BQ or Bust!

Murph_D

Killerz wrote: »

Well done Denis, hope you enjoyed the experience. So with a bq and a b out of the way, what are you going to rename the log as?

LQ or Lust? :pac:

Killerz

Murph_D wrote: »

LQ or Lust? :pac:

Why not change the 'or' to an 'and'?

Murph_D

This is long. Shorter version here (may contain spoilers). :rolleyes:

Mon 18 Apr

Boston Marathon 2016

If getting the BQ in Berlin, and bettering it in Cork, were two high points of this log, the big day itself proved a total bust, so the log title proved prophetic in the wrong kind of way. It’s disappointing of course, not just for me, but for most of our little travelling group, none of us hitting our targets on an unexpectedly hot day on what, for me at least, was a beautiful but brutally difficult course.

Pre-Race

My day had begun at about 4am with some instant oatmeal, coffee, muffin, and fruit. It was an earlier start than necessary, but I’d been awake since 2. Had another breakfast of porridge with Anna around 7am, and there was still plenty of time then for the pre-race routine, which begins about three hours before the off with a bag drop at the finish area followed by an unnervingly long bus ride out to the start area at Hopkinton. Anna saw me off on Boston Common with a hug and good wishes. I felt like a kid being dropped off to the school bus and we were both quite emotional at this point. My bus trip was quiet - there was an expectant buzz among the passengers but I didn’t feel like joining in and tried, unsuccessfully, to doze. Was feeling quite nervous, certainly more than usual, although not debilitatingly so. Just anxious to get moving after the lengthy preamble. I was certainly in awe at the entire setup and the logistics of getting 30,000 people out to Hopkinton and holding them there before the race in the high school grounds, where there was plenty of water, coffee, bagels and, most importantly, rows upon rows of portaloos, in high demand among the jittery marathoners.

Bumped into DrQ as he headed to the start line and we wished each other well, after some remarks about the temperature, which seemed to be climbing by the minute. I was in Wave Three, starting 50 minutes after most of the others who were off at 10am in Wave One. Sat outside on a sunny bank for a while but then headed into one of the tents for the shade. A nice Asian woman offered me a spare piece of plastic sheeting to lie on and I dozed for a while. Joined one of the portaloo queues then, timing it just right to get a final bathroom stop out of the way just before the wave was called to the start. Chatted to another runner who remarked on the heat but assured me it was due to get cooler the closer we got to Boston. I glanced up at the clear blue sky and thought, “Wishful thinking, lady, wishful thinking".

The Race

Felt great on the half mile walk down to the starting corrals. The atmosphere was crackling with anticipation and I temporarily forgot about the heat, sauntering down with a big grin on my face. I’d been careful to apply plenty of sunblock before leaving the hotel but that seemed like hours ago. A runner in front picked up a discarded bottle of Factor 50 and passed it around, so I was able to top up. Spotted a few sheepish looking Wave Four bibs heading back up the road, having unsuccessfully tried to jump the earlier starts. Delighted with my wave position in Corral One, right up front. The first thing I noticed was that I was surrounded by women in their 20s and 30s, lean and fit looking in that wholesome American way. The gynergy was strong and I wondered where all the other aul lads were, I’d say we made up less than 10 percent of this particular corral. Didn’t have much time to contemplate this because after a few verses of a patriotic song, the local retired fire chief fired the starting pistol and we were off.

The First Half

Ok, showtime. Target :20:00, 7:38/m, 4:44/km hopefully in nice even splits of 23:40. It’s a steeply downhill start where all the advice is to be disciplined, hold your horses, ease into it even more than you would anywhere else.The first few kms were clearly marked on the road and I was hitting each of them bang on time, give or take a few. It felt easy, as it should. Was a few seconds ahead at the first 5k mat (23:34), all good. Despite the downhill there’d been a couple of sharp little rises, tiny tasters of what lay ahead. I was well hydrated but already looking to take on some water, however. There were a lot of stations, heavily staffed on both sides of the road by fabulously encouraging volunteers, with Gatorade sports drink available also (annoyingly before the water, in what I assume is a sponsor requirement). I hadn’t done any cup practice — hadn’t thought about it much, but the hope was that the Berlin walk-through strategy would come up trumps again. As it happened I just took a few sips at the first stations, dousing the head with the rest of the cup. By the 10k point (split 24:23) I could see the stops were already costing me time. It was only a few seconds, but not good this early, with the legs already starting to feel heavy in the heat, which was still rising.

The next five kms were relatively flat. Tried to pick things up, but felt like I had nothing and only succeeded in leaking more time (split 24:39). The only positives were the crowd: incredibly loud, incredibly positive. By the time we passed through Framingham and Natick I’d already heard “You got this!” “Go Crusader” and “Awesome, runner” about a thousand times and it wasn’t getting old - I was not feeling awesome or that I had this, but I needed the support, badly. There’d been a cooling breeze off the lakes around this area but I was starting to bake. Approaching the halfway stage, the Wellesley girls’ hysterical screaming wasn’t enough to provide a boost (a bit terrifying tbh). I followed FBOT’s advice, passed on from Killerz, and hugged the left side, well away from the fray. But the 20k split was more than two minutes off (25:48), and the halfway number of 1:43:57 was not looking good at all.

Miles 1-13: 7:34 7:34 7:34 7:40 8:01 7:43 7:52 7:59 7:49 8:14 8:21 8:02 8:14 (Half: 1:43:57)

The Second Half

I tried to apply the DG cattle prod, not for the first time. Could I HTFU and take a bit more pain? No, it seemed. Every time I tried to pick it up I felt a stitch coming on and would have to drop it back down again. Frustrating, although I never really tested this enough. I’d never felt worse during a race, except perhaps the Dublin Half in 2013, another roaster of a day that had come out of nowhere. It was relatively flat through 25k but again the split (26:32) was way off. As I posted last week, there was no B goal. If there was, it would have been 3:22 to qualify for NY but that had been history since the halfway gantry. Could I at least hang on for a PB in the low 3:29s? Even that was now unlikely. I didn’t really understand what was happening. I don’t normally pay much attention to the heat but this time it was different. I had nothing to go to. I looked around for signs that others were struggling but runners were passing me all the time. Most of those young female runners I’d started with had already handed me my ass, it seemed, and plenty more were coming through from behind. By now I’d lost it and when I passed over the 30k mat (28:06) I wasn’t even bothering to look at the splits. In fact I was expecting the 35k mat at this point, that’s how demoralised I was.

At this stage we’d made the iconic right turn at the fire station, and the Newton Hills had already begun. I had no idea which one was the fabled Heartbreak and didn’t really care at this point, I didn’t think it would make much difference, uphill or downhill felt like the same kind of slog. But here it was and yes, it is quite a whopper. Again the crowd support was amazing and they made it easier than it should have been, although in fairness the many trips up and down Howth Head of late helped to make this far less intimidating than it would have been otherwise. Near Boston College, where the students did their best (and succeeded, I think) to outshout their Wellesley rivals, I logged another shocking 5k split (29:46), continuing the trend of each one being slower than the last. At least the last five miles would be gravity-assisted, and we were approaching downtown and its opportunity for a bit of shade. Anna, Mrs Mc and two other friends were somewhere up the road, near Fenway at around 40k. I hoped they’d been tracking progress and weren’t worrying about my lateness. Just put one foot in front of the other and managed to reverse the trend for the first and only time at the 40k split (28:35). Wasn’t sure what side of the road the missus would be on so I stayed in the middle, scanning, and nearly missed her. A quick hug from A and Mrs Mc near the Citgo sign. Anna broke the news that everyone was struggling. I was able to pick it up some more (from shuffle to plod) for the last mile, finally making the right and left turns that brought the finish line into view down Boylston St.

I’d joked with FBOT during the previous day’s reccie that I hoped to be be dry retching down the finish straight (usually a sign of a good effort). Maybe it’s autosuggestion but I actually did get a few heaves here as I upped the pace as best I could, applauding the magnificent crowd and roaring at them (most unlike me) to make more noise. They obliged. I could see the clock counting towards 3:45 and decided I’d keep it under that number and at least beat my DCM 2013 time. Another aul lad I’d traded a few blows with over the course of the day tried to pass here. I locked onto his Dubai marathon shirt which should have given him the edge in the conditions and managed to out-shuffle him through the last 100m, crossing in 3:44:24.

Miles 14-26.2: 8:22 8:51 8:14 9:06 9:18 8:55 9:33 10:08 8:55 9:11 9:06 9:18 9:40 (0.3 @ 8:25) Finish: 3:44:24

Afterwards

Immediately on finishing I was queasy and thought I might throw up. I’d managed four gels en route, which probably just about kept the glycogen levels up, and I'd taken on enough gatorade along the way too. A bit unsteady for a few yards and a marshall asked was I OK and encouraged me to keep walking. The finish area was full of marshalls and other volunteers, and I thanked as many of them as I could on the way out: there’s no way this event could function without their massive contribution. You really get treated well doing this race, that’s for sure. Every participant is given the utmost respect and it deserves to be reciprocated.

Reflections

Looking back a couple of days later, the performance and result are obviously a disappointment. I don’t usually suffer much in the heat, so I’m surprised there wasn’t at least a little bit more in the tank. On one hand, I’m glad to have finished in one piece, but on the other, and regardless of what happened to others, I’m disappointed not to have gotten closer to the goal. I said the other day there was no B goal, and maybe that was a mistake. As PaulieYifter demonstrated, a decent result might have been possible by taking the conditions into account and being more realistic from the start. As it was, I just lost interest after halfway knowing there was no way I would do a negative split on that course, especially in those conditions.

I have the satisfaction of having done a great block of training with the P&D plan, even if that training has yet to be exploited. I’ll hope to build on it after a few weeks of recovery. It was nice to relax with the others and have a few drinks for the first time in 11 or 12 weeks. Cutting back on the booze didn’t deliver in the end but I’m glad to have done it, I’ve been wanting to press the reset button in that department for some time. It’s hard to do away marathons, especially point to points, as yaboya has mentioned once or twice since - sleep difficulties didn’t help me on the day either, although I wouldn’t overthink that, as in other ways I was better prepared than ever.

One consolation I can take is that I beat the bib number at least, finishing in 12,206th position (on chip time, I assume) out of 26,639 finishers, a solid mid-pack result that’s not bad relative to my rank based on qualifying time (16,510th) - so despite feeling that the whole field was passing me, in reality I must have been doing a bit better than a lot of people who started in earlier waves - or else I was doing just OK, and they were doing worse, whichever way you want to look at it. At that straw I shall clutch, for the time being at least.


Previous PB: 3:29:16
Target: 3:19:59
Official Time: 3:44:24
12,206 posn /26,639 (Category M55 579th of 1,564). Age grade: 63.92%. :mad: VDOT 42.3.
Verdict: Gruesome, but beat the bib.

WTD: 42k (26m)
MTD: 181 (113)
YTD: 1,041 (647)

Younganne

Murph, you completed the Boston marathon in grueling conditions and kept going when the going got extremely tough. Be very proud of your achievement, especially for an auld lad

yes maybe you should have reassessed when the temps were so high, but every race is a learning curve and when you have done such a great training block and have a goal its very difficult to change tact on the day.

Congratulations on a great report, i could feeling all your emotions and thankfully no-one around to see my tears the report has brought. Well done.

This Fat Girl Runs

Younganne wrote: »

Murph, you completed the Boston marathon in grueling conditions and kept going when the going got extremely tough. Be very proud of your achievement, especially for an auld lad

yes maybe you should have reassessed when the temps were so high, but every race is a learning curve and when you have done such a great training block and have a goal its very difficult to change tact on the day.

Congratulations on a great report, i could feeling all your emotions and thankfully no-one around to see my tears the report has brought. Well done.

+100 to this. Younganne said everything I was thinking but didn't know how to put into words.

Firedance

This Fat Girl Runs wrote: »

+100 to this. Younganne said everything I was thinking but didn't know how to put into words.

Ill go one further and say was afraid to say in case the ole backslapping thing comes up again. Finishing a marathon, instead of dropping out (which anyone can do) when things are hard is a sign of strength. Whatever else went wrong on the day, or could have been improved (yaboya too) this is one positive and we should take our positives where we can in running and in life.

Well said younganne.

Dubgal72

I'd slap you on the back but I'd be afraid I'd snap you in two aul skinny fella. Looking forward to hearing what's next. I believe real pain was on the agenda post-Boston? *whistles innocently*

Murph_D

Ah stop worrying about the backslap police. I can take any form of criticism or praise, positive, negative, constructive, destructive, I've seen it all before, and I will again! Thanks.

tang1

Murph_D wrote: »

Ah stop worrying about the backslap police. I can take any form of criticism or praise, positive, negative, constructive, destructive, I've seen it all before, and I will again! Thanks.

Cool, with that sentiment, I hope I'm still running close to 3.44 when I get to your age D, a seriously gutsy performance that I've no doubt you'll learn a thing or to from and use it in the future. Ye got dealt a $hitty hand as I said already with the weather, you didn't perform to your full capabilities because of that. Your human not Superman, sun is the Irishmans kryptonite!!! Very well done again.

Bungy Girl

Great report, Murph. Hope the recovery is going well and looking forward to hearing about your next goal(s). What a fantastic block of training you did in the lead up to Boston. It's a shame that circumstances outside your control meant the A-goal wasn't attainable on the day. The mile is a more forgiving distance - road relays next year :P ??

Kennyg71

Great report D, really good read, sounds like race not likely to forget in a hurry
and what doesn't kill us, makes us stronger so to that end I think plenty PB
braking to come this year, well done:)

Murph_D

Thanks all. Don’t worry, haven’t given up on 3:20 - it was a realistic goal, arrived at over the course of the training and solidly based on recent results and will continue to be the goal for the next 26.2. It was my first time going into a marathon with a best race time that was actually from a 5k, but I’d ignored that in favour of 3:20 based on a comfortable Ballycotton time. So tang, I appreciate the sentiment, but this aul lad isn’t any happier with 3:44 than you would be at any age! I like your DCM idea and if I’m racing it and close to that target I’ll certainly think about it (not sure I’ll do DCM yet, and not sure you should either!)

Next up is Terenure 5, bit of unfinished business there from last year. Don’t have any strong feelings yet about the rest of the year. Yes, BG - like the idea of the road relays. Was disappointed that it clashed with Boston this year and that I couldn’t help the club put out an M50 team. Would be nice to do so next year and give davedanon and his mates a run for their money. Would be interesting to train for that kind of distance if there’s a chance.

Wed 20 Apr

40 mins recovery on the seafront with A. Nice to stretch the legs after the flight home.

Thu 21 Apr

No running. Swim, sauna, steam room, more swim, jacuzzi. Legs appreciated that and the DOMS is receding.


WTD: 49k (30m)
MTD: 187 (116)
YTD: 1,047 (651)

tang1

Murph_D wrote: »

and not sure you should either!)

Interested in why you think this?

annapr

tang1 wrote: »

Cool, with that sentiment, I hope I'm still running close to 3.44 when I get to your age D, a seriously gutsy performance that I've no doubt you'll learn a thing or to from and use it in the future. Ye got dealt a $hitty hand as I said already with the weather, you didn't perform to your full capabilities because of that. Your human not Superman, sun is the Irishmans kryptonite!!! Very well done again.

ouch... :pac: :pac:

tang1

annapr wrote: »

ouch... :pac: :pac:

Stop stirring you, he knew what I meant. I phrased it shockingly alright!!

annapr

tang1 wrote: »

Stop stirring you, he knew what I meant. I phrased it shockingly alright!!

Ah I know you meant well... Just made me laugh !

Murph_D

tang1 wrote: »

Stop stirring you, he knew what I meant. I phrased it shockingly alright!!

Decided to give you the benefit of the doubt. But now I see you've ordered some zimmer frames for your canal run. :eek:

Re the second marathon in a year, I think it's something you should think about and talk over with your coach, who knows better than me how you were responding specifically to the training. Two marathons a year is a big stress on the body, and you did well to make it through one training block at last.

It's not something I know a lot about -- I'm conservative (because I want to avoid the zimmer frame for a bit longer). You're obviously younger and stronger but it's still a big step up to go from zero to two, and a few people around here have come a cropper trying to do a second one too soon.

tang1

Murph_D wrote: »

Decided to give you the benefit of the doubt. But now I see you've ordered some zimmer frames for your canal run. :eek:

Re the second marathon in a year, I think it's something you should think about and talk over with your coach, who knows better than me how you were responding specifically to the training. Two marathons a year is a big stress on the body, and you did well to make it through one training block at last.

It's not something I know a lot about -- I'm conservative (because I want to avoid the zimmer frame for a bit longer). You're obviously you're and stronger but it's still a big step up to go from zero to two, and a few people around here have come a cropper trying to do too a second one too soon.

No fair point and appreciate the advice, it's not something I've discussed with L yet so don't know his thinking on it but you make a good point about going from zero to two in space of just over 6 months. Like all of us, last thing I want to do is end up injured again and rushing another marathon cycle could well do that coming from where I was. Will ask coach and see what he reckons and heed the advice.

Murph_D

tang1 wrote: »

No fair point and appreciate the advice, it's not something I've discussed with L yet so don't know his thinking on it but you make a good point about going from zero to two in space of just over 6 months. Like all of us, last thing I want to do is end up injured again and rushing another marathon cycle could well do that coming from where I was. Will ask coach and see what he reckons and heed the advice.

If you decide not to race another one this year you'd make a terrific pacer which is always in demand at DCM, I think you'd really get a lot out of it (and so would your pacees!)

aquinn

What a report D. Very tough and extremely honest. Brought back tracking memories as that was tough to watch and the cheek of tang, huh the insult after super training.

The crowd and atmosphere sounded amazing and glad as well as wrecking your head they helped.

Awful disappointing after the training but with weather conditions as they were go easy on yourself. To start finding it tough early on is an awful long way left to race but you did it and not by crawling over the line either.

I hope you are starting to feel ok. Well done. You're a Boston marathon finisher. Fantastic.

nop98

What a great report - and a super effort despite the tough conditions. I'm sorry it didn't go better. I hope you're not too disappointed (anymore) - you did get to run the Boston Marathon - which is something not many can say.

Killerz

Great report and really felt your struggles after reading that. Tough break getting the hot day and as you say, got through in one piece which is the main thing. Having spectacularly crashed out of Chicago a few years ago due to heat, your result and being able to make the most of the end of the race, finishing strongly, is nothing to be sneezed at.

PS glad I didn't tell fbot to go to the right at wellesley and see the advice reproduced here

Back in Black

Great report Murph. Sounds like it was a really tough race. You done well to get to the finish in one piece.

Murph_D

Fri 22 Apr

Rest.

Sat 23 Apr

Recovery 8k (5m) on the Clontarf seafront.

Sun 24 Apr

Recovery 8k including Dublin Remembers 1916 5k run.

Really enjoyed this untimed run through the city, running with the missus and my brother-in-law. We lined up in the joggers pen and the atmosphere was very relaxed. Seemed to be a very good turnout for this event, which was very attractively priced at €11, including plenty of post-race refreshments and even a shuttle bus back to the start line (allegedly - I got a lift back meself!) Lots of people seem to have integrated this into their long runs today, judging by the amount of shirts we spotted on the drive back. No idea what it was like at the racey end of this, hope it was as much fun as at the back. Good way to end a tough enough week.

WTD: 65k (40m)
MTD: 203 (126)
YTD: 1,063 (661)

laura_ac3

Catching up here. Sorry you missed out on the A goal last week D but good to see you taking the positives from the experience too and that cycle of training will stand to you.

Just a question out of curiosity, you mentioned in your shorter and longer reports that the course was tough as well as the conditions. The weather seemed to be a big part of the day but say that had been OK do you think the course would have bitten you on its own or would Howth etc have well prepared you and on for the target goal?

Murph_D

laura_ac3 wrote: »

Catching up here. Sorry you missed out on the A goal last week D but good to see you taking the positives from the experience too and that cycle of training will stand to you.

Just a question out of curiosity, you mentioned in your shorter and longer reports that the course was tough as well as the conditions. The weather seemed to be a big part of the day but say that had been OK do you think the course would have bitten you on its own or would Howth etc have well prepared you and on for the target goal?

Good question. Hard to say for sure of course. Calculators that factor in the effect of heat on performance (like this one, for example) suggest that I probably would not have made the 3:20 target if the temperature had been the predicted 11 degrees (turned out to be 20-21 on the day). Equivalent final time is somewhere around 3:30 I think - but that doesn't take the "I give up" factor into account. I think if I'd stayed closer to the target pace for longer I'd have dug in a good bit more than I did in the end.

I'd say I probably overestimated the effect of the net downhill, and I think the even-split strategy would have backfired and I'd have lost a few minutes in the second half even in the best conditions. PaulieYifter had advised to allow for a few mins positive split (unfortunately I'd forgotten that advice) and it's definitely the way to go, I think. The course had little hills everywhere (as well as the big ones) and it's the constant adjustment from uphill to downhill that makes it tough. You definitely should prepare with plenty of long pace runs over undulating territory, and the odd big Howth-ish hill, I reckon. Which is pretty much what I did, but probably not enough to hit the target.

Firedance

Would you go back D? or move on to another big city marathon?

I hope the body is recovering well now?

Murph_D

I'd go back but not for a PB!

Recovering fine - my experience is that every marathon recovery is faster and less painful than the previous one. Raced marathons that is - paced ones are different, as you're recovering from the duration rather than the pace, which seems harder. Think I was sorer for longer after last October's 4:40 than last week's 3:44.

Will of course be taking it very easy for the next few weeks. Terenure 5 comes a week earlier than ideally, and if it doesn't feel right I will be bailing out.

PaulieYifter

Murph_D wrote: »

PaulieYifter had advised to allow for a few mins negative split (unfortunately I'd forgotten that advice) and it's definitely the way to go, I think.

Positive split - as in slower 2nd half....

3 Bostons and I still haven't nailed it -> I'll be back next year all going well.

Murph_D

PaulieYifter wrote: »

Positive split - as in slower 2nd half....

3 Bostons and I still haven't nailed it -> I'll be back next year all going well.

Oops, yes, that's what I meant to say. (Edited to fix).