Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Malaysian airline MH-17 discussion thread

Options
1…5859616364…148

Comments

  • Options
    #1802
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    KahBoom wrote: »
    That doesn't prove anything - judging by the claims from both sides, both rebels and Ukrainian forces were in the area - what is needed is proof of who shot down the airline, not speculation based on who was around.

    Well if someone goes missing and was last seen in an area that I am in and Im threatening people and not letting them in the area then what would people think? It wont be "oh im sure it is a perfectly reasonable explanation"

    While there may not be proof released yet it still makes them the prime suspect and they are doing nothing to change that.


  • Options
    #1803
    jimeryan22
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,170 ✭✭✭jimeryan22


    shruikan2553 wrote: »
    Well if someone goes missing and was last seen in an area that I am in and Im threatening people and not letting them in the area then what would people think? It wont be "oh im sure it is a perfectly reasonable explanation"

    While there may not be proof released yet it still makes them the prime suspect and they are doing nothing to change that.

    No it does not... They possibly could be so paranoid of outside interference with all the bull being reported that they felt the only way to protect themselves was guard the crash site and evidence until they could hand bits over or show to who they felt the right crowd, namely the international investigators.. They may have feared a stitch up... And if that's the case you couldn't blame them


  • Options
    #1804
    loughside
    Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭loughside


    jimeryan22 wrote: »
    No it does not... They possibly could be so paranoid of outside interference with all the bull being reported that they felt the only way to protect themselves was guard the crash site and evidence until they could hand bits over or show to who they felt the right crowd, namely the international investigators.. They may have feared a stitch up... And if that's the case you couldn't blame them

    that`s a crock of horse manure Jime, and you know it,

    it`s late on a friday night, so `fools pardon` and all that...


  • Options
    #1805
    jimeryan22
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,170 ✭✭✭jimeryan22


    loughside wrote: »
    that`s a crock of horse manure Jime, and you know it,

    it`s late on a friday night, so `fools pardon` and all that...

    Fetched even for me right..? ;)
    Night all.. Enjoy talking to you's


  • Options
    #1806
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    Now, I was looking at some news today and one article stood out in my mind and it was this one:

    ibtimes(dot)co(dot)uk/malaysia-airlines-flight-mh17-extraordinary-new-wreckage-discovered-machine-gun-type-holes-1458258


    "EXTRAORDINARY" new wreckage ! ? ! ?

    ..Now talking about bullet holes in the fuselage. And I looked at that piece of whatever it is propped against a cement column and thought to myself. "I've seen that piece of "whatever it is before" and sure enough it was from post 1490.

    Me being asked if these holes were made from an external force. Leading my I assume to admit that they were some kind of shrapnel holes.


    The lovely couple in the background are of course oblivious to this debate.

    Is that the same piece of blue under both pictures that looks like a dead plastic bag or some crap?

    Nah, this is extraordinary NEW footage.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1807
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    DamagedTrax wrote: »
    first line under the headline and sub



    see, there's always an agenda. after that they could claim anything they like for all its worth to the truth.

    Indeed, it's almost as shabby as:

    "MORGAN FREEMAN DENIES RAPING WIFE AND CHILDREN"
    . (after being asked)


  • Options
    #1808
    DakarVert
    Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭DakarVert


    Anyone seen the conspiracy that MH-17 IS actually the plane of missing MH-370?

    Can't post links as new user. :(


  • Options
    #1809
    Ash.J.Williams
    Registered Users Posts: 21,023 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    DakarVert wrote: »
    Anyone seen the conspiracy that MH-17 IS actually the plane of missing MH-370?

    Can't post links as new user. :(

    No


  • Options
    #1810
    Grayson
    Registered Users Posts: 16,220 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    DamagedTrax wrote: »
    first line under the headline and sub



    see, there's always an agenda. after that they could claim anything they like for all its worth to the truth.

    Jesus i hate these kind of responses. there's an agenda.... really?. Prove it and then prove that it affected that article and that the article is incorrect.

    there's another word that I'm fed up hearing with the whole Crimea/Ukraine crises. It's "Provocateur". Every idiot in that part of the world automatically labels anyone they disagree with as being a provocateur. I think I've heard that word more in the last three months than I have in my entire life.


  • Options
    #1811
    DamagedTrax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,277 ✭✭✭DamagedTrax


    Grayson wrote: »
    Jesus i hate these kind of responses. there's an agenda.... really?. Prove it and then prove that it affected that article and that the article is incorrect.

    see i didnt write the article so i dont need to prove its incorrect. since you didnt like my answer so much, how about you prove it IS correct?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1812
    Grayson
    Registered Users Posts: 16,220 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    DamagedTrax wrote: »
    see i didnt write the article so i dont need to prove its incorrect. since you didnt like my answer so much, how about you prove it IS correct?

    i don't have to since you obviously have an agenda.

    see how easy it is to dismiss something. At least i read your post, you dismissed an article without even reading it. Are you psychic?


  • Options
    #1813
    jimeryan22
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,170 ✭✭✭jimeryan22


    Grayson wrote: »
    i don't have to since you obviously have an agenda.

    see how easy it is to dismiss something. At least i read your post, you dismissed an article without even reading it. Are you psychic?

    What is his agenda..?
    And how do you know trax didn't read the article you posted..?
    Are you psychic..?


  • Options
    #1814
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    shruikan2553 wrote: »
    Thanks for the replies about how the bodies got to Netherlands.



    Well the people who are connected to the Russians controlled the area, they arrived on the scene and weren't exactly welcoming to others and then Russia makes no attempt to prove this claims wrong. Russia is keeping a very close watch on Ukraine, if something happened they would have something to show they werent involves or who was.

    The Russians shouldn't have to prove their innocence. That's not how it works. You make accusations against someone and claim you have evidence they did it then you must show that evidence and your so-called proof or else be quiet. You can't accuse someone of something spuriously, with no proof and then leave the burden upon them to prove their innocence.


  • Options
    #1815
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Egginacup wrote: »
    The Russians shouldn't have to prove their innocence. That's not how it works. You make accusations against someone and claim you have evidence they did it then you must show that evidence and your so-called proof or else be quiet. You can't accuse someone of something spuriously, with no proof and then leave the burden upon them to prove their innocence.

    No but you can make them the prime suspect. The question asked was why would people believe the rest of the world over Russia and I explained their actions make them the prime suspect and they have no alibi. Until there is something to suggest it was someone else then people will be up Russia's ass.
    It is no different to any other crime.


  • Options
    #1816
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Well to be fair the only ones hiding stuff and destroying evidence are the separatists. Unless you take the word of carlos the air traffic controller.

    SBU Security seized and is controlling Kiev ATC comms.
    The US are hiding satellite and air traffic data.


  • Options
    #1817
    DamagedTrax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,277 ✭✭✭DamagedTrax


    Grayson wrote: »
    i don't have to since you obviously have an agenda.

    the agenda of someone who's clearly stated thru out this thread they they support neither ukranian nor russian explanations until proof is shown?

    At least i read your post,

    you read my post and jumped to a conclusion that was wrong. well done.

    you dismissed an article without even reading it.

    i dismissed an article because of the first line, after reading the entire thing.

    Are you psychic?

    no, but you're clearly making attempts at it yourself.


  • Options
    #1818
    DamagedTrax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,277 ✭✭✭DamagedTrax


    shruikan2553 wrote: »
    No but you can make them the prime suspect. The question asked was why would people believe the rest of the world over Russia and I explained their actions make them the prime suspect and they have no alibi. Until there is something to suggest it was someone else then people will be up Russia's ass.
    It is no different to any other crime.

    totally agree. they are the prime suspect. but until it's proven they are only a suspect and should be treated like any suspect.


  • Options
    #1819
    Autonomous Cowherd
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,100 ✭✭✭Autonomous Cowherd


    DamagedTrax wrote: »
    totally agree. they are the prime suspect. but until it's proven they are only a suspect and should be treated like any suspect.

    Exactly.
    People should step back and look at the longer term consequences here.

    If the world rushes to action (of whatever sort against Russia) without adequate proof, then things will really look bad in Europe. Do we really want another Cold War, or some proxy war fought on Ukrainian soil?

    I am not advocating appeasement, but IF it was some rogue element in the pro-Russian wing then we should still be very careful about creating a new ...well...basically World War. I don't think people recognise how dangerous things are right now.


  • Options
    #1820
    jimeryan22
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,170 ✭✭✭jimeryan22


    DamagedTrax wrote: »
    totally agree. they are the prime suspect. but until it's proven they are only a suspect and should be treated like any suspect.

    But there has been the suggestion of someone else being the culprit lads.. I also am not decided until I see real evidence... Why is Washington refusing to release its satellite data..? Because maybe and I am saying maybe, the hoo ha that the Ukrainian forces may have accidentally blown the plane down..
    Also the Australian article I posted not one hour ago.. Saying Aussie police there on the ground have just found the largest piece of debris of the aircraft in a secluded spot.. With one of the chaps saying it has holes on the piece of fuselage that "looks" to represent bullet holes... People seem to be ignoring this


  • Options
    #1821
    jimeryan22
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,170 ✭✭✭jimeryan22


    A fact is: IF the US or anyone else had concrete data showing what they want it to, it would have already been out there a week ago.. And this whole thing would "pretty much" be wrapped up..


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1822
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Egginacup wrote: »
    SBU Security seized and is controlling Kiev ATC comms.
    The US are hiding satellite and air traffic data.

    Odd that no other country is saying this ? where is this information coming from ? Any links ?


  • Options
    #1823
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,465 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »
    Exactly.
    People should step back and look at the longer term consequences here.

    If the world rushes to action (of whatever sort against Russia) without adequate proof, then things will really look bad in Europe. Do we really want another Cold War, or some proxy war fought on Ukrainian soil?

    I am not advocating appeasement, but IF it was some rogue element in the pro-Russian wing then we should still be very careful about creating a new ...well...basically World War. I don't think people recognise how dangerous things are right now.

    Russia is not a Superpower anymore, the EU on it's own could win a conventional war with them. Their is no will or reason for this to happen though. Their is only one group that thinks they can go back to the glory days.


  • Options
    #1824
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    loughside wrote: »
    sorry this is giving you so much torment, but.,... here`s the front page article again, maybe you can expand on your `answer` for us fick people??

    The Russian newspaper Novaya Gazeta has dedicated its front page today to an apology to the Netherlands for the Malaysia Airlines MH17 crash, in which 193 Dutch citizens were killed.



    The poignant cover features the headline “Forgive us, Netherlands”, written in Dutch as “Vergeef ons, Nederlands" and translated into Russian below. The image, occupying the whole of the page, shows a procession of hearses carrying the coffins of victims.
    The picture was taken as the first bodies recovered from the crash site were transported to a military barracks in Holland on Wednesday for identification after a solemn ceremony at Eindhoven Airport.
    Novaya Gazeta was established by Mikhail Gorbachev, the former leader of the Soviet Union, who used money he received from him his 1990 Nobel Prize to part fund the publication in 1993.


    The newspaper printed a picture with a poignant photograph. All it is is an accusation made by a tabloid. How many times have you seen some tabloid with some ridiculous front page headline like "I'M SLEEPING WITH BRAD PITT" and then the next line is:
    "this could be the claim of lucky Vikki from Lewisham if she's shortlisted to be an extra in the Hollywood hunk's upcoming movie. As filming is on a desert island, cast, crew and extras will have to share living quarters."

    It's just more sensationalist trash to sell these rag newspapers. And it works too. People are more likely to buy the paper that has the dramatic and provocative headline: SCUM! rather than the broadsheet who's headline is "Police charge 2 with affray at football match."


  • Options
    #1825
    jimeryan22
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,170 ✭✭✭jimeryan22


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Russia is not a Superpower anymore, the EU on it's own could win a conventional war with them. Their is no will or reason for this to happen though. Their is only one group that thinks they can go back to the glory days.

    I agree with there being a group that would like to go back to the good ole days, but to think Europe on its own could take Russia in conventional war is folly I'm afraid..


  • Options
    #1826
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    DakarVert wrote: »
    Anyone seen the conspiracy that MH-17 IS actually the plane of missing MH-370?

    Can't post links as new user. :(

    Can't say I've heard anything about that. Seems a bit of a stretch.


  • Options
    #1827
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    shruikan2553 wrote: »
    No but you can make them the prime suspect. The question asked was why would people believe the rest of the world over Russia and I explained their actions make them the prime suspect and they have no alibi. Until there is something to suggest it was someone else then people will be up Russia's ass.
    It is no different to any other crime.

    Well if that's your M.O. then go ahead with it. Accuse them of everything from the Lindbergh Baby to Kennedy's assassination to this. But without some proof don't expect it to go any further. In fact don't expect even a response. You'll be out there pissing in the wind.


  • Options
    #1828
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Egginacup wrote: »
    Well if that's your M.O. then go ahead with it. Accuse them of everything from the Lindbergh Baby to Kennedy's assassination to this. But without some proof don't expect it to go any further. In fact don't expect even a response. You'll be out there pissing in the wind.

    Yeah, everyone else are the ones with a M.O and are pissing in the wind.


  • Options
    #1829
    Swede517
    Registered Users Posts: 9 ✭Swede517


    jimeryan22 wrote: »
    I agree with there being a group that would like to go back to the good ole days, but to think Europe on its own could take Russia in conventional war is folly I'm afraid..

    Why do you think Russia would defeat the EU?


  • Options
    #1830
    Egginacup
    Site Banned Posts: 2,922 ✭✭✭Egginacup


    DamagedTrax wrote: »
    totally agree. they are the prime suspect. but until it's proven they are only a suspect and should be treated like any suspect.

    I don't even agree that they are PRIME suspect. A plane was shot down over a warzone. The Russians aren't IN that warzone. The two PRIME suspects would be parties to the "war" i.e. Ukrainian government forces and Novorussian separatists.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1831
    DamagedTrax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,277 ✭✭✭DamagedTrax


    Egginacup wrote: »
    I don't even agree that they are PRIME suspect. A plane was shot down over a warzone. The Russians aren't IN that warzone. The two PRIME suspects with be parties to the "war" i.e. Ukrainian government forces and Novorussian separatists.

    they are prime suspects to the majority of the world. just because you or me are reading the situation differently it doesnt mean that to the majority they are not the prime suspects.


Advertisement