Foal killed in Galway

meoklmrk91

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Can you give us a link to the law saying that?

Well it is in Limerick, I assumed it would be the same in Galway, if its note I'm sorry.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Nice link - but it does not say that you are not allowed to keep horses in an urban area. All it says is that is some designated Control Areas, you must have a license.

Is Galway City even designated as a Control Area?

And please point to the place where I have said that I have no interest in having the issue solved.

I would say that I'm equally interested in having it solved, but that I do not believe a solution which basically says "shoot them all" is going to be acceptable. (I'm not a horse lover .. but even I don't think they deserve to be shot just 'cos their owner is ignorant.)

I also don't think the horse should be shot just because the owner is an entitled moron. I'm sure plenty of rescues would love to offer places. However as it stands we have an overpopulation of horses, there are simply not enough good homes for them so some may have to be put down. It's a sad fact but IMHO, it's better than being sold for €5 to some kids and being jocked to death, or being beaten to death and then set alight.

If I decided in the morning that I wanted a pet cow and put it in my backyard in a residential neighbourhood I doubt the council would too long in telling to get rid of it because Cows do not belong in residential areas, why is it different for horses?

Discodog

Before meetings & petitions the following need to be done.

Find out which areas of Galway have been designated Controlled Areas as per the Control of Horses Act.

Have specific examples including dates, times, call logs etc. You have to be able to show that the Council have failed to act.

If you go off half cocked the Council will just dismiss you & ask for specific examples of where they have failed to implement the Act.

The GSPCA are almost powerless - the ISPCA would be the better choice.

To put things in perspective. The Irish donate more per person than the English to charity. But the English donate five times more per person to Animal charities.

If the ISPCA received this level of funding we would have few neglected horses.

Roquentin

Discodog wrote: »

Before meetings & petitions the following need to be done.

Find out which areas of Galway have been designated Controlled Areas as per the Control of Horses Act.

Have specific examples including dates, times, call logs etc. You have to be able to show that the Council have failed to act.

If you go off half cocked the Council will just dismiss you & ask for specific examples of where they have failed to implement the Act.

The GSPCA are almost powerless - the ISPCA would be the better choice.

To put things in perspective. The Irish donate more per person than the English to charity. But the English donate five times more per person to Animal charities.

If the ISPCA received this level of funding we would have few neglected horses.

I would be also putting pressure on Simon Coveney to introduce better legislation for animals on the whole. The UK have a good model that we should adopt.

Discodog

Roquentin wrote: »

I would be also putting pressure on Simon Coveney to introduce better legislation for animals on the whole. The UK have a good model that we should adopt.

We already have. The recent Animal Welfare Act provides much better protection.

Where we fall short is enforcement. The SPCA'S need to stop arguing & become one national ISPCA.

One other point. The enforcement of the Control of Horses Act & what happened to the foal are separate & different issues.

meoklmrk91

Discodog wrote: »

We already have. The recent Animal Welfare Act provides much better protection.

Where we fall short is enforcement. The SPCA'S need to stop arguing & become one national ISPCA.

One other point. The enforcement of the Control of Horses Act & what happened to the foal are separate & different issues.

Yes they are different issues but if the control of horses act was enforced then this foal would never have been there, thus this would never have happened.

The ISPCA definitely need more funding, we definitely need more inspectors for a start, at the very least one per county. The SPCA's uniting with the ISCPA will never happen, for a start most rescues operate under a no kill policy, the ISPCA doesn't.

Discodog

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

Yes they are different issues but if the control of horses act was enforced then this foal would never have been there, thus this would never have happened.

The ISPCA definitely need more funding, we definitely need more inspectors for a start, at the very least one per county. The SPCA's uniting with the ISCPA will never happen, for a start most rescues operate under a no kill policy, the ISPCA doesn't.

I disagree in that plenty of horses get abused that have nothing to do with being kept in gardens. Most horses in Ireland are a commodity.

Rescues don't really have a no kill policy. If you are full & can't take more dogs then more die in the Pounds. The ISPCA kill
because they operate official dog Pounds. They started doing this because they thought that they could do it better than the LA's. Actually the figures show that they perform badly.

The GSPCA should focus on their name ie preventing cruelty rather than rescue & rehoming. There are plenty of rescues who are extremely good at rehoming.
I am disappointed that there hasn't been a major campaign to persuade existing horse owners to take a rescue horse. I am certain that a lot could be rehomed.

After the infamous Spindles Farm prosecution, in the UK, the RSPCA were inundated with offers of help from the equestrian community. Dozens of horses were rehomed.

TheSegal

Was cycling through Ballybane yesterday around 8 and there was a foal wandering around the roads blocking traffic beside the church, I didn't see anyone around it but I didn't want to intervene as didn't know anything about the foal.

Is this a regular occurrence in Ballybane? I never thought to stop a take a picture, but after reading this thread I wish I had so the GSPCA could have a look at it

Mrs OBumble

TheSegal wrote: »

Was cycling through Ballybane yesterday around 8 and there was a foal wandering around the roads blocking traffic beside the church, I didn't see anyone around it but I didn't want to intervene as didn't know anything about the foal.

Is this a regular occurrence in Ballybane? I never thought to stop a take a picture, but after reading this thread I wish I had so the GSPCA could have a look at it

Why didn't you call the council there and then?

TristanPeter

I see mention was made of the petition in the Advertiser today. We need to keep the pressure on so it does not blow over. Cllr. Mairead Farrell made a good point in that all councillors have to act as one on the issue overall.

Roquentin

TristanPeter wrote: »

I see mention was made of the petition in the Advertiser today. We need to keep the pressure on so it does not blow over. Cllr. Mairead Farrell made a good point in that all councillors have to act as one on the issue overall.

http://www.advertiser.ie/galway/article/70495/vile-killing-of-foal-must-be-catalyst-for-action-on-horses-in-estates

yea, need to keep the pressure on.

TheSegal

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Why didn't you call the council there and then?

To be honest with you I was so shocked at the fact that there was a foal out in the middle of the road that I didn't even think of it. I cycle through there quite a lot and it's the first time I seen one in the middle of the road with no one around it. You can be sure that i'll be ringing either the council or Mill St. Garda station with details and taking pictures next time.

meoklmrk91

Discodog wrote: »

I disagree in that plenty of horses get abused that have nothing to do with being kept in gardens. Most horses in Ireland are a commodity.

Rescues don't really have a no kill policy. If you are full & can't take more dogs then more die in the Pounds. The ISPCA kill
because they operate official dog Pounds. They started doing this because they thought that they could do it better than the LA's. Actually the figures show that they perform badly.

The GSPCA should focus on their name ie preventing cruelty rather than rescue & rehoming. There are plenty of rescues who are extremely good at rehoming.
I am disappointed that there hasn't been a major campaign to persuade existing horse owners to take a rescue horse. I am certain that a lot could be rehomed.

After the infamous Spindles Farm prosecution, in the UK, the RSPCA were inundated with offers of help from the equestrian community. Dozens of horses were rehomed.

I'm not saying that horses outside of cities lead wonderful lives and are never abused but in this specific case if the control of horses act had been enforced then this foal wouldn't have been abused.

Rescues do have an no kill policy, just because animals are killed elsewhere when they are full does not mean that they don't operate a no kill policy, it just means that they are full and can't take anymore animals and as a result of that some sadly are PTS. I am well aware that ISPCA run some of our pounds and of the figures. This is a major difference in basic ethos therefore I cannot see them joining forces anytime soon. IMHO the ISPCA is poorly run in many capacities, severely underfunded and has been asleep at the wheel for far too long.

I'm not even sure that the GSPCA have an inspector, if they have up rescue and rehoming where would the funding come from? Where would they take animals that they have seized if they do not rescue and rehome?

Roquentin

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/675/147/288/#sign

for anyone who views the thread

Discodog

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

I'm not saying that horses outside of cities lead wonderful lives and are never abused but in this specific case if the control of horses act had been enforced then this foal wouldn't have been abused.

Rescues do have an no kill policy, just because animals are killed elsewhere when they are full does not mean that they don't operate a no kill policy, it just means that they are full and can't take anymore animals and as a result of that some sadly are PTS. I am well aware that ISPCA run some of our pounds and of the figures. This is a major difference in basic ethos therefore I cannot see them joining forces anytime soon. IMHO the ISPCA is poorly run in many capacities, severely underfunded and has been asleep at the wheel for far too long.

I'm not even sure that the GSPCA have an inspector, if they have up rescue and rehoming where would the funding come from? Where would they take animals that they have seized if they do not rescue and rehome?

I agree with you regarding the ISPCA & I know people who work with them.

Of course an SPCA needs a holding & recuperation facility but rehoming should be farmed out to the rescues.

We need a single organisation like the RSPCA in the UK. The Dog's Trust have proved that people here will donate.

meoklmrk91

Discodog wrote: »

I agree with you regarding the ISPCA & I know people who work with them.

Of course an SPCA needs a holding & recuperation facility but rehoming should be farmed out to the rescues.

We need a single organisation like the RSPCA in the UK. The Dog's Trust have proved that people here will donate.

I think we can agree then, we definitely need one organisation, I have found from my experience in rescue etc. that a lot of time is spent on different organisations arguing. Just this week there has been the whole DSPCA, ISPCA, Dogs Trust and donedeal debacle goes to prove that. We badly need one organisation that the country can get behind. The RSPCA is far from perfect, but it's better than what we have.

galwaygirl08

TheSegal wrote: »

To be honest with you I was so shocked at the fact that there was a foal out in the middle of the road that I didn't even think of it. I cycle through there quite a lot and it's the first time I seen one in the middle of the road with no one around it. You can be sure that i'll be ringing either the council or Mill St. Garda station with details and taking pictures next time.

Its a common occurrence at all hours of the day sadly enough.
Please report these issues straightaway.
There seems to be very few who are actually picking up the phone to do so. Page up on Facebook if you happen to be on there. 'Ban horses from our residential areas in Galway City'.
Alot of contact numbers and email addresses on there. We need to keep the pressure on.

Discodog

galwaygirl08 wrote: »

Its a common occurrence at all hours of the day sadly enough.
Please report these issues straightaway.
There seems to be very few who are actually picking up the phone to do so. Page up on oFacebook if you happen to be on there. 'Ban horses from our residential areas in Galway City'.
Alot of contact numbers and email addresses on there. We need to keep the pressure on.

If you see a stray horse the only number that you need is 999.
It's up to the Guards to deal with it or refer it to the appropriate authority.

antoobrien

Discodog wrote: »

If you see a stray horse the only number that you need is 999.
It's up to the Guards to deal with it or refer it to the appropriate authority.

http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Lang=1&Page=1698

When do I call 999?
You should call 999 or 112 in the case of an emergency. An emergency is any incident which requires an immediate Garda response. Examples of emergencies are:-

A danger to life
Risk of serious injury
Crime in progress or about to happen
Offender still at scene or has just left

Stray horse does not (usually) cover these, ring the garda station. The only reason I'd ring 999 not the station would be if one got loose on busy road.

Discodog

antoobrien wrote: »

http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Lang=1&Page=1698



Stray horse does not (usually) cover these, ring the garda station. The only reason I'd ring 999 not the station would be if one got loose on busy road.

A stray horse can easily become a danger to drivers or pedestrians. People may not know where the local station is.

Why is it that we find it wrong to call 999 whereas in the UK you would do it instinctively?

antoobrien

Discodog wrote: »

A stray horse can easily become a danger to drivers or pedestrians.

999 is for real emergencies, a stray animal in most cases is not. A stray horse/donkey wandering about castlepark is not a reason for a 999 call, a stray horse/donkey wandering about at the GMIT roundabout might be.

Discodog wrote: »

People may not know where the local station is.

It's not hard to find out, among others directory enquiries will have a list. While I don't know the number for any of the stations in Galway, I can still get one within a minute.

Discodog wrote: »

Why is it that we find it wrong to call 999 whereas in the UK you would do it instinctively?

In the UK a 999 is apparently appropriate for:
Repair advice (Cracked toilet & loose worktops)
Getting clothes off a washing line
Cooking advice (time to cook a turkey at Christmas)
Have seagulls arrested for a breach of the peace
Requesting confiscaed cannabis back


and

Manchester United performances

Discodog

I would far rather that it was seen as normal to dial 999. The operator can easily redirect the call to the appropriate authority.

The fact that animal neglect & even cruelty are not seen as emergencies may have contributed to the death of the foal.

I wonder how the Guards would react to a report that a horse is being tormented or being pelted with rocks. At least a 999 call gets logged.

antoobrien

Discodog wrote: »

I would far rather that it was seen as normal to dial 999. The operator can easily redirect the call to the appropriate authority.

Normalising 999 calls for non-emergency situations is northing short of criminal as it will take vital resources away from situations where it's needed, e.g. somebody trying to report a house fire or car accident.

The fact that animal neglect & even cruelty are not seen as emergencies may have contributed to the death of the foal.

And it may not have, there are facilities in place to report both neglect and cruelty.

On the GSPCA report cruelty page, they don't mention the emergency services, so unless the animal will die quickly without intervention, I'd be contacting the garda stations in Oranmore/Mill St/Salthill rather than ringing the emergency services.

I wonder how the Guards would react to a report that a horse is being tormented or being pelted with rocks.

Probably would the refer it to GSPCA.

At least a 999 call gets logged.

A 999 call getting logged will also get nuisance callers logged, and imo reporting strays to 999 is nuisance calling.

TristanPeter

If I had seen the foal being beaten I'd have no problem calling 999. They can re-direct as required.

Last year, a stray horse was killed on the Old Monivea Road (near to the reservoir) by a car which drove into it. The driver could have been killed too but luckily wasn't. A 999 call would really have helped here had one been made. Perhaps a car already in the vicinity could have been dispatched very quickly.

The amount of times I have gone out and picked big rocks off the road too which were knocked off the walls by horses straying in search of food. It's a serious accident waiting to happen. I wouldn't call 999 for every stray horse, I'd judge each incident individually.

Discodog

The whole point is that we need one number. There is absolutely no reason why the 999 operator can't forward the call or direct the caller to the appropriate service.

Would a child being beaten constitute an emergency? But an animal suffering pain isn't?

Someone left a dog in a car today. A woman, who turned out to be a Vet, called the security responsible for the car park. They said that it was nothing to do with them.

The owner returned & gave the Vet abuse along the lines of "it's none of your business". Even if the GSPCA arrived they would not be able to do anything. The only people that could of saved the dog were the Guards.

The vet told me that she had called Guards before & they had refused to break into a car.

So given the helplessness & underfunding of the GSPCA, the attitude of the Guards & the view that animals aren't an emergency, the poor horses haven't a hope.

Discodog

By the way the examples of 999 misuse in the UK may be funny but a loose horse would be regarded as a valid reason as would a dog in a car.

The UK Police will close a motorway to rescue a Swan.

Roquentin

Discodog wrote: »

The whole point is that we need one number. There is absolutely no reason why the 999 operator can't forward the call or direct the caller to the appropriate service.

Would a child being beaten constitute an emergency? But an animal suffering pain isn't?

Someone left a dog in a car today. A woman, who turned out to be a Vet, called the security responsible for the car park. They said that it was nothing to do with them.

The owner returned & gave the Vet abuse along the lines of "it's none of your business". Even if the GSPCA arrived they would not be able to do anything. The only people that could of saved the dog were the Guards.

The vet told me that she had called Guards before & they had refused to break into a car.

So given the helplessness & underfunding of the GSPCA, the attitude of the Guards & the view that animals aren't an emergency, the poor horses haven't a hope.

it would be ideal if there existed an animal control officer like they have in america, who has the same powers as a police officer.

Discodog

Roquentin wrote: »

it would be ideal if there existed an animal control officer like they have in america, who has the same powers as a police officer.

I could break a car window in the UK because, when the Police turn up, they would support my actions.

The Gardai will always be the final authority because only they can enforce the law.

galwaygirl08

Well ringing Millstreet, The Community Garda and almost every dept in the City Council hasn't done much good for myself or the neighbors this past week. Do we honestly have to resort to 999 at this stage? Because I am running out of options slowly.

We have been reporting the same pony every single day since it arrived on the estate last Sunday.
Today we witnessed the owner and 4 or 5 other youths mount the pony one by one in the middle of the housing estate, and they then beat him with a whip as they circled around the field at speed.
These youths range in ages from 12 up to 25. You can imagine the size of these guys sitting on top of this poor animal.

The council said they were dispatching an inspector to the area straightaway. The Garda said they were sending out an officer too.
This did not happen. I am pulling my hair out at this stage. This is another tragedy waiting to happen.

As already stated, these are not people you can intervene with as neighbors have made the mistake of doing so already.
I am so god damn angry. We have spent the entire week on the phone and the situation still remains the same.

TristanPeter

galwaygirl08 wrote: »

We have been reporting the same pony every single day since it arrived on the estate last Sunday.
Today we witnessed the owner and 4 or 5 other youths mount the pony one by one in the middle of the housing estate, and they then beat him with a whip as they circled around the field at speed.
These youths range in ages from 12 up to 25. You can imagine the size of these guys sitting on top of this poor animal.

The council said they were dispatching an inspector to the area straightaway. The Garda said they were sending out an officer too.
This did not happen. I am pulling my hair out at this stage. This is another tragedy waiting to happen.

So, even with all the publicity surrounding this over the week, between sending the petition to the council members and the Gardai directly, articles in the local papers (in which staff specifically said to contact them immediately) they still have not done a thing? This is just amazing! No wonder the horse owners are doing this, they realise they will get away with it. What does it take to get some action on this issue. It really seems it's all just lip service. If I behaved in my job the way the coucnil members and Gardai do, I'd be fired, especially with so many people watching me.

We have to continue pushing this no matter what.

I emailed Patrick Floey about having a discussion of the petition discussed at the next Council meeting 3 days ago. I have not even received an acknowledgement yet:

++++++++++

to patrickfoley
Dear Patrick,

Please include on the agenda a discussion of the following petition at the next Council meeting, July 7th.

We would like answers to the questions within the petition itself. All council members and members of staff were sent a link to this yesterday, as were the Gardai.

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/675/147/288/#sign

Kind Regards

Discodog

galwaygirl08 wrote: »

Well ringing Millstreet, The Community Garda and almost every dept in the City Council hasn't done much good for myself or the neighbors this past week. Do we honestly have to resort to 999 at this stage? Because I am running out of options slowly.

We have been reporting the same pony every single day since it arrived on the estate last Sunday.
Today we witnessed the owner and 4 or 5 other youths mount the pony one by one in the middle of the housing estate, and they then beat him with a whip as they circled around the field at speed.
These youths range in ages from 12 up to 25. You can imagine the size of these guys sitting on top of this poor animal.

The council said they were dispatching an inspector to the area straightaway. The Garda said they were sending out an officer too.
This did not happen. I am pulling my hair out at this stage. This is another tragedy waiting to happen.

As already stated, these are not people you can intervene with as neighbors have made the mistake of doing so already.
I am so god damn angry. We have spent the entire week on the phone and the situation still remains the same.

This is what I would do.

Go, in person, to Mill Street Garda station preferably with several witnesses.

State that you wish to report a crime & make a written statement. Bare in mind that the key factors are the causing of "unnecessary suffering" as per the law.

If you encounter any reluctance then ask to speak to a superior officer. Point out that you expect immediate action & you will be monitoring & following up.

Make it clear that you will make a formal complaint to the Garda Ombudsman if the matter is not investigated.

There is an excellent guide here

http://www.ispca.ie/assets/legal.pdf