
9.18 miles @ 7:19 pace

Tues 2nd Sept
6.54 miles @ 7:51 pace

Wed 3rd Sept
6 miles @ 8:03 pace

Thurs 4th
21 miles (10 miles @ 6:30 + 6 miles @6:40)

Fri 5th
off

Sat 6th
4.40 miles @ 9:06 pace

Sun 7th
13 miles @ 8:02 pace

yaboya1

What's the plan for Berlin now jfh?
Any time in mind, or will you just take it easy?

jfh

honestly have no idea, my physio advised me to jog around, stopped going to him:o
i'm seeing a physical therapist now who's a runner himself, sounds a bit unfaithful.
he advised no hills/speed work/no races so nothing to guide me on pace.
i did 2 long runs to try to see what would feel doable, one was 7 min, the other around 6:30 6:40 sorry to drag out an answer but i'm trying to figure it out myself.
i'm hoping to go Sub 3, which would be 6:50 pace but not sure if leg would hold for 26.2 miles of that.

you're going well yourself, some sensible training.

yaboya1

Sounds a bit like me going into Chicago last year.
Kind if had to play that a little bit by ear, but didn't know what pace was sustainable until the day.
Best of luck anyway.
See you in 3 weeks.

jfh

yeah, you going to the breakfast run?
i'll check out your log on chicago for motivational reading!

yaboya1

jfh wrote: »

yeah, you going to the breakfast run?
i'll check out your log on chicago for motivational reading!

Yeah, I'm going to do the breakfast run. I'll wear my infamous tricolour running shirt so any fellow boardsies can easily spot me.
I only started the log after Chicago. Report is here though. I ran 3:34 there, a fair way below what you're capable of since you won Portumna on a training run!

jfh

yaboya1 wrote: »

Yeah, I'm going to do the breakfast run. I'll wear my infamous tricolour running shirt so any fellow boardsies can easily spot me.
I only started the log after Chicago. Report is here though. I ran 3:34 there, a fair way below what you're capable of since you won Portumna on a training run!

you still got a PB though. good report,
you miss much training with calf?
i've also got one of those irishfit tricolour singlets in my wardrobe that i've been threatening to wear one of these days..

yaboya1

I did nothing whatsoever for 7 weeks. Was on crutches for two of those as I couldn't walk. All self inflicted :rolleyes:
You should wear it at the breakfast run too. There's no way we'll miss each other then :pac::pac:

jfh

building on last week which was my best week in over 6 weeks, i wanted to try to
be careful, yet get some miles under the belt..

Monday 8th
AM 3.69 miles @ 8 min/mile
PM 5.78 miles @ 7:28 min/mile

Tuesday 9th
i felt really good, pain wise last few days, i'm able to walk after a run.
today was going to be the day that i would test whether a sub 3 was on the cards. i did an hour warm up, then 4 * 3 Miles @ 6:30 pace
all in all ,it was tough i have lost fitness over the last 2 months but i was very happy to complete 20.69 miles

Wed 10th
off, leg sore but that was to be expected, i did a light aqua jogging session which i am finding really beneficial.
i went to a heartbreaking funeral & did the typical irish thing of going to the pub afterwards, i didn't give berlin a second thought much more relaxed about it now, that i've given up on the A goal.

Thur 11th
iwas very hungover & dehydrated all day, but after a few hours physical work on the farm, i was starting to come around to my normal self, a friend of mine came back from holidays so was looking for an easy run, i wanted to clear the head, more of a case of running for the head than the body.

we were running easy but all of a sudden, i got this pain down the outside of my leg to the knee. never experienced this before, not painful but couldn't run so had to stop up.

Fri 12th
leg still sore but after a day putting down concrete the body was less warmed up and felt fine by evening, no running though.

jfh

Sat 13th
a new low, i've done no race's during this marathon schedule, a short 5k doesn't count so i wanted to do a tune up race to see where i was at.
signed up for 6k , leg felt fine, as i was doing the warm, got the familiar twinge in the IT band, this is a relatively new one for me, so not sure if i would just "run it off" got my race number & started into a few strides, it dawned on me then, that this was getting worse.
i decided i'd walk the 6k, i've never jogged a race before, started down the back with the mothers with prams but after a mile i got pissed off & went home.
figured it would take me at least an hour to walk it, didn't realise i hate walking so much.
Sun 14th
up to hurling pitch to "test" leg, fine for first 2 miles, felt good, then at much the same time as before, it flares up again. trudged home dejectedly.

dublin runner

jfh wrote: »

Sat 13th
a new low....

I think you are being a bit hard on yourself. If you felt a twinge the correct thing was to not race, no doubt about it. You have have done a lot of damage to yourself.

I hear you on the walking though. I'd rather sit in 10 minutes of traffic than walk the short walk down to the local shop!

jfh

the missus often asks me to go for a walk, it's the typical arm swinging, Tempo walk, it's alright at the start but i lose concentration after 5 min & i'm in between jogging/walking to keep up to her.

ecoli

Sorry to hear about yesterday but you made the right call, build up races aren't the target so don't jeopardise the main goal for the sake of them you will still gain confidence from good solid training, listen to the body and look after yourself

jfh

Mon 15th
if there's one thing i have learned from my injurys, it the benefit of aqua jogging.
this is something i would not have tried if i was injury free & perhaps for my next marathon schedule(which could be a long way of as i have no interest in doing another any time soon) i will incorporate aqua jogging into training.

anyway i always feel better after it, did 10 min WU , then 10 * 1 Min intense jogging, tougher than any track!

no running.
Tue 16th
went back to my original physio, who diagnosed the latest as not a IT band issue, some latin sounding name(aren't they all). shockwave & dry needling.

no running

wed 17th
a tough physical day on the farm, with a 30 min spin session in between.
no running.
the rest of the family are down with a stomach bug, what next a plagues of locusts!
fortunately i feel grand, actually never felt better from lack of running & physical week working

jfh

18th Thursday
5 miles really easy, 7:46 pace.
leg felt ok, was thinking of still running in a weeks time but..

19th Friday
very busy tough day on farm, putting down concrete, i used to think when i was working in an office, that working on the farm would be far better for my running, however there's no way that one could keep a high mileage plan in place when working hard.
no running although good for strength

20th Sat
i'm a bit slow when it comes to accepting injuries, only 5 miles so far this week, meet up with a friend of mine for 8.5 miles, several of these were around 6:50 - 7:00 min mile, which is his easy run but MP for me if sub 3 is on.
finished this but leg seized up afterwards. bloody IT band again which is a new one on me, rang physio to take me as i felt it was an emergency, thankfully she did but i was in pain all evening.

21st Sun
super day for a run, first morning i slept in after 8:30, so there is some benefit to not running:P
went back to lahinch for beautiful day at the beach.

just over 13 miles for the week, it's not the lack of miliage that's worrying but the complete break down of the right leg, one muscle at a time.
looking forward to the break afterwards.
still not sure whether i'll be able jog it or just leave it..

jfh

22nd Sept Monday
doing all i can to sort out this IT band, still no running.
went 30min of spinning
also 2 sessions of cryotherapy in ennis, felt really good afterwards. not just the leg but the rest of the body too.

23rd Sept Tues
went aquajogging

24th sept Wed
mecca for the country folk, a day at the ploughing, a lot of walking, hip sore after the driving, it's worse than running:eek:
will have it sort it out once and for all after the marathon, i cant be like this in my day to day life.

25th Sept Thurs
again nothing of note, eased up on the farming so rest up.

26th Sept fri
was hoping to get to physio early in the week but she was either busy or i was.
legs felt better than for a long while, the rest did them good.
i've no running done this week, was hoping to get a recovery paced run in today but it was either school mass or a run, decided mass might be more beneficial at this stage.

The last 9 months have been a rollercoaster ride, left my job, started farming, a lot of change in my life & running has been the one constant go to.
lacing up the runners & heading out the door was very therapeutic.
no matter how uncertain the future seemed, it was great to have a big goal to aim for & the plan to complete that goal. i really pushed the body hard with those JD sessions, too hard as it turns out & i think i will get a coach in future.

i was going really well in june, in the space of one weekend, i came 2nd in 4 mile, won a light marathon & third in a mountain race a few days later. for those of us that don't run to place in a race, it's a welcome surprise.
in hindsight these were all distractions to the main goal but i'd probably do the same again.. that's why i need someone to tell me when to say no.

i've been on/off injured since july, i know i have to stop after sunday for a couple of months, my close friends & family are dreading it as they know how grumpy i get if i dont get a run in every few days, god knows what i'll take up.

i've put no pressure on myself, a month ago i'd given up all hope of doing it, cancelled hotel, cancelled segway tour, didn't get a pair of runners so i'll be wearing my trusty sayonaras that have got me though, charleville half, rocknroll, dcm 2013 & a few other races, this is definitely their last hurrah.

i remember i got a bad dose of taper madness for DCM last year, pace bands, gels, rub downs, the week of the marathon, this year, very relaxed.

i still don't know whether i'll be able to complete it or not, or if i should use a jog walk strategy or just go with the sub 3 hr pace & see how far i get.
the breakfast run tomorrow will be my first run of the week & i really hope to feel no IT band twinges, i can deal with the hip flexor & HHT injury but the IT band which sneakily creeps up is the one i cant.

i've learned a lot from the experience of the marathon schedule, far more than last year when everything went perfect.

looking forward to catching up with a few of ye.

jfh

Was hoping to do breakfast run but friends I'm staying with work in a bar until late so also sleep in late, got locked into apartment, just as well this wasn't the morning of the race.

So no test run this week but won't make a bit of difference now.
My bib number is 12801
I'm starting in pen b so not sure if I'm going to catch anyone here, going to try to get to Oscar Wilde this eve for hurling.