ITU going draft legal

tunney

Saw this when it broke last week and had expected someone to start something here.


"To all National Federations, ITU would like to make you aware that its Executive Board has approved a change to the Competition Rules which will see the ITU Sprint Distance Age Group competition at the World Championship move from a “drafting-illegal” to a “drafting legal” competition. The Standard Distance competition will remain as a “drafting-illegal” race. The enforcement of this rule will go into effect at the Grand Final in 2016.

For more information contact ITU Secretary General Loreen Barnett here."

Sprint AG worlds going draft legal. How long before AG racing at sprint distance is drafting in Ireland?

What think ye of this?

rodneyr1981

tunney wrote: »

Saw this when it broke last week and had expected someone to start something here.


"To all National Federations, ITU would like to make you aware that its Executive Board has approved a change to the Competition Rules which will see the ITU Sprint Distance Age Group competition at the World Championship move from a “drafting-illegal” to a “drafting legal” competition. The Standard Distance competition will remain as a “drafting-illegal” race. The enforcement of this rule will go into effect at the Grand Final in 2016.

For more information contact ITU Secretary General Loreen Barnett here."

Sprint AG worlds going draft legal. How long before AG racing at sprint distance is drafting in Ireland?

What think ye of this?

I think for elite level athletes it's prob a good thing however I'd worry about the safety of racing if this goes ahead for all.
There is no comparison between draft legal and non-draft.
From my limited experience of bike racing very different skills required. To be honest tri bike leg is just foot to the floor. And even at that I've seen a few scary moments. Put a lot of different level bikers together together at speed could be dangerous. All it takes is 1 rub of wheels and a whole pack could be down.

RacoonQueen

Is the AG world champs that thing TI ask for applications for and let anyone who applies in?

rodneyr1981

tunney wrote: »

It's age group racing. There are no elites. Despite what some may call themselves.

Elite prob wrong word. I was more getting at the potential safety issues of local races. Even within the AG cat there is a big difference in skill level.

Gringo78

AG sprint racing in Spain is already all draft legal. Any other European countries like this?

Kurt Godel

tunney wrote: »

Sprint AG worlds going draft legal. How long before AG racing at sprint distance is drafting in Ireland?

What think ye of this?

It seems to work very well as things stand, I've never yet seen a major crash in AG racing.

peter kern

world age group champs covertedly were draft legal since Itu decided long time ago not to give a fly about drafting at age group world champs.
I would honestly be suprised if they had 10 mototrbike marahels last year in london ( and I think iam quite positive here)

anyway more on an Irish level i believe that there might be up to 6 draft legal races in ireland next year and this is a god thing for the sport. ( one would also understand why TI was looking to have a divison 1 and divison 2 licence)
I guess 6 draft legal races would be the max the irish market will bear
and i guess if one wants a decent filed its more like 4 at tops.

Shedite27

Presume draft-legal means we're all back on road bikes?

LaGlisse

Shedite27 wrote: »

Presume draft-legal means we're all back on road bikes?

For the sake of my future bank balance i hope this is the case

littlemsfickle

rodneyr1981 wrote: »

I think for elite level athletes it's prob a good thing however I'd worry about the safety of racing if this goes ahead for all.
There is no comparison between draft legal and non-draft.
From my limited experience of bike racing very different skills required. To be honest tri bike leg is just foot to the floor. And even at that I've seen a few scary moments. Put a lot of different level bikers together together at speed could be dangerous. All it takes is 1 rub of wheels and a whole pack could be down.

I guess then you would have to divide up waves based on overall times rather than swim times? So that people of similar ability would come out together rather than just strong swimmers who aren't as strong on the bike.

tunney

littlemsfickle wrote: »

I guess then you would have to divide up waves based on overall times rather than swim times? So that people of similar ability would come out together rather than just strong swimmers who aren't as strong on the bike.

But that is ITU racing, swim strong, bike race (which may mean sitting in) then run. Ultimately ends up on the strongest runner winning.(usually)

littlemsfickle

tunney wrote: »

But that is ITU racing, swim strong, bike race (which may mean sitting in) then run. Ultimately ends up on the strongest runner winning.(usually)

Yeah, I know. I was addressing that guy's concern about safety. I guess "strong" was the wrong word, I meant someone less experienced and therefore not comfortable with group cycling....but then just because someone is good at triathlon it doesn't mean they would be good at cycling in a pack, so really I'm just dismissing my own point:rolleyes:

MD1983

some thoughts:

hard to know who would benefit most from this, there are only a handful of really good swimmers so the main swim chase pack forms a peloton (if they are organised) and chases down the best swimmers? down to the run then but ultimately the racer who depends on the bike leg to gain most positions loses out overall (if they cant run so well). Makes swimming well more important than ever though.

mass start events as presumably waves could not work for draft legal racing?

probably going to be more bike accidents with triathletes with no bike racing experience

i think the choice is a good thing, no one is going to be forced to enter these races and i would do a few for the variety

tunney

LOL http://www.slowtwitch.com/News/AGs_move_closer_to_draft_legal_4471.html

Its all about the money

"they found it to actually be safer and more cost effective,"

So if you remove the need to have enough room on the course for draft legal racing you can pile sh1t loads more on and sell more NGB tri suits and tracksuits.

I look forward to the day when everyone in Ireland "has represented their country" in the worlds.

P2C

Bring it on is what I say. If people want to race for their country. They will now have to qualify via draft legal racing. Its nearly impossible to separate participants in a sprint race with the numbers and standards racing. I am getting a we bit sick of listening to the same drafting arguments after every race. Either that or put a camera on every second bike.

I saw a draft legal standard age race with a mass start in Quateria Portugal last year. They had about 8 referees. It was a circuit course on closed roads. Any lapped riders were pulled of the course. The circuit was about 6 k. Not that many got eliminated. What struck me was the amount of penalties for indiscretions in transition that are not implemented here. It was a mirror of the elite races on the same day. No big fuss and a massive range in standards. All the athletes were using road-bikes. They were a few groups on the road and it was a little more scattered than the elite races

The most important thing is that coaches, athletes and clubs will have to improve the level of bike skills and develop athletes competencies before participating in such races. That's not a bad idea.

Different dynamic will be introduced into the sport and I would anticipate that the gap will close to the top swimmers over a few seasons. You cans see the standards are rising each year.

peter kern

quote
probably going to be more bike accidents with triathletes with no bike racing experienc.

Aparantly in italy , mexico , and spain this does not really seem to be the outcome. but i guess this will be decided by risk analists of Insurance companies.
if anybody is really good I would like to see if there is more accidents at the garmin barcelona triathlon ( which has been held draft legal for a good few years )

what we will see is that the more draft legal races there will be is that the participation of females in tri is likely to go down and governing bodies will have to watch that. ( we already see that female participation in aquathon is higher than in triathlon )

Anyway overall what we see is there will be choice and choice is a good thing.
and i would guess that even in 10 years more than 66% of races will be non drafting.


as for money
i cant realy see the difference between age group worlds and the european ironman champs in frankfurt. Fact is people want it. If they want to pay for it why not.

Green&Red

It'll mean triathletes actually have to learn how to cycle a bike and suck a wheel properly, which in fairness shouldnt take too long.

Disaster for the likes of me whos best leg is the bike, a poor swim, then drag people around on the bike and be passed on the run :(:(

woody1

will this eventually trickle down to all races though .. hardly ?

HI2002

The standard in the country is rising of the sport, gradually. I actually think in part this is due to those atheletes applying to TI and doing overseas races - because it is only then you realise what small little fish we really are in comparision to UK, and the rest of europe - so competing abroad really puts things in perspective.

Draft legal AG racing will mark the demise of the TT bike for Triathletes! It would have to from a safety point of view. And yes, bike handling skills would have to improve considerably ..its no surprise that most triathletes have very poor bike handling skills - so this is a major positive. The major down that I can see, is that you will see the bigger clubs, grouping themselves together throughout the cycle ..so small clubs and those individual entries wont have a hope as they will be stranded - of course, they can always try to hook a ride with these peletons! Envisioning big bunches of cyclists on the roads ... instead of a long line with 2 sometimes 3 abreast ... will this mean our races will also be on closed roads?

EC1000

HI2002 wrote: »

The major down that I can see, is that you will see the bigger clubs, grouping themselves together throughout the cycle ..so small clubs and those individual entries wont have a hope as they will be stranded ?

I doubt it. There is more intra club competition than inter club competition in my experience. Also, if I am 1 minute out before a club mate in a sprint swim, there's no way I'm waiting!

HI2002

I wonder will your club mate, when he/she catches up with you on the bike, will they now in turn, go ride on past you ..he/she would now be able to legally sit on your wheel .. benefitting from all your efforts on the swim and the bike .. chill out and have nice fresher legs for the run ..
We've all seen members of some of the bigger clubs (smaller ones dont tend to - doesnt mean they dont - its just down to numbers) - doing this group riding anyway over past couple of years - illegal or not, so if it drafting becomes legal - there will be big groups/peletons on the road - which will by necessity have to provoke a different set of safety rules. We (Triathlon) may have to turn to Cycling Ireland for advice on this ...

tunney

HI2002 wrote: »

I wonder will your club mate, when he/she catches up with you on the bike, will they now in turn, go ride on past you ..he/she would now be able to legally sit on your wheel .. benefitting from all your efforts on the swim and the bike .. chill out and have nice fresher legs for the run ..
We've all seen members of some of the bigger clubs (smaller ones dont tend to - doesnt mean they dont - its just down to numbers) - doing this group riding anyway over past couple of years - illegal or not, so if it drafting becomes legal - there will be big groups/peletons on the road - which will by necessity have to provoke a different set of safety rules. We (Triathlon) may have to turn to Cycling Ireland for advice on this ...

No TT bikes, no disc wheels, no aero helmets.

It will be all about who can run the fastest 10km. If you can knock out a 32 minute 10km you'll be away with it.

desertcircus

Is there anything to prevent the emergence of domestiques within races? I want to do as well as possible at Race A in June, you want to do as well as possible at Race B in August. You give me a tow for the entire bike leg in Race A and jog home long after I've finished, then two months later I return the favour and sit out front going full tilt while you recharge and refuel for the run...

sconhome

desertcircus wrote: »

Is there anything to prevent the emergence of domestiques within races? I want to do as well as possible at Race A in June, you want to do as well as possible at Race B in August. You give me a tow for the entire bike leg in Race A and jog home long after I've finished, then two months later I return the favour and sit out front going full tilt while you recharge and refuel for the run...

Nope. Sure isn't that what the British team did for the Olympics. Think it was the womens triathlon in particular the uproar was about.

desertcircus

Actually, Sagan-Rodriguez style deals like in this year's Tour are more likely. Sprint cyclist takes the front on the flat, climber provides a tow over the hills