Fed-up being a landlord/time to sell?

Hannaho

Just wondered if anyone else finds being a landlord, stressful. I have two properties, one left to me, and the other I bought in my early 20s - no mortgage on either. Have issues with tenants recently and last year. Last year the tenants left the place filthy, mould growing on unwashed dishes, hundreds of cigarette butts on the patio, and they didn't use the shower curtain in the bathroom, so the ceiling in the kitchen came down twice. Now, tenants who have just left ard threatening going to PRTB as I kept e200 for excessively dirty sofa, chairs and carpet, rubbish not remohved, chair broken and gates removed from hinges at front gate. So far, I have paid out e120 and e225 for cleaning, e50 for chair, e100 for rubbish removal, yet have only docked tenants e200. They rented my property for six years, but wihen I asked to increase the rent after six years, to bring it line with rents in the area, they became very difficult and demanding and even wanted a second bathroom installed in the house. Now, last year's experience with tenants and fthis year's, I can't face renting the properties again. I was hoping to keep them for pension purposes, as I have taken a lot of time out of work for kids. At the moment the properties are empty - though I've applied for change of use for one of the properties. Just wondered if anyone else felt similarly about being a landlord, and what did you do?

endacl

Use a letting agent? Avoid the hassle altogether.

NIMAN

I became a reluctant landlord nearly 4yrs ago as we couldn't get our house sold.

I found a tenant I knew personally, and they were perfect, really looking after the place. But in the back of my mind I always wanted rid.

After about 18 months or so of renting I put it back on the market and let my tenant stay at a reduced rate until I got it sold. Thankfully I did and made a little profit. I was over the moon to get rid of it to be honest. Some friends and family think I sold it too low or should have held on to it as an investment for the future, but I always thought of it as hassle, even though I had a good tenant. I was always thinking about him leaving, a future bad tenant, storm damage, etc etc.

I can understand where you are coming from.

Hannaho

Thanks to both of you for your replies.

ENDACI - I did have a letting agent, but when there were problems as in the ceiling coming down because the tenants didn't use the shower curtain,l or the place being left like a tip, or the neighbours complaining about the tenants' parties - I found therey were useless - basically they were useless and just passed information between the tenant and I. They were also so terrified by PRTB, that I was encouraged not to reduce the tenants' deposit on return, even if they caused the ceiling to fall down twice etc.

NIMAN - yes that's exactly where I am coming from - for instance, I am toying with using some of the money from the sale of the properties to buy a holiday home in the beautiful village of Dunmore East - I'm originally from near there and my children go there every Easter and for four weeks in the summer to the Adventure Centre there. I wouldn't be worried about having a property that may be vacant for long period, and I don't mind paying the extra premium for holiday home insurance. I know that there would be no tenants in it to damage it, or who would leave the heat off in the middle of freezing weather (as happened me before), there would be no tenants to have aggravation with over how the property was kept etc. There would be no worries about tenants refusing to leave at end of notice period, or having to get involved in PRTB case - this is happening to my sister currently. For peace of mind and lack of stress, I would prefer to have a holiday home, not earning an income, and costing me a little, rather than having an investment property with more income and more stress. Maybe some people will think I'm totally mad!

CrinkElite

Hannaho wrote: »

they didn't use the shower curtain in the bathroom, so the ceiling in the kitchen came down twice.

The ceiling in the bathroom came down twice because they didn't use a curtain??

Smells of bullshoite

Hannaho

Sorry, it was the ceiling in the kitchen that came down - the bathroom is directly over the kitchen.

beauf

CrinkElite wrote: »

because they didn't use a shower curtain???
In another light you'd be in big trouble for charging rent on an unsound building.

Explain how?


Ceilings as a sweeping generalisation aren't structural. They are cosmetic. Usually plasterboard and paper. Excessive damp and moisture will bring them down.

beauf

Hannaho wrote: »

Just wondered if anyone else finds being a landlord, stressful. ....

I know a few people who let a property empty rather than have the stress or hassle of renting it. Being a LL is work and can be stressful. Not everyone like the same kind of work/job.

Deagol

As a one time tenant, I can tell you that a landlord telling me he's putting my rent up is going to make me get the whoopass excuses / threats / begs/ pleads out.

What would you expect? Oh yes, Mr Landlord, I am quite happy to pay the revised higher rent that you propose?

It's nothing personal, but of course any tenant is going to try and bargain with you! Would you, in there place, do anything different?

Hannaho

Deagol - I think if tenants haven't had an increase in rent in 6 years, and are now paying way below the market, e.g. e300 below the market rent, and the Landlord has maintained the property, I think it is reasonable of the Landlord to increase the rent, of course, giving them the required notice of the increase - e300 per month is a lot! Demanding a second bathro om in a house, which would cost around e5000 is just unreasonable.

Re. the ceiling, yes, it came down from damp and moisture - basically they just hopped into the shower and never drew the shower curtain, and the water from the shower splashed all over the bathroom. Over a couple of months the moisture and damp caused the ceiling in the kitchen underneath to collapse. This was half way through the tenancy. The tenants were asked to ensure that they always drew the shower curtain and had it inside the shower basin - something we would all do at home if we had a shower unit upstaris. One month before the end of the tenancy, the letting agent rang to say that the ceiling had come down again. These were all supposedly 'professional' people!

Larry Wildman

Why didn't you just install a permanent shower screen?

rotun

Would you consider handing it over to the social welfare?

Best thing I ever did..

Larry Wildman

rotun wrote: »

Would you consider handing it over to the social welfare?

Best thing I ever did..

That's a great idea.

You still derive an income but you're insulated from problem tenants.

murphaph

Larry Wildman wrote: »

Why didn't you just install a permanent shower screen?

Why didn't the tenants just pull the sodding curtain over like civilised human beings? Jesus wept...

murphaph

Larry Wildman wrote: »

That's a great idea.

You still derive an income but you're insulated from problem tenants.

Not under RAS you're not. Only under long term leasing to the local authority would that be the case and not all local authorities will even enter into such lease agreements. They'll also pay considerably less than market rate.

beauf

Larry Wildman wrote: »

That's a great idea.

You still derive an income but you're insulated from problem tenants.

No you're not.

They do they normal stuff but if there is a problem it's back to the LL. The LL has no protection in reality.

Larry Wildman

murphaph wrote: »

Why didn't the tenants just pull the sodding curtain over like civilised human beings? Jesus wept...

Hmmm...relying on the common sense of people who've proven themselves to be gobsh1tes or preventing the problem in the first place...a tough choice.

godtabh

CrinkElite wrote: »

The ceiling in the bathroom came down twice because they didn't use a curtain??

Smells of bullshoite

I had to build down a ceiling in a bathroom because they didnt use an extractor fan

Green farmer

I was a landlord for a long time. You can get good and bad runs. I'd seriously consider putting the properties into ras scheme. They could rent the house off you for anything up to 20 years. Sure they will pay you less then market rent, but bright side is you are guaranteed your money every month without any trouble. You give them the keys and forget about the property.

Second option is sell the properties. I wouldn't rush into buying a holiday home straight away though. If you think about what it costs to pay property charges, water, esb , maintenance over a year, you'd pay for a nice holiday with the same money.

Only an opinion, your gut will know what's right for you.

murphaph

Larry Wildman wrote: »

Hmmm...relying on the common sense of people who've proven themselves to be gobsh1tes or preventing the problem in the first place...a tough choice.

But where do you stop Larry? There are almost limitless ways someone can damage a property through negligence. Do you mitigate against all of them?

murphaph

Green farmer wrote: »

I was a landlord for a long time. You can get good and bad runs. I'd seriously consider putting the properties into ras scheme. They could rent the house off you for anything up to 20 years. Sure they will pay you less then market rent, but bright side is you are guaranteed your money every month without any trouble. You give them the keys and forget about the property.

Second option is sell the properties. I wouldn't rush into buying a holiday home straight away though. If you think about what it costs to pay property charges, water, esb , maintenance over a year, you'd pay for a nice holiday with the same money.

Only an opinion, your gut will know what's right for you.

You misunderstand the RAS. It is not a fire and forget solution at all. You remain the tenant's landlord.

listermint

murphaph wrote: »

But where do you stop Larry? There are almost limitless ways someone can damage a property through negligence. Do you mitigate against all of them?

No just the simple ones. Putting a fixed shower screen over a problem area such as a shower area is just basic common sense. I'm perplexed why anyone would be against such a simple option with a high success of damage limitation...

professore

I'm with the OP. Being a landlord would not be for me. Life is too short. I wouldn't buy a holiday home though. Going the same place every year on holidays? No thanks. Also the money you would spend would allow you to go on 5 star holidays in a different place every year. What about buying shares or some other passive investment? Sit down with a pen and paper and calculate it all out.

Green farmer

To me it was a forget all solution. I signed a long lease with the local authority and they looked after everything after that. I had no further contact with tenants. As I said I'm no longer a landlord, but it's about suggesting some positive options that the op can explore.

ted1

CrinkElite wrote: »

because they didn't use a shower curtain???
In another light you'd be in big trouble for charging rent on an unsound building.

That's nonsense, stop trolling

listermint

professore wrote: »

I'm with the OP. Being a landlord would not be for me. Life is too short. I wouldn't buy a holiday home though. Going the same place every year on holidays? No thanks. Also the money you would spend would allow you to go on 5 star holidays in a different place every year. What about buying shares or some other passive investment? Sit down with a pen and paper and calculate it all out.

Friends have a place in South wexford. It's idyllic, quiet by the sea beautiful weather and makes a fantastic get away. They use it all the time.

Literally brightens the mood to have somewhere easy to get to that gets a break for the norm.

Five star get aways can't deliver that regularly with ease.

murphaph

listermint wrote: »

No just the simple ones. Putting a fixed shower screen over a problem area such as a shower area is just basic common sense. I'm perplexed why anyone would be against such a simple option with a high success of damage limitation...

If they don't pull the shower curtain over what makes you think they'll close a shower door? We don't know the exact setup the OP has anyway. A fixed screen may not be an option.

beauf

Green farmer wrote: »

To me it was a forget all solution. I signed a long lease with the local authority and they looked after everything after that. I had no further contact with tenants. As I said I'm no longer a landlord, but it's about suggesting some positive options that the op can explore.

That's great but I've seen stories having great difficulties with tenants on the RAS. Evictions and such.

But you are right in that you get good and bad periods like any business.

Santa Cruz

I think that you are in a fantastic place financially but you did need to give serious thought about the future use of these properties.
On the basis of what you have told us I would suggest the following.

1. Sell both properties
2. With the income received buy an apartment in a good standard apartment complex which attracts good rents due to it's convenience to centres of employment, transport links etc. Apartments are far easier manage, with one. beds you invariably have either one tenant or two tenants at most to deal with, Apartments blocks that have good management companies and agents are maintained to a high standard.
The secret to rental is of course good selection of tenants. There are great tenansts out there who will meet you half way and more. I manage a number of properties in Dublin where there has not been a change of tenancies in four years. Just have a plumber, electrician available if needed, play fair with appliances which break down and things go great.
3. If you have the funds for a holiday home in Dunmore East BUY Buy. It will be the best investment from a family viewpoint. It is a lovely resort, great beach and a relaxing friendly atmosphere. Your kids know the area allready, you have family links thee as well. You can always make an arrangement with someone you know and trust to keep an eye on the property during the winter for you.
While some Irish people are obsessed with sun holidays they can be stressful for families. Motorway links make access to Dunmore very easy now and a property would be ideal for long weekends etc. While you may not wish to rent it out as a holiday let that option is there down the line.

With my suggestion you have a rental income from the apartment going in to the future and a holiday home as well. You have the assets to have a secure future and it's a shame to see you getting stressed over these problems.

Labarbapostiza

Hannaho wrote: »

Have issues with tenants recently and last year. Last year the tenants left the place filthy, mould growing on unwashed dishes, hundreds of cigarette butts on the patio, and they didn't use the shower curtain in the bathroom, so the ceiling in the kitchen came down twice. Now, tenants who have just left ard threatening going to PRTB as I kept e200 for excessively dirty sofa, chairs and carpet, rubbish not remohved, chair broken and gates removed from hinges at front gate. So far, I have paid out e120 and e225 for cleaning, e50 for chair, e100 for rubbish removal, yet have only docked tenants e200.

How much did you earn from these tenants?

Was it the equivalent of having one or even little more of them working for you for an entire year, and handing over all their wages? Precisely, like a slave.

And you're complaining about cigarette butts on the patio.

You probably feel like they're parasites, sucking your blood.

ZENER

Labarbapostiza wrote: »

How much did you earn from these tenants?

Was it the equivalent of having one or even little more of them working for you for an entire year, and handing over all their wages? Precisely, like a slave.

And you're complaining about cigarette butts on the patio.

You probably feel like they're parasites, sucking your blood.

I guess economics isn't your strong point ?!

Ken