Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 13/8

Backstreet Moyes

MagicIRL wrote: »

We lost 2-1. A lot of people need to calm the **** down. Everyone can have an off day. It doesn't help that we've a rake of injuries and that Rooney, Mata and Chico had a pretty poor game.

Keep calm and Que Sera, Sera.

Rooney, Mata and Chico are going to continue to struggle unless we get quality in midfield. They are having to drop too deep making them less effective. Same with the defence i thought Jones especially was brilliant yesterday but they were exposed by the poor midfield.

The midfield is the heartbeat of any side where everything flows through and United unless make two good cm signings are going to be in big trouble.

kona

At this stage we just need a few competent players. If other teams can sign decent players for a few million why can't we?
Seem to be chasing players for crazy money.

Lord TSC

kona wrote: »

At this stage we just need a few competent players. If other teams can sign decent players for a few million why can't we?
Seem to be chasing players for crazy money.

Because we don't need "competent" players. LVG has said it clearly; he wants upgrades on what we have. Other teams can sign players for a few million because "competent" is an upgrade, but we need top level players coming in.

On top of that, it's pretty obvious we...
1. Have money
2. Are desperate
...so the selling club can just double their prices once we ask for a player.

irishfeen

Pro. F wrote: »

Not touchy at all. I can just see that your over the top defence of Moyes last season is causing you to make Moyes supporting comments this season.

Honestly last night was a joke but you are right with the fact that I defended Moyes last year - and still do to an extent. We obviously have fundamentally differing opinions of his time in charge, there is nothing wrong with that. I will defend LVG to the hill if the squad remains the same too, the two additions are very welcome but you cannot get blood from a stone. Without additions over the next two weeks LVG would work miracles to secure 4th.

irishfeen

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Yesterday was a bad bad day for the club, it was supposed to signal a new start, a dawn of a new era.

We played Swanses and were fuc*king pathetic. Nobody had a "bad day", we played like that team can be expected to play and how its been playing for the last year.

Injuries? Rvp yes, but he is likely pick up some knock but will the rest of them make much of. Difference especially in big games? No way.

Its not just the squad thats broken, its the entire club. Our fanbase has lost its fight and from the minute i went inside the ground yesterday i sensed something strange was up. The fans have had enough - years of club mismanagement, now brought to insane levels of ineptness with money wasted and s shift on focus to determining our success by off field activity as opposed to football results.

On friday,I called the team a mid table team (on paper) and i was attacked for it...nonsense i was talking, talking rubbish, hyperbole. The reality is our team is in dire straights....can we turn it about and finish top 4? Perhaps yes, being lucky. But the fact not one United fan expects us to mount a league challenge says it all.

We are Manchester United for f*ck sake! The mediocrity levels that some fans accept is astounding, but the match going fans want this club run as it deserves. And while our fans can be idiots at times, thers f*ck loads of very knowledgeable people whove been watching the club for years and years and know what a man utd team should look like.

Yesterday was not a man united team and it created one of the strangest and subdued atmospheres ive ever seen.

Totally agree - that team United put out yesterday was of a mid-table standard.

redbaron_99

Woodward said the club monitors social media to gauge the mood of the fans. Well. I think it should be quite clear now that none of us are happy. Some of the meltdowns on the cafe and twitter are quite something to behold.

And Tom cleverley gets offered a new deal!!??!!!!????
I'm gonna go back to my old suspicion that there's a very damaging and negative influence somewhere in the club that's protecting wasters like Tc.

Soups123

GSPfan wrote: »

Totally disagree. He can watch hours of matches previous to see how bad some of them are. How would you ever buy a player if you needed to see him play for you before you can judge him? Every player would have to be a loan deal first before you buy with that logic.

To be honest he is in the job a short amount of time but it is a bit mental if he thinks this group of players is gonna win him trophies. Same happened last year. The new manager thought he had a great squad until the window closed and then all of a sudden the talk of big changes started.

I reckon Van Gaal knows what players he wants but United are struggling to close the deals. He wont let players leave either till he brings in players.

It's not as simple as looking at last season, Fergie got a lot of these players doing well in a PL winning team he needs to see who still has it, preseason won't answer that only real games will.

I don 't think he is realistically thinking trophies this year he has to be thinking rebuild and top 4. He has a lot of players capable he just needs to see the wood from the trees.

United have the financial clout to sign any player in the world if the player is available, I would worry though how much the Americans are holding back

homerjay2005

I will agree with one thing - if yesterday leads to long term gains, i will accept it. It should (i hope)act as an eye opener for many how bad things are including our owners.

During the summer i had a theory that inside the club, David Moyes was getting 90% of the blame and the club thought small changes plus a new manager would sort it. the last 3 weeks have shown me that this theory is correct.

If yesterday (as disappointed as we all are) is the start of the rebuilding process, then so be it. if LVG gets us to top 4 with that squad, the man is a miracle worker.

PhlegmyMoses

Mid-table team.

The first XI is top 4 level.

---

DDG
Raf

---

Jones--Smalling--Evans

---

Shaw

---

Herrera

---

Carrick

---

Mata

---

Rooney

---

RVP

Could maybe do with a more high profile CB, and an upgrade on Carrick, but that's a strong side and more than capable of Top 4.

The squad is not top 4 material.

We have deep enough cover in certain areas. The likes of Januzaj, Nani, Chicharito, Welbeck provide good cover in attacking areas.

Defence is painfully short though. One injury to anyone in the backline above and we're down to youth teamers and wingers playing out of position, as we saw yesterday.

Swansea had two meaningful attacks yesterday and scored both of them. Still undecided on whether Blackett got dragged too far out of position for the first but Young was definitely at fault for the second, coupled with poor midfield tracking back.

It's why I wanted Vermaelen and if we can bring in any reliable and experienced CB, we should pay what it takes.

homerjay2005

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Woodward said the club monitors social media to gauge the mood of the fans. Well. I think it should be quite clear now that none of us are happy. Some of the meltdowns on the cafe and twitter are quite something to behold.
.

Social media matters f*ck all apart from impact on commercial deals though it appears thats our focus now sadly.

Its inside the ground that should really matter and yesterday should be enough. There was no meltdowns, but what we have right now is an unmotivated, disillusioned fanbase who will support the team, but half assed....like our board.

Nalz

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Bit creepy that you keep bringing that up, just a little strange at a certain stage.

lol you have a playful windup at the United fans usually every time they have a bad result which unfortunately has increased in frequency the last 18 months (which you also made apparent in another thread yesterday). Repetitive bantz

I reply with the one repetitive playful windup I have. Very creepy indeed! I just prefer it to going into the Liverpool thread and pointing out or making fun at any slips that they had over recent years

Blatter

Pro. F wrote: »

I might just be forgetting something obvious, but I can't think of a team/manager who have successfully alternated between flat back four and 3CBs + wing-backs formations.

I think Rodgers did it a bit last season, not much though.

GSPfan

homerjay2005 wrote: »

I will agree with one thing - if yesterday leads to long term gains, i will accept it. It should (i hope)act as an eye opener for many how bad things are including our owners.

During the summer i had a theory that inside the club, David Moyes was getting 90% of the blame and the club thought small changes plus a new manager would sort it. the last 3 weeks have shown me that this theory is correct.

If yesterday (as disappointed as we all are) is the start of the rebuilding process, then so be it. if LVG gets us to top 4 with that squad, the man is a miracle worker.

If you phrased your posts more like this one I think you'd have everyone agreeing with you. I think people are quick to disagree with you when go all guns blazing in attack at the club.

I do hope yesterday was a shock for the club as people walking out with nearly ten minutes left was an absolutely awful sight. I hate Booing in all its forms but a good mass walk out really gets the point across i think.

homerjay2005

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Mid-table team.

The first XI is top 4 level.

---

DDG
Raf

---

Jones--Smalling--Evans

---

Shaw

---

Herrera

---

Carrick

---

Mata

---

Rooney

---

RVP
.

The mid table argument ( seen as you started your post with it) was in relation to the team we had out yesterday so stop trying to move goal posts with a line up that was not available to us.

The line up we had yesterday was the reason for our awful atmosphere. When LVG came out, very few people actually cared. Moyes brought the roof down

Nalz

homerjay2005 wrote: »

I will agree with one thing - if yesterday leads to long term gains, i will accept it. It should (i hope)act as an eye opener for many how bad things are including our owners.

During the summer i had a theory that inside the club, David Moyes was getting 90% of the blame and the club thought small changes plus a new manager would sort it. the last 3 weeks have shown me that this theory is correct.

If yesterday (as disappointed as we all are) is the start of the rebuilding process, then so be it. if LVG gets us to top 4 with that squad, the man is a miracle worker.

+1 on this... on all points.

I seriously fear we won't get 4th now... Even if we manage to get in 2 or 3 players before the deadline. But I won't moan on here, no point.
Liverpool lost Suarez and even though they did a Spurs on it in spending 100m on 6 or 7 players, they're starting lineup today looks very strong and smells of a top 4 side. If we put our best 11 out I can't say the same thing.

RVP won't save us this year. Rooney won't save us this year. LVG with this squad won't save us this year.

CM, LB cover and a utility player needed badly.

Pro. F

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Woodward said the club monitors social media to gauge the mood of the fans. Well. I think it should be quite clear now that none of us are happy. Some of the meltdowns on the cafe and twitter are quite something to behold.

And Tom cleverley gets offered a new deal!!??!!!!????
I'm gonna go back to my old suspicion that there's a very damaging and negative influence somewhere in the club that's protecting wasters like Tc.

I would have no doubt that there is at least some truth to what Woodward said about monitoring social media and that that is affecting his public statements about transfers, and maybe even causing him to encourage LVG to buy and sell certain players.

That is very bad news for the club. The vast majority of fans are idiots who, if given the chance, would make idiotic transfers.

Pro. F

Blatter wrote: »

I think Rodgers did it a bit last season, not much though.

They were defensively disorganised all season though so I wouldn't count that as a success.

PhlegmyMoses

homerjay2005 wrote: »

The mid table argument ( seen as you started your post with it) was in relation to the team we had out yesterday so stop trying to move goal posts with a line up that was not available to us.

The line up we had yesterday was the reason for our awful atmosphere. When LVG came out, very few people actually cared. Moyes brought the roof down

I'm not trying to move the goalposts. The team I have posted is our first XI. I was giving context to the point I made later that we aren't deep enough in defensive bodies and it results in us playing wingers and youth teamers when we get injuries.

I pretty much agree with you to a certain extent. We need signings

Your Airbag

Vidal, Reus, Di Maria, Strootman, Blind and Hummells in the remaining 15 days.

Crisis over :pac:

Pro. F

I wouldn't be at all surprised if Louis is thinking that he'll wait on one of Strootman and Vidal to recover from their knee issues and then go for whoever proves their fitness first. Wait until January if he has to and not bother with buying any other CM in the mean time.

So, if by the end of this window we've only bought a few defenders that wouldn't surprise me much. However, if we buy no defenders that would be a surprise.

Your Airbag

According to information from SPORT BILD PLUS, Bayern Munich are very close to acquiring Moroccan central defender Mehdi Benatia.
The 27-year old plays for Seria A runners-up AS Roma and will replace the injured Javi Martinez. The Spaniard suffered an anterior cruciate ligament tear in last Wednesday's Supercup against Borussia Dortmund.
Benatia, who was recently connected to a move to Chelsea, would cost Bayern a sum of around 30M euros. Manager Pep Guardiola confirmed on Saturday that Munich would make one more foray into the transfer market.

http://sportbild.bild.de/bundesliga/vereine/bundesliga/bayern-vor-verpflichtung-von-benatia-37282720.sport.html

MagicIRL

What happened to Rojo? It was on the BBC at one point and still nothing?

Benita as well? And Vidal is signed according to La Stampa. What a wonderful time to be a fan! :pac:

redbaron_99

Kinda funny how a strong rumour of an incoming transfer surfaced after a woeful performance like yesterday.
Today it completely disappears.

GSPfan

Your Airbag wrote: »

Vidal, Reus, Di Maria, Strootman, Blind and Hummells in the remaining 15 days.

Crisis over :pac:

We'd be in a whole new financial crisis after buying that lot.

Lord TSC

MagicIRL wrote: »

What happened to Rojo? It was on the BBC at one point and still nothing?

Still seems to be interest on our side, but the contract/3rd party situation is a mess and holding things up...

redbaron_99

MagicIRL wrote: »

What happened to Rojo? It was on the BBC at one point and still nothing?

Benita as well? And Vidal is signed according to La Stampa. What a wonderful time to be a fan! :pac:

Maybe it's the club leaking this BS to buy some time with the fans.

bucketybuck

MagicIRL wrote: »

We lost 2-1. A lot of people need to calm the **** down. Everyone can have an off day. It doesn't help that we've a rake of injuries and that Rooney, Mata and Chico had a pretty poor game.

Keep calm and Que Sera, Sera.

Haha, yeah, thats it alright, just a bad day at the office. :pac:

I mean, its not like some people saw it coming a mile off, its not like some people repeatedly pointed out that a lot of the players weren't good enough and would probably play to the same shite standard as last season. Its not like a lot of people knew that new signings were desperately needed and were very worried that the lack of such signings would result in days like yesterday.

Nah, none of that, it was just on off day, right?

PhlegmyMoses

Bayern don't pay players top dollar. If Bayern are in and LVG really wants him, that's the only area that United will be seen as a more attractive proposition.

titan18

Wouldn't mind signing Schneiderlin. He wants out and would be an improvement

2moreMinutes

homerjay2005 wrote: »

During the summer i had a theory that inside the club, David Moyes was getting 90% of the blame and the club thought small changes plus a new manager would sort it. the last 3 weeks have shown me that this theory is correct.

A huge majority of those outside the club also put at least 90% of the blame at Moyes feet.

Add in the excitement of our new manager taking a completely different team deep in a cup competition, a few meaningless friendly wins against teams a few weeks behind us in pre-season preparation, the noticeable efforts of players to get the "we are Man Utd and we don't settle for 4th" message out there, the excitement over a new system of playing and an unexpected upsurge in form in a few players during pre-season and a lot of people were somehow convinced LVG was the second coming of Jesus compared to Moyes and he would solve everything just by being there.

Son Of A Vidic

redbaron_99 wrote: »

And Tom cleverley gets offered a new deal!!??!!!!????

Dear God please no.

NTMK

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Maybe it's the club leaking this BS to buy some time with the fans.

Benatia? maybe
Rojo? that situation is so messy it wouldn't surprise me if he signed monday or if united were understandably put off by the mess and the players alleged actions during training

redbaron_99

titan18 wrote: »

Wouldn't mind signing Schneiderlin. He wants out and would be an improvement

Cleverley is on the verge of signing a new contract so u can forget about a new midfielder coming in.

These players won the league two years ago remember.

bucketybuck

redbaron_99 wrote: »

These players won the league two years ago remember.

I remember that season as well as you, the signs of our current problems were very evident that season and I bet my posts from the time would back up that opinion.

The oft repeated mantra that "these players won the league" is ignoring the fact that most of "these players" were shite that season as well.

beno619

A new contract for Cleverley before a new player is signed could add to the "perfect storm" that was suggested is brewing a few pages back.

homerjay2005

2moreMinutes wrote: »

a lot of people were somehow convinced LVG was the second coming of Jesus compared to Moyes and he would solve everything just by being there.

The feeling before and during the game yesterday suggested otherwise. Never experienced such a dour mood and im going 12 years now.

Even driving to the ground, walking up...something just didnt feel right.

kryogen

bucketybuck wrote: »

I remember that season as well as you, the signs of our current problems were very evident that season and I bet my posts from the time would back up that opinion.

The oft repeated mantra that "these players won the league" is ignoring the fact that most of "these players" were shite that season as well.

He was being sarcastic, he is a member of the everything is ****e brigade as well.

How Soon Is Now

Out of interest when's the last time we won a battle for a player when another major Club was interested?

Mitch Connor

Still of the opinion that Woodward is the problem, he just isn't good at transfers. I'm confident the money is there and the club is willing to spend it, we just can't actually get any deals done, and that is woodwards job. I don't believe for a second that LVG hadn't decided on any targets til a week ago as some argue.

Mitch Connor

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Out of interest when's the last time we won a battle for a player when another major Club was interested?

RVP.

Cookiemunster

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Out of interest when's the last time we won a battle for a player when another major Club was interested?

Roy Keane???? :-) Didn't RVP choose us over City

How Soon Is Now

Outside of the premier league?

How Soon Is Now

kryogen wrote: »

He was being sarcastic, he is a member of the everything is ****e brigade as well.

Everything is awesome!!

Cookiemunster

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Outside of the premier league?

In that situation I'd say never. Ronaldinho, Moura, Hazard, Benzema off the top of my head.

kryogen

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Still of the opinion that Woodward is the problem, he just isn't good at transfers. I'm confident the money is there and the club is willing to spend it, we just can't actually get any deals done, and that is woodwards job. I don't believe for a second that LVG hadn't decided on any targets til a week ago as some argue.

I dunno, its tough on the one hand to say that Woodward, or someone above him is shrewd enough to spot this last season and keep him away from the Mata transfer but is not able to see it this season and say he is the problem.

If he was singled out as the problem last season, and action was taken as in the Mata transfer then why would it change this season?

How Soon Is Now

Cookiemunster wrote: »

In that situation I'd say never. Ronaldinho, Moura, Hazard, Benzema off the top of my head.

Ya I can't remember the last one there's bound to be at least one though?

Mitch Connor

kryogen wrote: »

I dunno, its tough on the one hand to say that Woodward, or someone above him is shrewd enough to spot this last season and keep him away from the Mata transfer but is not able to see it this season and say he is the problem.

If he was singled out as the problem last season, and action was taken as in the Mata transfer then why would it change this season?

no evidence, as far as I am aware, that Woodward was benched by the club during the mata transfer. From what I remember it was Woodward who wanted the deal done as it was because he didn't think the deal would happen if united made their interest known straight out the gate, and the worry Rooney would become part of the conversation if he tried to deal directly.

homerjay2005

beno619 wrote: »

A new contract for Cleverley before a new player is signed could add to the "perfect storm" that was suggested is brewing a few pages back.

Imagine the anarchy if we announce a new sponsorship deal for some random noodle partner in Nepal tomorrow.

Part of me actually wants it to happen, just for the lols.

kryogen

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Everything is awesome!!

Wouldn't agree with that assessment either.

kryogen

Mitch Connor wrote: »

no evidence, as far as I am aware, that Woodward was benched by the club during the mata transfer. From what I remember it was Woodward who wanted the deal done as it was because he didn't think the deal would happen if united made their interest known straight out the gate, and the worry Rooney would become part of the conversation if he tried to deal directly.

Which would demonstrate pretty good acumen when it comes to transfer dealings, so again it leaves us with a bit of a problem when declaring he is clueless or would be unable to recognise that he is the problem.