Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Notes in OP,22/7

KH25

bucketybuck wrote: »

Is cover what we need? We have enough squad players as far as I am concerned.

If we were picking him up on a free transfer then grand, sign him up. But paying £10 million? I don't know about that.

In a way, yes. Now as I said I thought we'd buy a bigger name. But I do believe that 2 of jones/Evans/Smalling can establish themselves as our main CB's. So in that sense somebody like Vermaelen is a good signing as cover.

Backstreet Moyes

It all depends on what way LVG see's it really. If he has decided he see's the potential in Smalling and Jones and wants to play them then Vermalen makes sense. I think Jones and Smalling will come good and signing a top class cb means they will continue to not play regularly and continue to not fulfill their potential.

Vermalen was very good two seasons ago but not this season. He has premiership experience and it is not a big fee. Personally i would be happy with Evan's, Jones, Smalling and Vermalen. We have no Europe next season and it is make or break for Jones and Smalling and i trust they will come good.

Lord TSC

There's also the chance that LVG doesn't like one of the trio and plans on shipping someone out, in which case we'd need a top level player AND a back up.

There's also the chance he's going to take a lower-budget option here so he can invest more heavily in other areas...if we're spending 100m on Vidal and Pogba, maybe we need to cheapskate the central defence for a year :pac:

FutureGuy

Maybe LVG thinks that he can bring the best out of Vermalaen. He was a savage player for arsenal for years.

Mr_Red

I really dont see anyone going to be confirmed unless LVG is actually at the club.

This is a very proud man and I would think that he will want to take all the glory when he arrives then the signings will be confirmed when he is sitting in the hot seat.

As long as Holland are on fire in the world cup the standard of player we can sign will increase.

Im sure there is alot of work going on in the background but as long as LVG is over in Brazil no pen will be hitting paper.

bad2dabone

FutureGuy wrote: »

Maybe LVG thinks that he can bring the best out of Vermalaen. He was a savage player for arsenal for years.

he wasn't. A few goals from corners and a propensity to charge forward masked his defensive frailties.

Mikeyt086

FutureGuy wrote: »

Maybe LVG thinks that he can bring the best out of Vermalaen. He was a savagedecent player for arsenal for (a) years.

.

Unearthly

Out of the hundreds of names linked in the media, we get the one I hoped wasn't true

gandalf

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Would not be totally shocked if true, but Arsenal will become our feeder club soon if this continues

If United want to give us money for our cast offs then fair play.

Just like every forward player in the premiership I'd love to see the partnership of Phil Jones and Thomas Vermaelen in action

irishfeen

Being brutally honest Thomas would be nowhere near my first choice but if LVG thinks he is worth the money then I'm more then happy to give him the benefit of the doubt - LVG has been around the block quiet a few times and knows exactly what he's doing.

Leftist

vermaelen isn't really united standard.

in lvg we trust though I suppose.

Iseedeadpixels

I'm actually happy with Vermaelan to be signed, we have just lost 2 experienced CB's and we are left with Evans, Smalling and Jones with the former being the only experienced CB we have, Vermaelen is a player that will pop up with the odd goal and was in the team of the season a few years ago, I'm happy enough we will get the CM's we need in a few weeks.

Maximus Alexander

Okay Louis, when I said I wanted you to sign some Dutch players I meant the real deal, not these cheap knock offs from two towns over. :pac:

NTMK

irishfeen wrote: »

Being brutally honest Thomas would be nowhere near my first choice but if LVG thinks he is worth the money then I'm more then happy to give him the benefit of the doubt - LVG has been around the block quiet a few times and knows exactly what he's doing.

Hes a decent player tbf and we may as well get at least a back up defender in place if other deals on defenders go tits up

Until i see a price im not going to complain

aha_sender

Vermalen is a good signing. We lost vidic and Rio over the summer which as well as losing game experience we lost leadership. At least TV has that so could be of use for that purpose. He is not Hummel's but is solid depth / fringe first team player. If the is under 15mil good piece of business. If over 20 got ripped of

MagicIRL

I think Vermaelen is a good signing. Anything is an improvement on Jones/Evans/Smalling. I expect one of the three to be shipped out, maybe even two, and Keane from the youth team to be brought up. I wouldn't be surprised if we sign another CB from Europe. Having Vermaelen partnering a CB with no Premier League experience could be a dream.

Perhaps Martins Indi, Blind (Although LB/DM) or de Vrij could be following Louis home on the plane?

Mitch Connor

Reasons I can see why LVG might be interested in Vermaleen.

1. Left footed - LVG likes a left footer at CB.
2. Good on the ball - can bring the ball out of defence and offer another attacking threat, which LVG likes one of his CBs to be able to do.
3. A product of the Ajax academy, so I would assume a product of the mentality and structures LVG would have put in place at that club, so would adapt quickly to the tactics of LVG.

Reasons I don't think he should be a target.

1. Not good enough to spend the money on.
2. Injury prone - all the guys we already have are injury prone, adding another injury prone CB...why?

Mars Bar

MagicIRL wrote: »

I think Vermaelen is a good signing. Anything is an improvement on Jones/Evans/Smalling. I expect one of the three to be shipped out, maybe even two, and Keane from the youth team to be brought up. I wouldn't be surprised if we sign another CB from Europe. Having Vermaelen partnering a CB with no Premier League experience could be a dream.

Perhaps Martins Indi, Blind (Although LB/DM) or de Vrij could be following Louis home on the plane?

I'd be utterly shocked if that happens. Shocked.

MagicIRL

Mars Bar wrote: »

I'd be utterly shocked if that happens. Shocked.

I wouldn't be too sure. All three spend their seasons out injured. It's not like they're providing cover from the medical table. It's gotta' be make or break at this stage. Waaaaaay too many pedestrains in the United team. When Jagielka is playing for the national team ahead of you, you need to re-evaluate your club position.

slingerz

Vermalen will only join if he's going to be playing I'd imagine. No difference for him from going as Arsenal centre half backup to United centre half backup

Adamcp898

Don't like the sound of this Vermaelen signing. The last thing this squad needs is more squad players and I certainly don't see him as starting CB for a title challenging team. If Moyes had went for him there wouldn't be nearly as much positivity floating around.

Maximus Alexander

slingerz wrote: »

Vermalen will only join if he's going to be playing I'd imagine. No difference for him from going as Arsenal centre half backup to United centre half backup

Of course there's a difference.

Backstreet Moyes

MagicIRL wrote: »

I think Vermaelen is a good signing. Anything is an improvement on Jones/Evans/Smalling. I expect one of the three to be shipped out, maybe even two, and Keane from the youth team to be brought up. I wouldn't be surprised if we sign another CB from Europe. Having Vermaelen partnering a CB with no Premier League experience could be a dream.

Perhaps Martins Indi, Blind (Although LB/DM) or de Vrij could be following Louis home on the plane?

That is a load of crap Evans has been our best defender the last two seasons. He is no Vidic but to say anything is an improvement on him is just nonsense.

TheDoc

Can't say I'd be too disheartened by the arrival of Vermaelan. OK prone to some injuries but I think he is an intellegent hearty CB. Should not be forgetting that he was playing alongside a very rubbish Kolschieny(spellcheck) who has only really developed into a good CB the last 18 months.

While it's not a Matt Hummels, I would be happy enough with him coming onboard.

I'm of the belief at this point Chris Smalling will be gone relatively soon. Might not be this season, but I've a sneaky feeling he won't make the grade at the club.

beakerjoe

Id say with Koeman coming in, hopefully Shaw deal will be wapped up soon. In relation to Vermaelen, Hes had a bad time at Arsenal but has shown he can play great for them in the past. Maybe a move could rejuvenate him and he can come good. Not the signing I expected but he could be a shrewed purchase.

MagicIRL

TheDoc wrote: »

I'm of the belief at this point Chris Smalling will be gone relatively soon. Might not be this season, but I've a sneaky feeling he won't make the grade at the club.

Agreed. That's the problem with the current United team. There's too many players that we're waiting on to come good. Jones, Smalling, Young, Valencia, Cleverly, Nani (:pac:), Welbeck (to a degree), even Rafael.

For a club that expects to challange for every trophy available, you just can't have so much dead weight hanging around a club.

beakerjoe

MagicIRL wrote: »

Agreed. That's the problem with the current United team. There's too many players that we're waiting on to come good. Jones, Smalling, Young, Valencia, Cleverly, Nani (:pac:), Welbeck (to a degree), even Rafael.

For a club that expects to challange for every trophy available, you just can't have so much dead weight hanging around a club.

Id say the homegrown rule is the only thing keeping Smalling, Young and Cleverley at the club

Spazdarn

TheDoc wrote: »

Can't say I'd be too disheartened by the arrival of Vermaelan. OK prone to some injuries but I think he is an intellegent hearty CB. Should not be forgetting that he was playing alongside a very rubbish Kolschieny(spellcheck) who has only really developed into a good CB the last 18 months.

While it's not a Matt Hummels, I would be happy enough with him coming onboard.

I'm of the belief at this point Chris Smalling will be gone relatively soon. Might not be this season, but I've a sneaky feeling he won't make the grade at the club.

Chris Smalling isn't an intelligent play it out of defence type, or a braveheart throw your head at it type. He looks very uncomfortable on the ball, I don't think he has the attributes to make it at United.

I think Evans is solid though, with a good player beside he he'll do well.

Al Capwned

I don't buy into this "Ah we should trust van Gaal with the potential signing of Vermaelan, he's been around a while" train of thought.
I am entitled to my own opinion, and just because I'm not a world-class football manager type person, doesn't mean that my opinion should be belittled or discounted.

I don't see how Vermaelan is good enough. I will judge the summers transfer policy in it's entirety, and I fully expect a top class CB, amongst others, to be brought in.

beakerjoe

Garay played well last night, would like to see how he gets on as the competition progresses

ScummyMan

Smalling was outstanding at centre back when playing against Bayern Munich. Have people forgotten that already??

How is he meant to improve as a centre back if he keeps being shoved into right back? He hasn't been given a proper chance yet, and imo he is the best prospect of Jones/Smalling/Evans.

RobertKK

If LVG still wants to play a 5-3-2, lets say against Man City for example, the fact is we need more than Vermaelen to be signed.
OK there is Keane as back up but he lacks experience, so Jones, Evans and Smalling, add in Vermaelen, add in injuries and it is easy to see Vermaelen will not be the last signing for central defense.
That is my opinion, I think we will see one more CB signing.

I'll go with Daley Blind being signed too, maybe with Shaw. Blind can play LB, CB and CDM.
The versatility of Blind would make him an interesting signing.

United might not go for big money signings in defense, and save the money for midfield and the wings.

In the league:
Last season United conceded 43 goals and scored 64.
The previous season conceded 43 goals and scored 86 goals.

The defense last season did no worse than the previous season, United need to spend big on midfield and the winger area, given this is the supply chain for the goals.
So if we don't go overboard on the defense spending it makes sense, the supply chain to goal is the problem.
ok, RVP and Rooney were injured at times and this caused a major problem, but we don't have any wingers who can score lots of goals, or midfielders who can to make up for it when the main strikers are injured.

To score 25% less goals in the league, while conceding the same number of goals shows the defense was not really a problem area, yes 43 is not the best ever for United, but it was the goal scoring that was the problem.

Mata was settling in nicely and scoring well towards the end of the season. Rooney is a problem in the team, he was very good last season but fittting him in the team is the problem as RVP is a more lethal striker, Mata is a better number 10, not sure Rooney is happy on the wings and apart from the good cross in the England game, he looked ineffective there (got far too much criticism for that game).
I would sell Rooney and have Welbeck, Wilson and maybe even Lingard as back up for striker, yeah I know Lingard is not a striker but he has the eye of one when in front of goal.

We lack goals when out wingers are useless, exclude Januzaj - young so he will only improve, Nani way too injury prone, Young can score great goals but waiting for one and you could be dead while waiting and if he does start scoring he will get injured and be out for ages, Valencia is not good enough.

Defense spending will not be priority apart from replacing Vidic and Rio, maybe why Vermaelen is strongly linked.
The main money will be spent on the midfield and the wings in my opinion, it could be why we are linked with Cavani a lot, he is more versatile than Rooney and can play wide. If Cavani is bought it would mean Rooney is going in my opinion, leaves Mata and Kagawa better placed in the team too.

My prediction for signings:
2 wingers to replace the ones that are sold.
2 midfielders, maybe two more sold here - Fellaini and take your pick...
A left back and 2 central defenders.

I am going for a big clear out to make room for the new signings.

I expect a lot will find things wrong with my post :pac:

TheDoc

Man.UnitedLad wrote: »

Smalling was outstanding at centre back when playing against Bayern Munich. Have people forgotten that already??

How is he meant to improve as a centre back if he keeps being shoved into right back? He hasn't been given a proper chance yet, and imo he is the best prospect of Jones/Smalling/Evans.

the phrase every dog has his day springs to mind in fairness.

I think when your a CB for United, there is a certain expectation that you will be inactive for spells, so being switched on, focused and alert to a moments danger is very important.

Smalling puts of to me this aura that his mind somewhat drifts. While a bit of pace might cover that up, he doesn't come accross as the most switched on individual.

I don't know I'm not entirely writing Smalling off, but similarlly to how I felt with Cleverly and Anderson, time for waiting seems up, and there needs to be tangible performances coming now.

keeponhurling

Still no new signings. Pretty amazing how Chelsea got the Fabregas deal tied up so quickly (a la the Matic deal in January).

Are United waiting until Aug 31st again to do their transfer business?

TheDoc

keeponhurling wrote: »

Still no new signings. Pretty amazing how Chelsea got the Fabregas deal tied up so quickly (a la the Matic deal in January).

Are United waiting until Aug 31st again to do their transfer business?

As much as Fabregas seems to be indicating it was his choice, I think everyone knows that Barcalona were offloading him.

As typical with someone who is essentially being touted for sale, communication would be sent to assuming target clubs.

The Fabregas deal is different to what we are dealing with, and we need to appreciate that if we are going to run comparisons.

I'm not defending our club, obviously we would all like deals to be done early to alleviate any fears.

But there is a big difference with Fabregas, a player Barca openly communicated to clubs is available, against our targets, which the clubs involved do not seem willing to let the players go.

The Shaw deal is unique in itself, in that the club obviously don't want to sell, but have a player who feels he can take a jump in his career early, and wants to make the move. They are in the precurious situation of being managerless, and not wanting to disway potential candidates who might be looking on to see their top players being sold.

It's rare that at top player is open for transfer, in that the club are willing to get off the books. That provides wiggle room in regarding fees. Normally we are dealing with targets who are key members of their squads and clubs dont want to sell.

We are shifting in terms of transfer targets. While the odd marquee comes in every so often down the years, normally we took players from smaller clubs. We had the benefit that the player would be more then likely blown away with our interest and wanting to move, and the clubs ivnolved not really able to say no to the money we were offering.

That paradigm has shifted now, as we are hunting top class players, already assosiated with top clubs, or being chased by rivals. Our money isn't diswaying big hitters like Bayern and co., and the players involved are already used to CL football and playing at a high level.

I for one, can fully appreciate why this is a tough and testing time for the club in terms of the transfer market, but the hope is that with the arrival of LVG the mood and outlook is more positive, and players would maybe look at our CL omissions as a blip to be rectified next season.

bangkok

up until Friday nobody here even heard of Daley Blind, 3 days later people want him signed

MagicIRL

bangkok wrote: »

up until Friday nobody here even heard of Daley Blind, 3 days later people want him signed

When you bend the Spanish midfield over and make it your bitch, you deserve to be looked at with high esteem.

Backstreet Moyes

TheDoc wrote: »

the phrase every dog has his day springs to mind in fairness.

I think when your a CB for United, there is a certain expectation that you will be inactive for spells, so being switched on, focused and alert to a moments danger is very important.

Smalling puts of to me this aura that his mind somewhat drifts. While a bit of pace might cover that up, he doesn't come accross as the most switched on individual.

I don't know I'm not entirely writing Smalling off, but similarlly to how I felt with Cleverly and Anderson, time for waiting seems up, and there needs to be tangible performances coming now.

How is the time for waiting up for Smalling. He has never got a consistent run of games to show if he is good enough or not.

RobertKK

Does anyone think Varela will be used next season when Rafael is injured or suspended from getting too many cards?

bangkok

MagicIRL wrote: »

When you bend the Spanish midfield over and make it your bitch, you deserve to be looked at with high esteem.

im sure van gaal knows how good he is anyway. don't want to do a Liverpool on it, Senegal beat france in the world cup and Liverpool go out and spend big money on salif diao and el hadji diouf!!!

MagicIRL

bangkok wrote: »

im sure van gaal knows how good he is anyway. don't want to do a Liverpool on it, Senegal beat france in the world cup and Liverpool go out and spend big money on salif diao and el hadji diouf!!!

Blind can not possibly turn out worse than Tom Cleverly. Everything's an improvement on our midfield.

newballsplease

Times saying Southampton rejected Shaw Bid now.

TheDoc

bangkok wrote: »

up until Friday nobody here even heard of Daley Blind, 3 days later people want him signed

WC syndrome.

Similar to Fabio Contrao. Nobody had a ****ing clue who he was before South Africa, lad was immense and off he went to Real Madrid.

Bound to be a couple like this during the summer, but I'd say with LVG being part of the dutch setup he has a good indication of who's decent and who isn't.

Have to say first thing we were saying after that match was that we would bet any money Blind would appear on this infamous "target list" in the papers.

In fairness to F365, they did a "youngster to watch out for" about 2 months ago and Blind, aswell as Griezmann for France appeared on that list. So he wasn't a total non entity.

If I'm honest while the Dutch squad were impervious to watch and operated so well together, it's debatable how one would operate independantly from that system and playerbase.

Robben would be the only one for me in terms of " a must have" from that squad.

TheDoc

Nuts102 wrote: »

How is the time for waiting up for Smalling. He has never got a consistent run of games to show if he is good enough or not.

Well the counter arguement there is that he has not shown in the games he has got, or in training, that is he worthy or getting a run out in his prefered position.

The same aguement put towards Kagawa, and while I appreciate where your coming from, I think both sides hold just as much weight.

beno619

Im really excited about what LVG could do with someone like Powell, he could be an midfield option.

beno619

TheDoc wrote: »

Well the counter arguement there is that he has not shown in the games he has got, or in training, that is he worthy or getting a run out in his prefered position.

The same aguement put towards Kagawa, and while I appreciate where your coming from, I think both sides hold just as much weight.

Well im not sure mow many times you've watched him on training, but he was basically fist choice last season. Smalling and Jones have never has settled runs in the side for numerous reasons.

Corvo

Little bit underwhelmed with the possible signing of Vermaelan as I thought for sure we would be aiming a bit higher than that quality-wise and also looking to recruit a little bit more reliable injury-wise when our own current defenders in the squad have been plagued for more than two years with consistent strains and all forms of back problems etc.

I understand that LVG may very well have a vision of how he wants to set up his defence and how it will operate and you would believe that he knows this player well enough to make a decision on him, but like I said - a bit underwhelming.

Bannerman7

Lots of rumours about players coming in, not much word about anyone leaving.
Will it be a case of LVG wanting to have a look at the squad before he decides who will go ?
If that's the case he wont have much time to move anyone on when he gets back from the WC.

bangkok

Bannerman7 wrote: »

Lots of rumours about players coming in, not much word about anyone leaving.
Will it be a case of LVG wanting to have a look at the squad before he decides who will go ?
If that's the case he wont have much time to move anyone on when he gets back from the WC.

eh vidic, rio macheda left and giggs retired

Iseedeadpixels

bangkok wrote: »

eh vidic, rio macheda left and giggs retired

I think he's talking about players being sold.