General Rugby Discussion

.ak

Buer wrote: »

They're not taught to leave their leg up like this:



A red is harsh given the mitigating circumstances but I don't believe it caused him to bring his leg up so far and directly into the path of the Dulin's landing. I think a yellow would have been fair but red isn't as bad a decision as the article makes out.

He's a forward so he's not going to have great aerial skills but he's clearly trying to get off the ground before he's interfered with. It's not reckless in that regard. It's a farcical red imo.

Buer

.ak wrote: »

He's a forward so he's not going to have great aerial skills

I don't think you can apply that to Parisse, to be honest. We've all seen him take those sort of catches with his eyes closed as well as most back three players. It's clumsy.

.ak

Buer wrote: »

I don't think you can apply that to Parisse, to be honest. We've all seen him take those sort of catches with his eyes closed as well as most back three players. It's clumsy.

Maybe, but can he do it with another player pulling at his jersey? He literally gets yanked backwards so he can't get off the ground. What else is he to do? It's not clumsy imo, he's forced into that position.

thomond2006

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCq4tynp38Q

Legend

Teferi

Who doesn't love a prop try in fairness.

Swiwi.

Dunno if already posted but here is another red card ruck clear out from the weekend just been.

https://vine.co/v/em5XAglXarM

Micky Dolenz

What was he thinking? Fcuking hell. It's no wonder parents dont want their kids to play.

.ak

Stupid. When there's so many cameras at games now how do you think you'd get away with that.

Totally different scenario to Hendo's by the way.

Buer

There are going to be inevitable comparisons but it's far, far different. He went in directly at a guys head. There was no change to the situation from when he started to go in. He wasn't interfering with the ball either. So he'll have to take his medicine.

Oh, wait, Aviva Prem? 1 week.

Realistically, I can see him getting 4 for it.

jacothelad

Buer wrote: »

There are going to be inevitable comparisons but it's far, far different. He went in directly at a guys head. There was no change to the situation from when he started to go in. He wasn't interfering with the ball either. So he'll have to take his medicine.

Oh, wait, Aviva Prem? 1 week.

Realistically, I can see him getting 4 for it.

Vunipola on Tait was actually worse and he was 'cleared'.

aimee1

jacothelad wrote: »

Vunipola on Tait was actually worse and he was 'cleared'.

Vunipola is an england international. Not being cynical or anything though.....

shuffol

Buer wrote: »

There are going to be inevitable comparisons but it's far, far different. He went in directly at a guys head. There was no change to the situation from when he started to go in. He wasn't interfering with the ball either. So he'll have to take his medicine.

Oh, wait, Aviva Prem? 1 week.

Realistically, I can see him getting 4 for it.

He really should be seeing 3 months at least for that type of offence, sickening and looked deliberate too, wouldn't be surprised if there's a cop out given we're at the business end of the season and Tigers will be in the playoffs if they beat Northampton who have nothing to play for, it may be in Northamptons interest to lose the game given it would keep Saracens out of the playoffs who they might view as a bigger threat.

The Lost Sheep

USA will take on Australia at Soldier Field in Chicago on Saturday, September 5, CEO Nigel Melville has announced
The Test fixture will be the final game for both teams prior to the World Cup.

http://planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_48903,00.html

Great to see this for American rugby. There is such a market for the sport in the States. Sooner they can get a pro league going the better. The likes of Former Leinster hooker Gavin Hickie, who was recently appointed as head coach of the AIG Men’s Collegiate All-Americans in addition to his head coach position with Dartmouth University, and Greg McWilliams, former St. Michael’s, Blackrock schools and Leinster underage coach, at Yale are doing fabulous work.

Ive played a large number of American sides and refereed a few when they've been on tour here and standard has improved a huge amount the past 5/6 years.

wp_rathead

Speaking of American rugby: Montage of the Pacific Rugby Premiership

errlloyd

wp_rathead wrote: »

Speaking of American rugby: Montage of the Pacific Rugby Premiership

There was some weak tackling there. Also was that Todd Clever?

Buer

So Bai got 3 weeks. I think he deserved about 6-8, would get 4 and he ended up with 3.

More damning though, to me, is Matt Kvesic only getting 3 weeks for this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEfrTDJqPsU

Spear tackle on a player without the ball (never had it at all), tackled player's head coming straight into contact with the ground.

Ian Prior only got three weeks though also in S15 a couple of weeks ago for a very similar one on TNW although at least TNW was receiving a pass and was lined up in that incident.

Buer

Interestingly, SANZAR give a full report on how they come to their conclusion regarding the Prior suspension. Good level of transparency and something I'd like to see here:

SANZAR Duty Judicial Officer Nigel Hampton QC assessed the case.

In his finding, Hampton ruled the following, "I viewed a number of angles of the incident which clearly showed the actions and reactions of the two players involved in the tackle, Ian Prior, the tackler and Tim Nanai-Williams, the tackled Chiefs' player, were able to be seen.

"It was submitted that this was a tackle similar to a previous case in 2015 (Liam Gill, March 2015) which I did not accept. The Gill tackle was an unusual and uncommon manoeuvre whereas this tackle fell into the relatively commonplace for lifting tackles.

"The tackled player was fortunately not injured through a combination of good fortune and his own attempts to break his descent. I found the incident to be at the lower end entry level for sanctioning purposes which has an entry point of four weeks.

"Prior had positioned himself for a high impact collision with Nanai-Williams who, momentarily before impact, had lost the ball, slowed himself down and brought himself into a more upright position, which altered the situation. Prior had shut his eyes as he went into the tackle and was unprepared for such an altered situation.

"This meant the tackle effected was completely different to what the player had anticipated in terms of the changed momentum and stance of the tackled player. Realising that he had "lost control of the tackle", Prior tried to release the tackled player who went to ground at a dangerous angle with some force.

"An aggravating factor to be taken into account is the need for a deterrent for these tackles. Lifting tackles have been sought to be eliminated from the game and yet still remain. I added a week to the suspension as a deterrent. Mitigating factors that I took into account include the player's good record, his shame at letting his teammates down during the match and his early acceptance of guilt and genuine contrition for his actions. As a result of these factors, I reduced the suspension to three weeks which was accepted by the player.

"The Force have two matches followed by a bye in Round 14. I was told the player, who has had little match time during Super Rugby this year as a result of playing off the bench, was expected to play a club game for his club, Nedlands during the bye to continue developing his match fitness. I sought direct evidence from the Force coach, Michael Foley who provided details of Force players being released in previous bye weekends to play in the Perth Premier Grade Competition when available. I was satisfied that this match was meaningful and should be included in his suspension.

"Therefore, the player is suspended from all forms of rugby up to and including 17 May 2015."

thomond2006

Buer wrote: »

So Bai got 3 weeks. I think he deserved about 6-8, would get 4 and he ended up with 3.

More damning though, to me, is Matt Kvesic only getting 3 weeks for this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEfrTDJqPsU

Spear tackle on a player without the ball (never had it at all), tackled player's head coming straight into contact with the ground.

Please, allow me: No easy suspensions in the Premiership.

connemara man

Ridiculous only 3 weeks for that

.ak

Any clips of it?

total former

.ak wrote: »

Any clips of it?

Of the Kvesic incident? It's at the very start of this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEfrTDJqPsU

Hard to see how they considered that an 'entry level' offence tbh.

On the plus side, it's good strong refereeing that he was given the red straight away. It will be interesting to see what suspension Gori gets for his similar but (IMO) less dangerous offence on Friday night.

Buer

.ak wrote: »

Any clips of it?

Seremai Bai incident.

Ian Prior incident.

Matt Kvesic incident.

The Lost Sheep

New row brewing in Wales...
Regions want to replace the premiership sides competing in the British and Irish cup with A teams.

At present, one club from each region takes part in the cross-border competition following a qualifying play-off but regions want to have more control over sides competing..
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/pontypridd-rfc-vent-fury-regions-9245219

total former

Just looking at the fixtures for this weekend, London Welsh wrap up their season by hosting Saracens.

Barring the most shocking upset of the season, LW are going to finish with 22 defeats from 22 games with only a single losing bonus point from the entire season. Zebre lost all 22 in their first season (2012-13) but still managed 9 LBPs and even 1 TBP. Welsh also managed to finish 0 from 6 in the Challenge Cup and 0 from 4 in the LV Cup.

So... are London Welsh the worst team ever to play top-flight rugby?

*Yes, I know they got off to a bad start being promoted late.

Bazzo

total former wrote: »

Just looking at the fixtures for this weekend, London Welsh wrap up their season by hosting Saracens.

Barring the most shocking upset of the season, LW are going to finish with 22 defeats from 22 games with only a single losing bonus point from the entire season. Zebre lost all 22 in their first season (2012-13) but still managed 9 LBPs and even 1 TBP. Welsh also managed to finish 0 from 6 in the Challenge Cup and 0 from 4 in the LV Cup.

So... are London Welsh the worst team ever to play top-flight rugby?

*Yes, I know they got off to a bad start being promoted late.

Their points difference is something hilarious too. Close to -800 I think

molloyjh

Bazzo wrote: »

Their points difference is something hilarious too. Close to -800 I think

-747. They've conceded an average of 41 points per game for a total of 953 points. :eek:

The Lost Sheep

Would be interesting to see what impact this could have on age grade rugby if these changes in soccer went ahead.

http://www.the42.ie/john-osullivan-column-2105622-May2015/

errlloyd

Manu Tualagi will not be considered by Lancaster after pleading guilty to assaulting a police officer.

Teferi

More about the Tuilagi incident here.

RFU statement here.

bilston

errlloyd wrote: »

Manu Tualagi will not be considered by Lancaster after pleading guilty to assaulting a police officer.

Wow

Fair play to Lancaster and the RFU.

Sangre

bilston wrote: »

Wow

Fair play to Lancaster and the RFU.

Why does Lancaster have to be so bloody likeable? Acts like this, on top of his current team for the most part, makes it harder and harder to hate the old enemy. Making me lose interest in rugby to be honest.

Dozen Wicked Words

bilston wrote: »

Wow

Fair play to Lancaster and the RFU.

Much easier decision for them to make about a player who's been injured since October. Absolutely the correct decision though.

/cynicism

Clearlier

Dozen Wicked Words wrote: »

Much easier decision for them to make about a player who's been injured since October. Absolutely the correct decision though.

/cynicism

TBF Lancaster has consistently gone down the road of doing the right thing ahead of the expedient thing. Always humble in defeat and victory - he has done a great job with England which made the whole discussion about his position being vulnerable pretty bizarre.

its_phil

Sangre wrote: »

Why does Lancaster have to be so bloody likeable? Acts like this, on top of his current team for the most part, makes it harder and harder to hate the old enemy. Making me lose interest in rugby to be honest.

Just do what I did and focus all your hate on Wales. Now despise them more than England (I'm also half-English I should add)

Sangre

its_phil wrote: »

Just do what I did and focus all your hate on Wales. Now despise them more than England (I'm also half-English I should add)

Thank God for Wales.

Teferi

Jaysus, Mike Phillips has a punchable face.

molloyjh

Teferi wrote: »

Jaysus, Mike Phillips has a punchable face.

I just love that both Kearney brothers are in there stirring it up. Look at them, they're loving it!

bilston

Dozen Wicked Words wrote: »

Much easier decision for them to make about a player who's been injured since October. Absolutely the correct decision though.

/cynicism

I know what you're saying but I do genuinely think Lancaster would have done the same if Tuilagi had been playing and playing as well as we know he can. Actually if anything made the decision easier it will have been the form of Jonathan Joseph.

Still as well as Joseph has done, on his day Manu is probably in the top quartet of centres in the world so you know, similar to his stance with Armitage, Lancaster isn't afraid to make a big decision which isn't necessarily in his own interests.

thomond2006

For all the Wales haters the RWC is a must see since they won't get past the pool stages....

bilston

Sangre wrote: »

Thank God for Wales.

Plus that was in reaction to that other lovely Welsh chap Liam Williams sticking his elbow into Jackson's head after he had scored.

Such likeable fellows...

Unless it suits Ireland otherwise I will always support England over Wales now. Not that enthusiastically mind...

Micky Dolenz

Tuilagi isn't the worlds best drunk. He crashed a party I was at once, in an English team hotel, and was pretty pissed. He tried pulling a few guests wives with no joy, he had better luck pulling pints of Guinness before duly taking a nap to the bemusement of the people at the party. I didn't witness this but I heard he wasn't exactly complementary about Brian o Driscoll but I don't believe it.

Buer

Teferi wrote: »

More about the Tuilagi incident here.

RFU statement here.

I'm a big fan of his playing abilities but the bloke has problems and seems a bit of a moron. He should be doing jail time for assault on an officer of the law. Certainly not the first time he has shown his temper or stupidity.

At 24 years old, it's time for him to cop on or he'll wind up being an unfulfilled talent.

19543261

Buer wrote: »

I'm a big fan of his playing abilities but the bloke has problems and seems a bit of a moron. He should be doing jail time for assault on an officer of the law.

That was my thinking. Curious as to how he got away with only a fine

Bazzo

Sangre wrote: »

Why does Lancaster have to be so bloody likeable? Acts like this, on top of his current team for the most part, makes it harder and harder to hate the old enemy. Making me lose interest in rugby to be honest.

Just picture Mike Brown and Dylan Hartley. Works for me.

thomond2006

After RWC Scott LaValla is retiring from rugby and joining the Marines!

English Lurker

If I wanted to be really cynical, I'd say that Lancaster's hands would be tied by instructions from above of "Do not upset the sponsors". Land Rover, O2 and so on do not put decent sums of money into English rugby to see headlines about England playing a guy who assaults police officers.


In any case I'm... well, I would be hopping mad, but don't really have the emotional energy for it. The possibility of a Tuilagi-Joseph axis was our best hope for a centre partnership that would really worry anyone else good. I'm very disappointed we have no chance to using that. But, well, if he's going to go around pushing police officers, this isn't a terribly surprising reaction.

The only problem I have with this punishment is that, for my money, Lancaster has been somewhat lax about setting a high moral tone recently and it's annoying that he now feels the need to do so when we're talking about a genuinely irreplaceable player for England. But it is the right decision. Just really bad timing.

.ak

Really hope he doesn't go down the havin route. On form his one of the best 13s in the world and a lot of what England did was based around his abilities, much like Toulon do with basteraud. And even then I felt he had so much to learn... Hard to see him ever playing in an international test Jersey again

Morf

thomond2006 wrote: »

After RWC Scott LaValla is retiring from rugby and joining the Marines!

The Marines may fund further study for him so it can be a good longer term move. Wish him the best etc and so on

PJ Maybe

bilston wrote: »

I know what you're saying but I do genuinely think Lancaster would have done the same if Tuilagi had been playing and playing as well as we know he can.

Agree with this, I remember him dropping Delon Armitage before when he was arrested for assault.

English Lurker

.ak wrote: »

Really hope he doesn't go down the havin route. On form his one of the best 13s in the world and a lot of what England did was based around his abilities, much like Toulon do with basteraud. And even then I felt he had so much to learn... Hard to see him ever playing in an international test Jersey again

Oh, he'll be back unless his injury problems get too much or he does something else stupid. England don't have enough centres of his calibre to hold a moral position for too long, sadly.

Besides, a man who keeps picking Hartley and Calum Clark can't be too interested in moral causes, hence my cynicism about sponsors.

PJ Maybe wrote: »

Agree with this, I remember him dropping Delon Armitage before when he was arrested for assault.

Don't think Delon was ever named in any of Lancaster's squads.