Random Running Questions

Foweva Awone

TFB thanks for your last couple of posts. I'm running a few months now, starting at a fitness level of zero, and am at the point where I'm running about 5k, but very very slowly and still struggling a lot (mostly because I have a good bit of weight to lose.) I'm feeling more motivated now after reading about your experience that my hard work now will hopefully pay off in the future!!

Omega28

Thanks for everyone's advice.

Yeah, I never ran before but I lifted weights and often cycled up to 650km a week during the summer months. That would my baseline of fitness.

But running is a totally different ball game.

BeginnerRunner

Omega28 wrote: »

Thanks for everyone's advice.

Yeah, I never ran before but I lifted weights and often cycled up to 650km a week during the summer months. That would my baseline of fitness.

But running is a totally different ball game.

I see you're the same as me. Fit enough that the lungs and heart is able, the head is willing and the joints are screaming 🤣

Omega28

BeginnerRunner wrote: »

I see you're the same as me. Fit enough that the lungs and heart is able, the head is willing and the joints are screaming 🤣

I never experienced that much pain in my life from my joints and muscles in legs from running 😂

TFBubendorfer

Omega28 wrote: »

Thanks for everyone's advice.

Yeah, I never ran before but I lifted weights and often cycled up to 650km a week during the summer months. That would my baseline of fitness.

But running is a totally different ball game.

That explains the 70k first week, alright!

You need to be careful. You are obviously very fit but your leg muscles are in no state to support the level of training your aerobic system would be able to sustain, and the chain is only as strong as the weakest link. You basically have Ferrari engine inside a Nissan Micra.

Start small and increase gradually is the only way to overcome this. You can still expect a few niggles along the way. I had plenty of issues in my first two years but once the legs had adapted I would go through almost 10 years of hard training without injury.

Glencarraig

Omega28 wrote: »

Thanks for everyone's advice.

Yeah, I never ran before but I lifted weights and often cycled up to 650km a week during the summer months. That would my baseline of fitness.

But running is a totally different ball game.

You cant freewheel when running :):):)

BeginnerRunner

Does it make sense to have some shoes and brands in rotation?

Currently running in a pair of pegasus 36 that feel fantastic on.

Is it worth getting a few more pairs of them and rotating daily, or should I get some different brands of the same style? (and if yes, what is the pegasus equivalent for other brands?)

Thinking each shoe will end up wearing slightly different which should theoretically lead to a reduce injury risk?

Cartman78

BeginnerRunner wrote: »

Does it make sense to have some shoes and brands in rotation?

Currently running in a pair of pegasus 36 that feel fantastic on.

Is it worth getting a few more pairs of them and rotating daily, or should I get some different brands of the same style? (and if yes, what is the pegasus equivalent for other brands?)

Thinking each shoe will end up wearing slightly different which should theoretically lead to a reduce injury risk?

"No harm in rotation" is every runners motto :-)

I have a couple of pairs of Pegasus in my roster alright...I like the 36's a lot as well (wasn't a big fan of the 35's) but very hard to find them now.

I'm also doing the odd run in New Balance 1080's; had the 880's before as well and would recommend both of them.

Asics Cumulus used to be good as well but they changed the toe box in a horrible way a few years ago

wersal gummage

Cartman78 wrote: »

"No harm in rotation" is every runners motto :-)

I have a couple of pairs of Pegasus in my roster alright...I like the 36's a lot as well (wasn't a big fan of the 35's) but very hard to find them now.

I'm also doing the odd run in New Balance 1080's; had the 880's before as well and would recommend both of them.

Asics Cumulus used to be good as well but they changed the toe box in a horrible way a few years ago

How do the Nike compare in size to the NB and asics?

I'm wearing the 1080s and asics at the moment, same size in both. Would Nike likely be same again??

Just asking as both asics and NB sizing nowhere remotely near my normal shoe size.

Wottle

wersal gummage wrote: »

How do the Nike compare in size to the NB and asics?

I'm wearing the 1080s and asics at the moment, same size in both. Would Nike likely be same again??

Just asking as both asics and NB sizing nowhere remotely near my normal shoe size.

Nike tend to be a half size bigger than NB.
Both might say UK 8 but if you look at the EU sizing, the Nike will say 42.5 but NB will say 42.
Double check though, just incase.

Omega28

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

That explains the 70k first week, alright!

You need to be careful. You are obviously very fit but your leg muscles are in no state to support the level of training your aerobic system would be able to sustain, and the chain is only as strong as the weakest link. You basically have Ferrari engine inside a Nissan Micra.

Start small and increase gradually is the only way to overcome this. You can still expect a few niggles along the way. I had plenty of issues in my first two years but once the legs had adapted I would go through almost 10 years of hard training without injury.

How come my leg muscles are able to sustain crazy mileage on a bike yet they can't do the same with running?

Not sure if this makes a difference but I'm 101kg so maybe my weight is a factor?

TFBubendorfer

Omega28 wrote: »

How come my leg muscles are able to sustain crazy mileage on a bike yet they can't do the same with running?

Not sure if this makes a difference but I'm 101kg so maybe my weight is a factor?

Running uses different muscles than cycling.
Also, as Glencarraig pointed out, there is no freewheeling in running.

And yes, weight is a factor. Running is a weight-bearing exercise, with each step you have to overcome gravity. Cycling is not.

Enduro

BeginnerRunner wrote: »

Does it make sense to have some shoes and brands in rotation?

Different brands will be built on different lasts, so will have different shapes. So any subtle pressure points will more than likely change when switching. That's a big plus in some circumstances.

Ceepo

Omega28 wrote: »

How come my leg muscles are able to sustain crazy mileage on a bike yet they can't do the same with running?

Not sure if this makes a difference but I'm 101kg so maybe my weight is a factor?

The simplest answer is, impact.

Ceepo

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Running uses different muscles than cycling.

Really, or does it use the same muscles differently?

BeginnerRunner

Omega28 wrote: »

How come my leg muscles are able to sustain crazy mileage on a bike yet they can't do the same with running?

Not sure if this makes a difference but I'm 101kg so maybe my weight is a factor?

Same reason a good runner couldn't jump on a bike with no experience and cycle 650km in a week without severe repercussions!

Their hole would be ruined because while their raw baseline fitness (call it aerobic engine) is enough to do it, the rest of their body isn't ready.

As someone said - simply, impact.

Cartman78

wersal gummage wrote: »

How do the Nike compare in size to the NB and asics?

I'm wearing the 1080s and asics at the moment, same size in both. Would Nike likely be same again??

Just asking as both asics and NB sizing nowhere remotely near my normal shoe size.

From memory I'd say Nike and Asics would be similar in sizing, but haven't worn Asics in a few years at this stage.

I find I need to go up half a size in New Balance

Foweva Awone

Last couple of runners I've had were Asics, they're very comfortable but the interior lining seems to wear out quicker than I'd have expected.

Was thinking of trying a pair of Brooks, but obviously I'll have to prefer online. My question is, are they usually true to size, i.e. should I order a size 6 (my size in Asics) or would it be recommended to go up or down a size.

Thanks! :-)

Myksyk

Foweva Awone wrote: »

Last couple of runners I've had were Asics, they're very comfortable but the interior lining seems to wear out quicker than I'd have expected.

Was thinking of trying a pair of Brooks, but obviously I'll have to prefer online. My question is, are they usually true to size, i.e. should I order a size 6 (my size in Asics) or would it be recommended to go up or down a size.

Thanks! :-)

Hard to advise on sizing but I went with the same size when I went from Asics to Brooks initially. But definitely felt the Brooks were tighter in the toe box and moved up half a size on my next Brooks and that was much better.

MY BAD

On sizing I always use European sizes. Sometimes depending on the brand 10 UK can differ. For example Nike UK 10 is EU 45 while Adidas UK 10 is EU 44 2/3.

Swashbuckler

MY BAD wrote: »

On sizing I always use European sizes. Sometimes depending on the brand 10 UK can differ. For example Nike UK 10 is EU 45 while Adidas UK 10 is EU 44 2/3.

Good advice. Same here.

Take a pair that fit you well. Check the European size and then apply that to the ones you're interested in.

BeginnerRunner

I want to add some strides to my workout tomorrow but don't know what to do.

It's due to be an easy 40 minute run @ approx. 70% MHR, so around 6-6.5km total.

I THINK they're best served towards the end of a run, but the practicality of my route means the most suitable location to do them is about 2km-4km in, but they could also be done inside the last km from home in our estate if I had to.

Am I right saying I should be striding out for about 20-30 seconds, with a small portion of that at or near top speed?

Then rest/walk for a minute (essentially full recovery) and repeat 4-5x?

Also... are they called strides or striders?!

Omega28

Any Black Friday deals on a decent pair of trainers for a newbie runner?

Ceepo

BeginnerRunner wrote: »

I want to add some strides to my workout tomorrow but don't know what to do.

It's due to be an easy 40 minute run @ approx. 70% MHR, so around 6-6.5km total.

I THINK they're best served towards the end of a run, but the practicality of my route means the most suitable location to do them is about 2km-4km in, but they could also be done inside the last km from home in our estate if I had to.

Am I right saying I should be striding out for about 20-30 seconds, with a small portion of that at or near top speed?

Then rest/walk for a minute (essentially full recovery) and repeat 4-5x?

Also... are they called strides or striders?!

Strides or pick up, would normally be done towards the end of some easy runs, or before faster intervals or races.

The idea of them before a session or race is to "prime" the body for the work you are about to do.
Strides in a slow/easy run are normally done towards the end of the run, to help permote and maintain better running form, as well as put some zip into the legs after a few miles of easy running.
Normally i would recommend doing 4/6 of them for 20/30 seconds on a flattish surface. In my opinion they should not be sprints, but more 3/4 pace efforts with short recover 30/60 seconds.
While the could be done at any point during the run, you can see why its better to do them towards the end of an easier run.

Wottle

BeginnerRunner wrote: »

I want to add some strides to my workout tomorrow but don't know what to do.

It's due to be an easy 40 minute run @ approx. 70% MHR, so around 6-6.5km total.

I THINK they're best served towards the end of a run, but the practicality of my route means the most suitable location to do them is about 2km-4km in, but they could also be done inside the last km from home in our estate if I had to.

Am I right saying I should be striding out for about 20-30 seconds, with a small portion of that at or near top speed?

Then rest/walk for a minute (essentially full recovery) and repeat 4-5x?

Also... are they called strides or striders?!

Different ways to do strides, some do it at the end of their run. I like to do them throughout, roughly 1x100m for every mile run and then running easy for another mile.
I calculate the 100m by counting 35 steps on my right foot, doesn't need to be exact.
I do not do them at top end speed and would advise against this, they should be done at 5k pace or slightly quicker.
They're ideal for making an easy run a little more interesting, helping to improve form, teaching the body to change gears and acting as a primer for a session the day after.

Max efforts are entirely different and would need a lot more recovery. After you establish the strides above for a few months, you could then start looking at 10 second hill sprints off a 2 minute plus walk.

Tergat on hill sprints below

Quote:
Hey Dave. 100% hills should be included in all endurance athletes programmes from 800m to marathon male or female. For me with your marathon people these three types would be gold:

1) Short power hills (8-10 secs fast with 2.5 mins walk rec) Start with 2-3 and add 1 per week until you reach about 6-8 depending on the athlete. Do after a small easy run and the day before a workout day


Quote:
So benefits as follows:

1) Improved speed & power
2) Improved running mechanics & efficiency
3) Improved strength or muscles, ligaments, tendons etc
4) Improved stroke volume of heart (amount of blood heart can pump per beat)
5) Help prime the body for key workout days the next day

Basically many strength, neuromuscular and cardiovascular adaptations going on. They are gold once progressed wisely each week. Also take the full 2.5-3 mins between each one, they’re alactic sprints so no lactate build up (only 8-10 secs long) and uses the ATP-CP system so must allow to fully recover after each one.

Dudda

Omega28 wrote: »

Any Black Friday deals on a decent pair of trainers for a newbie runner?

Nike have a sale on currently. Use code BRIGHT30. Got a pair of Pegasus 37 for just under 60 euro. Well ordered, they arrive next week but I've the 36 and had 35’s before too. Neutral great all rounder shoe.

This is a great week for getting shoes with Black Friday coming a lot on the online shops will have sales. I'd check out the Bargain Alerts forum for codes and offers and in the Athletic Gear forum they have a thread on shoes.

https://touch.boards.ie/forum/346

https://touch.boards.ie/thread/post/115364335

wersal gummage

Very random, stupid question..

I've a few pairs of runners and have never cleaned them, bar obvious lumps of muck or banging the soles together to clear off dried in stuff....

Happy enough to continue, but recently while jogging I fully submerged an entire foot in a hidden puddle, while stepping off a path onto swampy grass to make room for old folk etc.... Anyway, result is a fairly horrendous muck coloured runner....

When I was a kid the trick was to put the runners inside a pillow case in a low spin /temp wash.... Is that still a thing?? Or do more harm than good?

Swashbuckler

wersal gummage wrote: »

Very random, stupid question..

I've a few pairs of runners and have never cleaned them, bar obvious lumps of muck or banging the soles together to clear off dried in stuff....

Happy enough to continue, but recently while jogging I fully submerged an entire foot in a hidden puddle, while stepping off a path onto swampy grass to make room for old folk etc.... Anyway, result is a fairly horrendous muck coloured runner....

When I was a kid the trick was to put the runners inside a pillow case in a low spin /temp wash.... Is that still a thing?? Or do more harm than good?

Depends on how much you love your runners. I've done it plenty of times. Wouldn't dream of doing it with my Nike 4% though!

BeginnerRunner

Ceepo wrote: »

Strides or pick up, would normally be done towards the end of some easy runs, or before faster intervals or races.

The idea of them before a session or race is to "prime" the body for the work you are about to do.
Strides in a slow/easy run are normally done towards the end of the run, to help permote and maintain better running form, as well as put some zip into the legs after a few miles of easy running.
Normally i would recommend doing 4/6 of them for 20/30 seconds on a flattish surface. In my opinion they should not be sprints, but more 3/4 pace efforts with short recover 30/60 seconds.
While the could be done at any point during the run, you can see why its better to do them towards the end of an easier run.

Thank you. I found a place to do them at the end of an easy run so I'll do that on Monday's going forwards

Deffo over cooked the pace a bit on Monday when trying them for the first time.

Wottle wrote: »

Different ways to do strides, some do it at the end of their run. I like to do them throughout, roughly 1x100m for every mile run and then running easy for another mile.
I calculate the 100m by counting 35 steps on my right foot, doesn't need to be exact.
I do not do them at top end speed and would advise against this, they should be done at 5k pace or slightly quicker.
They're ideal for making an easy run a little more interesting, helping to improve form, teaching the body to change gears and acting as a primer for a session the day after.

Max efforts are entirely different and would need a lot more recovery. After you establish the strides above for a few months, you could then start looking at 10 second hill sprints off a 2 minute plus walk.

Tergat on hill sprints below

Quote:
Hey Dave. 100% hills should be included in all endurance athletes programmes from 800m to marathon male or female. For me with your marathon people these three types would be gold:

1) Short power hills (8-10 secs fast with 2.5 mins walk rec) Start with 2-3 and add 1 per week until you reach about 6-8 depending on the athlete. Do after a small easy run and the day before a workout day


Quote:
So benefits as follows:

1) Improved speed & power
2) Improved running mechanics & efficiency
3) Improved strength or muscles, ligaments, tendons etc
4) Improved stroke volume of heart (amount of blood heart can pump per beat)
5) Help prime the body for key workout days the next day

Basically many strength, neuromuscular and cardiovascular adaptations going on. They are gold once progressed wisely each week. Also take the full 2.5-3 mins between each one, they’re alactic sprints so no lactate build up (only 8-10 secs long) and uses the ATP-CP system so must allow to fully recover after each one.

I've the perfect hill in mind for these.

Since they're alactic it feels like there shouldn't be too much of a recovery debt so I might look to add them in at the end of my short 4th easy run after a few weeks of regular strides on my first run

Glencarraig

wersal gummage wrote: »

Very random, stupid question..

I've a few pairs of runners and have never cleaned them, bar obvious lumps of muck or banging the soles together to clear off dried in stuff....

Happy enough to continue, but recently while jogging I fully submerged an entire foot in a hidden puddle, while stepping off a path onto swampy grass to make room for old folk etc.... Anyway, result is a fairly horrendous muck coloured runner....

When I was a kid the trick was to put the runners inside a pillow case in a low spin /temp wash.... Is that still a thing?? Or do more harm than good?

Bucket of warm soapy water and a nail brush, take the insoles out before you start. Allow everything to dry naturally