Clerical Positions in the Civil and Public Service

The_Conductor

Divisadero wrote: »

Yes indeed. One factor is that they haven't been able to hire in real numbers in years.

Before the complete embargo- there was a staggered run down in numbers from the late 1990s onwards. By 2000- the policy was to replace 1-in-6. This is why the workforce has aged.........

Divisadero wrote: »

Another and this is just a theory is that jobs like a CO were not very attractive to young people during the height of the Celtic Tiger.

It was seen as a basic level entry position- without much in the way of promotional prospects. Many people had the idea that they would be noticed, and promoted on merit- which unfortunately in an organisation like the civil service, very often is wishful thinking.

Divisadero wrote: »

There were higher paid jobs out there and in more appealing (dare I say glamorous) fields.

Well- there are glamarous fields in the civil service too- some with lots of foreign travel- some with lots of investigative roles etc etc. Lots of technical roles too. In general they don't pay as well as the same roles in the private sector- particularly IT roles.

Divisadero wrote: »

Job security and a better pension isn't always a priority for someone straight out of school or college. At least not during a boom.

Its not necessarily a better pension- because any post 1995 employees have the basic state pension as the significant part of their pension. Aka- after 40 years service you might be entitled to 50% of your final pay- if your final salary is 32k (not unusual for a CO?) half of this is 16k. If the state PRSI pension is 10k (roughly)- this means you get a civil service pension of 6k per annum after 40 years service.

People seem to think the pensions are remarkable in the public sector- for the vast bulk of employees- they aren't. Papers report all the exceptions- not the norms.

Divisadero wrote: »

My boss told me that during the Tiger years some CO's would leave the Civil Service within a week or two of starting. Some may have regretted their decision to leave the dreary old Civil Service when the recession hit. Others probably never looked back!

EOs and AOs walked out too- I'm personally familiar with several. They got far more money in the private sector (esp. those with professional qualifications). Some regretted it- some didn't. Some of those who stayed, were told they were stupid to stay.

Thats life.

Divisadero

thisNthat wrote: »

What seems to be the biggest obstacles in getting promotion in the public service? Is it qualifications or lack of? Too many applications for any advertised job?
I
I don't mean that to sound patronising but I'm just wondering why someone would stay in a job when after many years it didn't work out to be what they thought it would be?
especially when the years of experience in that job would be a great advantage in getting another job in other areas bar the public sector? Probably with better pay and promotional opportunities?

Just curious

People stay for different reasons. Personally I wouldn't say it is a great job but it depends. Try working in a private sector call centre to see what a real crappy working day or night is like! If your career is your whole world and you are dynamic and ambitious I would say look elsewhere. If you want flexibility and you have lots going on outside work it might suit you. Also like any job there is a lot of luck involved as to where you are posted. They are good about paying for study, time off to be with family, career breaks etc. It is probably one of the last bastions of the 'job for life' and although pensions and benefits are constantly eroded they are still far better than what most employees in the private sector can look forward to. I think one of the probs with promotions is that exams are usually involved so your actual experience comes second as once again you have to compete to get a good placing on a panel.

Rorster_123

thisNthat wrote: »

What seems to be the biggest obstacles in getting promotion in the public service? Is it qualifications or lack of? Too many applications for any advertised job?

I don't mean that to sound patronising but I'm just wondering why someone would stay in a job when after many years it didn't work out to be what they thought it would be?
especially when the years of experience in that job would be a great advantage in getting another job in other areas bar the public sector? Probably with better pay and promotional opportunities?

Just curious

Lack of competitions to start with and a lack of posts to be filled. Civil Service is a job now rather than a career. You may have to wait 5 years or more for a competition for the next grade with thousands applying.

sillysocks

So really for anyone who has hopes on eo or ao level the best chance they'll probably have is the competitions for those if they happen rather than thinking of promotin as an option from co anytime soon.

Gongoozler

Look, it really just depends on where you're working. Unless someone here is working in the depr, or whatever department was advertised, no one can tell you how likely anything is. Go for the job for what it is, not for what you could progress to.things change all the time, for better or worse, so you really shouldn't be basing your applying for a job on what someone on the Internet is telling you.

ezra_pound

sillysocks wrote: »

So really for anyone who has hopes on eo or ao level the best chance they'll probably have is the competitions for those if they happen rather than thinking of promotin as an option from co anytime soon.

There will be promotions over the next ten years. The next five years will have very different opportunities to the last five, which have been absolutely hopeless.

The_Conductor

Pure demographics- the average age of current employees- mean there will be recruitment drives again over the next few years- unlike the past 15 years, where competitions were few and far between.

There is a current calm- as a lot of the senior people who were anywhere near retirement age- jumped ship to get pensions based on their previous scales. These positions are now being backfilled- with some external recruitment, some internal promotions etc. However, by and large this cohort has been dealt with (with the exception of the September numbers- which are unlikely to be extended).

A lot of functions previously inhouse- have already been outsourced to a variety of providers and contractors.

Who can tell what the future will bring?

Gareth178

The_Conductor wrote: »

Pure demographics- the average age of current employees- mean there will be recruitment drives again over the next few years- unlike the past 15 years, where competitions were few and far between.

There is a current calm- as a lot of the senior people who were anywhere near retirement age- jumped ship to get pensions based on their previous scales. These positions are now being backfilled- with some external recruitment, some internal promotions etc. However, by and large this cohort has been dealt with (with the exception of the September numbers- which are unlikely to be extended).

A lot of functions previously inhouse- have already been outsourced to a variety of providers and contractors.

Who can tell what the future will bring?

very true... for long time serving civil servants, the upcoming AO/AP/PO competitions (with rumours of internal and interdepartmental HEO competitions across some departments) is very welcome news and regardless of how many are actually placed on panels and subsequently promoted, the fact that the wheels are turning again will raise the general morale (i know it does for me)

Aglomerado

Gareth178 wrote: »

very true... for long time serving civil servants, the upcoming AO/AP/PO competitions (with rumours of internal and interdepartmental HEO competitions across some departments) is very welcome news and regardless of how many are actually placed on panels and subsequently promoted, the fact that the wheels are turning again will raise the general morale (i know it does for me)

For sure. Morale is down the toilet for the last few years. A few promotions will lift the mood (especially if I'm one of the successful candidates! )

gazzer

Gareth178 wrote: »

very true... for long time serving civil servants, the upcoming AO/AP/PO competitions (with rumours of internal and interdepartmental HEO competitions across some departments) is very welcome news and regardless of how many are actually placed on panels and subsequently promoted, the fact that the wheels are turning again will raise the general morale (i know it does for me)

It raises morale for me too. Finally a chance after 10 years to get above EO. It has been so demoralising (especially the last 3 years) to see my work getting eroded away by shared services initiatives to the point that the moment my PO is in charge of 3 totally different areas so I am in the mad situation where one minute I am doing Level 2 Helpdesk work, then I am doing Webmaster duties and then 10 minutes later I might be taking calls on pension entitlements. The sharing around of work has become so haphazzard that nobody knows what they are meant to be doing anymore.

qwertyabcd

Can someone with more knowledge answer a query for me.

My sister applied on public jobs and ticked the disability box (its hard to explain but its a 'hidden' disability from the MMR vaccine in 1988). She got a call yesterday asking for a copy her OT report, does this mean her application will be done differently?

She is qualified for the job but I went through this recruitment style with the HSE and I know she would struggle with some aspects of it.

Thanks

KERSPLAT!

Just received the first info email. Have my Assessment Questionnaire between Friday and Monday

sickle

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

Just received the first info email. Have my Assessment Questionnaire between Friday and Monday

Got one today too for between Thursday and Sunday.
Was checking out the sample questions they linked too, different format from the example ones on the publicjobs website but nicely laid out.

McSween

Can one add another location? Id like to include Clare also.

The_Conductor

qwertyabcd wrote: »

Can someone with more knowledge answer a query for me.

My sister applied on public jobs and ticked the disability box (its hard to explain but its a 'hidden' disability from the MMR vaccine in 1988). She got a call yesterday asking for a copy her OT report, does this mean her application will be done differently?

She is qualified for the job but I went through this recruitment style with the HSE and I know she would struggle with some aspects of it.

Thanks

Sometimes they invite those with disabilities in to do their supervised exams separately. You'd tend to be in a smaller group- where people could take medication, go to the toilet, drink sugary drinks- or whatever they may need to do- in a more relaxed atmosphere, where people might feel pressurised were they part of the big group doing their supervised exams.

Its the same exam- and the same rules apply- its just the candidates are given a little more leeway to do whatever they need to do, to take care of their medical conditions (for example- I have Crohn's Disease, and need to be able to go to the toilet, when I need to go to the toilet- and if I were part of a big group- constantly running in and out to the loo wouldn't work).

Nothing to be scared of- and its not held against you in the application process.

Lenn Brennan

Just got my message on publicjobs.ie, best of luck everyone

RoadhouseBlues

Just got mine as well. There is an army of moths and a legion of butterflies on a rampage in me belly.

WhiteWalls

will this be anyways similar to the aptitude tests for the gardai?

The_Conductor

WhiteWalls wrote: »

will this be anyways similar to the aptitude tests for the gardai?

Same idea- some differences, in particular in the work skills part- but same general idea.

egan2020

No email or message yet. Does everyone who applied get sent the questionnaire?

Technocentral

egan2020 wrote: »

No email or message yet. Does everyone who applied get sent the questionnaire?

I would imagine, as the initial registration doesn't ask any pertinent questions, check your messages on publicjobs as they don;t email you about it.

KERSPLAT!

egan2020 wrote: »

No email or message yet. Does everyone who applied get sent the questionnaire?

Yeah but it'll be done on different dates. Maybe give them a ring tomorrow afternoon if you don't hear anything

KERSPLAT!

Technocentral wrote: »

I would imagine, as the initial registration doesn't ask any pertinent questions, check your messages on publicjobs as they don;t email you about it.

I got a text and an e-mail to say it was in my public jobs messages. That's not to say everyone did though

FloatingVoter

egan2020 wrote: »

No email or message yet. Does everyone who applied get sent the questionnaire?

Same here ... nothing arrived for me either.

bulmersgal

FloatingVoter wrote: »

Same here ... nothing arrived for me either.

I'm the same I say they doing it in stages we might have to do the test next week.

alwaysadub

Didn't get any email, but there was a message on my publicjobs page when i checked.

egan2020

Just received text to say message had arrived

Steodonn

Only got the message on publicjobs

If you haven't heard from them make sure to check the My Messages tab after you log into publicjobs

If I hadn't been checking this thread I probably would of missed it

RobbingBandit

I got a text but they gave me the wrong user name, I remembered my own one as I only applied for this a few days ago so I was able to sign in and the message was there.

FloatingVoter

Just got the text there. Between Friday and Monday for me.:)