Donegal 8 driver pleads guilty

Theanswers

Don't shoot the messenger.

Tell me this. How often do you see a child sitting on the centre arm rest of an Irish 4x4?

It is done.

Dangel4x4

Theanswers wrote: »

Don't shoot the messenger.

Don't make excuses for the guy.

Theanswers wrote: »

Tell me this. How often do you see a child sitting on the centre arm rest of an Irish 4x4?

Never. Any unrestrained person/item turns into a projectile in a crash situation.

Example: (This guy lived to tell the tale btw)

If you're r*tarded enough to endanger your kid's life (as well as that of all the other occupants) by allowing them to be unbelted, you deserve everything the law throws at you when things go wrong.

Theanswers

Hold on. I will defend him, as far as I know the families of the deceased don't even want him prosecuted. Now, that's saying something.

It was an accident. You can't blame the guy for that.

I know what happens when someone is unbelted, however I'm telling you I see it regularly. Maybe you should take a drive around the country.

It's very different to city life, with buses and taxis. People have very little choices.

I'm not arguing the rights or wrong of it. I'm just stating what happens.

Mackas_view

Theanswers wrote: »

Hold on. I will defend him, as far as I know the families of the deceased don't even want him prosecuted. Now, that's saying something.

It was an accident. You can't blame the guy for that.

I know what happens when someone is unbelted, however I'm telling you I see it regularly. Maybe you should take a drive around the country.

It's very different to city life, with buses and taxis. People have very little choices.

I'm not arguing the rights or wrong of it. I'm just stating what happens.

Thank you as I said before people don't know the ins and outs.

keithclancy

Sending him to Prison would serve no purpose other than fill another place in an already full prison system.

Theanswers

Apart from dangerous driving. What other rules has this man broke? Correct me if I'm wrong, however I don't think there is a direct rule against overloading from a driver point of view.

Zubeneschamali

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

his recently remapped A4...

Nope, we've seen the pics, and you're completely wrong.

a) it was a Passat, not an A4.

b) The car he clipped had a burst front drivers side tyre - he overtook (on a solid white line) from behind her, clipped it, lost it and totalled the old mans corolla coming the other way.

If the families didn't want this guy prosecuted, why are they preparing victim impact statements?

Mackas_view

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Nope, we've seen the pics, and you're completely wrong.

a) it was a Passat, not an A4.

b) The car he clipped had a burst front drivers side tyre - he overtook (on a solid white line) from behind her, clipped it, lost it and totalled the old mans corolla coming the other way.

If the families didn't want this guy prosecuted, why are they preparing victim impact statements?

Because they have to since he has plead guilty to the crime. You've been talkin some sh1t on here in fairness.

Dangel4x4

Theanswers wrote: »

It's very different to city life, with buses and taxis. People have very little choices.

Oh shur I know the country folk have no money for them fancy cars with the seven seats like those city people with their electricity and running water.

Instead they have to drive home from the pub, and drive their seventeen kids to school in the boot. They don't know any better, God bless em.

Don't give me your condescending horsesh%t.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Mackas_view wrote: »

No I expect people to show a bit of respect to everyone involved when they don't know the details of what happened. No one has the right to brand this man and idiot or a waste of space. He killed his best friends it was hardly intentional. A bit of respect. For everyone involved.

While I agree in general with what your saying, he drove at ridiculous speeds with 7 passengers not including himself in a car designed for a driver and 4 passengers, the car, naturally will not handle properly with a heavy load and at criminal speeds. He very much is to blame for the whole incident and it's understandable that people dislike him and call names. The circumstances of the case are well known, his legal team dragged this out at the expense of me and you, yes, the tax payer will foot the bill for this one, so people have a right to be angry over it and his actions.

Zubeneschamali

Mackas_view wrote: »

Because they have to since he has plead guilty to the crime. You've been talkin some sh1t on here in fairness.

No, they really don't. Look it up - victim impact statements are completely voluntary.

5. Do I have to make a Victim Impact Statement?

If you are entitled to make a Victim Impact Statement you can choose whether you want to make one or not. If you decide not to make a Victim Impact Statement, the judge will not take this to mean that the crime had no effect on you.

dingus12

The part about it being a re-mapped a4 is a load of ****e, it was an 05 black passat he was driving, the 7 lads where also picked up in clonmany not Ballyliffen, however the part about the car clipping the first car coming the opposite direction due to her being across the white line, having just overtaking the 2nd car(mr friels) is the general consensus from the locals as to why this accident happened, but for some reason the blame has never been on anyone but the young male driver.

Dangel4x4

dingus12 wrote: »

...the general consensus from the locals as to why this accident happened, but for some reason the blame has never been on anyone but the young male driver.

Well if the locals have decided who's to blame the court case may as well be called off.

The youngfella's obviously suffered a miscarriage of justice

IP freely

Dangel4x4 wrote: »

Well if the locals have decided who's to blame the court case may as well be called off.

The youngfella's obviously suffered a miscarriage of justice

Ah here, look at the photos again either the Renault had a mircalious spin or she was traveling the opposite direction to the passat.

I have been on the road a lot, once a few weeks after the accident, the initial impact marks are on the passage side of the road. The Renault clipped passat (traveling at speed) which caused it to vere to the opposite side of the road head on into the following car.

Media hype is great. Young fella involved in horrific crash , goes to press hours later (with no facts know) partioning blame at his feet, when further details are known no corrections made do everyone assumes it passat drivers fact cause they are told no different.

He is guilty of overloading and dangerous driving due to speed but he was hit, he didn't do the initial damage!

It is that black and white

Dangel4x4

He's changed his plea to guilty, so at least he's not in denial about what he's done - unlike some on here who insist on defending him...

IP freely

Dangel4x4 wrote: »

He's changed his plea to guilty, so at least he's not in denial about what he's done - unlike some on here who insist on defending him...

He was the driver of a car driving overloaded at speed which was involved in an accident which resulted in a loss of lives. That is what he is pleading guilty to.

People are equally on here spouting nonsense he was crashed into by a Renault on the wrong side of a continuous white line. Which was initial impact. He wasn't overtaking the Renault like is being suggested.

I don't see many here defending him (I'm certainly not) but some people need to know facts, not spreading nonesense.

h2005

Really tragic and something he will have to live with for the rest of his life. I dont see what good a custodial sentence does here to be honest.

con___manx1

I think this guy is pleading guilty because he wants to go to jail. imagine killing 8 people and you the driver survive. how bad would you feel? i seen him on tv walking from court.its a miracle he survived and is not crippled.

userod

Pricks on their high horses here.
I dont know how many times I put 6 or 7 lads into the car when i was younger and I too sat in their cars with more than should have been in it. That was the nature of carpooling , maybe cars werent plentiful or the gang enjoyed travelling together whatever the reasons.

We werent 'insane' , mindless thugs or any of that other sh*t thats going on here. We were just friends giving each other lifts.

And i doubt any of the lads killed would wrong the driver today for overloading the car either.

Its a tragedy for the driver too i have a lot of sympathy.

F*cking cold heartless high horse brigade. Follow the law down to the letter they do I suppose.

Gazzmonkey

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

The driver was woken up late one evening by a mate looking for a lift, been good hearted he got up, got dressed & drove to Ballyliffen to pick up his stranded mate in his recently remapped A4. Upon getting there he was greeted be several other mates all looking for a lift, been good hearted he let them all in and headed back to Buncrana.

On the way there he was showing his mates the difference that a remap makes to a car and in the process he had to serve out of the way of a female driver who was in the wrong side of the road after she overtook an old man. He clipped her car, lost control and had a head on collision with that same old man.

This is a heavily edited version of events, the full story would leave most people in tears.

The amount of 'people' on this site that like to slabber without knowing the facts is shocking, A lot of us have been in the exact same position as him except we never had a collision.

Ya don't say.

SniperSight

It never ceases to amaze me what can be excused by shouting "high horse brigade!"

What would you actually have to do to not be defended by this war cry?!

I've seen it used in fair enough context sure, but using it to defend a guy responsible for 8 deaths???? Really??

What's next....
"Ah yes heartless c##ts, get off the High Horse. All they did was shoot down a passenger airliner and kill 290 people...I'm sure they feel terrible and it was only an accident (that was completely avoidable)..... Sure haven't we all done some mad things eh? Off to mass with ye!

REALLY???

Canis Lupus

SniperSight wrote: »

It never ceases to amaze me what can be excused by shouting "high horse brigade!"

What would you actually have to do to not be defended by this war cry?!

I've seen it used in fair enough context sure, but using it to defend a guy responsible for 8 deaths???? Really??

What's next....
"Ah yes heartless c##ts, get off the High Horse. All they did was shoot down a passenger airliner and kill 290 people...I'm sure they feel terrible and it was only an accident (that was completely avoidable)..... Sure haven't we all done some mad things eh? Off to mass with ye!

REALLY???

I know when I was his age I and my mates often packed into a car to get to/from a location. It's practically a necessity out in the sticks.

I won't lie, I don't know the full details of the case but from what I read it was a tragic accident. I don't see what purpose is to be served by burning the guy at the stake personally.

challengemaster

Theanswers wrote: »

Hold on. I will defend him, as far as I know the families of the deceased don't even want him prosecuted. Now, that's saying something.

Yeah, it's saying you're biased.

It was an accident. You can't blame the guy for that.

I think you'll find that you can.

I know what happens when someone is unbelted, however I'm telling you I see it regularly. Maybe you should take a drive around the country.

It's very different to city life, with buses and taxis. People have very little choices.

Which country? I've seen that sort of crap a few times, I wouldn't say I encounter it regularly on the roads though.

And people do have choices, they just always take the 'easy' one rather than the sensible one. Nobody is pointing a gun at you saying to stick 8 people in 1 car.

Killinator

Canis Lupus wrote: »

It's practically a necessity out in the sticks.

Being from 'the stick's as I am, I really wish stuff like this wasn't constantly posted, because it just isn't true.

It gets pretty tiring to see living in the countryside used as some form of excuse because, apparently, things are different out here.
If people felt it was worth the risk to pack cars with people it's one thing but to use the 'everybody does/did it' and 'it'll be grand' technique of reasoning to justify it and absolve people of criticism gets really frustrating.

We've all made mistakes I'm sure, hell, I've got a couple of points for using the go pedal a bit freely(70 in a 60),
But this guy didn't just make a simple mistake, he made several severely stupid mistakes which not only cost 7 of his friends lives but also that of another innocent driver who had absolutely no control over the situation. A bit more than most of us have done and deserving of his criticism.

I also don't see why he should not serve a custodial sentence, plenty of people are in prison at the moment feel pretty bad about the things that got them there, it shouldn't be a free* pass for him.

* his grief taken into account

SniperSight

Canis Lupus wrote: »

It's practically a necessity out in the sticks.

Ya, because the village only has the use of the one car sure!!
What utter crap, I've lived out in the country all my life, and I've never done or seen this done. Why? Because it's common f##king sense!!

Stupid decisions being rationalised as "necessity" is all this is!

Akabusi

As already stated it's not always black and white. I think back to an occasion when about 6 - 7 of us got into a Toyota Celica after a nightclub and went back to a house party. The driver was drunk and so were all of us. When I went out that night I hadn't planned on going back to a house party in an over loaded car with a drunk driver but being young foolish and drunk myself and my friends all just thought - house party great lets get there any way we can. Thinking back the driver didn't have much of a choice as we were all piling into the car. I shudder now at what we did and how lucky we were to get to that house party because I remember the driver belting it around bends.
We were young and foolish; and being young we never thought of the consequences or danger of what we were at. That is the nature of a lot of young people and it will not change and it doesn't make them bad people.

What is needed is more education on the dangers of speed and drink driving. I'm out of school a long time now and maybe things have changed but that is where it should begin. We see and hear the road safety messages that the RSA run and they may work for a few moments when heard on a radio but it's obvious that they don't leave a lasting impression. They have the right idea in trying to get across the life changing results of car accidents but the medium they use to get this across is not working. IMO the RSA would be better served by employing these people that are in the road safety ads to go around the schools and talk one to one with the kids. Also greater law enforcement is needed when the majority of these accidents are happening i.e. any time from 10pm to 5am at weekends. Over the last few years I have come across 4 or 5 random breath check points but all during the day or morning. Young people are still being killed in my area and alcohol has been to blame in the last two collisions that two young lives have been lost yet still no check points at night. I always see a few drunk people get into cars any weekend I'm out and drive down the road. My nearest Gardai station is 12 miles away and the Gaurds have a massive area to cover so it impossible for them to police every road.

My condolences to everyone involved in that accident. My thought on the driver is that no matter what the circumstances where that night he did not get up that day with the intention of driving a car in which his 7 friends where killed. He has to live with this and i can imagine that he has been through some very dark days.

fro9etb8j5qsl2

As it has been pointed out already, it wasn't the overloading of the car that caused the accident, it was the drivers reckless and dangerous driving that did it. He is responsible for all of those deaths whether he set out to intentionally cause them or not.

Zubeneschamali

Canis Lupus wrote: »

it was a tragic accident. I don't see what purpose is to be served by burning the guy at the stake personally.

Of course it was an accident, no-one in the history of the world suggested that he killed 8 people on purpose.

If the same accident had happened with just him in the car, only the pensioner would have died, and he might have mounted a defence claiming the Megane driver was to blame (depending on the exact circumstances).

But having 7 lads in the car with him was dangerous driving before he started, and caused 7 deaths, so he has no defence.

And to all the super-low-horse brigade saying we all do it: stop doing it, OK?

keithclancy

CJC999 wrote: »

While I agree in general with what your saying, he drove at ridiculous speeds with 7 passengers not including himself in a car designed for a driver and 4 passengers, the car, naturally will not handle properly with a heavy load and at criminal speeds. He very much is to blame for the whole incident and it's understandable that people dislike him and call names. The circumstances of the case are well known, his legal team dragged this out at the expense of me and you, yes, the tax payer will foot the bill for this one, so people have a right to be angry over it and his actions.

Do you work for the Daily Mail by any chance ?

Canis Lupus

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Of course it was an accident, no-one in the history of the world suggested that he killed 8 people on purpose.

If the same accident had happened with just him in the car, only the pensioner would have died, and he might have mounted a defence claiming the Megane driver was to blame (depending on the exact circumstances).

But having 7 lads in the car with him was dangerous driving before he started, and caused 7 deaths, so he has no defence.

And to all the super-low-horse brigade saying we all do it: stop doing it, OK?

Back when I was a young lad in Kerry (before the celtic tiger had really kicked off and everyone had 5 cars each) only one of my mates had a car which was overloaded at times going to and from places and it was only a ****box of a car (and it was a common enough situation to see it with others after nightclubs etc). Young people do dumb **** and will continue to do it, the majority will make it through but sometimes tragic stuff happens.

I'm not really sure what the guy is facing in terms of prospective punishment but I don't see any need for his life to be completely ruined any more than it already has been.

I'm not absolving the lad of his 'sin', I guess I just empathise a bit is all.

punisher5112

As you say this was done a lot years ago sure even parents were doing it with cars full of kids but it just shows you how much times have changed.

If you were to be carrying that many even back in the day they wouldn't be booting it up the road and unbelievable speeds.

If this guy had driven normal and compensated for all the extra weight this woulkd never have ended the way it did.


It's common sense for most to drive for the conditions appropriately so it is quite obvious he was flying and nobody can argue with that.

Zubeneschamali

Canis Lupus wrote: »

Back when I was a young lad in Kerry (before the celtic tiger had really kicked off

Back then, road deaths were at double the level they are today.

In this case, all of the lads were employed, and several left their cars to take this lift, presumably because the driver had not been drinking. So it wasn't a case of 7 broke lads with no car.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

8 people died, needlessly, due to the stupid actions of one person, ironically the only person who survived.

Yes, he was an idiot.
Yes, he deserves to pay the consequences.
Yes, it will serve as a warning to others.

He has, and will continue to pay the price for what he did. His life is over. Not as finitely over as those he is responsible for the deaths of, but his life is effectively ruined.

Calling this young fella 'scum' is reprehensible. At the end of the day, he didn't set out to kill those 8 people on purpose. And waiting til the last minute to chance his plea to guilty is not deserving of the tag either. His mental state cannot be stable.

Some people around here need to take a good, long, hard look at themselves.

Guy:Incognito

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

8 people died, needlessly, due to the stupid actions of one person, ironically the only person who survived.

8 people. All 8 of them in his car were stupid. He was just the worst (by far).

As for people saying hes stuffered enough and will for his life so jailing him isn't right, how do you know he cares at all? He could be a cnut whos only concern is avoiding jail.

If everyone in his car had lived and he got off with killing the other driver they could well have decided to pile in to his new car again on a night out.

He did X wrong, he should be punished.

hollypink

Gazzmonkey wrote: »

On the way there he was showing his mates the difference that a remap makes to a car

What does this mean? How do you show the difference a remap makes to a car?

Alan_007_

hollypink wrote: »

What does this mean? How do you show the difference a remap makes to a car?

Accelerating power would be one way I'd assume.

lulu1

This was a tragic accident with no winners only losers and we are sitting here judging with 99% of us not knowing the true facts only what we read in the paper. Think of the stress in that family at the moment. Think of the stress the other famlies are going through reliving the whole lot again. I am sure that anyone with sons or daughters of thatage must feel for him I know i do. As the saying goes you never know when its going to come to your own door and believe me it came to mine

lulu1

Dangel4x4 wrote: »

I'd tend to agree - a lot of lives snuffed out by this guy. He'll get, what, 5-10 years and a lifetime driving ban maybe?

Those of us who are parents should educate our kids about making choices that end up with them getting in cars with idiots like this...

I agree but do you really think they will listen when they get to 18 or 19 I dont think so. I cant hear the best of them saying right boys mammy and daddy said dont get into a fast car. No way

lulu1

Mackas_view wrote: »

It's very interesting to see people using the words "idiot" and "waste of space" so freely on here when they probably have not got a clue of the circumstances surrounding the tragedy.

About time a moderator stepped in before a member of this mans family see these immature individuals comments

I agree 100% with you but I have a feeling that the Kelly family will have more to bother them than reading this

Jesus.

Theanswers wrote: »

It's very different to city life, with buses and taxis. People have very little choices.

Agreed.

userod wrote: »

Pricks on their high horses here. F*cking cold heartless high horse brigade. Follow the law down to the letter they do I suppose.

Very much agreed!

Jesus.

Killinator wrote: »

We've all made mistakes I'm sure, hell, I've got a couple of points for using the go pedal a bit freely(70 in a 60)

Take it easy there chief, that kind of adrenaline rush will surely kill you :rolleyes:

Guy:Incognito

It's just a pity that Ireland is the only country in the world that has people living in the countryside, We're so unique and the poor country dwellers shouldn't be held back by city-centric laws about seatbelts, occupancy numbers or drink driving. Not allowing them to just buy and drive cars when they feel they are ready and good enough themselves is bordering on racism.

Mackas_view

Addison Putrid Kazoo wrote: »

As it has been pointed out already, it wasn't the overloading of the car that caused the accident, it was the drivers reckless and dangerous driving that did it. He is responsible for all of those deaths whether he set out to intentionally cause them or not.

How can you just assume this when the actual details of the case still aren't clear. The oncoming car was hit on the passenger side which could mean she overtook the car being driven by mr Friel behind.

Your all great on here for slatin someone for somethin you know little about. Do you know that his barrister and solicitor BEGGED him to plead not guilty. The man has a case that would probably see him get a lot lesser sentence. A late guilty plea will mean nothin to a judge.

Renegade Mechanic

This has to be one of the greater tragedies on our roads. I wouldn't call him scum. I refuse to believe he made it his goal to kill all those people or destroy all those families. But he still did.
We all make stupid mistakes, bad judgement calls and I refuse to believe anyone who tells me they havent. Ive made some terrible ones. But, unlike that poor bastard, I, like you, got lucky. I may not have raced with 8 in the car but context is irrelevant here as Ive done plenty else. Nothing said here, nothing said to his face outside or inside court or jail, nothing done to him or anything he holds will ever, ever come close to the weight of regret he will carry to his grave. That, to me is the only apt punishment. And it works because he isnt a sociopath, he seems of reasonable (relatively at this stage) mental function. He fully feels and knows every twisted detail of what he's done and it will continue to hurt him in ways you people couldn't hope to dream of.

Dangel4x4

Dangel4x4 wrote: »

Rubbish. This isn't the 70s any more and overloading your car with passengers isn't acceptable.

You are very naive if you think overloading cars was a think of the 70's. I couldn't tell you how many times I came home from night clubs with 6 or 7 of us in the back of a 306 van or a golf van or 20 of us in a 10 seater mini bus etc. it was extremly rare to not go home in an over loaded veichle. It mightn't have been ideal but there was no option as you would be left to sleep on the street of you didn't manage to get a way home asap.

This was only 6 or 7 years ago. Almost the entire town would be balling into a couple of mini busses and a few cars.

Even still it's not unknown for the local mini busses to over load and I've gotten a lift home an odd time with 6 of us in the car etc. Personally if I 5 friends looking for a lift and 4 seats I'd take them.

fro9etb8j5qsl2

Mackas_view wrote: »

How can you just assume this when the actual details of the case still aren't clear. The oncoming car was hit on the passenger side which could mean she overtook the car being driven by mr Friel behind.

Your all great on here for slatin someone for somethin you know little about. Do you know that his barrister and solicitor BEGGED him to plead not guilty. The man has a case that would probably see him get a lot lesser sentence. A late guilty plea will mean nothin to a judge.

So, you're telling me that all of the wrongdoing in the accident lays with the 3rd car but the guards have still chosen to pursue and prosecute an innocent man? :rolleyes:

IP freely

Addison Putrid Kazoo wrote: »

So, you're telling me that all of the wrongdoing in the accident lays with the 3rd car but the guards have still chosen to pursue and prosecute an innocent man? :rolleyes:

The fella was driving an overloaded car at speed.

My understanding of the while event is that the lady did overtake on a continuous white line and did hit the driver on the wrong side of said line BUT the subsequent accident could have been avoided had the driver not being driving at speed also that ultimately the driver decided to carry on knowing his car was overloaded thus the charges being brought forward.

It is also well know that the 3rd driver was charged (with careless driving) but no case was persuaded by the DPP.

Crackle

Mackas_view wrote: »

The oncoming car was hit on the passenger side

The Megane was hit on the driver's side

Killinator

Jesus. wrote: »

Take it easy there chief, that kind of adrenaline rush will surely kill you :rolleyes:

Haha, your hilarious!
Funnily enough I didn't come up with all sorts of excuses as to why I shouldn't be to blame, and it was in the country and all, sure apparently you can do anything out the country cause there's no buses (I must have missed that lesson while growing up out there).

Gazzmonkey

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Nope, we've seen the pics, and you're completely wrong.

a) it was a Passat, not an A4.

b) The car he clipped had a burst front drivers side tyre - he overtook (on a solid white line) from behind her, clipped it, lost it and totalled the old mans corolla coming the other way.

If the families didn't want this guy prosecuted, why are they preparing victim impact statements?

My mistake, it was a Passat, it's that badly mangled I mistook it for an A4, but in fairness they are almost the same car.

But your wrong about everything else, she was charged but never prosecuted for overtaking the old man on a continuous white line. Multiple factors caused the accident.

I mentioned nothing about impact statements, learn to read :pac: twat