Donegal 8 driver pleads guilty

Zubeneschamali

Donegal 8 case driver pleads guilty to dangerous driving causing deaths of eight others back in 2010.

corktina

Lives extinguished and lives ruined. Tragedy all round.

Stheno

At least the guilty plea removes the families of the deceased having to go through a trial.

Truckermal

That man would be better of being one of the dead.

corktina

Truckermal wrote: »

That man would be better of being one of the dead.

I see what you mean, even though I don't agree. Punishment by the Courts is somewhat superfluous really,compared to how he has affected his future.

Zubeneschamali

Truckermal wrote: »

That man would be better of being one of the dead.

Several delays to bringing this to trial based on his fitness to plead.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Several delays to bringing this to trial based on his fitness to plead.

Argued by his own legal team. They delayed this case for 3 years and questioned every shred of evidence. It's ridiculous it's been dragged on for so long but at least there can be some closure now.

No Pants

Stheno wrote: »

At least the guilty plea removes the families of the deceased having to go through a trial.

Am I reading it wrong or did he not just change the plea at the very last minute? In which case he kept them going as far as he could. I don't think there should be much of a reward for that behaviour.

Dangel4x4

Truckermal wrote: »

That man would be better of being one of the dead.

I'd tend to agree - a lot of lives snuffed out by this guy. He'll get, what, 5-10 years and a lifetime driving ban maybe?

Those of us who are parents should educate our kids about making choices that end up with them getting in cars with idiots like this...

Kristopherus

Dangel4x4 wrote: »

I'd tend to agree - a lot of lives snuffed out by this guy. He'll get, what, 5-10 years and a lifetime driving ban maybe?

Those of us who are parents should educate our kids about making choices that end up with them getting in cars with idiots like this.

Hopefully 5 yrs for each death & to run consecutively:mad:. Waste of space:mad:.

challengemaster

Dangel4x4 wrote: »

I'd tend to agree - a lot of lives snuffed out by this guy. He'll get, what, 5-10 years and a lifetime driving ban maybe?

Those of us who are parents should educate our kids about making choices that end up with them getting in cars with idiots like this...

I'd put my money on suspended sentence and 10 year driving ban at most.

punisher5112

He is scum for leaving it till the end to plead GUILTY.

Why in gods name can the legal system be made a joke out of.

He was the driver and caused another innocent motorists death and also the stupidity of him to allow 7 and himself in a car only for 5 and at that with fully grown adults is tight.

The lawyers and barristers made a small fortune off this and to be honest most cases as the lenght it takes to bring to court.

RIP to all involved and feel for the families.

Mackas_view

It's very interesting to see people using the words "idiot" and "waste of space" so freely on here when they probably have not got a clue of the circumstances surrounding the tragedy.

About time a moderator stepped in before a member of this mans family see these immature individuals comments

Truckermal

Mackas_view wrote: »

It's very interesting to see people using the words "idiot" and "waste of space" so freely on here when they probably have not got a clue of the circumstances surrounding the tragedy.

About time a moderator stepped in before a member of this mans family see these immature individuals comments

What do you want people to say ya he is a great lad....

Zubeneschamali

Mackas_view wrote: »

It's very interesting to see people using the words "idiot" and "waste of space" so freely on here when they probably have not got a clue of the circumstances surrounding the tragedy.

Come off it, we had this same chorus at the time, even though the facts were perfectly clear, but the guy just plead guilty. No way you can claim mysterious "circumstances" excuse him now.

Mackas_view

No I expect people to show a bit of respect to everyone involved when they don't know the details of what happened. No one has the right to brand this man and idiot or a waste of space. He killed his best friends it was hardly intentional. A bit of respect. For everyone involved.

Moneymaker

Mackas_view wrote: »

It's very interesting to see people using the words "idiot" and "waste of space" so freely on here when they probably have not got a clue of the circumstances surrounding the tragedy.

About time a moderator stepped in before a member of this mans family see these immature individuals comments

Uh, what?

7 people are dead and he is to blame.

What do you want people to say?

And people are being respectful to the dead. He deserves none as his actions, dragging out the case for so long, pleading not guilty in the first place(I mean come on!) are deplorable.

challengemaster

Mackas_view wrote: »

He killed his best friends it was hardly intentional. A bit of respect. For everyone involved.

So they unintentionally ended up with 8 people in a car?

You're right - he killed them. Respect is earned and this guy certainly doesn't deserve any.

Mackas_view

Mackas_view wrote: »

No I expect people to show a bit of respect to everyone involved when they don't know the details of what happened. No one has the right to brand this man and idiot or a waste of space. He killed his best friends it was hardly intentional. A bit of respect. For everyone involved.

Perfectly clear???? Have you ever driven on the road where this accident happened? How are you so sure that the man hasn't plead guilty to avoid the suffering that a trial would bring to the family of the deceased??? You don't

JC01

challengemaster wrote: »

So they unintentionally ended up with 8 people in a car?

You're right - he killed them. Respect is earned and this guy certainly doesn't deserve any.

He didnt force them into the car did he? I'm not excusing his actions they wer unbelievably stupid but I genuinely beleive he has a life sentance hanging over him for the rest of his days because of that stupidity. It's this great Irish tradition to never speak ill of the dead yet every passenger willingly got into that car knowing full well what kind of a driver he was. They made the exact same stupid decisions he did.

Mackas_view

All grown men and all best friends well aware of the dangers of travelling in an overloaded car. I'm not sayin you have to have a positive opinion of him but the choice of words on here are unacceptable

corktina

As the driver he was certainly responsible, but the car was over-loaded and the passengers knowingly rode in it so were just a small amount responsible too.(I'll probably get flamed for that, but it is none the less true).How many of us did something similar in our youth and got away with it? Any sentence passed will not compare to the life sentence he (and his family) will serve knowing he killed his friends
As he has pleaded guilty, we can assume that the other motorist involved wasn't to blame I guess.

Zubeneschamali

Mackas_view wrote: »

No I expect people to show a bit of respect to everyone involved when they don't know the details of what happened.

But we do know the details, we knew the details years ago. They were in the papers, with photos of the scene and everything.

challengemaster

JC01 wrote: »

He didnt force them into the car did he? I'm not excusing his actions they wer unbelievably stupid but I genuinely beleive he has a life sentance hanging over him for the rest of his days because of that stupidity. It's this great Irish tradition to never speak ill of the dead yet every passenger willingly got into that car knowing full well what kind of a driver he was. They made the exact same stupid decisions he did.

He equally didn't force them out of the car - It's the drivers responsibility to make sure they're not breaking any laws, and it's the drivers responsibility to ensure the car isn't overloaded.

quadrifoglio verde

punisher5112 wrote: »

He is scum for leaving it till the end to plead GUILTY.

Why in gods name can the legal system be made a joke out of.

He was the driver and caused another innocent motorists death and also the stupidity of him to allow 7 and himself in a car only for 5 and at that with fully grown adults is tight.

The lawyers and barristers made a small fortune off this and to be honest most cases as the lenght it takes to bring to court.

RIP to all involved and feel for the families.

In this country we operate on the basis of innocent until proven guilty. By your argument anyone who is charged, should just plead guilty.
It is up to the prosecution to prove guilt.

While he was stupid enough to allow 7 people plus himself in the car, the 7 who died were adults, you don't need a degree to tell you that 8 in a car may not end well.

I've every sympathy for the families of the deceased and that of the driver, as well as the driver. While he has destroyed the lives of his friends, he has also destroyed his own life, in one moment of foolishness.

JC01

challengemaster wrote: »

He equally didn't force them out of the car - It's the drivers responsibility to make sure they're not breaking any laws, and it's the drivers responsibility to ensure the car isn't overloaded.

I never stated otherwise. As I said he made an extraordinarily stupid decision and undoubtably broke the law. I don't feel that justifies the hateful bile some people are spewing out on here though

punisher5112

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

In this country we operate on the basis of innocent until proven guilty. By your argument anyone who is charged, should just plead guilty.
It is up to the prosecution to prove guilt.

While he was stupid enough to allow 7 people plus himself in the car, the 7 who died were adults, you don't need a degree to tell you that 8 in a car may not end well.

I've every sympathy for the families of the deceased and that of the driver, as well as the driver. While he has destroyed the lives of his friends, he has also destroyed his own life, in one moment of foolishness.

He killed another driver though so am a bit confused here.

How could he be proven innocent if he was the driver he was found in driver seat and it was also his car am I missing something.
This happened years ago and should no way take this long to bring closure to the famillies

challengemaster

JC01 wrote: »

I never stated otherwise. As I said he made an extraordinarily stupid decision and undoubtably broke the law. I don't feel that justifies the hateful bile some people are spewing out on here though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHMoDt3nSHs

Zubeneschamali

JC01 wrote: »

I don't feel that justifies the hateful bile some people are spewing out on here though

I don't feel the need to call him an idiot or a waste of space - guilty of dangerous driving killing 8 people says it all.

Sober at the time, too.

Mackas_view

Sober at the time, too.[/quote]

What are you implying??? It wouldn't have been as bad if he was drunk?

Zubeneschamali

Mackas_view wrote: »

What are you implying??? It wouldn't have been as bad if he was drunk?

When people ask "How on earth could someone do anything that insane?", a common answer is "Must have been really drunk at the time". In this case, no, police ruled out alcohol as a factor.

Mackas_view

What did he do that could question his sanity!???

NIMAN

Speed was obviously the main factor in this case, and a reckless attitude to driving.

The fact that there was 8 in the car didn't cause it to crash, it was the fact that he was driving it recklessly.

Zubeneschamali

Mackas_view wrote: »

What did he do that could question his sanity!???

Kill 7 of his mates?

And of course, his lawyers have repeatedly claimed he was unfit to stand trial...

NIMAN

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Kill 7 of his mates?

And of course, his lawyers have repeatedly claimed he was unfit to stand trial...

Thats a lawyers job. They also defend mass murderers, child rapists, people who plant bombs, terrorists etc. They try to have people proven innocent.

I think it says something about Ireland that this took exactly 4 years from the accident to the driver pleading guilty. Shocking length of time.

I don't see under what circumstances the driver could claim to be innocent to be honest. But then again I don't know the in and outs of the legal system.

bladebrew

There was another thread here a few months ago with a lot of sympathy to the driver, plenty of people saying this is the way it is in the country, loads of people in a car is normal, where did all those people go?

fletch

challengemaster wrote: »

It's the drivers responsibility to make sure they're not breaking any laws

Isn't it the responsibility of adult passengers to ensure they buckle their seat belts?

NIMAN

Driver is ultimately responsible.

If I have people in my car and they aren't wearing seatbelts, I get the penalty points.

NIMAN

I can have some sympathy for the driver in that he has physical injuries and the main guilt of living with the death of 7 of his friends, but he was an unlucky one.

This country is full of young men acting recklessly on the roads, taking stupid risks every single hour of every day. Many might come close to crashing but don't. This guy overtook recklessly and paid the price in the most terrible way.

fletch

NIMAN wrote: »

If I have people in my car and they aren't wearing seatbelts, I get the penalty points.

I thought that was only true of children but it is adults responsibility for their own seat belt?

RootX

Driver is responsible for passengers under the age of 17.

Wossack

fletch wrote: »

I thought that was only true of children but it is adults responsibility for their own seat belt?

+1

under 17s are drivers responsibility

Dangel4x4

Mackas_view wrote: »

It's very interesting to see people using the words "idiot" and "waste of space" so freely on here when they probably have not got a clue of the circumstances surrounding the tragedy.

You think he was doing a good job driving a car with 8 people in it?

Sounds like the work of an idiot to me. I'd use stronger words to describe the guy if I didn't think I'd get banned.

corks finest

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Several delays to bringing this to trial based on his fitness to plead.

obviously its a heartbreak for all involved,vvv sad,but having lived in that region(derry city)for 20 yrs ,i can tell you,there are some serious lunatics driving around the border area,speed speed speed,hope not,but unless the idiots slow down,take care,dont drink/dope up ,before /during driving,this horrible scene will happen again.

Gazzmonkey

The driver was woken up late one evening by a mate looking for a lift, been good hearted he got up, got dressed & drove to Ballyliffen to pick up his stranded mate in his recently remapped A4. Upon getting there he was greeted be several other mates all looking for a lift, been good hearted he let them all in and headed back to Buncrana.

On the way there he was showing his mates the difference that a remap makes to a car and in the process he had to serve out of the way of a female driver who was in the wrong side of the road after she overtook an old man. He clipped her car, lost control and had a head on collision with that same old man.

This is a heavily edited version of events, the full story would leave most people in tears.

The amount of 'people' on this site that like to slabber without knowing the facts is shocking, A lot of us have been in the exact same position as him except we never had a collision.

Dangel4x4

Had the remap been declared to his insurance company?

What kind of idiot puts 8 people into a car designed to hold 5, and goes for a burn on a public road to show the passengers what a difference a remap makes?

FFS. :rolleyes:

corks finest

LIGHTNING wrote: »

That is some load of horse crap you are spouting and you should be embarrassed to post it.

lads,whatever the reason,speed etc,its done now,hope some one learns from it,lot of families grieving,lets leave it ,eh?

wotswattage

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

The driver was woken up late one evening by a mate looking for a lift, been good hearted he got up, got dressed & drove to Ballyliffen to pick up his stranded mate in his recently remapped A4. Upon getting there he was greeted be several other mates all looking for a lift, been good hearted he let them all in and headed back to Buncrana.

On the way there he was showing his mates the difference that a remap makes to a car and in the process he had to serve out of the way of a female driver who was in the wrong side of the road after she overtook an old man. He clipped her car, lost control and had a head on collision with that same old man.

This is a heavily edited version of events, the full story would leave most people in tears.

The amount of 'people' on this site that like to slabber without knowing the facts is shocking, A lot of us have been in the exact same position as him except we never had a collision.

You make it sound harmless/trivial that a guy would show off and drive fast on a bad road with 8 people in the car!!
I'm against trial by social media and hysteria, but there is no justifying show off driving with that many people jammed into a car...

Gazzmonkey

LIGHTNING wrote: »

That is some load of horse crap you are spouting and you should be embarrassed to post it.

Why would I be embarrassed?

Theanswers

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

The driver was woken up late one evening by a mate looking for a lift, been good hearted he got up, got dressed & drove to Ballyliffen to pick up his stranded mate in his recently remapped A4. Upon getting there he was greeted be several other mates all looking for a lift, been good hearted he let them all in and headed back to Buncrana.

On the way there he was showing his mates the difference that a remap makes to a car and in the process he had to serve out of the way of a female driver who was in the wrong side of the road after she overtook an old man. He clipped her car, lost control and had a head on collision with that same old man.

This is a heavily edited version of events, the full story would leave most people in tears.

The amount of 'people' on this site that like to slabber without knowing the facts is shocking, A lot of us have been in the exact same position as him except we never had a collision.

I have relations in the area. This I believe is the correct story. However, It does not suit the media/ country to hear he was not 100% in the wrong.

I see it day in day out, cars are always overloaded. He done what any mate would do, unfortunately in this case, the worst happened.

Dangel4x4

Theanswers wrote: »

I see it day in day out, cars are always overloaded. He done what any mate would do, unfortunately in this case, the worst happened.

Rubbish. This isn't the 70s any more and overloading your car with passengers isn't acceptable.

Just like drink driving or not wearing a seatbelt isn't acceptable any more...

Or are drivers in Donegal exempt from the laws they don't want to follow?