***ALL THINGS IRISH WATER/WATER CHARGE RELATED POST HERE***

seamus

Deleted User wrote: »

All because our money is going over to Europe.

Still the same old "burn the bondholders" guff, then?

I'm curious as to what your solution is? Default?

Old boardie22

seamus wrote: »

Still the same old "burn the bondholders" guff, then?

I'm curious as to what your solution is? Default?

Bond holders..? Don't make me laugh..
Do you think these bond holders lost any money do you..? No they didn't.. In fact quite a few of them were the recipients of the bail outs..!!! Keep your guff to yourself.. Yes default. Stick the finger to the banks. Just like them and their cronies did to us...
Let them pay for the bad gambles with other peoples money they made...
Not the rest of the country

dxhound2005

Fr. Ned wrote: »

Look, there's people on here who will do exactly what this government tells them to. Probably sell their first born if it came to it.
As I've said, the most of them are most lightly PS/semi state employees who need the trough kept full to keep them in the lifestyle they've become accustomed to.

Nobody in their right mind, unless they're compromised in the above way, would agree with the way this super quango is been set up and ran. Nobody.

Did you ever dip your own snout into the trough. Ever get any taxpayers money from any arm of the State? Ever hand over your PPS number when making a claim?

bladespin

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Ever hand over your PPS number when making a claim?

Did not realize the the department of SW was a company, learning something new every day here.

eeepaulo

seamus wrote: »

Still the same old "burn the bondholders" guff, then?

I'm curious as to what your solution is? Default?

Its not about burning bondholders now, its about recognising and acknowledging how much the non sovereign debt is costing us.

Fr Ned posted this the other day, of course no one addressed it, just keep repeating its already been convered.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/colm-mccarthy-this-burden-of-bank-debt-is-simply-not-sustainable-26833432.html

Some interesting points there, such as the budget surplus we were running for many years in the run up to the bailout.

We can now borrow the money on the bond markets much cheaper than the loan from the imf and eu, yet we have to go cap in hand to the imf to ask permission to refinance? 1.78% as opposed to 5%

Michael Noonan speaking as if we have achieved some kind of victory.

dxhound2005

bladespin wrote: »

Did not realize the the department of SW was a company, learning something new every day here.

To complete your education. IW has joined the long list of entities which are authorised to request your PPS number.

biko

Just signed up for it there, with PPS and all.

bladespin

dxhound2005 wrote:

To complete your education. IW has joined the long list of entities which are authorised to request your PPS number.

Sorry, already knew that and I don't dispute that for a second, doesn't make it right though or make me feel any less uncomfortable about giving those details to what is essentially a private company (albeit owned by the state for now).

Banjo String

dxhound2005 wrote: »

To complete your education. IW has joined the long list of entities which are authorised to request your PPS number.

They requested.

I declined. I declined on behalf of my children too.

Fr. Ned

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Did you ever dip your own snout into the trough. Ever get any taxpayers money from any arm of the State? Ever hand over your PPS number when making a claim?

Never drew the dole, have worked since I left school, the last 20 years through my own company.
My wife doesn't work, she looks after the house, and she has never claimed anything either.
She gets the children's allowance like everyone else who has kids, but I can guarantee you I've/we've put far, far more into the system than we've ever taken out.

What about yourself?
PS or semi state?

mad m

Fr. Ned wrote: »

My wife doesn't work, she looks after the house

Thats a whole job in itself. I hope she doesnt see that quote...:)

Leroy42

Fr. Ned wrote: »

Never drew the dole, have worked since I left school, the last 20 years through my own company.
My wife doesn't work, she looks after the house, and she has never claimed anything either.
She gets the children's allowance like everyone else who has kids, but I can guarantee you I've/we've put far, far more into the system than we've ever taken out.

What about yourself?
PS or semi state?

So you gladly accept the childrens allowance then? Probably MIR as well, pension tax relief. Where do you draw a line.

BoJack Horseman

Will any competitor be allowed in the market or will IW be a monopoly?

seamus

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Will any competitor be allowed in the market or will IW be a monopoly?

I imagine further down the line, once the whole setup is properly embedded and working properly, there will be mechanisms to enable other players into the market to resell services, in the same way that Electric Ireland provide gas services.

Chances are it will be EI, BG and IW in about five years' time, all offering triple-play services for water & energy.

Fr. Ned

Leroy42 wrote: »

So you gladly accept the childrens allowance then? Probably MIR as well, pension tax relief. Where do you draw a line.

Water taxes.

Fr. Ned

mad m wrote: »

Thats a whole job in itself. I hope she doesnt see that quote...:)

Don't tell her I said that.....

Geuze

seamus wrote: »

Still the same old "burn the bondholders" guff, then?

I'm curious as to what your solution is? Default?

Obviously everybody is sickened that we spent 64bn on bailing out the banks, and repaying all holders of bank senior bonds.

In hindsight, we should not have saved/re-capitalised some of the banks.

In particular, the 30-35bn spend on Anglo/IBRC is a total loss.

Whereas we may salvage some return on the funds poured into BoI/AIB/EBS/pTSB.

My suggestion is that we demand from the EU / ECB, a much better deal on their loans to us, in return for having saved the EU banking system from contagion.

I suggest a 0% loan for 20-30 years.

Nobody likes paying extra taxes/charges to reduce the fiscal deficit, but if we got a deal like that, it might make the pain a tiny bit more bearable.

Old boardie22

Geuze wrote: »

Obviously everybody is sickened that we spent 64bn on bailing out the banks, and repaying all holders of bank senior bonds.

In hindsight, we should not have saved/re-capitalised some of the banks.

In particular, the 30-35bn spend on Anglo/IBRC is a total loss.

Whereas we may salvage some return on the funds poured into BoI/AIB/EBS/pTSB.

My suggestion is that we demand from the EU / ECB, a much better deal on their loans to us, in return for having saved the EU banking system from contagion.

I suggest a 0% loan for 20-30 years.

Nobody likes paying extra taxes/charges to reduce the fiscal deficit, but if we got a deal like that, it might make the pain a tiny bit more bearable.

Saving the banks was actually fascism... As, in a free market there "is no such thing as too big to fail in a capitalistic system... Of course enda and all the gang would never tell people this of course.....
Capitalism is supposed to be.. Make big gambles, you either get very rich or go broke... Not be bailed out by the taxpayer...

Old boardie22

Oh. And while I'm at it..
We shouldn't have to "borrow" anything off anybody... If banks were run the way they were back in the day..
Namely, could only loan so much within reason of the money/gold they hold....
Not.. Make up money out of fresh air on a computer and loan it.. Therefore making a mint loaning money they don't even have in reserves...
If you or me did this. We go to jail for counterfeiting or fraud....
There's ya feckin problem...
Thanks "slick" willy Clinton with all your "deregulation"... Thanks alot

Curly Judge

Geuze wrote: »

Obviously everybody is sickened that we spent 64bn on bailing out the banks, and repaying all holders of bank senior bonds.

In hindsight, we should not have saved/re-capitalised some of the banks.

In particular, the 30-35bn spend on Anglo/IBRC is a total loss.

Whereas we may salvage some return on the funds poured into BoI/AIB/EBS/pTSB.

My suggestion is that we demand from the EU / ECB, a much better deal on their loans to us, in return for having saved the EU banking system from contagion.

I suggest a 0% loan for 20-30 years.

Nobody likes paying extra taxes/charges to reduce the fiscal deficit, but if we got a deal like that, it might make the pain a tiny bit more bearable.

If you can explain to me how we could have collapsed Anglo without bringing down the "pillar" banks, I would be very interested?

Old boardie22

Curly Judge wrote: »

If you can explain to me how we could have collapsed Anglo without bringing down the "pillar" banks, I would be very interested?

Easy.. We say you are under arrest for fraud and whatever else... Then have banks work the way they were set up to do... Loan what they have and not invent money from fresh air...
Also tell any bank ceo's or government lackeys to stop lying with the scare tactics that the country would fall around our ears because we wouldn't save a "private" bank..

S.O

Just reading online the injunction has being completely lifted from edenmore protesters in today's high Court case' no condiditions attached peaceful protest allowed'- now the edenmore protesters could of being imprisoned' but the very fact that they weren't speaks volumes that the authorities appear afraid to imprison anyone in fear of a public backlash.

Old boardie22

Curly Judge wrote: »

If you can explain to me how we could have collapsed Anglo without bringing down the "pillar" banks, I would be very interested?

Other answer was of course.. Ask Iceland... They managed to arrest and lock up those responsible for their going into the red.. They managed to get the bit of the debt wiped off that wasn't theirs... So should we

Old boardie22

Old boardie22 wrote: »

Other answer was of course.. Ask Iceland... They managed to arrest and lock up those responsible for their going into the red.. They managed to get the bit of the debt wiped off that wasn't theirs... So should we

Taken from this News report: http://www.rte.ie/blogs/business/2014/04/07/cold-comfort-iceland-after-the-crash/

"On the surface Iceland doesn’t seem in bad shape.
The statistics look reasonable, unemployment and inflation are low and the economy is growing again.
But a deeper examination reveals serious problems for ordinary people which restrict basic freedoms taken for granted elsewhere in the Europe.
The difficulties are so severe, it becomes clear that the notion that Iceland let its banks collapse and escaped unscathed is a fallacy.
When the crash happened the Icelandic krona plummeted by 77%, which made imports much more expensive. There has been a marginal recovery in the country’s currency but the effect of the collapse continues to make it much more difficult for ordinary people to be able to fill their shopping trolleys."

Cantona's Collars

Pay for your water folks,doesn't matter if it's undrinkable - we might give you a discount.We sure as hell won't do anything to make the water drinkable or clean just keep paying,we like money,not providing a decent service for that money.

Yours Sincerely,

Irish Water.


PS: Don't forget to give us your PPS numbers,we need them for EERRRRMMMM,we need them for important stuff.:rolleyes:

eeepaulo

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/imf-charges-twice-as-much-as-europe-for-irish-bailout-30448386.html

At 4.99pc of €22.5bn, the interest bill is €1.12bn

The State can borrow seven-year debt for 1.2pc per year. The IMF loan has an average maturity of about seven years.At 1.2pc, the interest bill on €22.5bn would be €270m.

Paying back the IMF early would trigger automatic repayment of a share of the bigger, and less onerous, EU portion of the bailout.
Any repayment by Ireland of loans from either the EU or IMF would trigger automatic repayment of an equal portion of the other bailout debts.
The estimated interest rates on the EU share of the loans from the European Financial Stability Facility and European Financial Stabilisation Mechanism range from about 2.3pc to just over 3pc.
Fianna Fail’s finance spokesman Michael McGrath, who obtained this information via a parliamentary question, said a strong case needs to be made to the troika to lift the restrictions on paying the IMF debt early.

That is only the imf part, the eu part is about 45 billion.

None of this debt was sovereign debt but lets pay another flat rate tax instead.

Bang_Bang

I got my píss pack in the door today, I've sent the píss pack back. I will drink my own píss before I pay for their píss. Because it's cleaner píss and I won't have to pay for dirty smelly píss from Irish water Píss. MMMMM, pííísssss.

Banjo String

S.O wrote: »

Just reading online the injunction has being completely lifted from edenmore protesters in today's high Court case' no condiditions attached peaceful protest allowed'- now the edenmore protesters could of being imprisoned' but the very fact that they weren't speaks volumes that the authorities appear afraid to imprison anyone in fear of a public backlash.

Just logged on to say this exact thing.

Looks like the courts are afraid to rock the apple cart. They know the public anger out there.

Proper decision too.

Of course the media are slow on the uptake of this, had it gone the other way it'd be front page news by now.

It'll all heat up again now, probably in a grander scale. Troubles brewing.

smash

Has anyone get a response from Irish Water after filling out their forms without the PPS numbers?

chasm

Banjo String wrote: »

Just logged on to say this exact thing.

Looks like the courts are afraid to rock the apple cart. They know the public anger out there.

Proper decision too.

Of course the media are slow on the uptake of this, had it gone the other way it'd be front page news by now.

It'll all heat up again now, probably in a grander scale. Troubles brewing.

It's on RTE website now.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0929/648767-water-meters/