Question for the boys - to pay or not to pay?

LordNorbury

riveratom wrote: »

Excellent my good man. Couldn't have nailed it better. Did she text you wondering where you went?!

Nope, she probably saw me walking out the door, she was the kind of clown who would have had no hesitation going up to the next guy she saw and fluttering her eyelashes at him and getting more drinks off him. I just chalked it up to experience, she might have gotten a few drinks out of me but I left the pub thinking she was an absolute and total cúnt. If I was her, I'd rather have spent the 30 quid and made a better impression of myself.

Pawwed Rig

LordNorbury wrote: »

But if you ask a girl out for dinner, are you not meant to bringing her out?!? I mean you can't be turning around at the end of the meal and saying, "right love I need 55 quid off ya for that"??? It is nice for a girl to offer, but I think if you ask a girl out for a dinner date, there is an implied thing there that you are treating her to dinner.

Well I wouldn't have taken a girl out for dinner on a first date. First date for me was always coffee as it gives you a chance to chat without the beer taking over. Also you aren't stuck there for hours if things don't go well like you might be in a restaurant for example. So by the time we went for dinner it would be at least a second date by whiclh time we both agreed to meet up again so it wouldn't be me asking her out as such.

OP just bear in mind it is not all about him impressing you. He is sizing you up at the same time as you are him and often the small gestures speak volumes. For example when I hold a door open for someone a thank you is nice. It shows the person appreciates small things.

Other big nonos for me were designer bags. If she had one then I'm not interested :pac:

Sibhsoo

Too many men focus on impressing women, just assume you're the sh1t and focus on whether the women you meet impress you.

MagicMarker

I'd always offer to pay but I wouldn't be impressed if there was no offer on their part to split the bill. The more they insist the more respect I have for them.

I think I've been lucky though, they nearly always insist that they pay their share, to the point where they won't take no for an answer.

GERALD GIRAFFE

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

He is going around the site pretending to be a giraffe for some reason. Bless him

You sound like the kids in school. "You're not a giraffe Gerry!"

"You only think you're a Giraffe Gerry; you're crazy!!!"

"Ger-ry Ger-ry Ger-ry thinks-he's a Gir-affe;
Ger-ry Ger-ry Ger-ry - let's all point and laugh!!!"

OK Pawwed Rig you got me!! You got me good!! It's me! Plain old Gerald McDermott. I am human, just like you.

You know my keeper once told me that no matter what anybody says; no matter what people think about you; the way you eat, the shrubs the grass: the way people look at you as if you're crazy - none of it matters! Lifes too short; you can be ANYTHING you want if you try hard enough!! And when people scoff at you; and point: it's probably because they are envious of the fact that you are being yourself. Your true self.

I am completely comfortable in my coat!

I think it was Katy Perry who once said:

I came from a lot of intolerance and prejudice, which aren't necessarily healthy to evolve as a human.

Sir_Name

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Well I wouldn't have taken a girl out for dinner on a first date. First date for me was always coffee as it gives you a chance to chat without the beer taking over. Also you aren't stuck there for hours if things don't go well like you might be in a restaurant for example. So by the time we went for dinner it would be at least a second date by whiclh time we both agreed to meet up again so it wouldn't be me asking her out as such.

OP just bear in mind it is not all about him impressing you. He is sizing you up at the same time as you are him and often the small gestures speak volumes. For example when I hold a door open for someone a thank you is nice. It shows the person appreciates small things.

Other big nonos for me were designer bags. If she had one then I'm not interested :pac:

Manners goes a loooooong way! In my experience most first dates have been dinner, and the guy has paid. I would always offer to split and in most cases if we've gone for a drink after I will buy the next few rounds as a thank you.
I prefer to pay my own way and I think it's a nice gesture to return the favour when you have been treated to dinner!

That said I find it mind boggling you wouldn't be interested in a girl if she had a designer bag. I have a few, nothing extortionate but I've bought them for myself as a treat at one time or another and find it odd that you wouldn't date a girl with one.

Pawwed Rig

Deanov wrote: »

That said I find it mind boggling you wouldn't be interested in a girl if she had a designer bag. I have a few, nothing extortionate but I've bought them for myself as a treat at one time or another and find it odd that you wouldn't date a girl with one.

Well I was being slightly tongue in cheek but where someone has a handbag for which they paid €600-700 we are unlikely to have too much in common.

Knex*

Deanov wrote: »

Manners goes a loooooong way! In my experience most first dates have been dinner, and the guy has paid. I would always offer to split and in most cases if we've gone for a drink after I will buy the next few rounds as a thank you.
I prefer to pay my own way and I think it's a nice gesture to return the favour when you have been treated to dinner!

That said I find it mind boggling you wouldn't be interested in a girl if she had a designer bag. I have a few, nothing extortionate but I've bought them for myself as a treat at one time or another and find it odd that you wouldn't date a girl with one.

As for the designer bag, I don't think that would ever bother me. Although I know some who will only ever wear one, as if anything less is beneath her, and that type of attitude would. But really, I can only see it being an issue for me, if she opened by going, "And look at my designer bag".

JeffKenna

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Well I was being slightly tongue in cheek but where someone has a handbag for which they paid €600-700 we are unlikely to have too much in common.

Wow...I wouldn't even be able to tell if a bag was designer or not!

I would never go for dinner on a first date, I just think straight away it adds pressure and creates the 'oh I'll pay half/no no I'll pay' Mrs Doyle scenario. Why anyone would deliberately do something on a first date that creates that kind of awkwardness is beyond me.

Unfortunately there are some girls who are just out to completely take what they can get. It's sad really but in my experience best to keep away from them. I'll never forget on a second date with a girl she told me how all her friends try to get guys to bend down and tie their shoe laces, just to see if they'll do it. And they were in there 30's...on the 3rd date with this girl I brought her for dinner, after dessert she went to the bathroom for 9 minutes, I timed it. No queues btw. At least we avoided the paying argument but it clicked fairly fast with me that like her friends she wasn't all that nice of a person!

LordNorbury

My "designer handbag" thing is texting at the dinner table, only happened to me once, but it's a complete complete deal breaker. Pick your nose if you wish, fart and let the whole restaurant hear it, but don't start start texting your mate in the middle of dinner.

Sir_Name

JeffKenna wrote: »

Wow...I wouldn't even be able to tell if a bag was designer or not!

I would never go for dinner on a first date, I just think straight away it adds pressure and creates the 'oh I'll pay half/no no I'll pay' Mrs Doyle scenario. Why anyone would deliberately do something on a first date that creates that kind of awkwardness is beyond me.

Unfortunately there are some girls who are just out to completely take what they can get. It's sad really but in my experience best to keep away from them. I'll never forget on a second date with a girl she told me how all her friends try to get guys to bend down and tie their shoe laces, just to see if they'll do it. And they were in there 30's...on the 3rd date with this girl I brought her for dinner, after dessert she went to the bathroom for 9 minutes, I timed it. No queues btw. At least we avoided the paying argument but it clicked fairly fast with me that like her friends she wasn't all that nice of a person!

I was once told that dinner is the perfect first date as you could eat through any awkward silences! Snigger...

I was on a second date before and paid for the dinner, and he got odd. Really odd. Said he didn't like feeling like he owed me... That was the end of that! ðŸ˜

To be honest I think most people are genuine and not out to fleece anyone. For me personally, meanness is the one of the most off putting traits in a person.

AngryHippie

To over-think it or not to over-think it ?

There is no right answer. Trust your instincts. Be yourself.

Have fun, be a gentleman, treat her as a lady, until she proves herself to be otherwise, then be nice until you can escape.

Pawwed Rig

GERALD GIRAFFE wrote: »

You sound like the kids in school. "You're not a giraffe Gerry!"

"You only think you're a Giraffe Gerry; you're crazy!!!"

Mod note - quit the nonsense

strobe

wolfen wrote: »

I guess because I had not such a great time with my last boyfriend I am in a way testing on the first date to see if he is capable of being generous.

He's just messaged me to ask me out again, so the verdict is that we should go 50/50 on this one?

Well no, he paid on the last date. So why don't you pay on this one, take the opportunity to show that you are capable of being generous (although I suppose generosity would be paying for the next two dates, paying for the next one would be more just returning the previous courtesy), imo you should definitely at the very least offer to pay the bill on the next date (and not just your part of the bill) .

Rachiee

Not a boy but a lesbian woman. If I ask her out and date is going well I'll insist on paying. If she wishes to contribute Ill be like hey get it back next time (excuse to meet again
Or if she really wants to pay for something she can pay for wine; i think that splitting the bill is overly familiar for a first date, its something i do with my mates.
If she invited me and asked for half the cost Id feel like she wasn't that into it;that said If she asks me out I would always offer half this is only polite.if she did pay for dinner id then pay for drinks afterwards or again offer to get her back next time.
It is important though that a woman doesn't make a show of expecting to be paid for(not offering not saying thanks etc) this would be so off putting for me.

pwurple

LordNorbury wrote: »

so at the end of the night, I popped over to the waitress on the way back from the jacks and settled the bill, which I had no problem with doing.

I think I can offer a suggestion on why your date went wrong from this point on, although you should have been thanked. I can't stand it when people do that... Pay out of my sight. I know the intention is good, and it's to avoid any arguing, but I consider it a sign of sneakiness, a trait I despise.

JeffKenna

pwurple wrote: »

I think I can offer a suggestion on why your date went wrong from this point on, although you should have been thanked. I can't stand it when people do that... Pay out of my sight. I know the intention is good, and it's to avoid any arguing, but I consider it a sign of sneakiness, a trait I despise.

I guess this is where people differ. I would normally do this and consider it excellent manners. It's taking control of the situation. It's also fun then to tell the girl we'll go and see how the freaked out look they get when I'm going to 'skip the bill'..lol!

eeeee

Gosh I find it hard to believe this is still an issue! I ALWAYS pay half, it really annoys me when a guy insists on doing so. It becomes an awkward mrs. Doyle style scenario and it puts me off a guy who insists on paying for things. I bring or make sure i have enough money for where ever I'm going or whatever the date is, i find it weird how some don't?
I also never knew about the whole let him pay the first time you the next. I still don't like it though, I am on a tiny budget at the moment so I don't go out for dinner, just tea or coffee or a few drinks. I mightn't be able to afford to get them back the next date so paying my own way is the only way I can work it.

I don't actually understand why a guy would pay for you anyway? Why would you feel the need to do that? Is it an etiquette thing?

Malari

I've never really been on a "first date" with a guy I didn't know before, but when I initially started going out with boyfriends and we went for dinner/cinema, etc, I'd always offer to pay. Usually it would work out as he pays this one, I pay the next one....whether it's drinks rounds, cinema and nummies, dinner this week and dinner next week.

While offering to contribute if someone else insists on paying is polite, I think being ungracious when someone really wants to pay for you is as bad as not offering at all. Sometimes you have to know when to accept a kind offer and make a mental note to pay the next time.

I do this with friends too most of the time, rather than splitting the bill.

Oh and I do have some designer handbags...and some designer shoes! Just because a girl buys expensive things for herself sometimes does not mean she can't be generous to others!

MagicMarker

pwurple wrote: »

I think I can offer a suggestion on why your date went wrong from this point on, although you should have been thanked. I can't stand it when people do that... Pay out of my sight. I know the intention is good, and it's to avoid any arguing, but I consider it a sign of sneakiness, a trait I despise.

I don't like it either, someone did it to me once while I went to the toilet. I really would have preferred paying my share.

Pinkmoon19

strobe wrote: »

Well no, he paid on the last date. So why don't you pay on this one, take the opportunity to show that you are capable of being generous (although I suppose generosity would be paying for the next two dates, paying for the next one would be more just returning the previous courtesy), imo you should definitely at the very least offer to pay the bill on the next date (and not just your part of the bill) .

Fair point. You're totally right.

Sauve

MagicMarker wrote: »

I don't like it either, someone did it to me once while I went to the toilet. I really would have preferred paying my share.

I think you could be safe to presume that they did it with good intentions. It's an etiquette thing that they likely picked up from older generations.
I've been out with guys who do this, but I'd be sure to get them back for it in other ways, like buying drinks afterwards or paying next time we meet etc.

LordNorbury

pwurple wrote: »

I think I can offer a suggestion on why your date went wrong from this point on, although you should have been thanked. I can't stand it when people do that... Pay out of my sight. I know the intention is good, and it's to avoid any arguing, but I consider it a sign of sneakiness, a trait I despise.

Well the alternative to settling the bill discreetly is to initiate a discussion about how the bill is being paid for, if I make an obvious point of bringing this up, I look like I'm almost looking for brownie points for doing something that I had no issue with doing from the very outset, which was paying for dinner, as I believe that if you are asking a girl out to dinner, you are paying for her to have dinner with you and that this is a given. That was never the issue, I was always going to be paying for the meal and I had no problem in that regard, and my way of doing it is to settle the bill discreetly. It was the total lack of gratitude subsequently that I took exception to.

pwurple

JeffKenna wrote: »

I guess this is where people differ. I would normally do this and consider it excellent manners. It's taking control of the situation. It's also fun then to tell the girl we'll go and see how the freaked out look they get when I'm going to 'skip the bill'..lol!

Taking control, or avoiding a confrontation. I see it as the latter, which is a bit... i dunno, a bit weak, or shows a lack of confidence? I know I've read too much into something which could just be an act of convenience and generosity, but I really don't like it.

miamee

Sauve wrote: »

I think you could be safe to presume that they did it with good intentions. It's an etiquette thing that they likely picked up from older generations.
I've been out with guys who do this, but I'd be sure to get them back for it in other ways, like buying drinks afterwards or paying next time we meet etc.

Same here, I think it is an etiquette thing plus it removes the awkward "I'll pay", "No, I'll pay" or "Let me pay half" scenario. A small part of me is nearly afraid to go to the loo near the end of a meal on a date though in case the man ends up paying while I am gone or worse, thinking that it is a strategic visit to enable him to do this.

On more than one occasion I have said something like "I'm just going to the ladies. Do NOT pay the bill while I am gone!" - usually when I know it's my turn to pay

Maximus Alexander

My line on this is if I asked her out I'd intend to pay, even insist on it, but if she made no effort to contribute I would probably interpret that as a bad sign. Notwithstanding the fact that I'd insist anyway.

LordNorbury

gadetra wrote: »

Gosh I find it hard to believe this is still an issue! I ALWAYS pay half, it really annoys me when a guy insists on doing so. It becomes an awkward mrs. Doyle style scenario and it puts me off a guy who insists on paying for things. I bring or make sure i have enough money for where ever I'm going or whatever the date is, i find it weird how some don't?
I also never knew about the whole let him pay the first time you the next. I still don't like it though, I am on a tiny budget at the moment so I don't go out for dinner, just tea or coffee or a few drinks. I mightn't be able to afford to get them back the next date so paying my own way is the only way I can work it.

I don't actually understand why a guy would pay for you anyway? Why would you feel the need to do that? Is it an etiquette thing?

If you come at it from another direction, imagine you get asked out for dinner and the guy at the end of the evening starts stepping through the bill and adding up who had what on the iPhone or even if he just splits it in half and says, "right love, that's 50 Euro each", do you not think that that looks really scabby and downright mean?

If a girl insists on going 50-50 beforehand and insists that she feels strongly about this, I have to respect that, but I still have my own view that you do not ask a girl out to dinner and then hand her half the bill, that just isn't on in my view. I actually think that it is disrespectful and demeaning to go at a dinner date in that manner.

OnTheCouch

I got a good tip on this topic a number of years ago. Whether you are going out on a date or just meeting up with a friend, under no circumstances should you ever see paying the bill as 'collateral' for an expected subsequent act, whether this be sex, a second date, favours, a reciprocal act in the future, officialisation of a relationship status and so on. No, purely pay for another person if you enjoy their company and because you like doing nice things, you sort matters out financially. If you see the settling of the bill by one person as a prelude to something else, you are more often than not going to end up disappointed and I think many girls can tell if this is where a particular interaction is heading. This probably to some degree explains why they would often rather pay half themselves.

If you simply don't want to pay for the other person, either state this at the beginning or go for coffee or something where the charges will be minimal.

That having been said, if I asked a girl out I would expect to pay for whatever we did. I think if she genuinely would prefer to contribute half at the end, you can usually tell by how insistent she is about refusing your offer. Some make a few mild protestations out of politeness but are usually happy to let you pay. Others are quite vehement about paying their share and you will probably antagonise them if you insist on sorting everything.

In a relationship then, outside of the equitable and standard situation where both partners have a career and therefore share everything, things can change depending if one of the parties is still a student or out of work. Sometimes the man still wants to pay should he fall into one of the latter categories, for understandable, if not perhaps wise, reasons. In all of mine, I have been lucky to have not really ended up with any proper princess types, even though I generally paid more than my fair share of the costs overall. I would have an issue mind you if after the first one or two dates, the girl made no offer to at least contribute something financially. Doesn't have to be a 50/50 split exactly but I would appreciate some attempt on her part to help out.

I think a lot depends on cultural background as well. I have some friends with Eastern European girlfriends and there seems to be a standard agreement that the man should pay for nearly everything with them. Certainly a lot more so than in Ireland. This is only going on two examples though, so I can only make a stab at a rough generalisation here.

One of the most interesting observations in here was when a couple of people objected to the 'discreet' paying of the bill. This is something that would never have occurred to me before, as it always seemed like a very nice gesture. Mind you, after thinking about it for a bit, I suppose if you did not know the person that well, it may seem somewhat presumptuous. Probably better to keep for long-term relationships and outings with friends.

Pinkmoon19

LordNorbury wrote: »

If you come at it from another direction, imagine you get asked out for dinner and the guy at the end of the evening starts stepping through the bill and adding up who had what on the iPhone or even if he just splits it in half and says, "right love, that's 50 Euro each", do you not think that that looks really scabby and downright mean?

If a girl insists on going 50-50 beforehand and insists that she feels strongly about this, I have to respect that, but I still have my own view that you do not ask a girl out to dinner and then hand her half the bill, that just isn't on in my view. I actually think that it is disrespectful and demeaning to go at a dinner date in that manner.

I have to say I would be inclined to agree more with your POV.

mariaalice

wolfen wrote: »

Hi!

I'm sure there are a million threads open already on this but looking for some male insight. I've recently started dated after getting out of LTR. My ex was pretty stingy and I paid for pretty much everything.

If you are on a date with a girl for the first time would you expect to pay? Or would you have an issue if she didn't offer to pay for anything?

I was on a date last night and it went really well and he paid, but afterwards I felt a little bit guilty. The girls think that it's normal, but what do the guys think?

Thanks a Mil!

I cant actually believe that their are still girls/women who still think its normal for a man to pay!! is the world going backwards or something?.

Pawwed Rig

pwurple wrote: »

Taking control, or avoiding a confrontation. I see it as the latter, which is a bit... i dunno, a bit weak, or shows a lack of confidence? I know I've read too much into something which could just be an act of convenience and generosity, but I really don't like it.

I think I would feel that I somehow owe them something now rather than having a mature discussion about a bill. Were it someone who I know and will get back at some point in the future then it may not bother me too much. Whereas someone who I had just met and may not want to meet again I would be mortified and probably fairly annoyed.

Malari wrote: »

Oh and I do have some designer handbags...and some designer shoes! Just because a girl buys expensive things for herself sometimes does not mean she can't be generous to others!

Nothing to do with generosity really. It would tell me that the person is frivolous with money and would cause me concerns about their ability to budget along with being swept up by consumerism and the 'must have' items. IMHO the only purpose of a €600 handbag is to make those that cannot afford it feel bad as they are no more aesthetically pleasing than a €19.99 model from Dunnes Stores. Not criticising people as such for having it but more stating that I would not date them.

mariaalice wrote: »

I cant actually believe that their are still girls/women who still think its normal for a man to pay!! is the world going backwards or something?.

During my dating days I would say aboyt 50% of my first dates made no attempt to pay for anything (circa 5 years ago)

miamee

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Nothing to do with generosity really. It would tell me that the person is frivolous with money and would cause me concerns about their ability to budget along with being swept up by consumerism and the 'must have' items. IMHO the only purpose of a €600 handbag is to make those that cannot afford it feel bad as they are no more aesthetically pleasing than a €19.99 model from Dunnes Stores. Not criticising people as such for having it but more stating that I would not date them.

The female equivalent would be a woman being put off by a man having a fancy car or sports car instead of the kind of reliable car that will get you from A to B without looking fancy. Cos the car will cost a lot more than the bag both initially and in the long run

(Sorry, a bit off-topic and no, I don't own any designer bags OR a fancy car :pac:)

LordNorbury

OnTheCouch wrote: »

One of the most interesting observations in here was when a couple of people objected to the 'discreet' paying of the bill. This is something that would never have occurred to me before, as it always seemed like a very nice gesture. Mind you, after thinking about it for a bit, I suppose if you did not know the person that well, it may seem somewhat presumptuous. Probably better to keep for long-term relationships and outings with friends.

I think it depends how you feel about one particular trait and that trait is meanness. I would consider any guy who asks a girl out to dinner and then expects her to pay for her meal, as downright mean.

I have a very very low toleration of meanness in people, it's one of two human traits that I cannot stand in people, when I encounter it, so that may account for why I feel the way I do about this subject of who pays for dinner. I believe there is a proper way of going at things and asking a girl out to dinner and then bringing up the bill at the end of the night or asking her to pay for her half, is actually the stuff of complete mortification to me I have to say.

Having said that, I do recall a date (a nice date actually), last year where before we met for dinner (we had agreed to do a dinner date), the girl insisted that we go half on it and said that she had to be clear about this, that there was no other basis for her agreeing to go for dinner with me other than that we would share the bill. At the end of the night, this was a simple matter to deal with as we had an agreement in place, that she insisted upon and even reminded me of on our way into the restaurant.

But in general I prefer paying for dinner and doing it discreetly. I don't go on dinner dates usually for a first date but every now and again you have a hunch that you will get on well, this is where you'd be chatting on the phone and you can be as good as certain that good intelligent and relaxed conversation will not be a problem on the night.

JeffKenna

pwurple wrote: »

Taking control, or avoiding a confrontation. I see it as the latter, which is a bit... i dunno, a bit weak, or shows a lack of confidence? I know I've read too much into something which could just be an act of convenience and generosity, but I really don't like it.

I suppose that's what makes dating such a minefield really. To be honest your attitude sounds like your looking for problems with a potential suiter that aren't there. Any time I've got a meal the favour has been by and large returned. I genuinely can't see a problem with it. I like a bit of romance in my life, pulling the calculator out at a dinner table is not my idea of that!

pwurple

LordNorbury wrote: »

If you come at it from another direction, imagine you get asked out for dinner and the guy at the end of the evening starts stepping through the bill and adding up who had what on the iPhone or even if he just splits it in half and says, "right love, that's 50 Euro each", do you not think that that looks really scabby and downright mean?

If a girl insists on going 50-50 beforehand and insists that she feels strongly about this, I have to respect that, but I still have my own view that you do not ask a girl out to dinner and then hand her half the bill, that just isn't on in my view. I actually think that it is disrespectful and demeaning to go at a dinner date in that manner.

What happens in my own experience is that the bill will come along, I will have kept an idea of the cost in my head... I offer to pay, the other person offers to pay, if they insist, i round up the amount in my head, add tip, and give them cash (a 50 or something, not down to coins or anything crazy) for my portion. No-one is out with iphone.

Now, that is not first dates, that is dinner with friends or family, but if the other party is a guy, he often insists on paying, which is unfair to them.

Also, i like to check over a bill. Mistakes happen.

If they paid 'discreetly', i'm left a bit in limbo... Did they tip, should i cover that?

Awkward.

A Primal Nut

For the first couple of dates I would always ask to pay and expect to pay. Unless we go for an all-nighter drinking in which case I'd expect her to offer at some point (most girls will) but I won't really care if she doesn't.

I would say that to girls reading that you don't need to try hard to show you are independent by always letting him pay; at
least let him buy you a meal or a drink if he offers. Let him treat you - it's not a big deal and most guys like to. It's not a bad thing if you don't of course.

I would say to guys reading that if you get worked up about whether a girl offered to pay; you will miss out on a lot of great girls. There are more important things to focus on in the early dates. Just because a girl is letting you treat her doesn't reflect anything about her personality.

I think it's a shame that in general gender roles are sort of being phased out of relationships and it's all about equality these days. Of course that's a good thing when it comes to important things; but for little things it's fine to have the gender role traditions I think - can be a bit more fun.

JeffKenna

pwurple wrote: »

What happens in my own experience is that the bill will come along, I will have kept an idea of the cost in my head... I offer to pay, the other person offers to pay, if they insist, i round up the amount in my head, add tip, and give them cash (a 50 or something, not down to coins or anything crazy) for my portion. No-one is out with iphone.

Now, that is not first dates, that is dinner with friends or family, but if the other party is a guy, he often insists on paying, which is unfair to them.

Also, i like to check over a bill. Mistakes happen.

If they paid 'discreetly', i'm left a bit in limbo... Did they tip, should i cover that?

Awkward.

Oh dear god I can imagine being on a date with you and checking over the bill!

Now that's awkward!!!

Pinkmoon19

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Nothing to do with generosity really. It would tell me that the person is frivolous with money and would cause me concerns about their ability to budget along with being swept up by consumerism and the 'must have' items. IMHO the only purpose of a €600 handbag is to make those that cannot afford it feel bad as they are no more aesthetically pleasing than a €19.99 model from Dunnes Stores. Not criticising people as such for having it but more stating that I would not date them.

I don't think that many people who spend that kind of money on a bag buy it with the sole purpose of making others feel bad. I find this post and your attitude quite judgmental, and slightly condescending. I have 1 designer bag, and I bought it as a treat for myself after a few tough months. I saved for it and I bought it and I love it. To be quite honest if I met a guy who didn't want to date me because I brought it to the date I would seriously be asking a question about who is the more superficial person?

pwurple

JeffKenna wrote: »

I suppose that's what makes dating such a minefield really. To be honest your attitude sounds like your looking for problems with a potential suiter that aren't there. Any time I've got a meal the favour has been by and large returned. I genuinely can't see a problem with it. I like a bit of romance in my life, pulling the calculator out at a dinner table is not my idea of that!

Ah now. It's just a foible... I just really don't like sneakiness. Other people have made judgements based on a bag type, or writes the person off if they checks their phone texts in case their mum fell down the stairs.

We all have traits we like or don't like.

Not knowing how to use your, you're, their, they're and there would be another one for me. Luckily I found someone with the same quirks.

Pawwed Rig

wolfen wrote: »

I don't think that many people who spend that kind of money on a bag buy it with the sole purpose of making others feel bad. I find this post and your attitude quite judgmental, and slightly condescending. I have 1 designer bag, and I bought it as a treat for myself after a few tough months. I saved for it and I bought it and I love it. To be quite honest if I met a guy who didn't want to date me because I brought it to the date I would seriously be asking a question about who is the more superficial person?

Good for you and I am happy for you but it is not for me.
I would argue that while dating we are at our most judgemental anyway as we are trying to size up a persons whole life and personality in the space of a couple of hours which (you may agree) is virtually impossible.
I get turned off by materiality. Other people get turned off by other things. I won't wear clothes with labels on them for example (if I can help it). I am not meaning to be condescending, to each their own and all that. I am just expressing what turns me off.

pwurple

JeffKenna wrote: »

Oh dear god I can imagine being on a date with you and checking over the bill!

Now that's awkward!!!

Lol, Yeah, I c an safely say we would not be compatible!

I don't have to check the bill, but if I'm not doing it someone has to. Otherwise they are a flippen dope with money. Big red mark.

pwurple

pwurple wrote: »

Lol, Yeah, I c an safely say we would not be compatible!

I don't have to check the bill, but if I'm not doing it someone has to. Otherwise they are a flippen dope with money. Big red mark.

Or good with numbers. I normally know what the bill should come to in restaurants, supermarket and much more. So I often do not check a bill for the sole reason that when the waiting staff / cashier said the total it matched the expectation I already had.

JeffKenna

pwurple wrote: »

Lol, Yeah, I c an safely say we would not be compatible!

I don't have to check the bill, but if I'm not doing it someone has to. Otherwise they are a flippen dope with money. Big red mark.

Apologies, on reflection my earlier post may have come across slightly insulting, it wasn't meant like that!

Haha I must be a flippen dope with money I'm thinking!!!

Alf Veedersane

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

IMHO the only purpose of a €600 handbag is to make those that cannot afford it feel bad as they are no more aesthetically pleasing than a €19.99 model from Dunnes Stores.

I don't know if I'm in the minority but I wouldn't know the difference between one from Dunnes and one that was €600.

Unless if the €600 bags are as gammy as those Louis Vuitton bags.

One word: ugh.

Zulu

When I was single, the way I just to work it was simple: if I ask you out on a date, I'm inviting you to join me. It's my invitation, so I'm paying. You can buy the first round after.

If you ask me, you're paying. I'll get the first round after.

If we (after a few dates) decide to get food, together, then it's 50/50.

OnTheCouch

LordNorbury wrote: »

I think it depends how you feel about one particular trait and that trait is meanness. I would consider any guy who asks a girl out to dinner and then expects her to pay for her meal, as downright mean.

I have a very very low toleration of meanness in people, it's one of two human traits that I cannot stand in people, when I encounter it, so that may account for why I feel the way I do about this subject of who pays for dinner. I believe there is a proper way of going at things and asking a girl out to dinner and then bringing up the bill at the end of the night or asking her to pay for her half, is actually the stuff of complete mortification to me I have to say.

Yeah I'd be like yourself, it's certainly up (down?) there when it comes to my pet hates in others. To such an extent that if I get any inclination at all that someone is a tight you know what, I will have no hesitation in showing him or her up in public as being just that. Which for some reason does not seem to be done more in Ireland, I don't know why. Anyway, this generally works, as with people like this, the only thing they hate more than spending money is being exposed as one of these types in front of people they know.

It is certainly a problem, I am noticing more and more recently (which in fairness can be explained to a large degree by the financial problems we have had in this country in the last few years - but not always) that the majority of people are frugal, if not actually being stingy as such.

Anyway, getting back on topic, again I'd think exactly the same as you when it came to asking someone out, I'd always expect and come prepared to pay. As you say, this would appear to me to be the 'proper' way of doing things. I really find it cringeworthy even in groups when people start getting out the calculators, so to do it on a date would be absolutely horrendous in my opinion.

To play devil's advocate mind you, if I am on a date, it's perfectly feasible that the woman, either unbeknownst to me, or more visibly, is not finding me riveting company and has no intention whatsoever of seeing me again. In that situation I can see that she may prefer to just pay her way and leave matters there. To then pay without her knowing could potentially get her seriously riled. So I think you can look at it both ways.

Pawwed Rig

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I don't know if I'm in the minority but I wouldn't know the difference between one from Dunnes and one that was €600.

The expensive ones usually have an ugly logo on them with Gucci, YSL or some other such branding written as large as possible so others will know at a distance that you spent ridiculous amounts of cash on a bag. I normally assume they are fakes until proven otherwise as I try to see the best in people :pac:

JeffKenna

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I don't know if I'm in the minority but I wouldn't know the difference between one from Dunnes and one that was €600.

Unless if the €600 bags are as gammy as those Louis Vuitton bags.

One word: ugh.

I would have thought any Louis Vuitton bags would have been bought in Turkey or somewhere akin?

miamee

A Primal Nut wrote: »

For the first couple of dates I would always ask to pay and expect to pay. Unless we go for an all-nighter drinking in which case I'd expect her to offer at some point (most girls will) but I won't really care if she doesn't.

I would say that to girls reading that you don't need to try hard to show you are independent by always letting him pay; at
least let him buy you a meal or a drink if he offers. Let him treat you - it's not a big deal and most guys like to. It's not a bad thing if you don't of course.

I would say to guys reading that if you get worked up about whether a girl offered to pay; you will miss out on a lot of great girls. There are more important things to focus on in the early dates. Just because a girl is letting you treat her doesn't reflect anything about her personality.

I think it's a shame that in general gender roles are sort of being phased out of relationships and it's all about equality these days. Of course that's a good thing when it comes to important things; but for little things it's fine to have the gender role traditions I think - can be a bit more fun.

I think that there is always room for both people in a couple to be generous, not just the man. How can you show your generosity if the other person insists on paying for everything in the first few dates? Then I just feel like some sort of scab or user for letting some guy pay for all these things and not letting me return the favour.
I wonder how same sex couples work this out without the traditional "I am the man, therefore I must pay" getting in the way? I'm sure whoever offers first just pays first time and they take turns or they split it - like any two people should in my opinion

Alf Veedersane

JeffKenna wrote: »

I would have thought any Louis Vuitton bags would have been bought in Turkey or somewhere akin?

Heh heh. I was going to add that alright.

If of course I knew the real deal was stupidly expensive.