BT phone + capacitor, still not ringing???

Oink

Hi All,

I know this is an old chestnut, but after searching on Boards I really don't know what I'm doing wrong.

I bought this phone from Argos. Then I saw the UK connection, cursed Argos, and bought an adapter. It didn't work, so I cursed Argos a bit more and they gave me what really seems to be a capacitor. It looks very much like this. Now the line works, but the phone won't ring. Looking at previous threads on the issue, it really looks like the capacitor should do the trick, so what I am I missing?

Thanks!

ZENER

"Not fit for purpose" comes to mind ? A bit like Currys selling TV sets that would only work in the UK in their Irish stores a few years ago - or selling Routers that are marked for BT use only.

All the reviews for that phone are from UK customers. Take it back and get a refund ? If the phone was meant for the Irish market it should have come with the necessary adapters.

Ken

Oink

Yeah if I can't get it to work I'll do that, but I'd rather try and get it to work first if I can.

ZENER

Have you tried to replace the cable with one from an Irish phone instead of the adaptor ?

Ken

Oink

I thought that wouldnn't work because of of the way the phone itself is wired or something? Im not holding my breath, but it's worth trying anyway, thanks!

ZENER

The British system uses the 2 outer wires on the cable - usually Black and Yellow. In Ireland we use the 2 inner wires - Red and Green.

It's possible they do all the changing in the cable alone so replacing it with the Irish one could work, if it doesn't then you need to chop the cable and connect Black and yellow at the Phone end to Green and Red at the socket end.

This should explain it. It's possible to do the change at the socket outlet but then it becomes non-standard and won't work with an Irish phone again.

Ken

Oink

Thanks Ken. I'm not too good at crimping, so I could also throw it out the window and try and find a normal phone. I'm not sure how much crap I'm willing to take from a €12 phone... I will try the Irish cable though...

ArielAtom

You need to swap the inside pair with the outside pair. You will get ringtone then.

Xantia

The adapters will work but the phone will only ring if you can see a capacitor inside the adaptor.

Oink

Cant believe it. The socket on the phone is smaller than on the Irish cable.
I'm going to have a word with them people tomorrow. Just not bothered rewiring it. Im not rewiring anything.

Cuddlesworth

Oink wrote: »

Cant believe it. The socket on the phone is smaller than on the Irish cable.
I'm going to have a word with them people tomorrow. Just not bothered rewiring it. Im not rewiring anything.

Are you sure that's not a headset socket?

SpaceTime

Just bring it back. If it won't work on an eircom landline, it's not fit for purpose - end of story.

There's one possible technical difference:

Eircom exchanges often use 'balanced ringing' where 75V 25Hz is applied differentially across both wires.

To explain it :

balanced ringing: the ringing voltage is applied to both A and B wires. Each line carries half the ringing voltage (with respect to earth potential), 180 degrees out of phase with the signal on the other line.

The idea of this is that it reduces crosstalk with adjacent pairs, avoids interference with DSL and also minimises the voltage to ground so the line are safer for DIY work.

Eircom lines may also present more continental European style ring voltages (which are lower than what BT tend to use). Bear in mind that Eircom doesn't necessarily use the same exchange equipment as BT either. A lot of our specs are more similar to France than Britain as a large chunk of the exchanges are an Alcatel system called E10 and we've a completely different history of equipment and standards evolved differently in the 70s and 80s.

BT lines normally use unbalanced ringing and higher voltage (70-90V AC)

Unbalanced ringing: the ringing voltage is applied between one line and earth. The full ringing voltage is carried by one line. The other line is kept near earth potential.

If you're buying phones in Argos you're better off to avoid BT-branded stuff as it's very market-specific. Products by Panasonic, Gigaset (Siemens) etc etc are usually made for a broader market than just BT, so they'll quite happily work on most European lines.

There's nothing particularly strange about eircom's setup. Electrically they're EXTREMELY standard 2-wire phone lines that are broadly in keeping with all ETSI recommendations and have been for decades.
It's actually BT that uses the odd-ball standards like reversing the line polarity to indicate Caller ID is being sent and stuff like that and using weird wiring on what should be standard RJ11 phone jacks on their phones.

...

If it doesn't work bring it back. There's no reason to accept any phone sold here if it will not work on an Irish PSTN line. Take no nonsense from them.

I wouldn't suggest rewiring the phone either, just get a refund and buy a branded model instead.

Some (most) BT phones will work fine though. It's just the odd weird model that seems to be totally BT- network specific.

NB: Also double check that the ringer's actually turned on too
It's also possible it's just a faulty handset too. It's very cheap, so I wouldn't be expecting a great piece of kit for that price!

Oink

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Are you sure that's not a headset socket?

I never realised or rather completely forgot there was such a thing, but yeah, then thats probably what it is! The phone itself is pretty much just a handset.

@ spacetime: thanks. Yeah the phone is going back this morning one way or another.

Oink

Phone replaced with a fancier non-BT phone: all good!

Thanks Boardsies! Feck off BT!!!