how to source chinese suppliers

zsha

Hi, so I've been looking at the likes of Alibaba and Ali express for Chinese suppliers, but their delivery on items seem huge, esp if you're just starting out and only need a small amount of different items.
So can any of you offer advice on how you actually go about sourcing a Chinese supplier? Is there any kind of directory you could look at or contact some off of??
Sorry I know I'm clueless on this, but any advice or pointers really are appreciated

Axwell

Whats a small amount of an item in your opinion?

zsha

To only get started, I'd hope maybe 20-50 pieces of the same thing, in different colours or styles....depending on how they sell then increase volume. I'd have a few different products at a time, I don't want to end up getting stuck with lots of things that don't sell, so would hope to start small

Duckett

have you tried the Chinese Embassy?

_Brian

While the shipping on your initial tester lot may seem large its still probably the best way to go.. You'll probably end up with a much smaller margin / no margin on the initial order but take it as market research.. And you'll have tested out the reliability of the supplier with less money involved in the transaction.

Then if you're happy with the business model you can increase volume to gain from the bulk discounts..

Alibaba is probably the best way you'll get direct to a Chinese supplier, when you start looking into 3rd parties they have to get a cut and so the profit is erroded..

zsha

Yeah suppose you are right....it would be little money and could put down as market research as you say. Thanks for that

makeandcreate

zsha wrote: »

Yeah suppose you are right....it would be little money and could put down as market research as you say. Thanks for that

Also remember that you have to consider customs charges. I ordered ribbon from China and it ended up costing €217 extra in customs and DHL charges (you pay on the cost of shipping as well as the value of the goods and if there isn't an invoive they will estimate a value instead)- - it was still really good value but it added an extra 2.50 per unit cost which I hadn't considered.
I've used Alibaba and Aliexpress with no problems.

getsome

Ask the supplier for small volumes they will either say yeah or no, another handy site that ships with small volume is DH Gate, offers live chat also but you will have to stay up late for that.

Keep orders including delivery under €100 you wont pay vat arriving with DHL, duty may apply.

zsha

Thanks everybody this Is all very useful info. When you say under 100e with dhl is a good idea, who stops dhl items to check customs? Do they have their own customs crowd?

getsome

As far as I know, DHL do their own customs clearance and collect on behalf of revenue, they also wont be fooled easily bring in a lot of boxes and saying there under €100 so don't get suppliers to mark down prices massively if your goods value and transport is €150 ask them to knock it down to €90.

zsha

Thanks that's great, it's super to get to know about the different delivery companies too as to rely on norm post waiting time could be huge!!

RUDOLF289

getsome wrote: »

As far as I know, DHL do their own customs clearance and collect on behalf of revenue, they also wont be fooled easily bring in a lot of boxes and saying there under €100 so don't get suppliers to mark down prices massively if your goods value and transport is €150 ask them to knock it down to €90.

Good morning,

I am afraid that this is very bad advice.

1) Customs has access to a very extensive (EU) data base with supplier details and pricing information
2) All entries are submitted electronically. Values on the entries are electronically verified against statistical information
3) If an entry is pulled (i.e. routed orange) full documentation will be requested by Customs, including proof of payment
4) Even if entries are passed, customs can do a post entry audit and request all information related to that specific entry. Usually they will add other entries too.

Sure, you will get away with some of the items slipping through. However, its like playing Russian Roulette. Especially if you intend to make a business out of importing / distributing products originating from outside the EU, my recommendation would be not to collude with your supplier(s) to show a reduced value. It will only take one or two "mistakes" to attract attention and scrutiny.

I know this perhaps sounds like a "moralistic lecture", however, it is based on 30+ years experience in the transportation / logistics / customs clearance industry.

For what its worth

Cheers,
Rudolf289

RUDOLF289

_Brian wrote: »

While the shipping on your initial tester lot may seem large its still probably the best way to go.. You'll probably end up with a much smaller margin / no margin on the initial order but take it as market research.. And you'll have tested out the reliability of the supplier with less money involved in the transaction.

Then if you're happy with the business model you can increase volume to gain from the bulk discounts..

Alibaba is probably the best way you'll get direct to a Chinese supplier, when you start looking into 3rd parties they have to get a cut and so the profit is erroded..

Good morning,

"getting direct to a Chinese supplier through Alibaba"? That would require a good bit of due dilligence. Afterall it is very easy to be a "gold supplier" on Alibaba, but that's no guarantee you're not dealing with an agent or intermediary. If you are in contact with potential suppliers, be sure to ask them for references of companies they have supplied in the UK/Europe and follow them up.

A professional sourcing company (i.e. "3rd parties") makes a living out of sourcing products on behalf of their clients. Just bear in mind some of the following ;

1) You are dealing with an Irish company, not an entity on the other side of the world
2) A (reputable) sourcing company will understand the business culture in China and have people on the ground in China that can do factory visits and pre-shipment inspections and most importantly are multi lingual (things do get lost in translation)
3) They have an extensive database of suppliers / products across a wide range of industries
4) Because they "know the way", they are likely to achieve lower costs from suppliers and their "cut" may not have the negative impact you assume. In the process you eliminate a lot of risk associated with doing business in China.

Perhaps it is worth exploring both options (Alibaba and sourcing companies)

Cheers,
Rudolf289

getsome

RUDOLF289 wrote: »

Good morning,

I am afraid that this is very bad advice.

1) Customs has access to a very extensive (EU) data base with supplier details and pricing information
2) All entries are submitted electronically. Values on the entries are electronically verified against statistical information
3) If an entry is pulled (i.e. routed orange) full documentation will be requested by Customs, including proof of payment
4) Even if entries are passed, customs can do a post entry audit and request all information related to that specific entry. Usually they will add other entries too.

Sure, you will get away with some of the items slipping through. However, its like playing Russian Roulette. Especially if you intend to make a business out of importing / distributing products originating from outside the EU, my recommendation would be not to collude with your supplier(s) to show a reduced value. It will only take one or two "mistakes" to attract attention and scrutiny.

I know this perhaps sounds like a "moralistic lecture", however, it is based on 30+ years experience in the transportation / logistics / customs clearance industry.

For what its worth

Cheers,
Rudolf289

How is this very bad advice, if you aren't brining in a lot of boxes and shipment is just over the €100 mark, asking suppliers to mark down price of shipping cost to avoid paying vat on arrival, I was not suggesting marking down 300-400euro worth just a small amount when over.

Never personal had a problem with any import when doing this. And I would not suggest paying vat on products you have not yet sold especially starting out.

RUDOLF289

It will only take one of two shipments to get picked up and any savings you have made or planning to make on future transaction will be out of the window. Especially when starting out you could potentially kill the business before it properly starts. I believe that advising people on boards.ie to break the law is bad advice.

Regards,
Rudolf289

getsome

RUDOLF289 wrote: »

It will only take one of two shipments to get picked up and any savings you have made or planning to make on future transaction will be out of the window.

Care to explain how?

RUDOLF289 wrote: »

Especially when starting out you could potentially kill the business before it properly starts..

Yeah if your talking in the thousands of euro of import! im talking a value of €150

RUDOLF289 wrote: »

I believe that advising people on boards.ie to break the law is bad advice. .

I am telling someone to defer paying the vat until they make sales, not avoid it, I think someone with 30+ years of experience could relate that similar to fiscal rep same concept delay so you can keep your cash flow.

Regards,
Rudolf289[/QUOTE]

Your opinion is appreciated don't get me wrong but starting out I would not advise paying vat on products not sold, keep your cash for advertising or making a website, don't go paying vat on small imports.

RUDOLF289

getsome wrote: »

Care to explain how?



Yeah if your talking in the thousands of euro of import! im talking a value of €150



I am telling someone to defer paying the vat until they make sales, not avoid it, I think someone with 30+ years of experience could relate that similar to physical rep same concept delay so you can keep your cash flow.

Regards,
Rudolf289

Your opinion is appreciated don't get me wrong but starting out I would not advise paying vat on products not sold, keep your cash for advertising or making a website, don't go paying vat on small imports.[/QUOTE]

1) If one of your shipments gets properly checked by Customs, they can request the full documentation including proof of payment. If there is a discrepancy there is every possibility that they will check on your previous shipments and do a post entry audit. If it is a once off situation, they would probably let it go.

2) The value is really immaterial. You're breaking the law and the potential rammification on past and future shipments is that you put a spot light on your business and may incurr penalties. Is it really worth doing that considering the "small value" ?

3) Fiscal Representation is based on the legitimate concept that you properly report and account for the transaction in your periodic VAT and INTRASTAT return. That in the process you end up with a zero outlay of VAT on imports is entirely different from avoiding VAT (and Duty - which is an EU issue) by willingly misdeclaring the value.

Bear in mind, if you are a VAT registered business the VAT paid on imports is a deductible input in your periodic VAT return. So all you are doing is affording the government a bit of cashflow for a number of months (unless you can avail of fiscal representation and defer the import VAT to your VAT return).

I am trying to point out the potential downsides of misdeclaring values to Customs.

Cheers,
Rudolf289

zsha

Thank you all for the replies and info. I def have taken on everything. I am only thinking about setting up and literally a few hundred is all I would have, so no major money involved....will not be vat registered unless business takes off.
Thanks again

DenisOakley

One of the key things you need to learn is how to purchase effectively from China? Generally you get that experience from working for someone else or doing it yourself. For a business the supply chain is critical and when you start out you generally have an idea and no experience.

So you start off looking for ways of reducing risk? What are your main risks? Loss of money; poor quality goods; slow delivery.

SDo start off with a number of small suppliers. Sure the costs are going to be high - but as a startup you very rarely compete on price because you don't have the economies of scale. So using small suppliers you build up your experience and the strength of your supply chain. Then you slowly move over to bigger and bigger suppliers to drive down the cost as you gain experience.

For ways of doing this use intermediaries. I've used Ebay, Alibaba and Mudah to get this to work. But it is not like ordering on Amazon and expecting it to be as simple!

zsha

Thanks, I have spent days looking on Ali express as I'm finding Alibaba is more for bulk buying.....I am in talks with a few companies now, so just questioning those and seeing what the reply times are like.....I am finding some suppliers even though they say they offer samples, have no discounted price for a sample, and want full payment, so I need to think about that one.
Thanks for all the info

DenisOakley

One approach then could be to be systematic in your searching.

I tend to take a category take all the suppliers and then send them the same questions.

Then for each question score them using an excel sheet. It can seem a hassle but it can make it really clear who the best suppliers are - or conversely which of your requirements are difficult for the market to fulfill

zsha

That's a good idea thanks, the time difference is a real difference compared to dealing with the likes of eBay/ Amazon so having my own tick sheet would be great idea thanks

Sam Kade

I emailed a supplier 2 weeks ago they said that I would get a reply within 36 hours still waiting :mad:

zsha

That's the problem, and you wait and wait and wait and there's nothing you can do. I have found a supplier that I am happy to try out for watches, very quick responses from them and seem to have v good feedback, so will order one piece from him now and see how it goes then hopefully will start from there. Wow exciting times ahead, fingers crossed.....my motto is what have I got to lose!:D Going to start small, and see how I fair out, if doesn't work out at least Ive tried.

MRTULES

RUDOLF289 wrote: »

A professional sourcing company (i.e. "3rd parties") makes a living out of sourcing products on behalf of their clients. Just bear in mind some of the following ;

1) You are dealing with an Irish company, not an entity on the other side of the world
2) A (reputable) sourcing company will understand the business culture in China and have people on the ground in China that can do factory visits and pre-shipment inspections and most importantly are multi lingual (things do get lost in translation)
3) They have an extensive database of suppliers / products across a wide range of industries
4) Because they "know the way", they are likely to achieve lower costs from suppliers and their "cut" may not have the negative impact you assume. In the process you eliminate a lot of risk associated with doing business in China.

Perhaps it is worth exploring both options (Alibaba and sourcing companies)

Cheers,
Rudolf289

Hi' could you suggest a professional sourcing company? I am looking for a recommendation please.
Thanks in advance.

RUDOLF289

Hello MRTULES,

Have sent you a PM.

Best of luck

Cheers,
Rudolf289

hubba_bubba

RUDOLF289 wrote: »

Hello MRTULES,

Have sent you a PM.

Best of luck

Cheers,
Rudolf289

Hi Rudolf, would you also be able to PM me the name of a sourcing company if you could please and thankyou.

RUDOLF289

Hello Hubba_bubba,

Have sent you a PM.

Cheers,
Rudolf289

denor2013

Hi Rudolf, could you please PM me the sourcing company too? Thanks very much

RoboRat

As somebody who regularly sources from China and Pakistan I can tell you that you may be better going within the EU for smaller quantities.

Both of the above are good for large consignments and even smaller ones but you can get caught up in red tape and suppliers can often add their own cut to organising delivery. I have found the best price is to pay FOB and organise the shipping yourself, your shipping handler can look after the customs clearance and this is something you need to factor into your pricing.

Also, once you go large scale be sure to work with a QA team on the ground unless you are satisfied that the quality is right.

I use Alibaba and DH Gate but its a myriad of ****e and takes some time to get what you are looking for.

RoboRat

I am finding some suppliers even though they say they offer samples, have no discounted price for a sample, and want full payment, so I need to think about that one.

This is generally the case as they get scammed themselves with people posing as buyers just to get free stuff. I generally add a term to say once I buy, the cost of sampling is deducted from the first order. Keeps them safe and also means you are not out of pocket.