Chemtrails

Augmerson

I don't know what to think about Chemtrails. A few of my friends, one in particular, are very into it and regularly post things about Chemtrails on Facebook.

I was always interested in conspiracy theories growing up and still am to a certain degree. It's not totally unbelievable to suggest that governments are up to something but I don't think Chemtrails are real. Having spoken to my friends, they've presented convincing arguments, but all their arguments are different.

It's either to control the population, to dumb down the population or as some form of weather control, or as an extension of HAARP.

It's just a bit hard to believe that multiple governments are all in on this, that they are using ordinary civilian aircraft to do it, that no one has come forward and said "Yeah I was a pilot for it we did it" like with Edward Snowden and the mass US surveillance or hard evidence like Wikileaks.

What do ye think folks?

Frosty McSnowballs

I believe in snailtrails

CianRyan

It's bollocks.

BonkeyDonker

I don't know why these people are worried about them - their tinfoil's hats will protect them.

I always ask this question - if they are able to produce whatever "chemtrails" are - why can they not make them invisible?? From my experience - and I must admit I do it primarily as a WUM to these people - the answer makes even less sense than the initial conspiracy.
And I have yet to see a theory that cannot be shot to pieces - not that it matters as these people generally tend to only believe their own ideas anyway.

Duffman K

Had to google what it was having never heard of it before. I didn't do much research now, but after a quick read it seems like ( the same as most conspiracy theories) a huge load of boll0cks.

Links234

Folks who don't know what a vapor trail is

seamus

People believe in conspiracy theories because they're unable or unwilling to accept that their failings in life are down to themselves and instead wish to believe there are external forces personally conspiring against them.

Typically those who believe in things like chemtrails have not tried (or are incapable of) understanding the actual scale of things, and there's a strong correlation with mental illnesses, especially those with strong paranoia aspects like schizophrenia and bipolar disorder.

Unfortunately studies have also shown that attempting to change someone's mind with hard facts and numbers often has exactly the opposite effect. Conspiracy theories operate much like religions in that they've inbuilt mechanisms into their delusion which tell them that anyone who attempts to change their mind is an agent of the enemy and should therefore be ignored/attacked.

Maximus Alexander

They're called contrails.

But then... Maybe I work for the government? Oooooh! *Ghost sounds*

Bipolar Joe

My Uncle is a conspiracy theorist. He's a bit not all there, but intelligent all the same. Never talked to him about chemtrails, but an old housemate of mine believed in them. I asked how he thought every government agreed to do it, when a single government can't fully agree on a single thing amongst themselves, got lots of sideways answers.

Honestly, a part of me thinks that these theories are invented by various people within government. It helps to separate a population, and stops at least some people from looking at all the horrible things that really are happening. My Uncle, if he put the same effort into looking at those things as he did looking at conspiracies, he'd make a phenomenal investigative journalist.

My name is URL

It's either to control the population, to dumb down the population or as some form of weather control, or as an extension of HAARP.

The irony is that contrails probably could be used to 'control' weather to some degree, but the loons that bang on about chemicals don't even realise that.

catallus

This chemtrails thing is a widely discredited internet meme, much like atheism.

Anyways, they don't need chemtrails to control us what with all the fluoride they're putting in our water! They're trying to contaminate our precious bodily fluids.

Maximus Alexander

Bipolar Joe wrote: »

My Uncle, if he put the same effort into looking at those things as he did looking at conspiracies, he'd make a phenomenal investigative journalist.

To be honest, and without meaning to be insulting, if he's put his mind to work on contrails and concluded that they are filled with mind controlling chemicals (I know you haven't confirmed that he thinks this), he'd make an absolutely terrible investigative journalist.

Augmerson

seamus wrote: »

People believe in conspiracy theories because they're unable or unwilling to accept that their failings in life are down to themselves and instead wish to believe there are external forces personally conspiring against them.

Typically those who believe in things like chemtrails have not tried (or are incapable of) understanding the actual scale of things, and there's a strong correlation with mental illnesses, especially those with strong paranoia aspects like schizophrenia and bipolar disorder.

Unfortunately studies have also shown that attempting to change someone's mind with hard facts and numbers often has exactly the opposite effect. Conspiracy theories operate much like religions in that they've inbuilt mechanisms into their delusion which tell them that anyone who attempts to change their mind is an agent of the enemy and should therefore be ignored/attacked.

People thought for years that the government was spying on them and it turned out they were. People will believe in conspiracy theories as they are born out of mistrust for governments, and some governments have a track record of betraying or lying to their people like the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 for instance.

Overheal

chemtrail CTs are the result of not understanding basic science.

Maximus Alexander

Augmerson wrote: »

People thought for years that the government was spying on them and it turned out they were. People will believe in conspiracy theories as they are born out of mistrust for governments, and some governments have a track record of betraying or lying to their people like the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 for instance.

But being mistrustful of a government is entirely reasonable. Making up fantastical alternate explanations for mundane phenomena and holding to them despite evidence to the contrary is not.

Augmerson

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

But being mistrustful of a government is entirely reasonable. Making up fantastical alternate explanations for mundane phenomena and holding to them despite evidence to the contrary is not.

And I agree with you.

blackwhite

Augmerson wrote: »

What do ye think folks?

I think there's a perfectly good conspiracy theories forum for you to post about nonsense like this on.

Links234

catallus wrote: »

This chemtrails thing is a widely discredited internet meme, much like atheism.

Hahaha! :pac:

Jawgap

Augmerson wrote: »

People thought for years that the government was spying on them and it turned out they were. People will believe in conspiracy theories as they are born out of mistrust for governments, and some governments have a track record of betraying or lying to their people like the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 for instance.

I think it's a fair bet that electronic eavesdropping has been going on since the day after Graham Bell invented the telephone. Were people really that surprised to find out someone like the NSA and GCHQ (welcome to our readers from these fine establishments) were hoovering up data?

As regards the chemtrails - what is it that we are (supposedly) being sprayed with? And in the era ever more accurate and sensitive analytical methods, how come whatever it is hasn't been detected? Who is manufacturing and distributing the stuff? And what actual effect is it supposed to have?

Bipolar Joe

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

To be honest, and without meaning to be insulting, if he's put his mind to work on contrails and concluded that they are filled with mind controlling chemicals (I know you haven't confirmed that he thinks this), he'd make an absolutely terrible investigative journalist.

I didn't say it was my Uncle who believed in chemtrails. That was my old housemate, who is a moron. The thing is, my Uncle has all these files he's written and notes and all sorts of stuff, teaching himself physics in an effort to really know. There was that two suns thing a few years ago. A lot of his conspiracy buddies thought he was mental because he said it doesn't make sense, but the same guy thinks there's an alien base on the other side of the moon. The sun, you can very clearly see there's only one. Only a handful of people have seen the moon up close and personal. Is there a secret alien moon base? most likely not, but I'm fucking stumped if I can prove it.

Hootanany

I witnessed some thing strange about 2 months ago
Loads of chemtrails planes pizzing them out criss crossing the sky.
Thing that got was 2 planes also in the sky and nothing coming out of them have pics as well.

Maximus Alexander

Bipolar Joe wrote: »

I didn't say it was my Uncle who believed in chemtrails. That was my old housemate, who is a moron. The thing is, my Uncle has all these files he's written and notes and all sorts of stuff, teaching himself physics in an effort to really know. There was that two suns thing a few years ago. A lot of his conspiracy buddies thought he was mental because he said it doesn't make sense, but the same guy thinks there's an alien base on the other side of the moon. The sun, you can very clearly see there's only one. Only a handful of people have seen the moon up close and personal. Is there a secret alien moon base? most likely not, but I'm fucking stumped if I can prove it.

Sure, because you can't prove that sort of negative. That's why the burden of proof always lies with the person claiming something exists. The more important question is, if you can't prove that it does or does not exist, what possible reasons do you have to believe it? Or care for that matter?

Also the other side of the moon has been photographed in high resolution. I think it's on Google Earth now.

Augmerson

Jawgap wrote: »

As regards the chemtrails - what is it that we are (supposedly) being sprayed with? And in the era ever more accurate and sensitive analytical methods, how come whatever it is hasn't been detected? Who is manufacturing and distributing the stuff? And what actual effect is it supposed to have?

I haven't a clue. I'm not pro Chemtrails. I am interested in what other people think about it though. These are very good and valid questions to be asking.

Mickeroo

Hootanany wrote: »

I witnessed some thing strange about 2 months ago
Loads of chemtrails planes pizzing them out criss crossing the sky.
Thing that got was 2 planes also in the sky and nothing coming out of them have pics as well.

Contrails require very specific conditions to occur and when they do happen the window in which they occur is quite small so planes flying at different altitudes might not necessarily produce them on a given day. There's actually no mystery surrounding how and why they occur at all.

Bipolar Joe

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Sure, because you can't prove that sort of negative. That's why the burden of proof always lies with the person claiming something exists. The more important question is, if you can't prove that it does or does not exist, what possible reasons do you have to believe it? Or care for that matter?

Also the other side of the moon has been photographed in high resolution. I think it's on Google Earth now.

"The burden of proof" is mostly a B.S. argument. How can I prove giant blue elephants are not in my house? Because I am here in it and can see there are none. As far as photographs go, there have been doctored photos before. It's still nonsense to me, but oh well. The end I guess.

seamus

Augmerson wrote: »

These are very good and valid questions to be asking.

"What is that coming out of the back of the plane" is a perfectly good question.

But then making the assumption that it's something malicious and using that as a basis for further questions, is not valid.

The sheer volume of people you would need to even lightly spray chemicals over Dublin in any quantifiable volume is staggering. Effectively you would need a few thousand people in Dublin alone to be complicit in the conspiracy in order to make it work. And not one of them speaks out, ever, to anyone.

You're talking hundreds of millions of people involved in aviation (even tenuously) all over the world, who have never once mentioned the fact that they are spraying chemicals in urban areas - not in the pub with their mates, not online, not even to their spouses.

It's the same as the moon landing conspiracy, which this video sums up best

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mo_nltYf9gw

The idea that chemtrails occur is ridiculous in itself. But even better is the absence of any reason for chemtrails to exist in the first place.

Jawgap

There are easier ways to spray the population - just introduce some mossies carrying West Nile Virus, then once human cases start to appear - BOOM - there's your excuse for lots of low level night time spraying.

Much more efficient than trying to spray from 30,000 feet.

Maximus Alexander

Bipolar Joe wrote: »

"The burden of proof" is mostly a B.S. argument. How can I prove giant blue elephants are not in my house? Because I am here in it and can see there are none. As far as photographs go, there have been doctored photos before. It's still nonsense to me, but oh well. The end I guess.

Checking every room in your house for giant blue elephants and not finding any would actually be really solid proof that they weren't there. You've basically described how science works.

kneemos

What about 90% of the landmass not underneath flightpaths?

catallus

Cos they're trying to get the fish too aswell, silly!

Jonny7

for anyone entertaining this theory or even sitting on the fence..

they've been loading containers of chemicals onto an indeterminal amount of aircraft for decades without the pilots or ground crews knowledge, without the mechanics who go over every inch of the plane discovering.. across every country in the world.. and remotely operating the spraying on clear days where they these trails are most visible.. spraying at an altitude that guarantees the chemical will be long dispersed before it even hits the ground.. no one has ever discovered what this "chemical" is, and there's never been any leaks.. from all the thousands in all the governments across the world..

surely it would be easier to pop something into the water.. oh wait

Son Of A Vidic

seamus wrote: »

People believe in conspiracy theories because they're unable or unwilling to accept that their failings in life are down to themselves and instead wish to believe there are external forces personally conspiring against them.

That's a pretty big sweeping generalisation don't you think? One of my best mates is totally minted, he doesn't need to work, is a fine amateur astronomer and is really into this chemtrails/geoengineering/contrails malarkey. So in every regard, he doesn't fit into the assumptions you made. People have their own beliefs for their own personal reasons. But to then attribute these beliefs to personal failings on their part? Well that's just utterly nonsensical imo.

wretcheddomain

I know a guy with a Ph.D in Conspiracy Theories but he doesn't himself believe he has it.

cml387

I posted in the Conspiracy Theories once (first and last time let me tell you) that surely it would make more sense to do the chemtrailly thing when it's overcast rather than wait when the sky is clear.
I got a warning for that.

Overheal

cml387 wrote: »

I posted in the Conspiracy Theories once (first and last time let me tell you) that surely it would make more sense to do the chemtrailly thing when it's overcast rather than wait when the sky is clear.
I got a warning for that.

Actually, it was using the term "Great Lizard Conspiracy" that got you carded.

cml387

Overheal wrote: »

Actually, it was using the term "Great Lizard Conspiracy" that got you carded.

Well I might have done.:o