***ALL THINGS IRISH WATER/WATER CHARGE RELATED POST HERE***

Valetta

hju6 wrote: »

Household charge, the LPT, and water charges were all voted for by idiots, who could not spot liars and two faced b'stards at the ballot box.

How would you have fixed the country's finances, and formed a stable tax base?

Barely There

Valetta wrote: »

How would you have fixed the country's finances, and formed a stable tax base?

He would have summoned a multitude of money fairies who would have brought large wads of cash.

hju6

Valetta wrote: »

How would you have fixed the country's finances, and formed a stable tax base?

I'm not employed by the people to make such decisions, do you think I'm a TD?

Or is it just a stupid question ?

gladrags

hju6 wrote: »

Household charge, the LPT, and water charges were all voted for by idiots, who could not spot liars and two faced b'stards at the ballot box.

You cannot blame joe soap for not understanding how these cowboys operate.

They use emotional blackmail.

Family with three kids and a mortgage,the old,the sick. People trying to live and get by.

They are emotionally blackmailed,they vote for what they think is best for them and their family,with the best of intent.

The corrupt gougers know they have them over a barrell.

Promises,promises.

Valetta

hju6 wrote: »

I'm not employed by the people to make such decisions, do you think I'm a TD?

Or is it just a stupid question ?

Yet you think you're qualified to class a large proportion of the Irish population as idiots?

Ghost Buster

Barely There wrote: »

He would have summoned a multitude of money fairies who would have brought large wads of cash.

OOooooooorrrrrrrrrrr. FG , as they promised to do, could have lead by example and stopped all the corruption, nepotism, outrageous bonus culture, embezelment (?) and accounts fiddling etc etc etc rampant within politics and state institutions. Though only a drop in the ocean in terms of cash this would have gained a little good will amongst the people.
I am now in the 'wont pay' camp NOT because i expect free water but because i object to the shoddy, dodgy way in which the entire thing is being run.

UCDVet

Valetta wrote: »

How would you have fixed the country's finances, and formed a stable tax base?

I have the same conversation, on a micro-scale with my sister. She's always in debt, can never pay her bills and is always turning to short-term fixes that cause more long term problems. She can't afford a car outright, so she gets a loan (at a bad rate). She even has some rent-to-own appliances.

And she always says the same thing, 'Well, how else could I afford a new TV? They let me pay each month....'.

Since she's always fully extended, financially. If she gets a raise, she takes on more expenses. She's always just scrapping by and whenever anything goes wrong, she acts like it was completely unforeseeable and completely beyond her control.

'My car broke down! What am I going to do now?!'

The solution isn't magic. It's not a get-rich-quick scheme. It's just simple, common sense. And you can apply it to your own budget or to the budget of an entire country.

* Don't spend more than you earn.
* Don't spend money just because you have it.
* Invest in things that will pay off in the long run.
* Things will break down. Budget for this.
* When times are good, and you have extra money remember that times will be bad too.

It's not fair to wait until the crap hits the fan, and then say, 'Well, what else could we do!'. Heck - just look at RTE. During the boom, what did we do? We kept throwing more and more money at it. Then, oh no, once our record breaking celtic tiger came to an end (who could have predicted that it would be never-ending record breaking growth!) and all of a sudden money is tight. And RTE is saying 'Oh no! We need money! Quick - we need to chance the TV tax - make it a household charge - add more commercials!' They're still getting more money than they did before the boom...but now it's an emergency.

Sane, conservative financial policies would have avoided the mess.

In my own life, I've experienced the same thing. I got a promotion and a big raise, it lasted for three years until the company went under and I was unemployed. I couldn't find another job that would pay me nearly as much - I took a job that paid 5% less than my pre-promotion salary. Had I bought a new house and a new car, when I lost my job I'd have been ruined. Instead, I upped my savings and paid down some debts.

Ireland's water system is a JOKE. And it didn't happen overnight. We're leaking a huge amount of water and the infrastructure is in dire need of repair. Why did we let it get this bad? Is it not easy to see that paying to pump clean water into a leaky pipe is a bad investment? The proper thing to do would have been to maintain it from the start.

Banjo String

Valetta wrote: »

Millions didn't march.

Or register their details.

emo72

hju6 wrote: »

I'm not employed by the people to make such decisions, do you think I'm a TD?

Or is it just a stupid question ?

Mate, even TDs haven't the brains to make decisions. They have a small army of advisors. The only thing that concerns them is the least dangerous decision that doesn't affect reelection.

They commission reports and pay consultants, with our money mind, to make decisions. I've heard it referred to as a gravy train.

dxhound2005

How many litres of treated water will IW provide to the Dublin region every day? Anyone like to guess without looking it up. I will allow 10 million litres either way. Free water for life for the winner.

Water is supplied in Dublin on a Regional basis. The Region includes all of Dublin City and County and parts of Wicklow and Kildare. On a typical day

540

million litres of water is collected from our rivers, cleaned and made safe to drink at four main treatment plants.


http://www.dublincity.ie/main-menu-services-water-waste-and-environment-your-drinking-water-managing-our-water-supplies/how-1

This will all be done by idiots.

hju6

emo72 wrote: »

Mate, even TDs haven't the brains to make decisions. They have a small army of advisors. The only thing that concerns them is the least dangerous decision that doesn't affect reelection.

They commission reports and pay consultants, with our money mind, to make decisions. I've heard it referred to as a gravy train.

Yes and people vote for the same incompetants time after time,

We have let politicians have the run of themselves, they think they are untouchable superstars,

And they forget that they are employed by us to look after the infrastructure of the country.

gladrags

Valetta wrote: »

How would you have fixed the country's finances, and formed a stable tax base?

Unless you have qualities such as leadership,trust and inegrity...

And a government that at least,is honest with the people who elect them,you are wasting your time.

Forget the "stable tax base" nonsense.

Ask the thieves who supposedly knew everything about fixing finances.

Fix the cronyism and corruption.

The rest will follow.

hju6

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How many litres of treated water will IW provide to the Dublin region every day? Anyone like to guess without looking it up. I will allow 10 million litres either way. Free water for life for the winner.

Water is supplied in Dublin on a Regional basis. The Region includes all of Dublin City and County and parts of Wicklow and Kildare. On a typical day

540

million litres of water is collected from our rivers, cleaned and made safe to drink at four main treatment plants.


http://www.dublincity.ie/main-menu-services-water-waste-and-environment-your-drinking-water-managing-our-water-supplies/how-1

This will all be done by idiots.

40% of the 540 mill litres will be wasted via leaks, due to the incompetence and neglect of politicians

dxhound2005

hju6 wrote: »

40% of the 540 mill litres will be wasted via leaks, due to the incompetence and neglect of politicians

Paul Murphy will come round to fix the pipes. Claire Daly will get a plumber in to do it.

Irish Steve

hju6 wrote: »

40% of the 540 mill litres will be wasted via leaks, due to the incompetence and neglect of politicians

The sad and damning aspect is that it is NOT their incompetence, it's their desperation to remain in office, which resulted in all manner of visible vote gouging schemes that were forced through in preference to doing the right thing for the population by voting for invisible underground schemes that were needed to enhance and repair the existing systems.

Most of them knew EXACTLY what they were doing, which is what makes it even more damnable, their own self centred self serving greed was put before the people that they were elected to serve.

That's why we desperately need a properly structured and properly resourced Water company, not another semi state super quango headed and managed by semi state gougers that have spent years feathering their own nests at the expense of the people they were supposed to be serving.

With the manner that semi states operate, we'd be better off with a completely private non unionised company that has to answer to the shareholders, at least that would have to be transparent, when I see that the PAC are being told they "Can't inquire into IW", that tells me that there are vested interests both in the semi states and the civil service that are desperate to keep the politicians who are prepared to ask the hard questions out of their activities.

That tells me that there is something very unacceptable going on, and it needs to be made very open, very visible and the corruption and graft has to be exposed and thrown out, along with the people that have benefited from it, and that goes from the bottom to the top, and includes some that are in political office as well. They've fought hard to stay off the radar, and there are also people in some of the trade unions that have a less than acceptable record in the areas of graft and corruption, it's not made headlines because they've fought tooth and nail to keep it under wraps, but there are clear indications that some people have benefited significantly from funds that they were not entitled to benefit from. How widely does that go I wonder.

gladrags

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Paul Murphy will come round to fix the pipes. Claire Daly will get a plumber in to do it.

That is blatant sexism.

Why can't Claire Daly fix the pipes,and Paul Murphy get the plumber?

hju6

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Paul Murphy will come round to fix the pipes. Claire Daly will get a plumber in to do it.

They might have to, IW won't be around to do it

dxhound2005

gladrags wrote: »

That is blatant sexism.

Why can't Claire Daly fix the pipes,and Paul Murphy get the plumber?

Normally I would agree but she says she can't do it herself. She could get a woman plumber of course, or maybe Mick Wallace could do it for her.

http://www.thejournal.ie/clare-daly-water-charges-1744251-Oct2014/

dxhound2005

hju6 wrote: »

They might have to, IW won't be around to do it

All in good time.

http://www.water.ie/news/proposed-capital-investme/

5. Tackling Leaks
Irish Water is proposing to spend €150 million to accelerate leakage reduction and is moving to a much more proactive approach on leakage, with the long-term objective of reducing public and customer side leakage nationally by 50%.

€51 million will be available as a result of the Government announcement last week to assist home owners to fix leaks which may occur on their own property. This is estimated to yield a saving of 40 million litres of water every day which can be put to more productive use in the system.

hju6

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Normally I would agree but she says she can't do it herself. She could get a woman plumber of course, or maybe Mick Wallace could do it for her.

http://www.thejournal.ie/clare-daly-water-charges-1744251-Oct2014/

Each to their own, and by employing a plumber she helps to keep the economy going

hju6

dxhound2005 wrote: »

All in good time.

http://www.water.ie/news/proposed-capital-investme/

5. Tackling Leaks
Irish Water is proposing to spend €150 million to accelerate leakage reduction and is moving to a much more proactive approach on leakage, with the long-term objective of reducing public and customer side leakage nationally by 50%.

€51 million will be available as a result of the Government announcement last week to assist home owners to fix leaks which may occur on their own property. This is estimated to yield a saving of 40 million litres of water every day which can be put to more productive use in the system.

And given their track record to date, do you actually believe that ?

renegademaster

dxhound2005 wrote: »

All in good time.

http://www.water.ie/news/proposed-capital-investme/

5. Tackling Leaks
Irish Water is proposing to spend €150 million to accelerate leakage reduction and is moving to a much more proactive approach on leakage, with the long-term objective of reducing public and customer side leakage nationally by 50%.

€51 million will be available as a result of the Government announcement last week to assist home owners to fix leaks which may occur on their own property. This is estimated to yield a saving of 40 million litres of water every day which can be put to more productive use in the system.

and what about the €400m for the roads in 2015 the government were talking about a few weeks ago? the lies are getting ridiculous now at this stage

dxhound2005

hju6 wrote: »

Each to their own, and by employing a plumber she helps to keep the economy going

It won't be an issue anyway. We had queues of posters on AH and Facebook lining themselves up to do jail time for not paying their property tax. And campaigners promising to organise mass protests at courthouses. One person here said he was going to burn down his house rather than pay. Never came to much.

I can't see IW bothering to reduce pressure. They can just keep sending out the bills every quarter and most people will come on board when they realise the consequences of not paying a utility bill. Which are far more wide ranging than restriction or removal of the service.

hju6

dxhound2005 wrote: »

It won't be an issue anyway. We had queues of posters on AH and Facebook lining themselves up to do jail time for not paying their property tax. And campaigners promising to organise mass protests at courthouses. One person here said he was going to burn down his house rather than pay. Never came to much.

I can't see IW bothering to reduce pressure. They can just keep sending out the bills every quarter and most people will come on board when they realise the consequences of not paying a utility bill. Which are far more wide ranging than restriction or removal of the service.

I haven't received the sign up pack, so I suppose I'll have to be patient whilst awaiting an actual bill

end of the road

Irish Steve wrote: »

we'd be better off with a completely private non unionised company that has to answer to the shareholders

that would take all the proffit and invest little to nothing in the infrastructure and charge over inflated prices. the semi-state unionized company will do for me anyway

Going Forward

dxhound2005 wrote: »

All in good time.

http://www.water.ie/news/proposed-capital-investme/

5. Tackling Leaks
Irish Water is proposing to spend €150 million to accelerate leakage reduction and is moving to a much more proactive approach on leakage, with the long-term objective of reducing public and customer side leakage nationally by 50%.

€51 million will be available as a result of the Government announcement last week to assist home owners to fix leaks which may occur on their own property. This is estimated to yield a saving of 40 million litres of water every day which can be put to more productive use in the system.

It's not very ambitious, given all the waffle about conservation.

The 50% target of leak repairs has a 20 year projected duration.

It'll be 2034 before the leaks are down to the acceptable 20% or so.

masculinist

end of the road wrote: »

that would take all the proffit and invest little to nothing in the infrastructure and charge over inflated prices. the semi-state unionized company will do for me anyway

Just like Eircon. It went from being one of the most advanced companies in Europe to one of the most backward, right when we needed it to be at the forefront too. The vultures hollowed it out and sold it off , mortgaging everything a couple of times over.

Frank O. Pinion

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I can't see IW bothering to reduce pressure.

Me neither. It would take a while to do that to a million homes.

dxhound wrote:

They can just keep sending out the bills every quarter and most people will come on board when they realise the consequences of not paying a utility bill. Which are far more wide ranging than restriction or removal of the service.

Do you know what a circle is? Because you're going around a few.

Irish Steve

end of the road wrote: »

that would take all the proffit and invest little to nothing in the infrastructure and charge over inflated prices. the semi-state unionized company will do for me anyway

At least if it was a private company, they'd have to be open to being scrutinised, if the information given to the PAC is correct, IW is answerable to nobody, and can't be checked up on or looked at in any way as things are right now.

That's a super quango with a structure that means they can do what they like with pensions, bonuses, expenses, and all the other unacceptable practices that have been seen over the last while, and if they at the same time screw up the job they are supposed to be doing, they can't be fired either.

Sorry, but if that's the sort of structure that's in place right now, it would be better privatised, at least the shareholders would be able to say "NO" to some of the extremes that are possibly happening in the quango situation, and fire the people at the top if they are not performing..

I'd much rather have a situation that IW is state owned and controlled, with the executives answerable and accountable to the people of Ireland, but with the way that politics and the state works right now, that's going to be hard to achieve.

dxhound2005

Irish Steve wrote: »

At least if it was a private company, they'd have to be open to being scrutinised, if the information given to the PAC is correct, IW is answerable to nobody, and can't be checked up on or looked at in any way as things are right now.

Someone with a bit more legal cop on than the politicians is probably saving them from themselves. They are already facing a legal case for their alleged behaviour in another investigation. Some politicians use committees as forums for grandstanding and speechifying instead of their proper purpose. It would suit some TD's agenda down to the ground to get Tierney in and subject him to populist rants. Achieving nothing in the process probably. They seem to have forgotten that the people clipped their wings in the constitutional amendment proposal.

The Thirtieth Amendment of the Constitution (Houses of the Oireachtas Inquiries) Bill 2011 (No. 47 of 2011) was a bill which, if enacted, would have amended the Constitution of Ireland "in order to provide for the Houses of the Oireachtas to conduct full inquiries". The bill was passed by both houses of the Oireachtas, but rejected at a referendum held on 27 October 2011.[2]