Football qualifier split

thelad95

Is it pure coincidence that the Football Qualifier draw has been incredibly dull this year with the split of fixtures into two groups?

Also looking at the master fixture list, teams who win round 4B will have one week to prepare for the Quarter Finals whereas 4A will have two weeks. I can see this being a glitch that will be talked about as a 'disadvantage' similar to the way playing a round 4 qualifier a week after provincial final loss has been pointed out as a disadvantage.

Fr Tod Umptious

thelad95 wrote: »

Is it pure coincidence that the Football Qualifier draw has been incredibly dull this year with the split of fixtures into two groups?

Also looking at the master fixture list, teams who win round 4B will have one week to prepare for the Quarter Finals whereas 4A will have two weeks. I can see this being a glitch that will be talked about as a 'disadvantage' similar to the way playing a round 4 qualifier a week after provincial final loss has been pointed out as a disadvantage.

As for the dates 4a is played on 26th/27th July and QF a week later, 4b is played 2/3/4 Aug and QF a week later, so there is no advantage for one over the other

Overall I think it's a load of B***ix,
It makes the whole lot so more predictable, and since A is so weak it makes it even more predictable.
I loved it when a a QF match up could be any provincial v at least 3 of the Rnd4 winners, and often 4.
Now you have a situation where the provincial winner may only be allowed be drawn against 1 of the Rnd 4 winners.
Take this example
Cork beat Kerry
Mayo beat Galway
Kerry win Rnd 4, Galway win Rnd 4
Mayo must play Kerry and Cork must play Galway. in QFs
And then the winners of the above QF play each other
It's just all too predictable

I'd love to see the Connaught or Munster winner have to play Tyrone, Armagh, Monaghan or Donegal, but it cannot happen unless in an AI final.

This was all put in place to regularise the schedule in some way, but there has to be a better way
Plus you loose the 4 QFs on the bank holiday weekend, they were always good.

Also, it makes weakens the value of the provincial championship final

Take the following example
If I am Mayo or Galway and I loose the Connaught final, I can take some comfort in the fact that I will only have to play a weak A side Rnd 4, and then either Kerry or Cork (who are both in a rebuilding phase and not what they used to be) in a QF, rather than having to worry about meeting Dublin or the Ulster winner.

A few years ago if you lost your Provincial championship and got past Rn 4 you had the daunting prospect of Dublin, Donegal, Mayo or Cork\Kerry to deal with

rpurfield

when was the initial draw done to determine which side of the draw the losers of the various games dropped into. I honestly never heard of it being done

Stinicker

Kerry V Galway would a great fixture, it would be a game of pure vintage football, an exhibition of how football should be played without cynicism and Galway have always played a lovely clean brand of football without negativity and they have showed some great skills and produced some great footballers like Michael Meehan who sadly is now retired and it was a great shame that he never got to win an All-Ireland medal. Kerry V Galway in 2008 along with Kerry V Dublin last year were the two greatest games of football in the last 30 years.

Syferus

Michael Meehan hasn't retired. He's also won two U21 AIs and an incredible senior club AI with Caltra. He's been more lucky than unlucky in terms of winning things.

Fr Tod Umptious

Stinicker wrote: »

Kerry V Galway would a great fixture, it would be a game of pure vintage football, an exhibition of how football should be played without cynicism and Galway have always played a lovely clean brand of football without negativity and they have showed some great skills and produced some great footballers like Michael Meehan who sadly is now retired and it was a great shame that he never got to win an All-Ireland medal. Kerry V Galway in 2008 along with Kerry V Dublin last year were the two greatest games of football in the last 30 years.

The 2008 Kerry v Galway game is hugely overrate, it was an average game, just because it was played in a monsoon.

Give me a low scoring but intensive, tactical battle over a meek score fest any day.

Frankie Lee

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

The 2008 Kerry v Galway game is hugely overrate, it was an average game, just because it was played in a monsoon.

Give me a low scoring but intensive, tactical battle over a meek score fest any day.

Some lovely scores taken in that game but I much preferred the battles between Armagh and Tyrone earlier in the decade.

T0001

If Galway lose the Connacht Final their worst case senario is they play Laois and then Kerry in a QF? Surely that's not right!

Similarly if they win they would most likely play Cork in a QF and then most likely Mayo/Kerry QF.

WHo decided this?

thelad95

There's been no great discontent about this so far mainly due to the black card debacle but I can see there being a bit of fuss kicked up by the time Round 4 and the Quarter Finals come around when people realise the draw is horribly biased against some counties while others can piss their way to a semi-final.

Syferus

There's been plenty discontent over it.

Fr Tod Umptious

T0001 wrote: »

If Galway lose the Connacht Final their worst case senario is they play Laois and then Kerry in a QF? Surely that's not right!

Similarly if they win they would most likely play Cork in a QF and then most likely Mayo/Kerry QF.

WHo decided this?

Provincial champions cannot play the team they beat in the provincial final in the QF.
That is the only thing that is decided.

So if Galway lose Connaught but win in Rnd 4 they meet Kerry in QF cos they can't meet Mayo

Lemlin

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Provincial champions cannot play the team they beat in the provincial final in the QF.
That is the only thing that is decided.

So if Galway lose Connaught but win in Rnd 4 they meet Kerry in QF cos they can't meet Mayo

It's a joke that Cavan already played Armagh and had such a high chance of meeting them again in the last round.

The GAA should be trying to avoid scenarios and rematches like that.

Last year I felt sorry for Fermanagh. Their championship basically consisted of losing to Cavan twice who also beat them the year before.

Fr Tod Umptious

Lemlin wrote: »

It's a joke that Cavan already played Armagh and had such a high chance of meeting them again in the last round.

The GAA should be trying to avoid scenarios and rematches like that.

Last year I felt sorry for Fermanagh. Their championship basically consisted of losing to Cavan twice who also beat them the year before.

And the qualifier split makes repeat matchups even more likely.

Another reason not to like it.

crapmanjoe

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

The 2008 Kerry v Galway game is hugely overrate, it was an average game, just because it was played in a monsoon.

Give me a low scoring but intensive, tactical battle over a meek score fest any day.

And what a monsoon it was - remember walking to Croker and the humidity was off the charts - v quickly the sky was black (and was a 4pm throw in if i remember) and the sky opened - amazing weather. Meehan was amazing on the day and was the last good game involving Galway!

Lemlin

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

And the qualifier split makes repeat matchups even more likely.

Another reason not to like it.

That was my point. Rematches should be avoided.

nice_guy80

Losers from Provincial finals should go into the opposite pot.

The current system might actually mean a draw might not be needed in a future round as some teams will already have played each other!

Fr Tod Umptious

nice_guy80 wrote: »

Losers from Provincial finals should go into the opposite pot.

The current system might actually mean a draw might not be needed in a future round as some teams will already have played each other!

Opposite pot of what ?

Prop Joe

There should be an open draw for all qualifiers with repeat pairings not allowed up to semi final stage.

I don't mind the A/B split for the first 2 rounds to keep things on schedule but it's a joke that Kerry/Mayo/Galway/Cork now know who they can play in the QF & Semi so they can sit down and plan for this,

DDC1990

Doesn't everyone really know who they are going to play?

Tipperary know that if they beat Laois, they will play Galway/Mayo and then Kerry
Sligo know that if they beat Limerick they will play Cork and then Mayo/Galway

Limerick and Laois know its going to be Cork/Galway/Mayo and will know as soon as the draw is made who they will face in the QF if successful.

Why is that such an advantage to Kerry/Cork/Mayo/Galway?

Its not the same yet on the B side because the Qualifier Round hasn't been played yet, but they have an extra week to prepare for the QF's so there is no advantage for anyone really.

Munster/Connacht got the luck of the draw with the Qualifier split this year, who's to say it won't be Leinster/Ulster next year.

km79

Is the thinking behind it that the 2 provincial finalists are on the same side so they can meet in an AI semi but not the AI final ?
Just wondering about the logic behind it

thelad95

km79 wrote: »

Is the thinking behind it that the 2 provincial finalists are on the same side so they can meet in an AI semi but not the AI final ?
Just wondering about the logic behind it

It's so that no team insofar as possible has to play two weeks in a row and it is also to create space for club championship games. Not sure how well this is working.

Fr Tod Umptious

km79 wrote: »

Is the thinking behind it that the 2 provincial finalists are on the same side so they can meet in an AI semi but not the AI final ?
Just wondering about the logic behind it

Back around 2005 they introduced a similar type system, where they introduced the SF pre-determination into the QF e.g if Connaught play Munster in the SF then Connaught champ v Munster loser or qualifier in QF.

The reasoning for that I think at the time was to try and prevent an all province All Ireland, in 2003 you had SF of Kerry v Tyrone and Armagh v Donegal, and a Tyrone v Armagh final.
They dispensed with it after a year of two though.

As I said earlier I think this sucks.

nice_guy80

thelad95 wrote: »

It's so that no team insofar as possible has to play two weeks in a row and it is also to create space for club championship games. Not sure how well this is working.

did Wexford footballers not just have one week to recover after losing to Dublin?