Malaysian airline MH-17 discussion thread

Rhys Essien

But whats the alternative,stand around and let the corpses rot?.Action needs to be taken fast.The rebels just seem to be covering and marking where the bodies are.

seamus

Rhys Essien wrote: »

But whats the alternative,stand around and let the courpses rot?.Action needs to be taken fast.The rebels just seem to be covering and marking where the bodies are.

To a certain extent you have to ask yourself where the logic would be in provoking a battle and risking troops for the sake of gathering up corpses.
And potentially sparking a much larger war.

I know if I was one of the deceased or their families I would rather there wasn't blood shed for the sake of collecting my body. It's heartbreaking for the families and disrespectful to the dead but it's not rationally justifiable.

I have no doubt the Dutch are anxious to get those bodies out, but they have to follow Ukraines lead; they can't land military personnel in another jurisdiction without permission.

rockbeast

Rhys Essien wrote: »

But whats the alternative,stand around and let the courpses rot?.Action needs to be taken fast.The rebels just seem to be covering and marking where the bodies are.

Never.

There are 20,000+ people currently discussing this who have a geopolitical interest in the situation.

Never take action fast.

Duggy747

Was scoping around news outlets to get the latest when I came across a Time article about a photographer who was one of the first on the scene.

They had some of his gruesome pictures on display with one of them of a bedroom where a passenger went through the roof.

“As we made our way to Torez, we learned that it was in fact a civilian plane,” the photographer told TIME. It didn’t take the pair long to reach the scene and they had no trouble accessing the crash site, as there were very few people in the area at the time. Yet the rebels soon arrived, and they initially gave Sessini trouble, taking his memory card away. They eventually returned it and allowed Sessini to take photographs.

Retrieving the bodies and the subsequent clean up / investigation is going to be an absolute nightmare.

rockbeast

Duggy747 wrote: »

Was scoping around news outlets to get the latest when I came across a Time article about a photographer who was one of the first on the scene.

They had some of his gruesome pictures on display with one of them of a bedroom where a passenger went through the roof.



Retrieving the bodies and the subsequent clean up / investigation is going to be an absolute nightmare.

I'd be very surprised if the "insurgent" that gave the order and/or pushed the button that shot down that flight hasn't already had a bullet through the head on the side of a road. I don't believe anybody wanted this.

rockbeast

Double post

Tarzana

Not sure if this will be the end of Malaysian. I think everyone knows this one wasn't their fault. And sure we don't even know what happened with the first plane.

anto9

>>Not sure if this will be the end of Malaysian.<<

They are partly Government owned ,and thats the only thing that might save them along with a name change.

seamus

seamus wrote: »

I know if I was one of the deceased or their families I would rather there wasn't blood shed for the sake of collecting my body.

Me too, but a lot of people are mental about bodies.

old_aussie

The United Nations said 80 of the 298 aboard were children.

That's numbing.

Muahahaha

CNN terrorism analyst reporting that he expects the US to come up with some hard evidence as to exactly where the missile was fired from. Said that their intelligence services will be "cleaning" the data right now. Didn't mention what kind of source but you'd imagine they're studying satellite imagery of the area at the time of attack. It'd be surprising if the US didn't already have satellites trained on the Russian/Ukrainian border to keep an eye on troop and artillery movements.

Galwayguy35

Just watching Sky News and they are reporting that people are looting and stealing credit cards and valuables from the bodies, horrible thing to do if true.

Tarzana

seamus wrote: »

First order of business should be scouring the wreckage for survivors, then arranging for the bodies to be respectfully recovered and treated - not walking around with video cameras searching for loot FFS.

Very different from Lockerbie, where pretty much the whole town volunteered at a huge warehouse to make sure that every piece of recovered belongings was organised and returned to the loved ones of its owner.

suicide_circus

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Just watching Sky News and they are reporting that people are looting and stealing credit cards and valuables from the bodies, horrible thing to do if true.

Classy stuff from the Russians there.

International politics is rarely cut and dry but to me, blame for this can be laid with confidence at the feet of those in the Kremlin. They not only goaded separatists in eastern Ukraine but actually gave them the weaponry used to commit this outrage.

Tarzana

keith16 wrote: »

I don't see how anyone could have survived it.

Rhys Essien wrote: »

There is no chance in hell that anyone survived.The plane would have exploded at 33,000ft.Instant decompression.Temperatures at that height are around -30C.Then you fall to earth from over six miles up.

A stewardess on the Lockerbie flight survived briefly on the ground, and that plane had levelled off.

Another stewardess on a Yugoslav airliner that was bombed in the '70s at 33,000ft survived and actually only suffered relatively minor injuries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vesna_Vulovi%C4%87

It's rare but not outside the realms of possibility.

DeanAustin

Tarzana wrote: »

Not sure if this will be the end of Malaysian. I think everyone knows this one wasn't their fault. And sure we don't even know what happened with the first plane.

They hire mentally unstable pilots and fly over war zones.

Or at least that's what a lot of people will think.

Bob24

DeanAustin wrote: »

They hire mentally unstable pilots and fly over war zones.

Or at least that's what a lot of people will think.

While this type of reasoning s is mostly irrational ... I think you have a point. I was surprised to see quite a number of people saying they wouldn't fly with them anymore on social media.

How big an actual impact it will have, I don't know.

Also I don't know how significant it is, but I am assuming losing 2 airplanes and crews and managing these events has cost them a good bit of money and is hitting the morale of their staff.

galwayqqq

I cant believe they haven't recovered the bodies yet.
I made the mistake of looking at some of the graphic pictures from the crash site. There was one of a little girl , face down in the mud. There was nothing else around her , no other victims , no plane parts, just her little body all alone.
She was obviously ripped from her mothers arms as the plane went down.
Couldn't sleep last night thinging about it and now to hear on Sky News that the bodies are still there and are now being looted!!!

What the fcuk is wrong with us as a species.

old_aussie

Russian military expert claims pilot radioed his concerns about the route before diverting over rebel-held territory

Russian media explores theory that Ukrainian armed forces shot down Boeing 777 after mistaking it for Putin's jet

Malaysia Airlines filed flight plan requesting 35,000 feet through airspace but was told to fly at 33,000

Kremlin leader was flying back to Moscow from Brazilian World Cup at around same time passenger plane crashed

Russian aviation sources said the routes of the two planes 'crossed at the same point and on the same altitude'

Ukrainian official accuses Putin of smuggling missile launcher back into Russia to cover up Kremlin involvement

Malaysian transport minister said MH17 was flying on approved route and pilot given no last-minute instructions

Putin calls for a ceasefire by pro-Russian separatists and Ukrainian government forces to allow for negotiations

Confusion over the two black boxes: Rebel says none found, another said it has eight, Ukraine says it has both

Ukrainian officials issue plea for respect as it emerges looters are raiding the possessions of dead passengers

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2696975/Putin-blames-Ukraine-loss-Flight-MH17-298-innocent-souls-DOESNT-deny-Russian-separatists-shot-missile-McCain-warns-Hell-pay.html#ixzz37tfcGNu2

If the black box/black boxes are on the way to moscow, then it's a total fiasco

Tarzana

DeanAustin wrote: »

They hire mentally unstable pilots and fly over war zones.

Or at least that's what a lot of people will think.

I'd have thought so too, but people flew with them the very next day.

cabbageandtay

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Just watching Sky News and they are reporting that people are looting and stealing credit cards and valuables from the bodies, horrible thing to do if true.

Do you actually believe that? Does SKY News report people looting and robbing people on the streets of London everyday?

Why would people dig through a crash site and steal a credit card? Are the people on the ground a bunch of monkeys?

If a plane crashed near you would you go and start stripping corpses of watches and loafers and earrings (assuming that the bodies still had hands, feet and ears) ?

How starving do you think Ukrainians are?

suicide_circus

cabbageandtay wrote: »

How starving do you think Ukrainians are?

They're russians by all accounts

Little CuChulainn

Muahahaha wrote: »

CNN terrorism analyst reporting that he expects the US to come up with some hard evidence as to exactly where the missile was fired from. Said that their intelligence services will be "cleaning" the data right now. Didn't mention what kind of source but you'd imagine they're studying satellite imagery of the area at the time of attack. It'd be surprising if the US didn't already have satellites trained on the Russian/Ukrainian border to keep an eye on troop and artillery movements.

I hope they caught the whole thing, including the launchers trip back across the Russian border.

Bob24

cabbageandtay wrote: »

Do you actually believe that? Does SKY News report people looting and robbing people on the streets of London everyday?

Why would people dig through a crash site and steal a credit card? Are the people on the ground a bunch of monkeys?

I definitely think the type of people who are posing for a picture as the one below (and have obviously been gathering people's belonging, see the right part of the picture) would do something like this, yes.



Very sad and indeed I dare to hope not too many people around here would be doing such thing, but this is the world we live in.

Santa Cruz

Katyn Wood 1940 Malaysian Airlines 2014. Same old Russians Sames old lies. Will we have to wait 50 years for the Kremlin to admit responsibility?
They can't blame the Germans this time.

cabbageandtay

suicide_circus wrote: »

They're russians by all accounts

Ah, so they must be completely wretched so. Chewing their fingers off, feeding newborns to their dogs to fatten them up before they become a stew, and waiting for planes to fall in flames from the skies so they can grab the (non-melted) credit cards and run them through their home swipers or sell the numbers over the phone that they have but can't afford shoes.

Right?

fedor.2.

cabbageandtay wrote: »

Do you actually believe that? Does SKY News report people looting and robbing people on the streets of London everyday?

Why would people dig through a crash site and steal a credit card? Are the people on the ground a bunch of monkeys?

If a plane crashed near you would you go and start stripping corpses of watches and loafers and earrings (assuming that the bodies still had hands, feet and ears) ?

How starving do you think Ukrainians are?

Pretty new to the world, are ya?

fedor.2.

cabbageandtay wrote: »

Ah, so they must be completely wretched so. Chewing their fingers off, feeding newborns to their dogs to fatten them up before they become a stew, and waiting for planes to fall in flames from the skies so they can grab the (non-melted) credit cards and run them through their home swipers or sell the numbers over the phone that they have but can't afford shoes.

Right?

What are you on about?

stevedublin

DeanAustin wrote: »

They hire mentally unstable pilots and fly over war zones.

Or at least that's what a lot of people will think.

The evidence seems to back those people!

Banjo String

cabbageandtay wrote: »

Ah, so they must be completely wretched so. Chewing their fingers off, feeding newborns to their dogs to fatten them up before they become a stew, and waiting for planes to fall in flames from the skies so they can grab the (non-melted) credit cards and run them through their home swipers or sell the numbers over the phone that they have but can't afford shoes.

Right?

WTF is wrong with you?

There are numerous pictures all around the net of the ill fated jets passengers belongings being gathered by the people on the ground.

Do not try and tell me for 1 min that some people wouldn't help themselves to such valuables, it's human nature.

The fact that they're Russian/Ukrainian is irrelevant so stop trying to spoil for the row you seem so desperately seeking.

Edit, just twigged you've only signed up. I think your intentions are quite clear.