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Random Running Questions

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Another one here for light shoes for all runs.
    I like to keep my Lunarracers for races and sessions (for some reason I feel guilty wearing them out on easy runs even though they are cheap :confused:) so I use Faas 400s (about 7 oz) for normal runs.

    O the St5s are a heavy enough shoe for racing flats...would you maybe consider something lighter again for actual races?


  • Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭paddybarry


    I wear orthortics. My understanding is that I should be wearing a neutral running shoe. I rotate between Brooks Ghost and Asics Nimbus for everyday running while I use DS Racers for sessions/races. I realise that the later are not neutral but no harm so far.

    I'm looking to get a new pair of racers. Looking for something I could use from 5k to Marathon. Any suggestions? Prior to getting the DS Racers, I had a pair of addidas adizeros.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,096 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    Do you wear orthortics running? I went and got my first running shoes recently and they told me not to.


  • Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭paddybarry


    Do you wear orthortics running? I went and got my first running shoes recently and they told me not to.
    Yep.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,420 ✭✭✭Ososlo



    Just on the ankle and foot strength thing O. Running on grass is excellent for building strength in those areas.

    Yeah good point. I know I should do more of my running on grass!
    menoscemo wrote: »

    O the St5s are a heavy enough shoe for racing flats...would you maybe consider something lighter again for actual races?

    I wouldn't have thought it'd make that much difference at my stage (and I do find the St5s fairly light personally) but I do miss the psychological advantage of having a different/even lighter shoe for race day so for that reason alone I might pop into AK over weekend to have a look.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭paddybarry


    Ososlo wrote: »
    Yeah good point. I know I should do more of my running on grass!



    I wouldn't have thought it'd make that much difference at my stage (and I do find the St5s fairly light personally) but I do miss the psychological advantage of having a different/even lighter shoe for race day so for that reason alone I might pop into AK over weekend to have a look.
    I find sessions/races a tad easier because of this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 352 ✭✭NetwerkErrer


    Do you wear orthortics running? I went and got my first running shoes recently and they told me not to.

    The whole gait analysis thing is bs in my opinion. I think it's important to realise it's a shoe salesperson giving the advice and that they have no medical knowledge with a fascination on pronation and nothing else. The gait cycle is far more complex than just that.

    A salesperson doesn't want you to go to a podiatrist, what can they sell you if you do?


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,096 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    I would wonder about people all right, and people selling orthotics too haha. They knew I was buying the shoes anyway and already had my orthotics with me, I should have asked more about it. The shoes really have made a huge difference, much less pain and a better run, don't use my orthotics in them so I was wondering if I should.

    I imagine he meant that the shoes I buy would have the support I need? I imagine orthotics are designed for neutral shoes, which my running shoes are not. So either wear orthotics + neutral running shoe or get a shoe with support. It's not like I wouldn't buy running shoes if I didn't have flat feet. :p

    My knees completely collapsed inwards in bad shoes, it looked ridiculous on camera.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 352 ✭✭NetwerkErrer


    I would wonder about people all right, and people selling orthotics too haha. They knew I was buying the shoes anyway and already had my orthotics with me, I should have asked more about it. The shoes really have made a huge difference, much less pain and a better run, don't use my orthotics in them so I was wondering if I should.

    I imagine he meant that the shoes I buy would have the support I need? I imagine orthotics are designed for neutral shoes, which my running shoes are not. So either wear orthotics + neutral running shoe or get a shoe with support. It's not like I wouldn't buy running shoes if I didn't have flat feet. :p

    My knees completely collapsed inwards in bad shoes, it looked ridiculous on camera.

    Yeah, that's the flipside I suppose too, some podiatrist can be trigger happy too. I'm just saying that the shop gait analysis is flawed in so many ways, essentially give a runner a crash course in psuedo biomechanics and set them free into the world with a pseudo scientific explanation as to why a person has gotta spend 180 bucks on a pair of asics kayano's and then asks if you want to avail of their special shop made orthotics that need to be replaced every 6 months. Seriously!?:D

    About the flat feet, as my physio tells me. 90+% of flat feet are functionally flat which means the issue is steming from above the knee or a leg length discrepancy. A person with true flat feet is very rare.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Anyone any experience of running in Saucony A6s in wet/damp conditions? I have a 3k this evening on Tarmac with one or two sharpish corners and am a little bit concerned about traction.
    My dilemma is...I have € earmarked for new shoes, sadly only one pair: do I nip down to Amphibian King to buy a pair of new regular Asics (my two pairs are 11 and seven months old) or a pair of racers with traction?!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,518 ✭✭✭✭Krusty_Clown


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Anyone any experience of running in Saucony A6s in wet/damp conditions? I have a 3k this evening on Tarmac with one or two sharpish corners and am a little bit concerned about traction.
    My dilemma is...I have € earmarked for new shoes, sadly only one pair: do I nip down to Amphibian King to buy a pair of new regular Asics (my two pairs are 11 and seven months old) or a pair of racers with traction?!
    I have only run with the A5s, and found the traction in wet conditions pretty poor. It's going to be slippy.. Particularly at the corner up near the entrance to the Park, but realistically the loss of traction throughout the course will cost between 2-4 seconds. Not sure if it really merits a drastic last minute dash for an alternative pair of shoes? Not sure if any racers have very good traction either. The only thing that would justify a purchase, is if you are going to spend the money anyway, and think it will improve your performance on the day. Just run a bit faster to compensate for the slippiness? :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    I have only run with the A5s, and found the traction in wet conditions pretty poor. It's going to be slippy.. Particularly at the corner up near the entrance to the Park, but realistically the loss of traction throughout the course will cost between 2-4 seconds. Not sure if it really merits a drastic last minute dash for an alternative pair of shoes? Not sure if any racers have very good traction either. The only thing that would justify a purchase, is if you are going to spend the money anyway, and think it will improve your performance on the day. Just run a bit faster to compensate for the slippiness? :)

    That was the corner I was thinking of :) Thanks Krusty, I think the answer I was looking for would have told me to raid the kids' piggy banks and go buy both you're right. I had some vague notion that there exists a grippy racer but I am probably better off spending the earmarked funds on a regular lightish pair of runners. And going faster :rolleyes: :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,016 ✭✭✭Itziger


    I like the feel of my Mizuno Wave Ronin (4) in the wet but they've stopped making 'em. Can't remember what the replacement is called. Hardly worth it though for a measly 3k run!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,065 ✭✭✭dublin runner


    Itziger wrote: »
    I like the feel of my Mizuno Wave Ronin (4) in the wet but they've stopped making 'em. Can't remember what the replacement is called. Hardly worth it though for a measly 3k run!

    What a great runner. Very hard to track down these days. Bought three pairs last year. Need to top up somehow!


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Itziger wrote: »
    I like the feel of my Mizuno Wave Ronin (4) in the wet but they've stopped making 'em. Can't remember what the replacement is called. Hardly worth it though for a measly 3k run!
    What a great runner. Very hard to track down these days. Bought three pairs last year. Need to top up somehow!

    Thanks, I'll try track them down for another time. The fierce glares I have been giving the ground in the back garden seem to have done the trick as the ground is drying up as we speak type :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,518 ✭✭✭✭Krusty_Clown


    Itziger wrote: »
    I like the feel of my Mizuno Wave Ronin (4) in the wet but they've stopped making 'em. Can't remember what the replacement is called. Hardly worth it though for a measly 3k run!
    I believe it's the Mizuno Wave Hitogami. Haven't tried them. Anyone else tried them?


  • Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭Larry Brent


    I believe it's the Mizuno Wave Hitogami. Haven't tried them. Anyone else tried them?

    Hi Krusty, I got a pair of these purely as they were the only shoes in my size in the shop at the time. They are extremely comfortable, roomy toe box although I have only worn them on a treadmill. But looking at the sole, I imagine they would be terrible on a wet surface and the shop person advised to wear something else for racing in the rain.

    The new balance 1400 is excellent in wet, so I wonder if the lighter 1600 is the same. I have a pair of new balance rc5000 which look to have a good wet weather grip despite being only 3 oz, but I've not had to wear them in wet conditions (don't get wet conditions here often). I like this shoe - it's basically the new balance long distance 5000 some without the spikes - the only pair of spikes I've ever actually found comfortable, even in a 10000m. The road version splits opinion though, I like them but probably wouldn't race above 5k in them, I know others who won't wear them on road, just for long distance track, they really are extremely light.

    Lastly, asics used to do a wet weather version of the hyper speed or speedster flat. Not sure if that's still about.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,016 ✭✭✭Itziger


    Maybe I should point out that I'm one of the worst takers of a corner I know. In every race I've ever done I seem to go wider than anyone else on a bend. Don't know what it is. Obviously this applies to Half marathon down as I'm not going fast enough for it to be a concern in anything further.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,008 ✭✭✭barryoneill50


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    That was the corner I was thinking of :) Thanks Krusty, I think the answer I was looking for would have told me to raid the kids' piggy banks and go buy both you're right. I had some vague notion that there exists a grippy racer but I am probably better off spending the earmarked funds on a regular lightish pair of runners. And going faster :rolleyes: :D

    That's the corner that I went slip sliding on last year, looks like similar conditions again this year.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,062 ✭✭✭davedanon


    I had a pair of Hitos. Dunno about running in the rain, but they were very nice. Quite similar to my Kinvaras, except that they wore out much quicker. Nice shoe though.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 767 ✭✭✭wrstan


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Anyone any experience of running in Saucony A6s in wet/damp conditions? I have a 3k this evening on Tarmac with one or two sharpish corners and am a little bit concerned about traction.

    How did you get on? Did you wear the A6's? I have recently picked up a pair. I really like them so far, they seem to just fit really well. I've almost no experience in such light, low shoes. I took them out for a 3X2 on those same paths today, and they felt good, although it wasn't wet.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    wrstan wrote: »
    How did you get on? Did you wear the A6's? I have recently picked up a pair. I really like them so far, they seem to just fit really well. I've almost no experience in such light, low shoes. I took them out for a 3X2 on those same paths today, and they felt good, although it wasn't wet.

    Hi wrstan, they are a really lovely shoe. I've raced up to 10k in them so far but conditions need to be practically bone dry to get max traction. I didn't wear them for the 3k because basically the faster the pace, the less traction there is (for example I wore them for a misty 10k in Enniscorthy but pace was in the higher end of 6m/m pace). I wore them when warming up for the 3k and strode out on a damp patch, you know that patch just after you enter the park and just before you enter the short wooded bit? I could feel my legs working harder over only 100m and there were enough of these patches throughout the course to warrant a change to my regular asics.
    So now I have a few recommendations here :) I think I can justify the purchase of grippy racers as we do seem to get quite a bit of the wet stuff here :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,936 ✭✭✭annapr


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Hi wrstan, they are a really lovely shoe. I've raced up to 10k in them so far but conditions need to be practically bone dry to get max traction. I didn't wear them for the 3k because basically the faster the pace, the less traction there is (for example I wore them for a misty 10k in Enniscorthy but pace was in the higher end of 6m/m pace). I wore them when warming up for the 3k and strode out on a damp patch, you know that patch just after you enter the park and just before you enter the short wooded bit? I could feel my legs working harder over only 100m and there were enough of these patches throughout the course to warrant a change to my regular asics.
    So now I have a few recommendations here :) I think I can justify the purchase of grippy racers as we do seem to get quite a bit of the wet stuff here :D

    This was always going to end with new shoes, wasn't it?!? :D. You earned them!


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    annapr wrote: »
    This was always going to end with new shoes, wasn't it?!? :D. You earned them!

    Hehe thanks Anna. :D It was always gonna end well shoe wise ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭oseia


    Hey everyone, trying to get into running and work my way up to 5km for starters... I've always been terrible with running though (poor speed and stamina) so I was wondering, what kinds of exercises can I do to improve my running? Bar running regularly... I mainly want to strengthen my legs, but my lungs too as they 'cause the most trouble really. Am 21 with a very low (but healthy) BMI so I feel like I don't have much holding me back bar the lungs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,420 ✭✭✭Ososlo


    oseia wrote: »
    Hey everyone, trying to get into running and work my way up to 5km for starters... I've always been terrible with running though (poor speed and stamina) so I was wondering, what kinds of exercises can I do to improve my running? Bar running regularly... I mainly want to strengthen my legs, but my lungs too as they 'cause the most trouble really. Am 21 with a very low (but healthy) BMI so I feel like I don't have much holding me back bar the lungs.

    In my opinion and from experience, the best thing to improve your running is more running. Obviously building it up sensibly. Just stick at it.
    I was obsessed with how bad my lungs were when I started (had smoked a lot for many years) and soon came to realise there's nothing you can do to improve them except training! So mainly you just need to get more 'running fit' by running!
    Best of luck with it!


  • Registered Users Posts: 55,639 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    oseia wrote: »
    Am 21 with a very low (but healthy) BMI so I feel like I don't have much holding me back bar the lungs.

    If it's healthy how is it very low?

    To improve your lungs and hearts as regards cardio stamina I think the only thing to do is to get miles on the clock. Keep ticking away at varying comfortable speeds and distance. Don't try and kill yourself with too fast a pace, just plenty of comfortable miles for quite a while, and then maybe ramp it up as regards tempo and distance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭oseia


    Thanks for the advice!
    Ososlo wrote: »
    In my opinion and from experience, the best thing to improve your running is more running. Obviously building it up sensibly. Just stick at it.
    I was obsessed with how bad my lungs were when I started (had smoked a lot for many years) and soon came to realise there's nothing you can do to improve them except training! So mainly you just need to get more 'running fit' by running!
    Best of luck with it!

    I thought that would be the answer but had to check. Yeah it's been the best so far, have gone from only being able to jog for 5 minutes to being able to jog for 15 or 20 so I'm happy with that at least. Have never smoked so it's not that for me anyway, just need to get fitter to improve my breathing I guess!
    walshb wrote: »
    If it's healthy how is it very low?

    To improve your lungs and hearts as regards cardio stamina I think the only thing to do is to get miles on the clock. Keep ticking away at varying comfortable speeds and distance. Don't try and kill yourself with too fast a pace, just plenty of comfortable miles for quite a while, and then maybe ramp it up as regards tempo and distance.

    Sorry I mean it's about 18.6, which seems to be about as low as it can be while still being classed as 'healthy' - i.e. I don't have too much weight to use as an excuse or anything and amn't trying to lose any.

    That's all I've been doing so far, concentrating fully on distance rather than speed though so I suppose once I get a bit of distance I should try and up my speed during some runs.



    Not as big a deal now with longer days and better weather, but is there anything at all I could do indoors that would help? Just for if I was ever sick or the weather was brutal, don't have a treadmill so that's not an option. Squats, lunges, skipping, is anything like that beneficial? Have done a few aerobics classes and found those very helpful.


  • Registered Users Posts: 55,639 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    You already have what many want, a low weight. This is ideal for running, assuming it's healthy enough. You aren't carrying around weight that will affect your movement and pace and effort.

    Indoors I would suggest weights and skipping. Focus on leg weights, and skipping with ankle weights will give you more bounce and spring. Not all that noticeable, but beneficial. High knee lifts during skipping and try as fast a tempo as you can. Get the legs moving.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    oseia wrote: »
    Not as big a deal now with longer days and better weather, but is there anything at all I could do indoors that would help? Just for if I was ever sick or the weather was brutal, don't have a treadmill so that's not an option. Squats, lunges, skipping, is anything like that beneficial? Have done a few aerobics classes and found those very helpful.

    If you want to improve your running as the guys have stated; you need to run more.
    If you are put off running by the Irish weather, then you really aren't going to improve much.
    While the exercises walshie suggests would likely be beneficial to your running, I'd say they'd be more beneficial as a supplement to your running, not a replacement for it.


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