Unpopular GAA opinions you hold

robbiezero

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

There is now only a top 2 in my mind. Tipperary now lag behind as in my post above.

In spite of a far superior record to Cork in the last 5 years? When will you refresh your top 2?

Flem31

robbiezero wrote: »

Why put it at 40 years. If Aston Villa and Sunderland had won the league once and been 2nd twice in the last 5 years, they would probably be in the big 4. Besides I think the "Big 3" in terms of hurling is not meant in the same context as the "Big 4 or whatever" in English football. I think it is meant more in terms of tradition and All-Ireland record. If it was meant the same as English football, there would be no mention of a Big 3, just a Big 1.

Regardless of the sport, when a Big 3 or 4 or whatever number is mentioned, it refers to the most likely winners year in and year out. It doesn't take into account that a particular team was dominant decades ago or in the soccer examples I used, over a century ago.
There is a jostling for position within the top tier of favourites and if a winner outside of this elite group wins it occasionally then it is an exception rather than an expected success. With a hit rate in the last four decades of one All Ireland every 8+ years, Tipp are becoming occasional winners.
40 years is used as a long enough period to judge the relative strength of a team rather than using much shorter periods where statistical anomalies are more pronounced.

robbiezero

Flem31 wrote: »

Regardless of the sport, when a Big 3 or 4 or whatever number is mentioned, it refers to the most likely winners year in and year out. It doesn't take into account that a particular team was dominant decades ago or in the soccer examples I used, over a century ago.
There is a jostling for position within the top tier of favourites and if a winner outside of this elite group wins it occasionally then it is an exception rather than an expected success. With a hit rate in the last four decades of one All Ireland every 8+ years, Tipp are becoming occasional winners.
40 years is used as a long enough period to judge the relative strength of a team rather than using much shorter periods where statistical anomalies are more pronounced.

Why not just make it a nice round 50 years and re-run your analysis or maybe reduce to 25 years?.

AugustusMinimus

robbiezero wrote: »

In spite of a far superior record to Cork in the last 5 years? When will you refresh your top 2?

I'm trying to balance what constitutes a permanent fall from grace vs peaks and troughs that teams go through.

The recent poor record of Cork is down to a trough. Their team was quite inexperienced in 2008/2009 but has now matured and could well go on to do big teams.

2010 aside, Tipp have won some very soft All-Irelands in the past 25 years. It simply looks to me that Tipp are suffering a permanent downturn in their fortunes, outside of the usual peak and trough, up and down that counties tend to go through. Its only a view obviously.

robbiezero

Flem31 wrote: »

Regardless of the sport, when a Big 3 or 4 or whatever number is mentioned, it refers to the most likely winners year in and year out. It doesn't take into account that a particular team was dominant decades ago or in the soccer examples I used, over a century ago.
There is a jostling for position within the top tier of favourites and if a winner outside of this elite group wins it occasionally then it is an exception rather than an expected success. With a hit rate in the last four decades of one All Ireland every 8+ years, Tipp are becoming occasional winners.
40 years is used as a long enough period to judge the relative strength of a team rather than using much shorter periods where statistical anomalies are more pronounced.

The Big 3 in hurling terms is based on the giants of the game since its inception. In 1998 if you said something about the Big 3 in hurling, everyone knew who you meant in spite of the fact not one of them had won an All-Ireland in the previous 5 years.

AugustusMinimus

robbiezero wrote: »

Why not just make it a nice round 50 years and re-run your analysis or maybe reduce to 25 years?.

Because the last 40 years is statistically very interesting. The fall off by Tipp is quite staggering and is actually quite difficult to explain.

robbiezero

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

I'm trying to balance what constitutes a permanent fall from grace vs peaks and troughs that teams go through.

The recent poor record of Cork is down to a trough. Their team was quite inexperienced in 2008/2009 but has now matured and could well go on to do big teams.

2010 aside, Tipp have won some very soft All-Irelands in the past 25 years. It simply looks to me that Tipp are suffering a permanent downturn in their fortunes, outside of the usual peak and trough, up and down that counties tend to go through. Its only a view obviously.

Every team has won "soft" All-Irelands in the last 25 years. At no time in the last 25 years did Tipperary win an All-Ireland where they were not the best team in the country.

DoctaDee

Flem31 wrote: »

Regardless of the sport, when a Big 3 or 4 or whatever number is mentioned, it refers to the most likely winners year in and year out.......

Only a big 2 in football for me *ducks for cover*

AugustusMinimus

robbiezero wrote: »

Every team has won "soft" All-Irelands in the last 25 years. At no time in the last 25 years did Tipperary win an All-Ireland where they were not the best team in the country.

1989. Galway would have won that All-Ireland but for the Tony Keady ban IMO. They were a beaten team before the semi-final that year, caught up in chaos of the ban.

robbiezero

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

1989. Galway would have won that All-Ireland but for the Tony Keady ban IMO. They were a beaten team before the semi-final that year, caught up in chaos of the ban.

And to balance it out, Tipp would have won the All-Ireland in 1995 only for Paul Delaney and Mick Ryan being suspended after they hammered Waterford etc etc... woulda, shoulda, coulda.

robbiezero

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

1989. Galway would have won that All-Ireland but for the Tony Keady ban IMO. They were a beaten team before the semi-final that year, caught up in chaos of the ban.

So who was suspended for that team in the following years, that stopped them winning another All-Ireland?

DDC1990

DoctaDee wrote: »

Only a big 2 in football for me *ducks for cover*

Only a big 1 for me

robbiezero

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

I'd split hurling like this

Group 1
Kilkenny and Cork

Group 2
Tipperary

Group 3
Limerick and Wexford

Group 4
Clare, Galway and Offaly

Group 5
Waterford, Dublin and Antrim

This is taking both history and modern day accomplishments into account. 50:50 on both. The one I'm unsure about is whether Clare deserve to be in Group 3.

You can't have a "group" of just 1. Very wasteful. Put Tipp in either 3 or 1.

DoctaDee

DDC1990 wrote: »

Only a big 1 for me

LOL... yeah yeah ... 1 is such a lonely number tho ... it's only for the sake of competition I said 2. We'll have the gap down to 11 after this year :pac:

zombieHanalei

robbiezero wrote: »

The Big 3 in hurling terms is based on the giants of the game since its inception. In 1998 if you said something about the Big 3 in hurling, everyone knew who you meant in spite of the fact not one of them had won an All-Ireland in the previous 5 years.

And even if they didn't know what the big 3 referred to in 1998, they would spend the next 14 years seeing only 3 counties win the All-Ireland.

From 1999 to 2012, plenty of counties challenged, Waterford were strong, Galway made a few finals, Limerick and Clare made final appearances, yet the only two counties to break Kilkenny's stranglehold were Cork and Tipp.

Last year it appeared we were about to enter a new phase where the whole thing was blown wide open; but all of a sudden a year later three of the 4 All-Ireland semi-finalists look very familiar....

Flem31

robbiezero wrote: »

Why not just make it a nice round 50 years and re-run your analysis or maybe reduce to 25 years?.

Ok, if we move it from 40 to 50 years, Tipp then go from 4 All Irelands in 40 to 7 in 50.
However 2 of those titles were in 64 and 65, so the current team need to win back to back titles to keep the 7 in 50 years, and it would be the first back to back in 50 years !!!!!
No pressure so on the current panel !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Do we need to go back further in history ?

Nidgeweasel

To be fair about it, there's Kilkenny and then the rest.

DDC1990

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

To be fair about it, there's Kilkenny and then the rest.

Yeah, same with Football, though Dublin are catching up.


:P

DoctaDee

DDC1990 wrote: »

Yeah, same with Football, though Dublin are catching up.


:P

We like to think we've just given you a head start :P

DDC1990

Just like we gave ye a few the past few years so ye don't lose hope altogether.

God the last time we did that we ended up with an 11 year Famine! We had to wait till ye got one in 1995 before we could win again in 1997.

About time we regain our crown this year.



Suits him don't you think :P

DoctaDee

You know when psychiatrists hold up a picture and ask for the 1st thing that springs to mind .. I just see him in a Dublin jersey holding Sam

*afterthought* ... a truly exceptional forward .. and one of the few out there that I'd gladly give a gorm/dubh gorm jersey to

Nidgeweasel

DDC1990 wrote: »

Just like we gave ye a few the past few years so ye don't lose hope altogether.

God the last time we did that we ended up with an 11 year Famine! We had to wait till ye got one in 1995 before we could win again in 1997.

About time we regain our crown this year.



Suits him don't you think :P

If he comes home with that in September and doesn't get the ride he may forget it!

DDC1990

DoctaDee wrote: »

You know when psychiatrists hold up a picture and ask for the 1st thing that springs to mind .. I just see him in a Dublin jersey holding Sam

Yeah... he's going to swap jerseys at the end of the game

DDC1990

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

If he comes home with that in September and doesn't get the ride he may forget it!

I'm not sure he'd have a problem in that department regardless of the Silverware.

Nidgeweasel

Strange thing with that photo, it actually suits him. It's the jersey.

Everyone of the feckers looks like they're destined to win it. Just suits them.

We landed back to Donegal in 1992 and you almost felt someone had nicked it!

DoctaDee

DDC1990 wrote: »

Yeah... he's going to swap jerseys at the end of the game

LOL..touchez ya bastad :pac:

Boom__Boom

Be afraid, be very afraid.

Amprodude

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

To be fair about it, there's Kilkenny and then the rest.

Cork were leading the roll of honour until 2008. They are only 4 behind KK now. Not a big lead.

Amprodude

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Be afraid, be very afraid.

Stick to the footy Jamsie boy.

RoyalCelt

robbiezero wrote: »

Of course there is a big 3 in hurling.
34,30,26,7,6,6,4,4,4,2.
That is the number of All-Irelands won by counties ordered 1 to 10. That stat has a suspicious look of a big 3 to me.

1971 is an arbitrary date and means nothing. Tipp have 9 since 1960, Cork have 11. Tipp have 1 All-Ireland in the last 8 years. Cork have 0.

There is a big 3 whether you like it or not and there will be a big 3 for another 2 decades at least.

Using such old historic stats to come up with a big three is like saying Ulster is the most uncompetitive province with the big one....(Cavan)

DEFTLEFTHAND

Who says big 3? It's known as the Holy Trinity of hurling.

Look at the honour rolls for those 3 teams in everything not just AI's, theres the reason.

clearodara

Gaelic football is one of the most boring, unexciting games to watch.

Amprodude

Croke Park looks horrible without Hill 16 not having a Stand covering it.

Amprodude

DDC1990 wrote: »

Just like we gave ye a few the past few years so ye don't lose hope altogether.

God the last time we did that we ended up with an 11 year Famine! We had to wait till ye got one in 1995 before we could win again in 1997.

About time we regain our crown this year.



Suits him don't you think :P

The Dubs should be telling him to keep his dirty hands off it. :-)

Moneymaker

clearodara wrote: »

Gaelic football is one of the most boring, unexciting games to watch.

There's unpopular, and then there's outright trolling.

Seriously.

WesternZulu

Moneymaker wrote: »

There's unpopular, and then there's outright trolling.

Seriously.

It's a warped perception that hurling is infinitely more exciting.

If the gaelic football championship was restricted to the 12 best teams in the country, like in hurling,the proportion of poor games would significantly decrease.

keane2097

WesternZulu wrote: »

If the gaelic football championship was restricted to the 12 best teams in the country, like in hurling,the proportion of poor games would significantly decrease.

I never considered that point, but it's true enough

iDave

WesternZulu wrote: »

It's a warped perception that hurling is infinitely more exciting.

If the gaelic football championship was restricted to the 12 best teams in the country, like in hurling,the proportion of poor games would significantly decrease.

That's very true

If you took the top 12 from the football rankings thread it would be a terrific championship.

Hibbeler

WesternZulu wrote: »

It's a warped perception that hurling is infinitely more exciting.

If the gaelic football championship was restricted to the 12 best teams in the country, like in hurling,the proportion of poor games would significantly decrease.

You're dead right of course. The hurling championship sees the elite teams play each other sooner and more often. Which makes it seem more attractive

There is an argument to be made for tiering the football championship along similar lines. But I wouldn't be too keen on that idea myself as I think there are better ways to try and bring the weaker counties up rather than just stick them in a tommy murphy cup type thing

nice_guy80

The minutes silence should be scrapped before all GAA games.

Ridiculous that some people get a minute, whereas others don't.
deceased members of the association should be treated equally

Realt Dearg Sec

nice_guy80 wrote: »

The minutes silence should be scrapped before all GAA games.

Ridiculous that some people get a minute, whereas others don't.
deceased members of the association should be treated equally

I dunno about scrapping it, but they definitely use it too often. When someone very special like Christy Ring dies, then it is a solemn occasion for the association, and the silence can reflect that. This will sound disrespectful, but so be it, but going to league matches and there's a silence nearly every single match for people that none of us have heard of. By having minutes silences all the time it means there's nothing special or commemorative about doing it for someone who is really close to the hearts of people in the association.(Obviously in local games etc it's a little different, if a team loses a player or someone involved in running their club, for example)

iDave

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

I dunno about scrapping it, but they definitely use it too often. When someone very special like Christy Ring dies, then it is a solemn occasion for the association, and the silence can reflect that. This will sound disrespectful, but so be it, but going to league matches and there's a silence nearly every single match for people that none of us have heard of. By having minutes silences all the time it means there's nothing special or commemorative about doing it for someone who is really close to the hearts of people in the association.(Obviously in local games etc it's a little different, if a team loses a player or someone involved in running their club, for example)

If the GAA tried t reduce the amount of minute silences or refused requests there would be the usual chorus of moaners saying HQ is out of touch with grass roots, Grab All....blah blah blah.

Realt Dearg Sec

iDave wrote: »

If the GAA tried t reduce the amount of minute silences or refused requests there would be the usual chorus of moaners saying HQ is out of touch with grass roots, Grab All....blah blah blah.

I know, once you've gone down that road then it's hard to turn back. It's just that when you're being silent for someone you've never heard of, it feels like you're just being polite, rather than actually commemorating someone. That's the very definition of an empty gesture.

deadybai

Trophies should be presented on A stage in the middle of Croke Park. Hardly anyone can see the presentation when your not on the pitch.

Nidgeweasel

nice_guy80 wrote: »

The minutes silence should be scrapped before all GAA games.

Ridiculous that some people get a minute, whereas others don't.
deceased members of the association should be treated equally

We will now pause to remember the 1979 Monaghan County Board treasurer's friends cousin's next door neighbour.


Ar dheis dé go raibh a anam.

AugustusMinimus

clearodara wrote: »

Gaelic football is one of the most boring, unexciting games to watch.

That's not an unpopular opinion though.

Realt Dearg Sec

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

That's not an unpopular opinion though.

Where I come from, holding any other opinion would earn you the suspicion of the whole community, and probably get you ostracised.

elefant

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

That's not an unpopular opinion though.

Considering Gaelic Football is the most popular game in Ireland, I would suggest it is an unpopular opinion.

DDC1990

clearodara wrote: »

Gaelic football is one of the most boring, unexciting games to watch.

Darts, Golf, Cricket, Lawn Bowls, Curling, Snooker, Pool, Soccer, Baseball, Ladies Football, Camogie, Show Jumping, Wrestling, Badminton, Archery, Clay Pigeon Shooting, Surfing, Hockey, Shot Putt, Hammer Throw.... etc.

Those are some of the sports you claim to be more exciting then Gaelic Football.

Don't get me wrong, I like a lot of these sports. I'd watch anything, and find it interesting. But Football is on the more exciting end of the spectrum, then the more boring.

Nidgeweasel

clearodara never got picked for u-12's.