Anyone please able to help - Garda cert error / convictions question - in a panic!!!

Durag

Hi,

I am stuck in a bit of a pickle.

I have three convictions - all from 2006 - 2 for drunk & disorderly and 1 for threatening, abusive or insulting behaviour. However on the original police cert i sent, they made an error and put down that i had a conviction for theft instead of one of the drunk & disorderly convictions. I was up in court in 2006 for theft as well but it was thrown out of court i.e. dismissed, so it should not have appeared in the police cert. I went through a bad period in 06 and couldnt remember what convictions i had so i just sent it off.

CIC came back requesting court records / police records relating to the convictions and it was only when i got the court records that i relaized the police had made and error and i was never actually convicted of theft (it was an item worth €40 when i was drunk - stupid i know, but a once off), i contacted the police, they admitted their error and issued a new police cert minus the theft conviction.

Now comes the tricky part - do i just send off the court records for the 3 convictions (2 for drunk & disorderly and 1 for threatening behaviour) and say i was never convicted of theft and how the police made an error, and NOT mention that i was up in court on charges of theft and it was thrown out? Or do i send off the court record for the theft charge AS WELL AS the other 3 which stated i was charged but not convicted of theft?

If the police had not made this error then theft would not appear on my record at all, i am very angry at them, but whats done is done, i know Canada takes theft very seriously, so i dont know what i should do, should i not mention that i was up in court on theft charges and just send off the 3 i was actually convicted of? Will they ask was i ever charged with theft? Or should i say i was in court on theft charges (and that is probably where the police made their error - but was not convicted as it was deemed a very minor offence) and just come clean about it?

They specifically asked for court records in relation to the convictions that appear on the police cert, i was in court on other charges before but they were dismissed i.e. thrown out so i was never convicted so i am not sending those off as they did not ask for them.

Anyone have any ideas what i should do? I know Canada takes theft v seriously but i was not convicted of it and it was a very minor offence here in Ireland.

I have not been in any trouble since 06, have a steady job, completed courses and am in a stable relationship. I have been planning this for ages and i am terrified of doing the wrong thing here.

Any help would be great.

Cheers.

Glitzgirl

Durag wrote: »

Hi,

I am stuck in a bit of a pickle.

I have three convictions - all from 2006 - 2 for drunk & disorderly and 1 for threatening, abusive or insulting behaviour. However on the original police cert i sent, they made an error and put down that i had a conviction for theft instead of one of the drunk & disorderly convictions. I was up in court in 2006 for theft as well but it was thrown out of court i.e. dismissed, so it should not have appeared in the police cert. I went through a bad period in 06 and couldnt remember what convictions i had so i just sent it off.

CIC came back requesting court records / police records relating to the convictions and it was only when i got the court records that i relaized the police had made and error and i was never actually convicted of theft (it was an item worth €40 when i was drunk - stupid i know, but a once off), i contacted the police, they admitted their error and issued a new police cert minus the theft conviction.

Now comes the tricky part - do i just send off the court records for the 3 convictions (2 for drunk & disorderly and 1 for threatening behaviour) and say i was never convicted of theft and how the police made an error, and NOT mention that i was up in court on charges of theft and it was thrown out? Or do i send off the court record for the theft charge AS WELL AS the other 3 which stated i was charged but not convicted of theft?

If the police had not made this error then theft would not appear on my record at all, i am very angry at them, but whats done is done, i know Canada takes theft very seriously, so i dont know what i should do, should i not mention that i was up in court on theft charges and just send off the 3 i was actually convicted of? Will they ask was i ever charged with theft? Or should i say i was in court on theft charges (and that is probably where the police made their error - but was not convicted as it was deemed a very minor offence) and just come clean about it?

They specifically asked for court records in relation to the convictions that appear on the police cert, i was in court on other charges before but they were dismissed i.e. thrown out so i was never convicted so i am not sending those off as they did not ask for them.

Anyone have any ideas what i should do? I know Canada takes theft v seriously but i was not convicted of it and it was a very minor offence here in Ireland.

I have not been in any trouble since 06, have a steady job, completed courses and am in a stable relationship. I have been planning this for ages and i am terrified of doing the wrong thing here.

Any help would be great.

Cheers.

Send off all doccumentation requested and maybe request a note from sergeant in charge of station you spoke to clarifying the above (on headed paper) to submit with your paper work. If you leave it out deliberately you will encounter time delays and cause a bigger issue.

Durag

The thing is i havent gotten a conviction for theft, and the new police cert shows that, there is no theft conviction on there, and the letter from CIC clearly states they only need further documentation for the offences listed in the cert and in the new correct cert there is no theft one on there, so if i say that i was charged but not convicted am i only creating unneccessary trouble for myslef as they never mentioned charges? Then if they did i could send off the records in relation to the theft showing that it was dismissed and say i didnt include it because it is not on the correct cert and there was no conviction?

Glitzgirl

You are just going to make things more complicated, trust me go with the advice given in my previous post and send off letter from sgt in charge stating error with first cert and forward amended cert and all doccumentation that was originally requested by CIC. They should be able to accept and amend your application if all the above is done

Glitzgirl

The documentation being requested is based on the information you provided at the time of application. If that information was incorrect you need to provided verified proof of this (ie letter headed paper from sgt in charge ) amended cert and the documentation for convictions on amended cert which shouldn't include your theft charge anyway as you weren't convicted, the main thing is get letter stating this error and the correct cert and write a letter yourself stating you never checked the original paperwork didnt notice error etc u wish to have your original application ammended to reflect the correct Garda cert information. Good luck with it

Durag

So i should send in the documentation for the 3 actual convictions and admit that i was up in court on charges of theft which didnt result in a conviction, obviously along with the documentation to prove it? Will i not have more of a chance of saying i have no convictions for theft and that it was a mistake (i have a letter from police stating they made an error) and only mention the theft charge if they specifically ask for it? I understand what you are saying to be honest, but am i not automatically making myself inadmissable when there may not be a need to?

Glitzgirl

Durag wrote: »

So i should send in the documentation for the 3 actual convictions and admit that i was up in court on charges of theft which didnt result in a conviction, obviously along with the documentation to prove it? Will i not have more of a chance of saying i have no convictions for theft and that it was a mistake (i have a letter from police stating they made an error) and only mention the theft charge if they specifically ask for it? I understand what you are saying to be honest, but am i not automatically making myself inadmissable when there may not be a need to?

Your original cert mentioned you had a conviction for theft yes? You can't unmention it all you can do is as suggested previously so I don't see how you think you will be making yourself inadmissible ? It's very simple at the moment your cert states you have a conviction for theft now until you ammend that you can't ignore it and not send in the paperwork. Anyone can say oh that was an error etc you need to send in verified proof of error correct cert and the paper work for your convictions. You have already made them aware of the theft conviction or dismissal so amend your application to your actual convictions and no more should be needed on the theft charge

Durag

Glitzgirl wrote: »

Your original cert mentioned you had a conviction for theft yes? You can't unmention it all you can do is as suggested previously so I don't see how you think you will be making yourself inadmissible ? It's very simple at the moment your cert states you have a conviction for theft now until you ammend that you can't ignore it and not send in the paperwork. Anyone can say oh that was an error etc you need to send in verified proof of error correct cert and the paper work for your convictions. You have already made them aware of the theft conviction or dismissal so amend your application to your actual convictions and no more should be needed on the theft charge

Thank you for your help. They are only aware of it through a mistake though, and the dates and the fine handed down correspond perfectly with the public order offence, so would they not just see that the police made an error with title of it (which in fact they did) and maybe not question it any further?

The reason i think i am making myself inadmissable is because theft is one of the charges that make you automatically inadmissable, and even though i was not convicted of it here, does it not depend on how it would be treated had i been up in court in Canada on similar charges?

Like i said however, it was for a €40 christmas wreath from Tesco when i was drunk.

Once again though thank you for your help

Glitzgirl

Durag wrote: »

Thank you for your help. They are only aware of it through a mistake though, and the dates and the fine handed down correspond perfectly with the public order offence, so would they not just see that the police made an error with title of it (which in fact they did) and maybe not question it any further?

The reason i think i am making myself inadmissable is because theft is one of the charges that make you automatically inadmissable, and even though i was not convicted of it here, does it not depend on how it would be treated had i been up in court in Canada on similar charges?

Like i said however, it was for a €40 christmas wreath from Tesco when i was drunk.

Once again though thank you for your help

I can't tell you wether or not the CIC will make the connection but if theft is listed as a conviction error or not they will expect to see the relevant documentation for it. All you can do is correct the issue as I have suggested. Most govt /state agencies will go on the information you have provided as they assume the paperwork is correct at the time or was checked before submission. I really can't help you anymore other than the advice I have already given to you in previous posts. Your safest bet is to assume they won't make the connection with the times for PO offence and theft listed as a conviction, so correct it for them by provideding the items I have suggested in the previous p

Durag

Glitzgirl wrote: »

I can't tell you wether or not the CIC will make the connection but if theft is listed as a conviction error or not they will expect to see the relevant documentation for it. All you can do is correct the issue as I have suggested. Most govt /state agencies will go on the information you have provided as they assume the paperwork is correct at the time or was checked before submission. I really can't help you anymore other than the advice I have already given to you in previous posts. Your safest bet is to assume they won't make the connection with the times for PO offence and theft listed as a conviction, so correct it for them by provideding the items I have suggested in the previous p

Thanks, i think i will bite the bullet and send it off, hopefully they will see that it was a very minor offence and not refuse my visa on grounds of it, however i am starting to think they will.

If the guards had not made this error in the first place (I realize i should not have committed the crime - but it was thrown out of court) then there would be no mention of it at all...

Kevwoody

Even without the guards mistake, you still have two other convictions, so if your visa is not granted, it's your own fault.

Blaming the guards for your own mistakes in life seems very unfair to me.

Durag

Yes I am aware of that, however the convictions I have u are considered rehabilitated if 5 years have passed, whereas theft takes 10 years