Water metering to begin in Waterford on Monday

shinzon

From the Water Metering Ireland Lets Fight Back Facebook page

https://www.facebook.com/WatermeteringIrelandLetsfightback/posts/263866547135401?fref=nf

Hi lads,

It seems metering is set to begin in Waterford on Monday.

Residents of the Mayors Walk area received letters yesterday informing them of meter installation on Monday!

Shin

PropJoe10

Its all good news in Waterford these days!

danjo-xx

Water metering to begin in Waterford on Monday

There was loads of meters all ready fitted before the handover to irish water.
One outside my door if anyone wants one:D

The Bowling Alley

Quick question...

Everyone complained about the Property Charge and then they paid it. I assume the same is going to happen here, in which case isn't it better to have one of the meters so you will at least be charge accurately?

This country is all talk. Most of the people are like those kids in school who told you that they didnt study for the exam and then get an A.

emo72

The Bowling Alley wrote: »

Quick question...

Everyone complained about the Property Charge and then they paid it. I assume the same is going to happen here, in which case isn't it better to have one of the meters so you will at least be charge accurately?

This country is all talk. Most of the people are like those kids in school who told you that they didnt study for the exam and then get an A.

this is a semi state business, they cant just take your money. the property tax is collected by revenue and they have way more powers. hell irish water cant even cut you off if you never pay.

its a totally different scenario to property tax. dont be fearful.

some_dose

emo72 wrote: »

this is a semi state business, they cant just take your money. the property tax is collected by revenue and they have way more powers. hell irish water cant even cut you off if you never pay.

its a totally different scenario to property tax. dont be fearful.

Genuine question - give me one reason why we should not pay for clean water in Ireland? Every other country does, so why shouldn't we?

BuffyBot

"Because"

That basically appears to be the reasoning..

gman2k

some_dose wrote: »

Genuine question - give me one reason why we should not pay for clean water in Ireland? Every other country does, so why shouldn't we?

You have already being paying for it, through taxation.
Now you will be metered and paying for it twice.

shinzon

gman2k wrote: »

You have already being paying for it, through taxation.
Now you will be metered and paying for it twice.

as gman2k said you've already been paying for it through indirect taxation for donkeys years, and youll continue to pay for the indirect taxation even after the metres go in, there not going to remove one to accommodate the other, so yes youll be paying for it twice

Shin

and if you don't think we are listen to this from Simon Coveney

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3TyfERp-Iw

O Riain

I think generally in other countries people are happier to pay a bit more tax when they have a good health service, an active and visible police force, a decent public transport system and good government funded community projects.

Give me one of these things and I would be happy to pay more taxes, as it stands our money will be going to pay off bank debt. Not very cool.

The Bowling Alley

The Bowling Alley wrote: »

Quick question...

Everyone complained about the Property Charge and then they paid it. I assume the same is going to happen here, in which case isn't it better to have one of the meters so you will at least be charge accurately?
This country is all talk. Most of the people are like those kids in school who told you that they didnt study for the exam and then get an A.

Pat Kenny's radio programme was from Kilkenny yesterday. They did a section on the new bridge controversy. Pat himself had walked around the city to familiarise himself with the subject. He then interviewed someone from Planning office and a spokesperson for those opposed to new bridge. This was in front of a live audience, who were very vocal in their objection. Pat asked the planner how many submissions/objections had been received. The answer was 34, he then asked how many in the audience had made a submission, the answer was 3. So yes, this country IS all talk.

O Riain

O Riain wrote: »

I think generally in other countries people are happier to pay a bit more tax when they have a good health service, an active and visible police force, a decent public transport system and good government funded community projects.
Give me one of these things and I would be happy to pay more taxes, as it stands our money will be going to pay off bank debt. Not very cool.

We don't have good services, because the tax intake is not enough. We are borrowing just to pay day to day expenses, which as any good housewife will tell you, is not sustainable. We need to broaden the tax base and make users pay for what they use, same as ESB, Gas, Phone, etc. The PAYE earner cannot keep subsidising their fellow citizens. EVERYONE must do their bit.

Junior

Deleted User wrote: »

We don't have good services, because the tax intake is not enough. We are borrowing just to pay day to day expenses, which as any good housewife will tell you, is not sustainable. We need to broaden the tax base and make users pay for what they use, same as ESB, Gas, Phone, etc. The PAYE earner cannot keep subsidising their fellow citizens. EVERYONE must do their bit.

the tax take is enough, those in power seem to be happy to spend it on consultants fees to tell them how the synergy of their logo should be rather than on actual services.

The_Shotz

We currently already pay for water through our taxation system. Once we pay for water via a meter will the government reduce our tax, NO. So as the lads said we will pay for it twice.

Does anyone really think we have been getting FREE water for the past 70+ years.

That old chestnut "but everyone in Europe pays for water" in that case let's do away with VRT, introduce free healthcare and the likes to come in line with Europe.

Just like gas and electricity, water will also be about profit which should never be the case. It will also in the future be privatised where we will then see our water in control of a multi national, which never works out to well for the people.

I recommend any to watch "blue gold" on YouTube, to see the effects of privatisation of water.

And before someone says here, it won't be privatised! Part of the bailout included a water company was to be established which could be privatised.

Other then all that, the corruption in which Irish Water was set up! That's a topic for another day!

shinzon

I dunno why so many people are ignorant to the fact that Irish Water has not been setup to deliver clean clear water at a price, its to service the debt, full stop. And if anyone thinks for one minute that this company will not be privatised as far as im concerned your living in cloud cuckoo land.

The government have already lied about the average cost of water to the consumer which by the way is one of if not the highest in Europe.

Shin

barneystinson

shinzon wrote: »

I dunno why so many people are ignorant to the fact that Irish Water has not been setup to deliver clean clear water at a price, its to service the debt, full stop. And if anyone thinks for one minute that this company will not be privatised as far as im concerned your living in cloud cuckoo land.

The government have already lied about the average cost of water to the consumer which by the way is one of if not the highest in Europe.

Shin

Haven't a breeze about this topic, because from day one when I heard about it I thought "well I suppose it's reasonable that water supply is paid for by the users". So I said I'd do a quick google to verify your assertion about our rate being "one of if not the highest in Europe." - first country I look at is UK, and I find "On April 1st, 2014, a 2% increase (roughly £8) was announced, pushing up the average UK's household bill for water and sewerage to £393 per year."

So I think I'll call shenanigans on that.

shinzon

barneystinson wrote: »

Haven't a breeze about this topic, because from day one when I heard about it I thought "well I suppose it's reasonable that water supply is paid for by the users". So I said I'd do a quick google to verify your assertion about our rate being "one of if not the highest in Europe." - first country I look at is UK, and I find "On April 1st, 2014, a 2% increase (roughly £8) was announced, pushing up the average UK's household bill for water and sewerage to £393 per year."

So I think I'll call shenanigans on that.

Really I did say one of if not the highest in Europe, read this

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/anger-as-our-water-charges-among-the-highest-in-europe-30476429.html

Shin

barneystinson

shinzon wrote: »

Really I did say one of if not the highest in Europe, read this

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/anger-as-our-water-charges-among-the-highest-in-europe-30476429.html

Shin

Exactly, so the average Irish household cost will be a lot less than the average UK cost... unless you've fallen into the trap of thinking the average Irish household consists of 4 adults?!

Johngoose

Firstly,I have nothing against you personally,but it's clear you have no financial difficulties.A lot of families/ individuals are struggling badly out there money-wise.Slapping a charge of €300 on these people could literally finish them off.The water charges will only go up and up over the course of the next ten years.In the end water charges will be just like your monthly electricity bill.Thousands of people out there are stretched to the limit financially,they don't need another charge. We are already paying "universal social charge," whatever the hell that covers!We have had the housing tax,the universal social charge and the water tax slapped on us in the space of a few years.What next?!What are people supposed to live on?!

Johngoose

I am of course referring to the pro Irish Water camp

emo72

It's a hard concept for myself, I can't get my head around the fact, that money isn't an issue for some people. No matter what they are asked for they can pay.

Edit... So can I ask the people who are lucky enough to get by comfortably, to have a little understanding for people, who work hard, provide for their families, but unfortunately on a fixed income and can't come up with the extra money for a new utility bill.

Potential-Monke

Money is an issue though. To look at me from the outside, i've a good job, no immediate family to look after, have a few luxuries (for my lifestyle), but at the same time i'm wondering where i'm going to find €150 to pay to a cardiologist consultant next friday. And god knows what else might come from that! And i'm also goosed because i work in the public sector in a job that doesn't allow me to join protests or go against government decisions!

So people are struggling to pay, but we have to find it somewhere. I'm being totally honest when i say i honestly cannot afford more charges/taxes/cuts.

barneystinson

I'm not talking about how people afford to pay it (or not), all I'm saying is that as a principle it's not unreasonable - people don't expect their electricity, gas or food supply to be free, so why should water?

The way I see it, the taxpayer is already paying for it through general taxation, which means the people who don't pay tax are getting a free ride as is so often the case - at least this way the cost is borne by the user.

And if the money is being collected by a specific charge rather than out of central funds, then there should be a corresponding reduction in general taxation to reflect this fact. I'm not saying it will happen, but I'll wait until it fails to happen before I throw my toys out of the pram... and I'll use my vote in 18mths accordingly.

The_Shotz

barneystinson wrote: »

, but I'll wait until it fails to happen before I throw my toys out of the pram... and I'll use my vote in 18mths accordingly.

By that time it will be too late to do anything about it.

A change of government won't make a difference I'm afraid.

barneystinson

barneystinson wrote: »

I'm not talking about how people afford to pay it (or not), all I'm saying is that as a principle it's not unreasonable - people don't expect their electricity, gas or food supply to be free, so why should water?
The way I see it, the taxpayer is already paying for it through general taxation, which means the people who don't pay tax are getting a free ride as is so often the case - at least this way the cost is borne by the user.
And if the money is being collected by a specific charge rather than out of central funds, then there should be a corresponding reduction in general taxation to reflect this fact. I'm not saying it will happen, but I'll wait until it fails to happen before I throw my toys out of the pram... and I'll use my vote in 18mths accordingly.

Unfortunately the tax intake isn't enough to cover day to day expenses, hence the need to broaden the tax base and get everyone to pay for what they use, not just PAYE earners paying for everyone. It will not equate to a reduction in general taxation, as that would defeat the purpose.

shinzon

barneystinson wrote: »

I'll use my vote in 18mths accordingly.

And what exactly do you think the next government will do, the taxation wont change, Irish Water wont be wound up metering wont be scrapped. Charges will go up the company will be privatised.

The question id ask to anyone in Ireland is when is enough enough, what is going to make people finally say **** this im not doing this anymore, whats everyones breaking point

Shin

barneystinson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Unfortunately the tax intake isn't enough to cover day to day expenses, hence the need to broaden the tax base and get everyone to pay for what they use, not just PAYE earners paying for everyone. It will not equate to a reduction in general taxation, as that would defeat the purpose.

You're right, I should've said there'd be a corresponding reduction in govt borrowing, or a corresponding increase in spending on a stimulus.

TheQuietFella

shinzon wrote: »

From the Water Metering Ireland Lets Fight Back Facebook page

Hi lads,

It seems metering is set to begin in Waterford on Monday.

Residents of the Mayors Walk area received letters yesterday informing them of meter installation on Monday!

Shin

I hope that those who can, park sensibly to allow the meters to be installed
efficiently so the company doing so can progress safely to other areas.

barneystinson

shinzon wrote: »

And what exactly do you think the next government will do, the taxation wont change, Irish Water wont be wound up metering wont be scrapped. Charges will go up the company will be privatised.

The question id ask to anyone in Ireland is when is enough enough, what is going to make people finally say **** this im not doing this anymore, whats everyones breaking point

Shin

As I've said, I support water metering and charges by reference to usage, so we aren't going to agree. And I've said I think either general taxation should fall, or since we're still operating at a deficit, borrowing should fall by the amount raised in water charges.

You're looking at the thing in isolation; the reality is EVERYTHING including water has to be paid for. What's your solution, tax "the rich"?

allthedoyles

Water meter and pay by usage is generally accepted , but there are two separate charges here :

1 . water
2. waste water

If you avail of the waste water service , then the charge for water usage is doubled .
Not very fair in my opinion.

By the way , The installers do a very tidy and professional job , and ye will find minimal interruption to your lives .

shinzon

barneystinson wrote: »

As I've said, I support water metering and charges by reference to usage, so we aren't going to agree. And I've said I think either general taxation should fall, or since we're still operating at a deficit, borrowing should fall by the amount raised in water charges.

So your basically just saying your happy to pay twice because everything you've just said above is not going to happen.

Shin