Random Running Questions

straps

What alternatives to gels is there for distance running?

I've never used gels n hear so many stories of them upsetting stomachs in races.

dintbo

Nodelbmiw wrote: »

I'm a new poster but have been reading for a while, hope it's ok to post here.

I'm not running that long but Have run a few 10k races in the past year, each one slightly quicker and my fastest I'm May (50 mins). However due to lots on with work & feeling a bit drained I found it hard to run past 3k in the last few weeks

Started up again last week when I got my holidays and feeling much more energetic than I have been. I have run 5k each morning and hoping to keep this up if I can until I go away travelling next week. Is this ok to run 5k each morning- should I be aiming to speed up as week goes on or keep same steady pace?

Hoping to really get back in to it properly in August when I return.

The best way about this IMO is to keep the pace easy for all your runs for the moment, and maybe add one longer run each week. It's better to build up a good base before trying to up the pace. Also remember it's never a great idea to increase distance and pace at the same time. If you'd prefer to have a plan to follow there are loads to get you started. Here is a good place to start. Good luck and enjoy!

dintbo

straps wrote: »

What alternatives to gels is there for distance running?

I've never used gels n hear so many stories of them upsetting stomachs in races.

I used to use gels but decided to try jelly babies for my most recent marathon. I found they gave me the same energy and were easier on the stomach. The proper jelly babies (Bassetts?) are easier to eat on the run than the cheaper (lidl) ones. I can't see myself going back to gels again!

boydkev

I was wondering if people have gotten their running Form/Technique checked by someone to see if they are running efficiently and given advice on ways to improve. Reason i ask is i find some people seem to be able run alot more effortlessly than i feel i am running. Currently running a 5k in 20mins and 10K in 42mins btu always looking to improve.

libelula

Tempo runs.
Should I be doing them, and how often?

I'm working on 5k & 10k stuff at the minute, and most recent 5k race is 26:09

If I add in a weekly tempo run, that'll make my week look like this -

1 x tempo
1 x speed session
1 x hill springs
1 x slow run
1 x lsr

That's fairly work-heavy isn't it? I could add in a 6th slow run day if I had to, but I'd rather not do that for another couple of months if possible.

Thanks!

Krusty_Clown

libelula wrote: »

Tempo runs.
Should I be doing them, and how often?

I'm working on 5k & 10k stuff at the minute, and most recent 5k race is 26:09

If I add in a weekly tempo run, that'll make my week look like this -

1 x tempo
1 x speed session
1 x hill springs
1 x slow run
1 x lsr

That's fairly work-heavy isn't it? I could add in a 6th slow run day if I had to, but I'd rather not do that for another couple of months if possible.

Thanks!

Yeah, that's a pretty heavy workload for someone running in the region of 26 minutes (not meant in any kind of derogatory way). A lot of improvement for 5k at your level will come from aerobic (easy) running. So I'd swap one of those sessions out for a mid-distance (2/3rds of your long run) easy run. You could alternate speed and tempo each week, if you feel that a tempo run would be valuable. Would you not consider following a structured plan? Also, you could likely do your hill sprints in the middle of an easy run, so get like 3 miles warm up and cool-down either side.

MarkY91

What do you all think of "nike free runs"? Ive a pair coming in the post this week. theyll replace cheap karimor runners thst don't feel do comfy. I chose free runs over asics as asics are..well..ugly. free runs are a kind of fashion atm so i can use them while going out and about locally so theyre kind of a 2 in 1 buy..

jebuz

skittles8710 wrote: »

Attention Cork Folk:
If you have the name of a good physio who knows a bit about running injuries etc can you pm me with name/details. I'd really appreciate any suggestions. *

Posted here on the sound advice of Dubgal72

Freda @ Westside Clinic in Togher is excellent. Former international athlete and very knowledgable so she can diagnose and treat most running injuries.

libelula

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Yeah, that's a pretty heavy workload for someone running in the region of 26 minutes (not meant in any kind of derogatory way). A lot of improvement for 5k at your level will come from aerobic (easy) running. So I'd swap one of those sessions out for a mid-distance (2/3rds of your long run) easy run. You could alternate speed and tempo each week, if you feel that a tempo run would be valuable. Would you not consider following a structured plan? Also, you could likely do your hill sprints in the middle of an easy run, so get like 3 miles warm up and cool-down either side.

Thanks for that Krusty. Alternate weeks sounds like a good idea.
I suppose I do the hill sprints in that way already, I'd usually do a long warm up and cool down so I could just make them a mile or two longer on either end.

As for the structured plan idea, I'd love to follow one. I started about ten weeks back from a pathetic six months of post-marathon stress disorder (tm) and have built myself up to a good routine and I'm seeing good improvements already.
I'll have a root around online and see if I can find one, but if there's one you can think of I'd be most grateful

Goals for now are a 25 min 5k, then a -50 10k after that.

Jotunheim

MarkY91 wrote: »

I chose free runs over asics as asics are..well..ugly. free runs are a kind of fashion atm so i can use them while going out and about locally so theyre kind of a 2 in 1 buy..

While I can't say I never give in to cosmetic temptations myself, I can say that it is the worst reason for choosing a pair of running shoes. If you want to buy nice looking running shoes for everyday wear, buy them. If they do the right job for running too, great, but if they don't, then go and buy a pair of running shoes that do. Two pairs of shoes will be a lot cheaper than seeing your physio for shin splints, knee problems and plantar fasciitis or whatever else you end up with.

adrian522

libelula wrote: »

Thanks for that Krusty. Alternate weeks sounds like a good idea.
I suppose I do the hill sprints in that way already, I'd usually do a long warm up and cool down so I could just make them a mile or two longer on either end.

As for the structured plan idea, I'd love to follow one. I started about ten weeks back from a pathetic six months of post-marathon stress disorder (tm) and have built myself up to a good routine and I'm seeing good improvements already.
I'll have a root around online and see if I can find one, but if there's one you can think of I'd be most grateful

Goals for now are a 25 min 5k, then a -50 10k after that.

This plan might be worth a look. Designed by clearier for the 2014 DCM novices for after the marathon and is focused on 5K-10K

You could jump in a bit later in the plan if you feel it is too easy at the start.

It's a good plan for improving 5K times I think.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ar6olCTLXB5ndFcta1g0aGVhZmtRczdEWkZwV0VmTWc&usp=sharing#gid=1

You can drop one of the easy runs if 6 days is too much.

Enduro

straps wrote: »

What alternatives to gels is there for distance running?

I've never used gels n hear so many stories of them upsetting stomachs in races.

(1) Nothing whatsover (as in, you don't actually need to eat anything)
(2) whatever you feel like!

Gels aren't some kind of magic beans that you need to run long distances. Gel manufactures may try to tell/sell you otherwise, but then they would!

Enduro

boydkev wrote: »

I was wondering if people have gotten their running Form/Technique checked by someone to see if they are running efficiently and given advice on ways to improve. Reason i ask is i find some people seem to be able run alot more effortlessly than i feel i am running. Currently running a 5k in 20mins and 10K in 42mins btu always looking to improve.

I know a few people who have gone to Champions Everywhere workshops and are happy with the results.

libelula

adrian522 wrote: »

This plan might be worth a look. Designed by clearier for the 2014 DCM novices for after the marathon and is focused on 5K-10K

You could jump in a bit later in the plan if you feel it is too easy at the start.

It's a good plan for improving 5K times I think.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ar6olCTLXB5ndFcta1g0aGVhZmtRczdEWkZwV0VmTWc&usp=sharing#gid=1

You can drop one of the easy runs if 6 days is too much.

That looks great, muchas gracias!
I'll have a more detailed look tonight.

MarkY91

Jotunheim wrote: »

While I can't say I never give in to cosmetic temptations myself, I can say that it is the worst reason for choosing a pair of running shoes. If you want to buy nice looking running shoes for everyday wear, buy them. If they do the right job for running too, great, but if they don't, then go and buy a pair of running shoes that do. Two pairs of shoes will be a lot cheaper than seeing your physio for shin splints, knee problems and plantar fasciitis or whatever else you end up with.

I get what you mean but surely them nike running shoes will be alot better than the €30 karimor pair i have now which gave me no problems other than plastic cutting into my ankles

menoscemo

Enduro wrote: »

I know a few people who have gone to Champions Everywhere workshops and are happy with the results.

I know a fair few people who went there and were not happy (myself included). They heavily push you into barefoot running shoes (not any old brand but the one they seem to have shares in) and want everyone to go back and start from scratch with 1 mile runs etc until used to the shoes. Not really an option when you are already running pretty well and preparing for long races.

I have heard great things about the Catherina McKiernan (chi running) workshop though. It's cheaper as well and I think Catherina is better qualified to give advice tbh...

Firedance

menoscemo wrote: »

I know a fair few people who went there and were not happy (myself included). They heavily push you into barefoot running shoes (not any old brand but the one they seem to have shares in) and want everyone to go back and start from scratch with 1 mile runs etc until used to the shoes. Not really an option when you are already running pretty well and preparing for long races.

I have heard great things about the Catherina McKiernan (chi running) workshop though. It's cheaper as well and I think Catherina is better qualified to give advice tbh...

another similar to Catherina is Mary Jennings , http://forgetthegym.ie/ which I would highly recommend

Jotunheim

MarkY91 wrote: »

I get what you mean but surely them nike running shoes will be alot better than the €30 karimor pair i have now which gave me no problems other than plastic cutting into my ankles

Perhaps, I have no way of knowing without knowing your mechanics and how much you run. And there are more than just those two brands and models to compare. Personally, I have everyday shoes, some of which are runners, then I have shoes for actually running which I choose carefully, ignoring cosmetic or brand considerations. I'd be fairly sure that's roughly what most keen runners do and I'd suggest you take a similar approach.

Jotunheim

straps wrote: »

What alternatives to gels is there for distance running?

I've never used gels n hear so many stories of them upsetting stomachs in races.

I've used High5 4:1 to drink my energy, Bounce balls, smoothies, various gels, Nakd bars and small salty potatoes.
I find the High5 best for sustained energy, Viper caffeine gels best for a genuine kick with no stomach issues and the spuds best for making me feel better. Bounce balls are good, but chewy, don't start one at the bottom of a hill, Nakd bars are a little better on that score. Smoothies are best left for afterwards unless you like something rancid on a run. Experiments have run to about the 8 hour mark. I'd say try anything you think might help in training and if it goes bad, well then you know and you can avoid them on race day.

Enduro

MarkY91 wrote: »

I get what you mean but surely them nike running shoes will be alot better than the €30 karimor pair i have now which gave me no problems other than plastic cutting into my ankles

Why though? just because Nike get more money from you?

IIRC there was a large survey on shoes and marathon runners done a few years ago looking for ant kind of patterns in the data, and the only pattern found was a (direct, not inverse) correlation between cost of shoes and the likelihood of injury (Note however they were not saying that expensive shoes cause injuries, just that the data showed a correlation).

From my own personal experience, in my first 6 day race I used about 5 different pairs of shoes during the race. I found (by far) the best to be a pair of shoes bought in Aldi for 20 euro.

diego_b

Hi, any recommendations for a physio or physical therapist in the North Kerry area. Nothing specific required at the moment in regards treatment.

tipping

menoscemo wrote: »

I have heard great things about the Catherina McKiernan (chi running) workshop though. It's cheaper as well and I think Catherina is better qualified to give advice tbh...

I did the Catherina McKiernan course a few months back. I found it good but there was a lot to take in. I probably thought it was better 2 weeks after than I did immediately afterwards. Certainly if you do the drills it will improve you and she could quite easily spot something obvious to change for everybody and it was different for everybody.
For me I believe it has reduced my tendency to heel strike and I think that I make noticeably less noise on the road these days which is good. How much of it I apply in a race is a different matter (but I do it in training!).

TFBubendorfer

diego_b wrote: »

Hi, any recommendations for a physio or physical therapist in the North Kerry area. Nothing specific required at the moment in regards treatment.

http://www.traleephysio.ie/

I've just been there to see Derek after a friend of mine recommend him. He's a very good runner himself, which helps.

One would assume the other physios there know their stuff as well but I asked for Derek and got an appointment straight away.

diego_b

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

http://www.traleephysio.ie/

I've just been there to see Derek after a friend of mine recommend him. He's a very good runner himself, which helps.

One would assume the other physios there know their stuff as well but I asked for Derek and got an appointment straight away.

Cool thanks!

davedanon

Enduro wrote: »

Why though? just because Nike get more money from you?

IIRC there was a large survey on shoes and marathon runners done a few years ago looking for ant kind of patterns in the data, and the only pattern found was a (direct, not inverse) correlation between cost of shoes and the likelihood of injury (Note however they were not saying that expensive shoes cause injuries, just that the data showed a correlation).

From my own personal experience, in my first 6 day race I used about 5 different pairs of shoes during the race. I found (by far) the best to be a pair of shoes bought in Aldi for 20 euro.

If they were anything like the pair I bought from aldiorlidl for €20, they wouldn't have lasted the whole race.

(otherwise they were fine; just wore out really quickly)


On the survey thing, I wonder could one reason have been the likelihood that people buying more expensive shoes were, in general, more likely to have been more serious runners doing higher mileage? People who do more running will almost certainly suffer more injuries, I would have thought.

RayCun

or people who sign up for a marathon because its on their bucket list, and start by going to a shop to buy the most expensive shoes they can because they must be the best

davedanon

RayCun wrote: »

or people who sign up for a marathon because its on their bucket list, and start by going to a shop to buy the most expensive shoes they can because they must be the best

Ahem. The first pair I bought when I started were Nikes from Elvery's that set me back €150. It's by far the most I've ever paid for a pair of running shoes. I got the whole gait analysis malarkey, and guess what I over-pronated and the video showed them to be the best at correcting this defective running style.

Enduro

davedanon wrote: »

On the survey thing, I wonder could one reason have been the likelihood that people buying more expensive shoes were, in general, more likely to have been more serious runners doing higher mileage? People who do more running will almost certainly suffer more injuries, I would have thought.

RayCun wrote: »

or people who sign up for a marathon because its on their bucket list, and start by going to a shop to buy the most expensive shoes they can because they must be the best

Agreed with both of those as possible explanations. Another possibility is the belief that more expensive = better, so people just buy the most expensive shoes they can afford in the belief it will make them a better runner, even though in relaity the most expensive pair could be completely innapropriate for them, thereby potentially leading to injuries. I was wondering was the poster enquiring about the Nikes falling into that trap, given the reasoning that they are more expensive so must be better.

MarkY91

Anyone doing the keith duffy or something duffy 10 mile in the phoenix park?

Im gonna sign up and train for it. Will be tough as the most i done so far was 7 miles which wasnt so hard but ive been holidaying and out at concerts the past while and had a few too many chippers so i think ill go back a few miles and restart at 5 miles?

MarkY91

Enduro wrote: »

Agreed with both of those as possible explanations. Another possibility is the belief that more expensive = better, so people just buy the most expensive shoes they can afford in the belief it will make them a better runner, even though in relaity the most expensive pair could be completely innapropriate for them, thereby potentially leading to injuries. I was wondering was the poster enquiring about the Nikes falling into that trap, given the reasoning that they are more expensive so must be better.

That was me posting about the nike runners. I haven't fallen into s trap as they cost only 65..my previous runners cost half that. I bought them more as nice looking runners to wear out and about than for running. Id hardly call myself a serious runner. I do about 15 miles per week.

I got them today and they feel very comfy so i guess theyre suited to my foot.