Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 13/8

markcahill1985

MagicIRL wrote: »

4-3-3 isn't, as that becomes 4-3-1-2 with Mata @ #10. I think. I'm not sure exactly what we'll play. I know LvG has said 3-5-2 but he seems to be talking a lot about 4-3-3 and 4-3-1-2 as well.

yeah its strange and dont think we have the squad at the moment to pull it off, cant see Kagawa switching to one of the wing back roles when we switch to 3 4 1 2 tho, would assume Mata is nailed on in the number 10 role going by the firnlies, dont see where kagawa fits in to be honest (which is a shame as i am a big fan)

Coat22

Macca07 wrote: »

€10 million, are you serious? About £8 million? That's what you think an international striker playing at the highest level is worth? If that's what any club offers for him, they should be laughed out of the office.

Origi went to Liverpool for £10 million, you think he is worth more than Hernandez?

He’s still an unwanted striker looking to leave a club that needs to shed players due to a lack of European competition. He’s not a first choice for Mexico either(although I fail to understand why)

I like Hernandez. Would keep him ahead of any of the other strikers after RVP but he’s looking for an exit and I think if he gets one to Spain it’ll go great for him and United fans will be sick again in a few years when he’s banging them in across Europe but we won’t get huge money for him – in his case it’s a buyers’ market and our best bet would be if we could use him in a player swap somewhere IMO

Macca07

Lord TSC wrote: »

Origi the highly rated young player moving up the chain, verses Hernandez, who is older, 4th choice and who the club wants rid of?

I'd say 10m would be about right for him sadly, and I say that as a fan of his.....

Origi is far from being highly-rated, no offense to him or to Liverpool, but he won't make it in England. He scored 5 goals last season in the French league. I know he's young, and had a good WC, but I wouldn't say he's highly-rated. Would you have heard of him before the WC?

And the club doesn't want rid of Hernandez, from what I can tell. He has said he might have to move to get more game time. And Hernandez is hardly over the hill, he's just 26.

Giggsy11

Shaw's attitude is excellent, Van Gaal said he is not as fit as he expect him to be, he agreed and started special training to get up to the speed. He played the game after heavy training session in the morning.

Spazdarn

Hernandez is good but he was lacking in quite a few areas last season, he's fairly bad with his back to goal and his hold up play is poor, though United tactically were fairly dreadful last season. Hopefully LVG can get them playing proper attacking football again, and find a place for him.

Nalz

A CB and A CM in

Sell Cleverley, Hernandez and Nani and I'd be happy

I don't think Nani will get much game time with these systems and we could recoup a good few quid for him.

It would be fantastic to get 35\40m + for the 3 above

cdb

I thought both Hernandez and Nani looked fairly serious and intense last night and didn't seem to be enjoying the game at all. Going on their expressions alone I wouldn't be surprised if they've already decided or been told they have no future at the club. Personally I'd prefer both to stay and excel but unfortunately my guess is they're done.

Lord TSC

Macca07 wrote: »

Origi is far from being highly-rated, no offense to him or to Liverpool, but he won't make it in England. He scored 5 goals last season in the French league. I know he's young, and had a good WC, but I wouldn't say he's highly-rated. Would you have heard of him before the WC?

And the club doesn't want rid of Hernandez, from what I can tell. He has said he might have to move to get more game time. And Hernandez is hardly over the hill, he's just 26.

Its probably disingenuous of me to go to the extremes when describing the duo, so I'll reign it back and agree to an extent.

Still, Origi is moving from a small club who likely don't want to sell to a club who just got a massive windfall of cash. He's younger, has potential (not WC, but still potential). Everything there leads to him being valued at a decently high price.

Hernandez is 4th choice striker at a club looking to shift players on. He scored 9 goals in 35 games last season (4 of which were in the league cup), is at a club with an overabundance of strikers. And he looks to want to leave as well. All that will combine to create a bargain buy for whoever comes sniffing.

I'd say 10m with clauses will be likely. Think we could get 15m if Woodward is on form (as I personally think he has been with Buttner and Bebe so far). Or he might even be used in a makeweight way somewhere (Turan has been rumoured to be of interest to us so maybe....)

Macca07

Can United afford to lose to Madrid and still win the group?

Rayne Wooney

Just watched the match and I love the passing moves and way we are playing. Really excited to see what Van Gaal can do in a few months if he has us playing better in a few weeks.

I get a bad feeling hearing Van Gaal talk about Kagawa as a 6 and 8 and not mentioning midfielders with transfers

Converting a number 10 to a CM is just another failure to fix the midfield

If we have an agreement to bring Strootman in in January then it's okay, but Roma are likely to be still in the CL at that stage and doing well in the league so putting our hopes on him leaving that to come to us is mad, and add in we are going to be playing half our games with Cleverley, Carrick, Fletch, Fellaini and Kagawa as midfielders there is a chance it could all go wrong between now and January

Headshot

Macca07 wrote: »

Talks this morning that Atletico Madrid are looking to sign Hernandez. He would be a fantastic striker in La Liga, but I don't know how much playing time he would get with Mandzukic already there.

I suppose you couldn't blame him for looking to leave, if he is. Would we get £20 million for him?

Over my dead body

Mr_Red

Kagawa should be swapped for Hummels. I think BVB would be interested

Macca07

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

If we have an agreement to bring Strootman in in January then it's okay, but Roma are likely to be still in the CL at that stage and doing well in the league so putting our hopes on him leaving that to come to us is mad, and add in we are going to be playing half our games with Cleverley, Carrick, Fletch, Fellaini and Kagawa as midfielders there is a chance it could all go wrong between now and January

You keep going on about the midfield and listing the midfielders available and yet you have not once included Herrera in the list, probably our best midfielder at the moment, who we spent close to £30 million on.

If you're trying to make a valid argument, at least have your facts right.

Maximus Alexander

Herrera has indeed been a joy to watch thus far. I knew nothing about him before since I don't watch much Spanish football and I'm not going to pretend I do, so watching him has been a pleasant surprise.

Spazdarn

Macca07 wrote: »

You keep going on about the midfield and listing the midfielders available and yet you have not once included Herrera in the list, probably our best midfielder at the moment, who we spent close to £30 million on.

If you're trying to make a valid argument, at least have your facts right.

He's probably stating that one midfielder can't do it all

Mitch Connor

Macca07 wrote: »

Can United afford to lose to Madrid and still win the group?

If the Roma/Inter game goes to penalties, we'd go through, as the groups are decided on Head to Head results, and we beat Inter and Roma on that score.

If either Italian side wins their game, we'd be out (assuming we lose to Real).

eagle eye

Mr_Red wrote: »

Kagawa should be swapped for Hummels. I think BVB would be interested

This is being mentioned in newspapers but it would still take a big transfer fee to secure it. Kagawa has lost his way at United and his value has dropped a lot I'd imagine. He did nothing in the World Cup to show he still retains the ability that he had a few years ago.

On the other hand Hummels has seen his reputation grow and grow and with both players the same age I'd imagine it would take an offer north of €12.5 million with Kagawa before Dortmund would consider it. I'm probably being generous there too.

Rayne Wooney

Macca07 wrote: »

You keep going on about the midfield and listing the midfielders available and yet you have not once included Herrera in the list, probably our best midfielder at the moment, who we spent close to £30 million on.

If you're trying to make a valid argument, at least have your facts right.

Ander has played the last two seasons primarily as a number 10, you don't know how Van Gaal is going to use him

I'll add him in there when I see enough of him in CM

Macca07

ToiletFusion wrote: »

He's probably stating that one midfielder can't do it all

If the 3-5-2 formation is the preferred one this season, then a 2-man midfield with Mata as the #10 is what will be used. So Herrera and one of the following, Carrick, Fletcher, Cleverly, Fellaini, Kagawa, Anderson.

That's 6 midfielders for one position. In a season with no European football.

Yes, I would love Vidal/Strootman/generic CM, and I'm not saying I'm happy with the current bunch of midfielders, but we will need to move a couple off that list before we do. I don't think we could give Anderson away at this stage, you could argue that Kagawa isn't a CM, but that's where he'll probably get more game time. I couldn't see the club selling Fletcher, Carrick, or Cleverly, and we'd make a massive loss on Fellaini.

Macca07

Mitch Connor wrote: »

If the Roma/Inter game goes to penalties, we'd go through, as the groups are decided on Head to Head results, and we beat Inter and Roma on that score.

If either Italian side wins their game, we'd be out (assuming we lose to Real).

Do you know what will happen if the game goes to penalties and either Roma/Inter win in 90 minutes? head-to head or GD?

bucketybuck

Macca07 wrote: »

You keep going on about the midfield and listing the midfielders available and yet you have not once included Herrera in the list, probably our best midfielder at the moment, who we spent close to £30 million on.

If you're trying to make a valid argument, at least have your facts right.

Herrera alone isn't coming close to fixing the problems with our midfield.

Macca07

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Ander has played the last two seasons primarily as a number 10, you don't know how Van Gaal is going to use him

I'll add him in there when I see enough of him in CM

Sure, because we've signed another #10 to add to the other 10 at the club. Cop on. He started the LA Galaxy game in CM. Did you miss that one?

Macca07

bucketybuck wrote: »

Herrera alone isn't coming close to fixing the problems with our midfield.

Never once said that... but it's a big move in the right direction.

Rayne Wooney

Macca07 wrote: »

Sure, because we've signed another #10 to add to the other 10 at the club. Cop on. He started the LA Galaxy game in CM. Did you miss that one?

1 game, how do you know he was signed as a CM if the club watched him last season playing as a 10, they may have signed him to be converted into a CM but that conversion isn't one game and you don't know how Van Gaal thinks Ander has performed as a CM

And maybe relax telling people to get facts right and to cop on when you are using 1 game to prove absolutely nothing concrete

bucketybuck

Macca07 wrote: »

Never once said that... but it's a big move in the right direction.

You snarkily tried to call him on his argument and said he should get his facts right, but your post didn't refute him at all. Heres what he said:

and add in we are going to be playing half our games with Cleverley, Carrick, Fletch, Fellaini and Kagawa as midfielders

He is correct, with Herrera there we will still be playing our games with the likes of Cleverley, Carrick and Fletcher in our midfield.

Cookiemunster

eagle eye wrote: »

This is being mentioned in newspapers but it would still take a big transfer fee to secure it. Kagawa has lost his way at United and his value has dropped a lot I'd imagine. He did nothing in the World Cup to show he still retains the ability that he had a few years ago.

On the other hand Hummels has seen his reputation grow and grow and with both players the same age I'd imagine it would take an offer north of €12.5 million with Kagawa before Dortmund would consider it. I'm probably being generous there too.

Very generous I'd say. I'd doubt anything less than £35 would get Hummels. Plus I don't think that there's room for Kagawa at BVB anymore. They have signed Mikhtryan, Reus and Aubamyang since he left and should have Gundogen back this season.
If we sell Kagawa I doubt it would be to Dortmund, but it could be to a BL club.

bangkok

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Ander has played the last two seasons primarily as a number 10, you don't know how Van Gaal is going to use him

I'll add him in there when I see enough of him in CM

no he hasn't he has played centre mid

Rayne Wooney

bangkok wrote: »

no he hasn't he has played centre mid

Just like Reus then

Giggsy11

Macca07 wrote: »

Can United afford to lose to Madrid and still win the group?

If Roma Vs Inter game ends in draw then ManUtd will win the group.

If ManUtd gets at least a draw then ManUtd will win the group.

jamesbere

Christ sky are really going overboard on shaws fitness thing, how dare van gaal criticise a English player.

Spazdarn

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

1 game, how do you know he was signed as a CM if the club watched him last season playing as a 10, they may have signed him to be converted into a CM but that conversion isn't one game and you don't know how Van Gaal thinks Ander has performed as a CM

And maybe relax telling people to get facts right and to cop on when you are using 1 game to prove absolutely nothing concrete

Still if your defence is that he doesn't know for sure how LVG thinks, then you don't know either.

He's played Herrera at CM since he got here, and he's stated already that he has too many number tens (4 being Rooney, Kagawa, Mata and possibly Felliani) of which he didn't name Herrera, so it's safe to say he's going to be a CM.

bangkok

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Just like Reus then

you have never seen Herrera play with bilbao prob only against united

Rayne Wooney

bangkok wrote: »

you have never seen Herrera play with bilbao prob only against united

Tell me what else I've never seen

bangkok

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Herrera has indeed been a joy to watch thus far. I knew nothing about him before since I don't watch much Spanish football and I'm not going to pretend I do, so watching him has been a pleasant surprise.

he is a cracking player with the potential to be one of the best midfielders in the league.

bangkok

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Tell me what else I've never seen

well you said he has played as a no10 which you clearly just made up or guessed that he played there

Giggsy11

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Just watched the match and I love the passing moves and way we are playing. Really excited to see what Van Gaal can do in a few months if he has us playing better in a few weeks.

I get a bad feeling hearing Van Gaal talk about Kagawa as a 6 and 8 and not mentioning midfielders with transfers

Converting a number 10 to a CM is just another failure to fix the midfield

If we have an agreement to bring Strootman in in January then it's okay, but Roma are likely to be still in the CL at that stage and doing well in the league so putting our hopes on him leaving that to come to us is mad, and add in we are going to be playing half our games with Cleverley, Carrick, Fletch, Fellaini and Kagawa as midfielders there is a chance it could all go wrong between now and January

Van Gaal's quotes on Kagawa was misinterpreted by almost all the papers including ManUtd twitter.

"I know him from Borussia Dortmund and he played in the no.10 position," van Gaal added. "I wanted to try him in the no.6 or no.8 position in our system in the first two matches, and then I also gave him a chance at no.10 because he wanted to play in that position. He did it much better than in the two matches before."

http://www.manutd.com/en/Tour-2014/Tour2014News/2014/Jul/louis-van-gaal-hails-manchester-united-win-over-inter-milan-as-best-performance-so-far.aspx?pageNo=2

Spazdarn

bangkok wrote: »

well you said he has played as a no10 which you clearly just made up or guessed that he played there

I think United fans are so unused to seeing a midfielder that can receive the ball, turn around and pick a pass, that we assume anyone that can is a Number 10 by trade.

Macca07

bucketybuck wrote: »

You snarkily tried to call him on his argument and said he should get his facts right, but your post didn't refute him at all. Heres what he said:
He is correct, with Herrera there we will still be playing our games with the likes of Cleverley, Carrick and Fletcher in our midfield.

You know he was implying that the mentioned above would be the starters, and he didn't include Herrera in the list. It wasn't the first post either that he made regarding the midfield and not including Herrera in the list.

Giggsy11

He cut short his three-week break after the World Cup to return to United training a week early, but still felt he was not at the level he wants to be at.
With United's matches coming thick and fast in the United States, a large part of the first-team training is geared around playing games and recovery.
Shaw felt he needed more intensive pre-season fitness work and asked United officials whether he could do extra training with Strudwick to make sure he is in the best possible condition in time for the opening game against Swansea on Aug 16.
Van Gaal spoke personally to Shaw about the personal training programme and it is understood both men are happy with the agreement

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/10998461/Luke-Shaw-requested-extra-training-as-Louis-van-Gaal-prepares-Manchester-United-for-Premier-League-season.html

Very good attitude imo and at this rate he will become fan favorite in no time.

TheDoc

Reports suggesting Vidal will today indicate to Juventus his desire to join Manchester Unites. He had hoped from respect for the club they would sanction the transfer however it seems now he will need to signal strongly to Juventus his desire to leave.

That story has come up all over my twitter retweeted by various journalists .

Coat22

TheDoc wrote: »

Reports suggesting Vidal will today indicate to Juventus his desire to join Manchester Unites. He had hoped from respect for the club they would sanction the transfer however it seems now he will need to signal strongly to Juventus his desire to leave.

That story has come up all over my twitter retweeted by various journalists .

Twitter you tease

bangkok

TheDoc wrote: »

Reports suggesting Vidal will today indicate to Juventus his desire to join Manchester Unites. He had hoped from respect for the club they would sanction the transfer however it seems now he will need to signal strongly to Juventus his desire to leave.

That story has come up all over my twitter retweeted by various journalists .

well its a good sign when Fernando Felicevich has also just arrived in Italy....

MagicIRL

Gentlemen... gifs on stand-by....

homerjay2005

RayCun wrote: »

- the club is perfectly capable of pursuing several transfer deals at the same time,

there is very little to suggest this is true right now. other clubs have been able to seal multiple deals quickly, but we have 2 -

one who was ongoing for 6 months with a mid table club that we spent £27million.

the other for a player that we had tried to sign 9 months earlier and made a mess of.

last summer we signed one player, last january we signed one player. lets be fair here, closing multiple deals is not something you can say is happening when its not exactly the case.

Backstreet Moyes

I really think Kagawa could do well in a 3 man midfield with a holding midfielder. If we got De Jong in and then Strootman in the next window i would not be delighted but it could work. I think Kagawa has the vision and passing ability to dictate from deep. A trio of Herrera, De Jong and Kagawa could be a good partnership.

Coat22

bangkok wrote: »

well its a good sign when Fernando Felicevich has also just arrived in Italy....

MAybe he's selling Medel to Inter?

Vic Vinegar

TheDoc wrote: »

Reports suggesting Vidal will today indicate to Juventus his desire to join Manchester Unites. He had hoped from respect for the club they would sanction the transfer however it seems now he will need to signal strongly to Juventus his desire to leave.

That story has come up all over my twitter retweeted by various journalists .

It seems most if not all of the reports stem from an article in El Mercurio, i've no idea how reliable they are.

MagicIRL

http://www.caughtoffside.com/2014/07/30/exclusive-man-united-agree-47m-deal-to-sign-arturo-vidal-squad-number-reserved-personal-terms-reached/

Man United have seen a €60m (£47m) bid for Juventus star Arturo Vidal accepted and with the Chilean having already agreed personal terms a move to complete a club record transfer deal appears to be on the cards.

CaughtOffside understands that Old Trafford boss Louis van Gaal had pushed chief executive Ed Woodward to pull out all the stops to land the highly rated attacking midfielder with the Premier League side keen to bring a ‘Marquee’ signing to act as a real statement of intent.







Read more Manchester United FC news.

Van Gaal is keen to freshen up his brittle midfield and his push for added creativity, and a genuine additional goal threat, has led Man United to make a big money move for Vidal.

The Dutch boss has been in hot pursuit of Vidal for some weeks and the departure of Antonio Conte as Juventus manager has only aided their move to bring in the former Bayer Leverkusen man.

Louis van Gaal has a long running interest in Vidal, having attempted to sign the cultured performer when he was in charge of Bayern Munich, and now seems to have won the race to bring in the Juventus man.



Vidal has been pivotal in Juventus’s three successive Serie A title wins but the club’s inability to make an impact at Champions League level may have left him open to a fresh challenge.

Though Man United do not have Champions League action to offer Vidal in 2014/15 he will have been impressed with the club’s drive to enter a new era, post Sir Alex Ferguson, with the club’s owners keen to repair the damage suffered during David Moyes’s brief reign.

Man United will hand Vidal a four year deal worth in excess of £200k a week and though a deal isn’t entirely done and dusted it is thought that the club will bring in the 27 year old in the coming days and have reserved the number seven squad number for the incoming South American.

Van Gaal has already brought in Ander Herrera and Luke Shaw from Athletic Bilbao and Southampton respectively, moves that cost around £60m, and further signings are penciled in and as such a number of the club’s expansive squad look set for summer exits in order to balance the books.

Nani, Javier Hernandez, Marouane Fellaini and Ashley Young are four players van Gaal is keen to cash-in on.

The only potential obstacle to a successful move for Vidal could come from PSG, who are also said to be keen on the Juventus man.

Spazdarn

Nuts102 wrote: »

I really think Kagawa could do well in a 3 man midfield with a holding midfielder. If we got De Jong in and then Strootman in the next window i would not be delighted but it could work. I think Kagawa has the vision and passing ability to dictate from deep. A trio of Herrera, De Jong and Kagawa could be a good partnership.

I agree with this, but we'd need that DM to anchor it, with wing backs on either side of 3 central defenders we'd surely be balanced enough in defence.

Hococop

MagicIRL wrote: »

http://www.caughtoffside.com/2014/07/30/exclusive-man-united-agree-47m-deal-to-sign-arturo-vidal-squad-number-reserved-personal-terms-reached/

......... Must resist urge to get excited............