***ALL THINGS IRISH WATER/WATER CHARGE RELATED POST HERE***

geeksauce

TheZohan wrote: »

The guy from IW told him that it's up to him if he wants to pay the water charge or not and that IW won't tell him what to do with his disposable income...how odd...

Not that odd really, it's not up to IW or anyone else to tell him what to do with his own money, he has to make those decisions himself.

steev e

They will just take the charges out of your income if push comes to shove. But by all means give them as much hassle as you can because that is all anyone can do.

Banjo String

steev e wrote: »

They will just take the charges out of your income if push comes to shove. But by all means give them as much hassle as you can because that is all anyone can do.

They won't be able to deduct at source.

It's a utility bill tax.

Best be in the safe side though, don't give the pps number over.

shruikan2553

Got the application form today. It would be nice to have some idea how much it will be for unmetered people so I can start budgeting it. Im going to guess higher than what it would be with a meter.

steev e

Banjo String wrote: »

They won't be able to deduct at source.

It's a utility bill tax.

Best be in the safe side though, don't give the pps number over.

Hopefully, you're right about that but I get the feeling they'll get their own way in the end.

RobertKK

Got the form, on a private well and a septic tank.

Will be short and sweet filling the form as I won't be an Irish water customer

Ogham

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Got the application form today. It would be nice to have some idea how much it will be for unmetered people so I can start budgeting it. Im going to guess higher than what it would be with a meter.

Some details of the proposed unmetered charges here. http://www.moneyguideireland.com/unmetered-water-charges-how-will-it-work.html

arse..biscuits

steev e wrote: »

They will just take the charges out of your income if push comes to shove. But by all means give them as much hassle as you can because that is all anyone can do.

Not true. This time they can't as they want to privatize the company, revenue cant get involved.

Please don't take this attitude that there is nothing we can do, we can beat them on this one if enough people refuse to sign contracts.

shruikan2553

Ogham wrote: »

Some details of the proposed unmetered charges here. http://www.moneyguideireland.com/unmetered-water-charges-how-will-it-work.html

Only 50% higher than the 240 avergae charge. Thats a surprise. :rolleyes:

MortGoldman

Won't sign anything, won't pay anything. Until I'm dragged through the courts, I won't be handing over a penny.

tallus

MortGoldman wrote: »

Won't sign anything, won't pay anything. Until I'm dragged through the courts, I won't be handing over a penny.

Living up to that username !

UCDVet

Just got a letter in the mail. Honest question - what happens if I do nothing? I never agreed to pay for water, after all. Hypothetically speaking, if I toss it in the trash, what happens?

I'm renting an apartment.
Wife's name is on lease.
Wife has no job.

Letter was sent to 'Occupant'

KERSPLAT!

UCDVet wrote: »

Just got a letter in the mail. Honest question - what happens if I do nothing? I never agreed to pay for water, after all. Hypothetically speaking, if I toss it in the trash, what happens?

I'm renting an apartment.
Wife's name is on lease.
Wife has no job.

Letter was sent to 'Occupant'

I don't think anyone knows exactly what would happen. A lot of people in a lot of different situations, e.g apartments, wells, etc. Some saying they can slow your water to a dribble, others say they can't regulate the water at all... I haven't a clue myself to be honest. It's not something that I want to pay, but I still will I'd imagine.

UCDVet

Honest question - does anyone know what non-eu students are meant to do with this? If you don't have a PPS number, what do you enter?

KERSPLAT!

UCDVet wrote: »

Honest question - does anyone know what non-eu students are meant to do with this? If you don't have a PPS number, what do you enter?

Get a PPSN I assume

lorweld

Sorry haven't read the whole thread. We haven't received our form yet but one thing is puzzling me. I live in a block of 6 apartments. There are no meters, so we'll be charged the "set rate". My question is what's to stop me lying & say there is only one person living here (there is two of us) & getting a cheaper rate. They only ask for one pps number. Or will they be able to check revenue or dept of social protection for details of who's living where.

Banjo String

frostypants wrote: »

Got the application as well today. I really do hate handing over my PPS number but it's the only way you will get the 30000 litre allowance. I've been reading my meter monthly since April and I'm averaging 800 litres a month so by that I'm guessing I'll be paying very little or nothing at all?

Personally, (and I'm not advocating you do the same) I will not be giving my Pps nor will I be engaging with them in any shape or form.

I'm yet to be metered, we have 2 kids, both my wife and I work. I pay 52% of everything I earn over in taxes, and various levies. As does my wife.

We are taxed at 52% on our incomes, after USC, PRSI and income tax is deducted.

I understand I will lose out on any 'free entitlements' we should be entitled to, but I'm ok with that.


I refuse to enter into a contract for something I've been paying for already, and unless they wish to reduce my other rates of tax, or offer some kind of rebate, this is double taxation.

It's now got to the point where no matter what charges and levies I pay, I'm still told aren't enough.

Income tax used to cover bin charges, then they made us pay direct. Next they introduced lpt to pay for local council services. They have also upped vat, and upped car tax, both of which previously paid for water.

I'm now left wondering on what the hell my income, PRSI and USC actually does pay for


With out my name, who will they summons to Court?
Without a contract, how can they claim I've agreed to be charged by them?
Without a meter, how will they restrict my pressure?
Without my Pps number, how will they deduct at source?

If enough people stand their ground on this one, possibly something can be achieved, maybe I'm kicking the can downl the road and will inevitably end up paying more. Who knows?

At least I'll be doing something though. Hopefully plenty more will follow suit.

frostypants

Banjo String wrote: »

Personally, (and I'm not advocating you do the same) I will not be giving my Pps nor will I be engaging with them in any shape or form.

I'm yet to be metered, we have 2 kids, both my wife and I work. I pay 52% of everything I earn over in taxes, and various levies. As does my wife.

We are taxed at 52% on our incomes, after USC, PRSI and income tax is deducted.

I understand I will lose out on any 'free entitlements' we should be entitled to, but I'm ok with that.


I refuse to enter into a contract for something I've been paying for already, and unless they wish to reduce my other rates of tax, or offer some kind of rebate, this is double taxation.

It's now got to the point where no matter what charges and levies I pay, I'm still told aren't enough.

Income tax used to cover bin charges, then they made us pay direct. Next they introduced lpt to pay for local council services. They have also upped vat, and upped car tax, both of which previously paid for water.

I'm now left wondering on what the hell my income, PRSI and USC actually does pay for


With out my name, who will they summons to Court?
Without a contract, how can they claim I've agreed to be charged by them?
Without a meter, how will they restrict my pressure?
Without my Pps number, how will they deduct at source?

If enough people stand their ground on this one, possibly something can be achieved, maybe I'm kicking the can download n the road and will inevitably end up paying more. Who knows?

At least I'll be doing something though. Hopefully plenty more will follow suit.

Hopefully people will. Don't get me wrong I'm totally in agreement with you but they've put that stick in of course that you will not get any allowance if you don't sign on the dotted line. It's a tough one.

A couple thing above though. They do have your name, well I think my name was on the letter. You're right about they can't restrict you or turn it off. I've included a link to a video couple posts back of an Irish Water representative saying that. They can never take from source anyway as they're just a utility company.

I think they're just playing with people's fears with this carrot and stick approach

Banjo String

frostypants wrote: »

Hopefully people will. Don't get me wrong I'm totally in agreement with you but they've put that stick in of course that you will not get any allowance if you don't sign on the dotted line. It's a tough one.

A couple thing above though. They do have your name, well I think my name was on the letter. You're right about they can't restrict you or turn it off. I've included a link to a video couple posts back of an Irish Water representative saying that. They can never take from source anyway as they're just a utility company.

I think they're just playing with people's fears with this carrot and stick approach

Have you been metered yet?

Timberrrrrrrr

frostypants wrote: »

Hopefully people will. Don't get me wrong I'm totally in agreement with you but they've put that stick in of course that you will not get any allowance if you don't sign on the dotted line. It's a tough one.

A couple thing above though. They do have your name, well I think my name was on the letter. You're right about they can't restrict you or turn it off. I've included a link to a video couple posts back of an Irish Water representative saying that. They can never take from source anyway as they're just a utility company.

I think they're just playing with people's fears with this carrot and stick approach

You keep posting that link, it's one customer service rep who is more than likely mistaken yet you are acting as if it was from the Irish Water board of management and was set in stone.

Banjo String

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

You keep posting that link, it's one customer service rep who is more than likely mistaken yet you are acting as if it was from the Irish Water board of management and was set in stone.

You keep on at this, but I've yet to hear your explanation on how exactly Irish Water could reduce an unmetered home.

I'm not a plumber, but I'm pretty sure it's next to impossible, and all the huffing and puffing by Govt supporters won't change this one.

Unless of course you actually have details on how they'll do this? In that case, I'm all ears.

lorweld

Another point is if, as in my case in a block of apartments that aren't metered and are fed from one pipe how are they going to reduce flow to one apartment if they don't pay!

Banjo String

lorweld wrote: »

Another point is if, as in my case in a block of apartments that aren't metered and are fed from one pipe how are they going to reduce flow to one apartment if they don't pay!

Exactly. ..

They can't. Ditto to a house in an unmetered estate. They cannot reduce the flow to a single house without first installing a meter.

Of course, they don't want you knowing that though.

mrsbyrne

steev e wrote: »

They will just take the charges out of your income if push comes to shove. But by all means give them as much hassle as you can because that is all anyone can do.

They won't take anything. Like any other bill you don't pay you'll eventually end up in Court. I don't understand all the histrionics associated with this.

RobertKK

Banjo String wrote: »

Personally, (and I'm not advocating you do the same) I will not be giving my Pps nor will I be engaging with them in any shape or form.

I'm yet to be metered, we have 2 kids, both my wife and I work. I pay 52% of everything I earn over in taxes, and various levies. As does my wife.

We are taxed at 52% on our incomes, after USC, PRSI and income tax is deducted.

I understand I will lose out on any 'free entitlements' we should be entitled to, but I'm ok with that.


I refuse to enter into a contract for something I've been paying for already, and unless they wish to reduce my other rates of tax, or offer some kind of rebate, this is double taxation.

It's now got to the point where no matter what charges and levies I pay, I'm still told aren't enough.

Income tax used to cover bin charges, then they made us pay direct. Next they introduced lpt to pay for local council services. They have also upped vat, and upped car tax, both of which previously paid for water.

I'm now left wondering on what the hell my income, PRSI and USC actually does pay for


With out my name, who will they summons to Court?
Without a contract, how can they claim I've agreed to be charged by them?
Without a meter, how will they restrict my pressure?
Without my Pps number, how will they deduct at source?

If enough people stand their ground on this one, possibly something can be achieved, maybe I'm kicking the can download n the road and will inevitably end up paying more. Who knows?

At least I'll be doing something though. Hopefully plenty more will follow suit.

It is not double taxation.

It has been free water.

I pay taxes and had to pay for water since I am not on a public water meter due to living in rural Ireland.
The electricity bill to run the pump averages €28 a month as it is away from the house and has its own ESB meter.
Then there is the cost of repairs and between everything costs at least €500 a year, as certain parts seem to wear on fast due to the acidity of the water.

Water had been free for the majority and now everyone pays for their water whether with Irish water, a group scheme or a private well.
No such thing as free water or taxes have been paid for the water, otherwise people not on public supplies would be due refunds.

Ogham

Banjo String wrote: »

You keep on at this, but I've yet to hear your explanation on how exactly Irish Water could reduce an unmetered home.

I'm not a plumber, but I'm pretty sure it's next to impossible, and all the huffing and puffing by Govt supporters won't change this one.

Unless of course you actually have details on how they'll do this? In that case, I'm all ears.

I think I posted this link here or on another IW related thread - and I know you saw it because you replied to it.
http://maric.com.au/wp-content/uploads/Maric-Application-WATER-AUTHORITY.pdf

There is no need for a meter to be in place. They can fit a flow reducing valve - it has nothing to do with having a meter . - they use them in Australia .
Not saying it's right - just pointing out that it can be done.

mrsbyrne

RobertKK wrote: »

It is not double taxation.

It has been free water.

I pay taxes and had to pay for water since I am not on a public water meter due to living in rural Ireland.
The electricity bill to run the pump averages €28 a month as it is away from the house and has its own ESB meter.
Then there is the cost of repairs and between everything costs at least €500 a year, as certain parts seem to wear on fast due to the acidity of the water.

Water had been free for the majority and now everyone pays for their water whether with Irish water, a group scheme or a private well.
No such thing as free water or taxes have been paid for the water, otherwise people not on public supplies would be due refunds.

Spot on . Excellent post.

Banjo String

RobertKK wrote: »

It is not double taxation.

It has been free water.

I pay taxes and had to pay for water since I am not on a public water meter due to living in rural Ireland.
The electricity bill to run the pump averages €28 a month as it is away from the house and has its own ESB meter.
Then there is the cost of repairs and between everything costs at least €500 a year, as certain parts seem to wear on fast due to the acidity of the water.

Water had been free for the majority and now everyone pays for their water whether with Irish water, a group scheme or a private well.
No such thing as free water or taxes have been paid for the water, otherwise people not on public supplies would be due refunds.

Water never was free.

You know the water depts in local or County councils? Their job was to maintain and run the water services, if a water leak emerged, they were called upon to fix it.

They are the people being kept on for a time because they have the in-depth knowledge of where and how the infrastructure is.


They were paid for from income tax, from vat, and from motor tax and also from commercial rates, all of which I / we contributed to.

As for your situation ref paying for a private water scheme, this is due to the fact you live in a rural part of the country, not connected to the mains (by choice I presume?)

You will prob take some solace from the fact that your lpt will be (prob) considerably lower than urban dwellers, especially those in Dublin who will be contributing towards services delivered to the sparsely populated areas of the Island. (ones like yourself I suppose)

Swings and roundabouts I suppose.

RobertKK

Banjo String wrote: »

Water never was free.

You know the water depts in local or County councils? Their job was to maintain and run the water services, if a water leak emerged, they were called upon to fix it.

They are the people being kept on for a time because they have the in-depth knowledge of where and how the infrastructure is.


They were paid for from income tax, from vat, and from motor tax and also from commercial rates, all of which I / we contributed to.

As for your situation ref paying for a private water scheme, this is due to the fact you live in a rural part of the country, not connected to the mains (by choice I presume?)

Young will prob take some solace from the fact that your lpt will be (prob) considerably lower than urban dwellers, especially those in Dublin who will be contributing towards services delivered to the sparsely populated areas of the Island.

Swings and roundabouts I suppose.

I pay allmost of those taxes and others not mentioned and had always had to pay for water,.

It is not by choice that I am not on the public system. The nearest public water pipe is miles away.

In rural Ireland for most, you have to provide your own water, it doesn't matter what taxes you paid.
There was never a tax credit every year for the cost of providing one's own water supply.

My LPT will be low as my house is situated next to farm buildings, is very old, would cost a fortune to make more modern - be cheaper to knock it down and rebuild...but there are nice houses near me that will be paying a lot as houses in my area have sold for over 400k due to the very scenic location of where I live and proximity to Kilkenny.

Rural Ireland is oft left to fend for itself, while in urban areas they have everything handed to them - public water, much better broadband, footpaths, lighting, transport, gas...
We don't get many services where I live apart form the postman delivering the letters, and the local council filling the potholes.

frostypants

Banjo String wrote: »

Have you been metered yet?

I have since April and been taking readings. I'm using on average 800 litres a month so I might not have to pay anything as I'm well under the 30000 allowance